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Old 01-09-2014, 10:57 PM   #271
john4200
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Originally Posted by smbaker View Post
A person who has a reason for being in that room looks at a mirror for 3 seconds. Not suspicious anywhere except on TV.
What an absurd thing to say.

Gunmen came into a DEA office, murdered the agents, and immediately located and disabled 2 of the 3 hidden cameras in the office.

Anyone who knows this and is reviewing the video from the few days prior to the shootings, looking for anything suspicious, is going to immediately flag the lady who stares right into the only surviving hidden camera as suspicious. There is no doubt. Real or TV, this is completely obvious.
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Old 01-10-2014, 12:58 AM   #272
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Gunmen came into a DEA office, murdered the agents, and immediately located and disabled 2 of the 3 hidden cameras in the office.
Realize what you've just said. You just made the case that the initial FBI investigators would have suspected the killers did not know about that camera, and therefore would not have paid any special attention to that mirror.

I think you watch too much television as you're taking a very naive view of how the real world functions. You're expecting scriptwriters to dangle obvious clues in front of you, to which the one-dimensional cardboard characters immediately recognize and use to solve the case. Real life doesn't work that way.

In reality, there would have been dozens or even hundreds of people that would have been investigated. More important than the camera that survived would be the two cameras that were known to the killers and destroyed. The FBI would be looking for people who knew about those two cameras. Contractors, maintenance workers, FBI agents, anyone who would have had knowledge of the locations of those two destroyed cameras. FBI would be watching surveillance video, but what they would have been looking for was not suspicious behavior in the vicinity of the surviving camera, but suspicious behavior in the vicinity of the two destroyed cameras.

This particular woman had a valid reason for being there. She even had a valid reason for looking at the mirror (applying her lipstick). That she looked up for a second or two would not stand out.

Furthermore, you've never explained why one would suspect that the mastermind of the shooting would look directly at the camera. If anything. knowledge of the camera would cause her to avoid it. You're standing behind something that isn't even a well-written episode.
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Old 01-10-2014, 06:40 AM   #273
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How did looking up at the mirror let her see the camera exactly? I've looked up at a high mirror before... Sometimes there's something on the ceiling that catches my eye.
Sorry, you are just stupid. You can join me in stupid corner and let the really smart people tell us how dumb we are.
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:14 AM   #274
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Sorry, you are just stupid. You can join me in stupid corner and let the really smart people tell us how dumb we are.
Can I join you guys?

I'll even wear a dunce cap with 'looks at cameras when at the bank' written on it. It's only a matter of time before a bank is robbed and some crack FBI team comes after me.
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:36 AM   #275
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Can I join you guys?

I'll even wear a dunce cap with 'looks at cameras when at the bank' written on it. It's only a matter of time before a bank is robbed and some crack FBI team comes after me.
I don't know how to count high enough to see if we have space for you.
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Old 01-10-2014, 12:12 PM   #276
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I'll even wear a dunce cap with 'looks at cameras when at the bank' written on it. It's only a matter of time before a bank is robbed and some crack FBI team comes after me.
This made me laugh out loud right there.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:06 PM   #277
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You just made the case that the initial FBI investigators would have suspected the killers did not know about that camera, and therefore would not have paid any special attention to that mirror.

(snipped remaining nonsense)
No, I made no such case. You may need to watch the episode again to eliminate your confusion. Crystal was not one of the gunmen. She is a suspect for the person who set up the gunmen to be caught.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:19 PM   #278
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No, I made no such case. You may need to watch the episode again to eliminate your confusion.
Pointless to continue discussing this with you. I think I'll join eddyj, who clearly has more common sense than me, as he gave up arguing with you days ago.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:59 PM   #279
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Pointless to continue discussing this with you.
Agreed. Since you are confused about what happened in the episode, and are unwilling to accept a simple common sense explanation, it will not help you at all to continue discussing it.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:24 PM   #280
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Agreed. Since you are confused about what happened in the episode, and are unwilling to accept a simple common sense explanation, it will not help you at all to continue discussing it.
I have no confusion about the episode.

However, if it makes you feel better to think so, then go ahead and do so. I declare you winner, by attrition. You're not interested in discussion, you're only interested in declaring your view correct and ignoring any discussion to the contrary.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:44 PM   #281
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I have no confusion about the episode.
False. You are clearly confused about what happened in this episode, and even what has been written in this thread. You already made a false assumption about Crystal being one of the gunmen and this led you to claim that I was asserting something that I did not say.

