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View Poll Results: If Netflix wanted to add advertisement I would:
I would just keep what I have, I don't mind a little advertisement. 0 0%
If the commercials were limited to just Prior to the start of the show, I am OK. 9 20.93%
I would be willing to pay more for a premium, advertisement free tier. 7 16.28%
I would drop Netflix at the first sign of any advertisement. 27 62.79%
Voters: 43. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-16-2014, 10:50 AM   #1
bradleys
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Net Neutrality - Adds in your Netflix stream?

With the demise of Net Neutrality the only thing guaranteed is that we will definitely see some changes and growing pains as the IP delivery companies try to get a piece of the revenue pie from the big internet companies.

Netflix and YouTube use 28% and 16% of the peak bandwidth respectively. One of the first changes you are going to see is Verizon and others charging Netflix and YouTube based on the "weight" they put on the infrastructure.

Netflix is going to have to recoup this revenue in some manner, either by adding advertisement in a Hulu+ model or by increasing rates to end users. Or possibly by a combination of the two by adding a premium (non advertisement tier).

Would you pay more for your Netflix account to avoid advertisement?

I think I will add a poll
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Old 01-16-2014, 11:11 AM   #2
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Would you pay more for your Netflix account to avoid advertisement?
It is kind of moot since Netflix would never add advertisements since that goes against their whole philosophy. The Net Neutrality issue isn't fully played out yet so I think we should wait and see what happens before we make any judgments like this.
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Old 01-16-2014, 11:16 AM   #3
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I think it's only a matter of time before one of the ISP's tries to extort money from Netflix. They will then come looking to customers for money as well. (I'm looking at you Comcast) This whole thing makes me sick to my stomach. The ISP's have every incentive manage their ISP's the same way they manage their TV business. They will demand money from Netflix (and others). When Netflix refuses to pay they will block access to the content. They have been doing it with cable TV for years and it always works out in their favor. Meanwhile customers are left in the lurch and can't get services that they are (un)happily paying for.

One of the articles I read had a nice analogy. It's like if a taxi company charged the customer for the taxi and also charged the hotel for bringing customers there. It would never happen in most industries.
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Old 01-16-2014, 11:22 AM   #4
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The reason I bought a Tivo was to avoid ads.
The reason I stream from Netflix is to avoid ads.
If Netflix goes the Hulu route they'll lose me as a customer.
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Old 01-16-2014, 12:25 PM   #5
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It is kind of moot since Netflix would never add advertisements since that goes against their whole philosophy. The Net Neutrality issue isn't fully played out yet so I think we should wait and see what happens before we make any judgments like this.
We do know that the ISP's want to develop different business models to share in the revenue of the internet market. This isn't a guess, they have been very clear about that.

Whether it is allowing a content provider to "host" the minutes you are using on their site, or creating premium access channels for higher speed throughput, or charging content providers based on the bandwidth they use, the intent is to transfer money from the content owners to the the ISP's.

If the ISP's create new business models to generate revenue from the Content Providers - that fee is GOING TO BE OFFSET. It will be offset either by advertisement dollars or direct cost to the customer in the form of subscription fees - but it will be offset.
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Old 01-16-2014, 12:51 PM   #6
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I think it's only a matter of time before one of the ISP's tries to extort money from Netflix.
I can't wait until they try. When Netflix pulls their content from a specific ISP because of this extortion, the ISP will never win that battle. Until then, I don't think most users understand what net neutrality is. But they will when this starts to happen.
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Old 01-16-2014, 01:42 PM   #7
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We have had many threads/posts where people like to dream about ip streaming replacing cable TV. I have often said it is not going to happen unless the cable company is making as much or more money. Well now we know what is going to happen, the cable company is going to get as much or more $$s from somebody and in the end the cost will be passed to the consumer.

We may actually be in the golden age of "cord cutting". As soon as cable companies actually start to lose revenue they are going to start charging everyone more to use their pipes.

