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Old 08-23-2013, 09:52 AM   #1
philhu
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Why are OTA recordings 4-5x larger than cable/FIOS?

I have FIOS. SD recordings (I love old tv shows and save alot of them), require alot more space when recorded OTA than recorded from a cable channel.

I mean, 1 hr shows on the cable run about 1.2G, while OTA requires 8-9G files!

Therefore, I get alot lets recorded on the Tivo before it runs out of space!

Now, I know about compression, etc but why does one need a bandwidth of 13 mbps ota for sd shows on sd 480 channels?
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:14 AM   #2
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I think the OTA shows you're recording must be HD. SD videos don't require 13 Mbps for either MPEG-2 or H.264 encoding. (And your OTA is MPEG-2)
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:37 AM   #3
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Well, they might be using HD bandwidth, but these are definitely SD channels and SD shows (1960-1980 shows) on SD channels, usually subchannels, like 7-2 or 62-3

See attachment, a screen from kmttg showing sizes and bandwidths

sd shows, 1 hour long, taking 11G of space!!!!!
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File Type: jpg bandwidth.jpg (26.0 KB, 29 views)
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Old 08-23-2013, 11:39 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philhu View Post

sd shows, 1 hour long, taking 11G of space!!!!!
Nothing on your screen cap is using 11GB of space. The most space used is 7.12GB and they average 3.3GB/hr. Why not show a sample of the cable recordings?
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Old 08-23-2013, 12:01 PM   #5
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You are right 7gb/hr is still pretty large

Here is a sd cable channel. They all run just like this, around 1.1g/h
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File Type: jpg band2.jpg (23.7 KB, 13 views)
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Old 08-23-2013, 04:21 PM   #6
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What does MediaInfo or VideoRedDo say about the resolution of the SD OTA videos? I guess the TiVo info is saying 480, correct?
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Old 08-24-2013, 09:34 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlfl View Post
What does MediaInfo or VideoRedDo say about the resolution of the SD OTA videos? I guess the TiVo info is saying 480, correct?
Tivo does say 480.

I downloaded an sd 1hr show, kmttg says 4.70GB, mbps is 11.28
WAY TOO BIG!

I put the file into video redo, and there shows the problem. The station seems to have it listed as 1920x1080 with a 16x9 aspect ratio. Interesting, the 3 SD stations I grab stuff from all seem to do this, unless the TIVO has a bug and just SETS them that way, but I doubt that is the problem:

Code:
 File:                                     Name : W:\video\TIVO_Underground\Newdownloads\Six Million Dollar Man.The Bionic Woman..Aug21-2000.mpg
                                           Size : 4.821 GB
                                       Duration : 00:58:52.16
                                       Mux type : PS - MPEG2
 Video:                                Encoding : MPEG2
                                  VideoStreamID : xE0
                                     Frame rate : 29.97 fps
                                  Encoding size : 1920 x 1080
                                   Aspect ratio : 16:9
                                Header bit rate : 17.971 Mbps
                                     VBV buffer : 976 KBytes
                                        Profile : Main@High
                                    Progressive : Prog or Int
                                         Chroma : 4:2:0
                                       Bit rate : 10.300 Mbps
                                     Captioning : EIA 608
 Audio Stream: 1 (Primary)                Codec : AC3
                                         Format : DVD VOB
                                       Channels : 2.0
                                  Sub stream id : x80
                                       Bit rate : 192 Kbps
                                  Sampling rate : 48000
                                    Sample size : 16 bits

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Old 08-24-2013, 02:08 PM   #8
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That media report confirms what I kind of suspected.

I am guessing here somewhat, but.......

Most of the old SD shows have small frame sizes.

When the cable company gives you these old shows, they actually send you the small little frame. The black bars around the frame may not be coded at all. Then your cable box or Tivo stretches out that image so that it fills up your full TV screen.

On the other hand, when people receive shows over the air, the frame size is already coded to fill up the entire screen before you even receive it. Even the black bars are coded. So no stretching required.

There are a couple of reasons I can guess as to why they would do this.

For one thing, it saves the cable provider bandwith(and thereby money) to only code the original "little" frame size and then let you stretch the image out after you receive it.

For over the air broadcasts, the content providers may not care so much about bandwith because the transmissions are going over the air and not tying up space on their hard wired networks.

And also, some people receiving OTA signals do not have any type of set top box or Tivo whatsoever. They just plug their antennas directly into their TV's. So the broadcasters HAVE to give them their content full frame because they may not have any way to stretch it out.

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Last edited by True Colors : 08-24-2013 at 02:17 PM.
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Old 08-24-2013, 10:14 PM   #9
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The content is SD, but it is being sent over an HD channel.
If it were an SD channel, encoding size would show something low like 480 x 480.
A waste of bandwidth, I know, but it's their bandwidth to waste.

Is the video 'letter boxed' on the sides only or on all 4 sides?
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