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Old 06-01-2014, 01:42 AM   #1
Adam M. Costello
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Can Roamio play 1080p60 35Mbps H.264 ?

Can the Roamio play back 1920x1080p60 35Mbps H.264 (high profile) video? That's what my new camcorder (Canon Vixia HF R500) produces (in an mp4 container), and I'm looking for a device that can play it back at full fidelity.

I've created a 30-second (125 MB) clip and put it online:

http://bulk.nicemice.net:65080/tmp/test-canon-vixia-hf-r500-1920x1080p60-35Mbps-h264.mp4


Could someone please try copying (and/or streaming) it to their Roamio (using TiVo Desktop or pyTiVo or StreamBaby or whatever tools you prefer) and report the result? Can you get it to play at all? Do you need to re-mux it to a different container? Do you need to transcode the video stream? If you set the TiVo output format to "native", what format and frame rate does your TV say it is receiving? Do you see any frame rate conversion artifacts?

Thanks!

If the Roamio fails this test, does anyone here happen to know of some other device that can play both 1080p60 content and 1080i content, either passing the 1080i straight through to the HDMI like the TiVo can, or doing a very good job of converting it to 1080p60? My previous camcorder was HDV, which is 1080i MPEG-2.
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Old 06-01-2014, 02:37 AM   #2
Azlen
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Pushed via PyTivo without changing anything and it worked fine for me. There is a 1080p60 option in the video settings that you need to be sure to select though.
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Old 06-01-2014, 03:30 PM   #3
aaronwt
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i just published it to my Roamio Pro using TiVo Desktop. My Roamio Pro and TiVo Mini played it back without any issues.

I didn't need to do anything with TiVo Desktop. I just copied the file to my published videos folder and TiVo Desktop automatically transferred it to my Roamio Pro. From there my Mini, Roamio Pro, and Roamio Basic played it without issue. I didn't check it with my Premiere though.

EDIT: I just tried streaming it to my PRemiere. The Premiere played it back but there were video and audio glitches every few seconds. No idea if that is from streaming or it would do the same thing if it was local. But at least the Roamio and Minis have no issue playing that video.

EDIT: I just had TiVo Desktop transfer the video to the Premiere. EVen from a local file the Premiere had the same issues. So I guess the Premiere can't play it properly. Although that wasn't what you asked but I was curious after playing it without issue on my Pro, Basic, and Minis.
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Last edited by aaronwt : 06-01-2014 at 03:42 PM.
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Old 06-01-2014, 04:16 PM   #4
eboydog
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Did it get transcoded to MPEG in the transfer process? I had the idea that H.264 content wouldn't play on Minis unless it was transcoded first or was that with the Stream?
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Old 06-01-2014, 04:23 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eboydog View Post
Did it get transcoded to MPEG in the transfer process? I had the idea that H.264 content wouldn't play on Minis unless it was transcoded first or was that with the Stream?
I only know that I copied it to the published videos folder on my TiVo Desktop PC. Then within a minute the video was on my Roamio Pro. Then I streamed it to my Mini.

I don't use this folder very often. Usually for some gaming preview videos and the like which are also H.264.

But the Mini certainly doesn't have a problem playing the FiOS H.264 channels either.
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Old 06-01-2014, 11:52 PM   #6
Adam M. Costello
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Thanks everyone!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azlen View Post
Pushed via PyTivo without changing anything and it worked fine for me. There is a 1080p60 option in the video settings that you need to be sure to select though.
That sounds promising, but I'm concerned about the video setting. If I understand correctly, this is the HDMI output setting, and choosing 1080p60 means that it will convert everything to 1080p60 regardless of the source format. There should also be a "native" option, meaning do no conversion, just pass the decompressed video straight through to the HDMI output at its original resolution and frame rate. Then your TV should be able to tell you what format & frame rate it's receiving.

A TiVo support person said the Roamio would "probably" convert the 1080p60 content to 30 fps during playback. Maybe it is indeed converting to 30 fps while decoding (by dropping half the frames), then converting back to 60 fps (by repeating the remaining frames) because of the "1080p60" video setting. That's why I'm interested in what your TV says when the TiVo is set to "native".