This is not rocket science. It can be summarized in a few sentences. I'll even do it again.

The men who gunned down the DEA agents knew exactly where 2 of the 3 surveillance cameras were, and they were so confident that they knew all of the cameras that they took off their masks (which makes little sense, but ignore that) and were identified by the 3rd camera they did not know about. A short time before the shootings, a woman stood right in front of the 3rd camera and stared for several seconds at what would be a reflection of the ceiling, or the position of the camera behind the mirror (which again makes no sense for a smart criminal to do, but ignore that). We have a suspicious lack of knowledge of the gunmen about the 3rd camera, and we have a woman suspiciously staring into the 3rd camera. This makes the woman a suspect worthy of further investigation.
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Old 01-10-2014, 04:07 PM   #282
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False. You are clearly confused about what happened in this episode, and even what has been written in this thread. You already made a false assumption about Crystal being one of the gunmen...
Good grief. Please actually go back and read what I said. At no time did I ever say or suspect that she was one of the masked gunmen.

Quote:
(which again makes no sense for a smart criminal to do, but ignore that).
Key point being conveniently ignored.

Quote:
We have a suspicious lack of knowledge of the gunmen about the 3rd camera, and we have a woman suspiciously staring into the 3rd camera. This makes the woman a suspect worthy of further investigation.
Key point being misinterpreted.
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Old 01-10-2014, 06:25 PM   #283
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At no time did I ever say or suspect that she was one of the masked gunmen.
Actually, you did. Either that or something even more nonsensical. It is hard to follow your logic since you are so confused about what happened.

You wrote:

Quote:
You just made the case that the initial FBI investigators would have suspected the killers did not know about that camera, and therefore would not have paid any special attention to that mirror.
I did not "make the case", since that would depend on a total misunderstanding of the situation.

The gunmen did not know about the third camera but they appeared confident that they knew about all the cameras. Apparently they had some inside information that they thought was reliable but was actually not. So anyone reviewing the video prior to the shootings would be looking for clues as to how the gunmen got their information about 2 of the 3 cameras. Anyone staring at any of the 3 cameras would have seemed suspicious, and Crystal was especially suspicious, staring into the camera that the gunmen did not know about.

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Old 01-10-2014, 06:53 PM   #284
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Good grief.
You realize he's never going to stop until you do?
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Old 01-10-2014, 06:55 PM   #285
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A It is hard to follow your logic since you are so confused about what happened.
You keep saying this, a simple attempt to deflect from actual discussion of the show by attacking the messenger instead of the message.

I know exactly what happened.

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The gunmen did not know about the third camera but they appeared confident that they knew about all the cameras.
Exactly correct. As such, the FBI would be concentrating on who knew about the two cameras that the gunmen did destroy, not who knew about the one camera they did not destroy.

For the mastermind to rely on one camera to be not destroyed, and that camera to lead police down an improbably series of steps in a complicated frame up is made-for-TV nonsense, and any person with 'a thimbleful of common sense' should see it as so.

Furthermore, as you pointed out yourself (and admittedly ignored, as it does not fit your narrative), the alleged criminal mastermind would not have started at the camera she knew about in the first place.

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So anyone reviewing the video prior to the shootings would be looking for clues as to how the gunmen got their information about 2 of the 3 cameras.
And they would have found someone in the place she was supposed to be, doing an activity that one normally does while looking at a mirror. They would have vetted her, and continued to look for someone else who was casing the locations of the other two cameras.

Didn't I already declare you the winner through attrition of this argument? Why am I still bothering?
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Old 01-10-2014, 06:59 PM   #286
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You realize he's never going to stop until you do?
I suppose you're right.

I knew this. Declared him the winner. Then somehow I got pulled back into the nonsense.
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Old 01-10-2014, 07:23 PM   #287
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I suppose you're right.

I knew this. Declared him the winner. Then somehow I got pulled back into the nonsense.
Good, because otherwise you go to the other corner, where you can beat your head against a wall, instead here with the rest of us stupids.
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Old 01-10-2014, 07:28 PM   #288
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I know exactly what happened.
Now that I have explained it repeatedly, you seem to finally be getting clearer on what happened in the episode.

