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Old 02-17-2014, 06:38 PM   #1
john4200
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House of Cards - Season 2 - Episodes 12, 13

Discussion thread for Season 2 Episodes 12, 13
(Chapters 25, 26)

S02E12
Walker accuses Frank of setting him up. Sharp is derided by the press. Frank convinced Durant and Dunbar offer Feng immunity and asylum. Sharp attacks Claire in the press. Stamper tells Rachel to put out Lisa. Gavin presses Agent Green for his freedom. Claire tries to reconcile with Sharp and drops the bill. Dunbar interrogates Frank and Larkin. Tusk is subpoenaed but pled the fifth. Grayson divides Tusk and Remy. Claire requests Jackie's help in guiding the impeachment.

S02E13
Frank and Walker attempt to seek Tusk. Vasquez speaks on behalf of Walker. Frank advocates for himself. Claire consoles Meghan. Orsay presses Green for a meeting with Stamper. In the face of midterms, Jackie sways votes. Claire pushes Frank. Frank seeks Walker's good graces. Jackie seeks Remy. Frank convinces Walker to abandon Tusk. Tusk pleads the fifth but then testifies against the President. Stamper pressures Rachel until she runs away. The House pursues impeachment. Amid low approval ratings, Walker resigns. Stamper is missing. Frank assumes office and negotiates an end to the military standoff by giving up Feng.
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Old 02-18-2014, 07:48 AM   #2
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Just finished. I thought the second half of the season was better than the first half.

More thoughts to come, but Hail to the Chief!
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Old 02-18-2014, 07:52 AM   #3
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I finished this morning. Too much to process it all!

I had thought early on that he'd own the white house in season 3. He got there faster than I thought!

I hope Walker kept a copy of Frank's letter.
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Old 02-19-2014, 05:39 PM   #4
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I was thinking that maybe Walker would burn the "letter" himself, except it would not really be in there. But then Walker handed it to Frank. I did notice that Frank did not verify that the letter was actually in the envelope. Did Walker count on that, giving the letter to Frank while standing by the fire and expecting Frank to burn it without looking? Seems a risky plan when Walker could have just held it up to Frank and then burned it himself. So I guess Walker did not do anything tricky there.

Now that Frank is President, I guess next season will be his downfall. Or perhaps they will have a season with Frank as President, and then 4th season he goes down. But I think that a season with Frank as President would not be as interesting to watch as his rise (or fall). Still, netflix probably would like to keep the show going more than 3 seasons, so I guess they will try to stretch it out somehow.

Do you think Rachel was correct that Stamper was going to hurt (or kill) her? I did not think she was correct. I think Stamper was going to try to scare her into telling him everything she knew, and then he would move her to a temporary safe house until he could relocate her again. I could be wrong, and he was planning to kill her. But I just cannot see him doing that to her -- his feelings for her were mixed up, but murdering her seemed to be beyond him. I was a little disappointed with the scene in the woods. It seemed too unrealistic that she would be able to get away from him so easily, then surprise him and beat him to death (or almost to death?) with a rock. Both the murder scenes in this season seemed hard to believe (especially the timing).
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Old 02-20-2014, 05:26 PM   #5
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No I think Stamper planned to eliminate Rachel as a risk altogether.

I am hoping that next year, President Underwood finally meets a villain worthy of him. This season was almost too easy for him.
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Old 02-21-2014, 10:53 PM   #6
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No I think Stamper planned to eliminate Rachel as a risk altogether.

I am hoping that next year, President Underwood finally meets a villain worthy of him. This season was almost too easy for him.
Why is Rachel such a risk again? I can't remember. Does she know that Underwood killed Russo?

FU had a bunch of stuff blow up in his face this season, but it all seemed to be defused pretty easily in retrospect. It feels a little bit weird that they're writing many of these crises to fit in an episode.