Also, pyTiVo sometimes transcodes the video if it thinks the TiVo won't support it. You can tell whether this has happened by going to the video's title screen on the TiVo and pressing the Info button on the remote. pyTiVo puts a message about what transcoding it did, if any. For example, for the MPEG-2 transport streams from my old HDV camcorder, the message says "...TRANSCODE OPTIONS... -vcodec copy... -acodec copy...", which means it just changed the container format but copied the video/audio streams as-is.

Sorry to trouble you again!
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Old 06-02-2014, 12:27 AM   #7
Azlen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam M. Costello View Post
Thanks everyone!



That sounds promising, but I'm concerned about the video setting. If I understand correctly, this is the HDMI output setting, and choosing 1080p60 means that it will convert everything to 1080p60 regardless of the source format. There should also be a "native" option, meaning do no conversion, just pass the decompressed video straight through to the HDMI output at its original resolution and frame rate. Then your TV should be able to tell you what format & frame rate it's receiving.

A TiVo support person said the Roamio would "probably" convert the 1080p60 content to 30 fps during playback. Maybe it is indeed converting to 30 fps while decoding (by dropping half the frames), then converting back to 60 fps (by repeating the remaining frames) because of the "1080p60" video setting. That's why I'm interested in what your TV says when the TiVo is set to "native".

Also, pyTiVo sometimes transcodes the video if it thinks the TiVo won't support it. You can tell whether this has happened by going to the video's title screen on the TiVo and pressing the Info button on the remote. pyTiVo puts a message about what transcoding it did, if any. For example, for the MPEG-2 transport streams from my old HDV camcorder, the message says "...TRANSCODE OPTIONS... -vcodec copy... -acodec copy...", which means it just changed the container format but copied the video/audio streams as-is.

Sorry to trouble you again!

For 1080p your options are 1080p (60 fps) and 1080p (pass-thru only). You can't choose the pass thru only one by itself, you have to choose at least one other resolution.
The info key shows nothing about any transcoding.
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Old 06-02-2014, 12:48 AM   #8
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The pass-through option is specifically "1080p/24", while it is true that at least one non-pass-through resolution must be set, which is up to 1080p/60 on the Roamio, and up to 1080i/60 on the Premiere.

The TV attached should be able to tell you what is being used at any given time, usually with a single TV remote button press, on most TVs I'm aware of.
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Old 06-02-2014, 01:35 AM   #9
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Yes, it transfers and plays fine as is using pyTivo push.
* pyTivo push does not transcode it since it's compatible format.
* If I have all video resolutions enabled on Roamio Pro (equivalent to Native output) when I play the video the TV indicates switch to 1080p/60 resolution.
* Also, using Select-Play-Select-Replay-Select backdoor which gives you some text information on screen, including resolution of the stored video on the TiVo, it shows 1920x1080@59.940fps.
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Old 06-02-2014, 02:31 AM   #10
Adam M. Costello
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moyekj View Post
Yes, it transfers and plays fine as is using pyTivo push.
* pyTivo push does not transcode it since it's compatible format.
* If I have all video resolutions enabled on Roamio Pro (equivalent to Native output) when I play the video the TV indicates switch to 1080p/60 resolution.
Thank you! Yeah, I just learned that the "Native" setting on my TiVo HD does not exist on the Roamio. Sorry if I confused anyone with that.

Quote:
* Also, using Select-Play-Select-Replay-Select backdoor which gives you some text information on screen, including resolution of the stored video on the TiVo, it shows 1920x1080@59.940fps.
Cool, I didn't know about that. It works on the TiVo HD too.
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Old 06-02-2014, 10:52 AM   #11
L David Matheny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam M. Costello View Post
Yeah, I just learned that the "Native" setting on my TiVo HD does not exist on the Roamio.
But can't the Roamio essentially do native pass-thru if you just tell it that all output resolutions are acceptable to your TV?
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Old 06-02-2014, 12:27 PM   #12
moyekj
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Originally Posted by L David Matheny View Post
But can't the Roamio essentially do native pass-thru if you just tell it that all output resolutions are acceptable to your TV?
Yes. I think perhaps the only confusion here is that series 3 units had a "native" output selection. Series 4 and later units are more flexible in that you can set up all the specific outputs you want, and enabling all of them is equivalent to "native" setting on series 3 units.
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