But your difficulty is that you refuse to accept a simple common sense explanation. In the situation that existed, Crystal's behavior was suspicious. It would make her a suspect.

I'm not sure why you are so confused about how investigations work in the real world. Investigators do not make all sorts of nebulous assumptions about why someone might have behaved in a suspicious way and then conclude, that's okay, they might have had a reason for doing that. No, what investigators do is look for anomalies -- unusual or suspicious behavior. Then they investigate those anomalies further.

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I knew this. Declared him the winner. Then somehow I got pulled back into the nonsense.
Clearly you felt bad about being confused and posting all that nonsense, and you wanted help trying to understand. You're welcome.
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Old 01-10-2014, 08:22 PM   #289
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Good, because otherwise you go to the other corner, where you can beat your head against a wall, instead here with the rest of us stupids.
I'm definitely sticking with the eddyj corner! It's good times over here.

Can we call our corner the 'den of the confused confusing confusers' ?

Maybe "men who stare at mirrors" would be an even better name for our corner. It could make an awesome George clooney movie about a tragic and comedic case of mistaken identity and law enforcement overreach.
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Old 01-13-2014, 09:49 PM   #290
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New mystery for this season -- what the heck happened to Van Pelt's hair??? She looks ridiculous.


(Did she have the new hairstyle in the first post-RJ episode?)


I'm expecting the tyger tyger folks are back.
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:50 PM   #291
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I liked this episode. The reboot is working for me. I like the new FBI lady, I like the way Jane plays them all, and even Lisbon is now the voice of experience when it comes to Jane's methods.

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I'm expecting the tyger tyger folks are back.
I hope not. I think the worst thing they could do for this show would be to bring back ANY vestige of The Mentalist 1.0. It's new, it's fresh, it's actually fun to watch again.

If tyger tyger or RJ or any of the old Mentalist returns, I think it would drive me away (and probably many old time viewers who were at our limits).
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:59 PM   #292
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I liked the episode. I like the reboot. Jane in this episode was laughing, fun and quirking that eyebrow again!

But really, Van Pelt looked like she was from the 60's with those bangs and Rigsby in the skinny jeans was amusing.
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:47 PM   #293
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I was worried that Rigsby was going to get killed in that final scene.
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Old 01-14-2014, 01:26 AM   #294
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I hope not. I think the worst thing they could do for this show would be to bring back ANY vestige of The Mentalist 1.0. It's new, it's fresh, it's actually fun to watch again.
I agree, but with someone running surveillance on cellphones of former CBI agents, I have a gut feeling it's an old foe. Tyger Tyger was never fully resolved.

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I was worried that Rigsby was going to get killed in that final scene.
or Van Pelt.

(actually, not worry, but hope...)
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Old 01-14-2014, 06:29 AM   #295
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I was worried that Rigsby was going to get killed in that final scene.
That would make Van Pelt available, right? Works for me!

Although that hair was godawful!
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Old 01-14-2014, 08:20 AM   #296
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I hope not. I think the worst thing they could do for this show would be to bring back ANY vestige of The Mentalist 1.0. It's new, it's fresh, it's actually fun to watch again.

If tyger tyger or RJ or any of the old Mentalist returns, I think it would drive me away (and probably many old time viewers who were at our limits).
This x 1000.

I have to admit I was kinda dozing off last night. From what did Van Pelt pull the information showing all the CBI agents being tracked? Surely it wasn't the cell phone bug.
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Old 01-14-2014, 08:46 AM   #297
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How did looking up at the mirror let her see the camera exactly? I've looked up at a high mirror before... Sometimes there's something on the ceiling that catches my eye.
Reminds me of this picture I saw on Facebook which was captioned:

"Why do you have a framed picture of your ceiling fan?"


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Old 01-14-2014, 11:37 AM   #298
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Grace "Sheepdog" Van Pelt
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Old 01-21-2014, 07:07 PM   #299
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What episode(name) aired this past Sunday? I missed it.

New episode or rerun? Thanks.
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Old 01-21-2014, 07:34 PM   #300
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What episode(name) aired this past Sunday? I missed it.

New episode or rerun? Thanks.
Rerun. It seems the show is on hiatus until March.
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