These complaints are minor since overall it was another a very enjoyable piece of programming. I almost wish I'd spaced them out a little more.
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:51 PM   #7
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Why is Rachel such a risk again? I can't remember. Does she know that Underwood killed Russo?
Not only that but she helped set Underwood up by getting Russo to drink in the first place at the hotel!
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Old 02-21-2014, 11:59 PM   #8
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Now that Frank is President, I guess next season will be his downfall. Or perhaps they will have a season with Frank as President, and then 4th season he goes down. But I think that a season with Frank as President would not be as interesting to watch as his rise (or fall). Still, netflix probably would like to keep the show going more than 3 seasons, so I guess they will try to stretch it out somehow.
Should be interesting to see how closely they follow the British versions main plot lines in terms of Franks rise and demise (if it happens like that at all)


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Do you think Rachel was correct that Stamper was going to hurt (or kill) her? I did not think she was correct. I think Stamper was going to try to scare her into telling him everything she knew, and then he would move her to a temporary safe house until he could relocate her again. I could be wrong, and he was planning to kill her. But I just cannot see him doing that to her -- his feelings for her were mixed up, but murdering her seemed to be beyond him. I was a little disappointed with the scene in the woods. It seemed too unrealistic that she would be able to get away from him so easily, then surprise him and beat him to death (or almost to death?) with a rock. Both the murder scenes in this season seemed hard to believe (especially the timing).
The main thing was that Doug had absolutely no idea that Gavin the hacker got his information from Lucas, not Rachel. He just really wanted to find out how Gavin got his information so I think Doug was going to help her (or interrogate her further as you say). When she first hit him with the brick all he said was "What are you doing?" Didn't violently react at all which he definitely would have if he was going to kill her in the first place.
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Old 02-22-2014, 11:23 AM   #9
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Not only that but she helped set Underwood up by getting Russo to drink in the first place at the hotel!
OK it's coming back to me now, thanks.
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Old 02-22-2014, 10:16 PM   #10
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Frank is the latest bad guy that I'm anxiously awaiting obliteration since The Governor (The Walking Dead) and Walter White ((Breaking Bad).
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Old 02-23-2014, 05:09 PM   #11
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The main thing was that Doug had absolutely no idea that Gavin the hacker got his information from Lucas, not Rachel. He just really wanted to find out how Gavin got his information so I think Doug was going to help her (or interrogate her further as you say). When she first hit him with the brick all he said was "What are you doing?" Didn't violently react at all which he definitely would have if he was going to kill her in the first place.
I agree that Stamper didn't expect the attack and wasn't thinking about killing her then.
The problem is that he didn't realize how scary his behavior had been to Rachel.

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Frank is the latest bad guy that I'm anxiously awaiting obliteration since The Governor (The Walking Dead) and Walter White ((Breaking Bad).
Agreed.
Frank Underwood is a cold blooded murderer and the fact the he is now President of the United States is a very scary idea.

I supposed it depends on how long they decide to let the series run.
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Old 02-23-2014, 05:18 PM   #12
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One spin they could do in season three is have Claire be the ultimate player and take out Frank. She could get Frank to appoint her to some fancy position and eventually work her way up the chain. Kind of how Hillary has worked her way up the chain!
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Old 02-24-2014, 09:25 PM   #13
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I'm rooting for the the hacker to get up on all of them.

An interview with Meechum:
http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/02/24/ho...esome-meechum/

Who BTW, is one more that knows all the dirt on Frank.
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Old 02-24-2014, 09:41 PM   #14
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Who BTW, is one more that knows all the dirt on Frank.
Does he? How does he know about the murders?
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Old 02-24-2014, 10:20 PM   #15
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Does he? How does he know about the murders?
Meechum had to drop off Frank and followed when he got Russo's car. We don't know how frank got the subway but it's not likely that he snuck out of the house.
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Old 02-24-2014, 11:06 PM   #16
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Interview with "hacker" Gavin Orsay
http://www.vulture.com/2014/02/house...interview.html
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Old 03-12-2014, 08:21 AM   #17
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I watched season 1 just a couple of weeks ago, it was cool to be able to juimp right into season 2. I enjoyed this season but preferred the first half to the second half. Looking forward to seeing the Prez in action next year. It will be interesting to see if the new VP is someone we already are familiar with or someone completely new.
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Old 03-12-2014, 09:52 AM   #18
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I was underwhelmed this season, and highly preferred the first half to the second half. Mainly because I found the political side of things this season to be so unbelievable that I couldn't properly enjoy the rest of the show.

A short list of political things that I cannot suspend disbelief on:
* VP resigns to become governor
* FU decides to just live in his current house rather than move to the Naval Observatory. Tough ****, neighbors! It's a good thing that Frank's backyard patio isn't overlooked by anyone else's house or windows! (Especially good since they might have seen him trying to throw a baseball.)
* President has no political allies or advisers, just a secret adviser who cares more about his own profit than anything else
* Pres drops his only trusted adviser, a man he has (secretly!) trusted for 20 years, at the drop of a hat. He apparently literally has no one else who he trusts or takes advice from now.
* FU slides in and somehow becomes President's best friend overnight. They pal around in the Oval and the residence, and the Pres asks him for life advice. FU tells him when to nap and when to work and etc etc.
* Pres loves FU, then hates FU, then loves FU, then lets FU lead him around on every single decision.
* The first lady, used to a life of politics and now at the top of the mountain, suddenly decides she needs marital counseling. WTF? And she can't make it more than 5 seconds without telling Claire some piece of crucial secret information each and every time they speak. Which also seems to be nightly.
* A priest counsels the Pres and his wife, then somehow wilts when threatened with a subpoena and spills his guts. All he needs to do is repeat, ad nauseum, "My discussions with the President are sacred and protected." With maybe an occasional, "besides, we never talked about anything remoted related to politics." How is marital counseling even really an issue, anyway?
* Even though FU has punked her repeatedly in the past, the Secretary of State lets herself be convinced to try to trick the President into impeaching himself. And somehow this is supposed to be good for the country? For the party?
* The trusted business adviser can plead the 5th and probably get away scott free, but instead decides to spill his guts to the special prosecutor in order to...I'm not sure what exactly. Get himself arrested but also get the President impeached?
* An impeachment scandal that begins, blows up, and ends with the President resigning in what seems like less than a week.

Ugh, too much. And I didn't even mention the "Deep Web" idiocy.

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Old 03-12-2014, 10:02 AM   #19
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I agree. The show became a parody of itself in the second half of this season.
And I really enjoyed it up until that point. The last few episodes were quite bad and I only watched them to put the series behind me.
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Old 03-12-2014, 03:16 PM   #20
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I was underwhelmed this season, and highly preferred the first half to the second half. Mainly because I found the political side of things this season to be so unbelievable that I couldn't properly enjoy the rest of the show.

A short list of political things that I cannot suspend disbelief on:

Have to agree with all of this but I found it good workout material -- unlike shows that I stop everything to watch undisturbed. I'll watch the next season on my exercise equipment.
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Old 03-12-2014, 03:26 PM   #21
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I thought it was great and wasn't bothered a bit by nitpicks like that. I watch shows like this because they are a bit fantastical (or more than a bit as the case may be).
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Old 03-12-2014, 03:51 PM   #22
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I really enjoyed this season. I agree that some of the stuff was totally outrageous, but that's why we watch TV shows and not real life.

The one thing that did really bother me though was how blatant Frank was with his lying. Like meeting with Feng and then flat out lying to POTUS and Tusk and saying that he didn't have any talks with Feng. Or telling SecState to grant Feng asylum, then claiming to POTUS that she came up with this on her own and that he didn't tell her to do it. Flat out lying just doesn't seem very strategic or manipulative and seems beneath a skilled operator like Frank. I would have rather seen him accomplish his goals with more underhanded and manipulative means rather than simply lying which just puts him in a he said/she said situation. Enough of those and people will stop believing him.
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Old 03-12-2014, 03:54 PM   #23
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In S1 he was more subtle while equally effective. Slightly more believable I suppose. In this one, he had to count on people flipping 180 multiple times in order for his plan to work. Lazy writing, IMO.
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Old 03-12-2014, 10:50 PM   #24
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Consider that Tusk had as much or more on Frank as he did on Walker.

"Yes. He knew."

Frank knew where the money was coming from before Walker thought to ask.
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Old 03-19-2014, 09:03 PM   #25
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I just finished and I want more. Now.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:12 AM   #26
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House of Thrones

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Old 03-26-2014, 10:41 AM   #27
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Great. Too bad that Frank took out the Quiznos that fed him.
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Old 03-26-2014, 11:00 AM   #28
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Yeah, that's weird. Still, I think, worth it.
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