The only possible way that doesn't happen is if there is some real competition. Which for most of us means some teleco stepping up and providing a real alternative (wired or wireless). This is possible but what I actually expect is for the telco's to only do the upgrades they will need to do when they can also charge more so either way get ready to pay more if you really want to be able to replace cable with reliable ip streaming.
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Old 01-16-2014, 01:49 PM   #8
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I can't wait until they try. When Netflix pulls their content from a specific ISP because of this extortion, the ISP will never win that battle. Until then, I don't think most users understand what net neutrality is. But they will when this starts to happen.
Only if there is an actual alternative. How many places can you actually replace a 15-20Mbps cable ISP with another provider? Between the 3 major cities (Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse) in my area there is one small aree outside of Buffalo that has an alternative ISP that can replace cable everywhere else there really is no viable option that doesn't cost an arm and a leg or isn't to slow to support reliable streaming.
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Old 01-16-2014, 01:59 PM   #9
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Exclamation

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It is kind of moot since Netflix would never add advertisements since that goes against their whole philosophy. The Net Neutrality issue isn't fully played out yet so I think we should wait and see what happens before we make any judgments like this.
What is the norm today for Netflix can easily change on a wim and/or heartbeat if it means more profits for its shareholders and/or long term viability. The only thing guaranteed these days is that NOTHING is guaranteed.

It would REALLY stink if Netflix went to some sort of commercial format, but I don't list it out of the realm of possibilities at this point.
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Old 01-16-2014, 02:08 PM   #10
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What is the norm today for Netflix can easily change on a wim and/or heartbeat if it means more profits for its shareholders and/or long term viability. The only thing guaranteed these days is that NOTHING is guaranteed.

It would REALLY stink if Netflix went to some sort of commercial format, but I don't list it out of the realm of possibilities at this point.
Netflix is trying to be the HBO of internet streaming. They know full well that adding advertising dilutes the premium feel to their content. I'm not worried in the least that advertisements will be added to their content. Price changes? Well, that is inevitable no matter what happens with net neutrality.
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Old 01-16-2014, 02:24 PM   #11
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My biggest concern about this whole thing is that a good majority of ISPs are also cable companies and they have a business interest in deterring Netflix usage in favor of their own offerings. So rather then extorting Netflix they may just block them out completely.

Given the monopoly/duopoly in most places, and the dependence we now have on internet access, I really think ISPs should be declared utilities and regulated as such. They should not be allowed to hinder progress for their own selfish business interests. If bandwidth is really such a problem then they can start charging customers by the byte with different rates for peak vs off peak times.

The only reason this whole net neutrality thing is even an issue because ISPs are part of bigger companies with competing interests. If ISPs were all standalone entities who's sole purpose was to feed you the internet they would never even consider this kind of crap.
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Old 01-16-2014, 03:27 PM   #12
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My biggest concern about this whole thing is that a good majority of ISPs are also cable companies and they have a business interest in deterring Netflix usage in favor of their own offerings. So rather then extorting Netflix they may just block them out completely.

Given the monopoly/duopoly in most places, and the dependence we now have on internet access, I really think ISPs should be declared utilities and regulated as such. They should not be allowed to hinder progress for their own selfish business interests. If bandwidth is really such a problem then they can start charging customers by the byte with different rates for peak vs off peak times.

The only reason this whole net neutrality thing is even an issue because ISPs are part of bigger companies with competing interests. If ISPs were all standalone entities who's sole purpose was to feed you the internet they would never even consider this kind of crap.
I my area somebody tried to install a big pipe (fiber optics) and only rent space on the pipe, so you could get your internet from one co and your cable from another, phone from a 3rd etc, they would maintain this pipe. The system was installed and almost nobody used it, I had Comcast triple play and did not want to through the hassle of another change, even if it might save me some money, teaser rates that were offered did not do the trick for me. We now have ATT u-verse in my area so I can negotiate with Comcast with a viable threat.
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Old 01-16-2014, 03:43 PM   #13
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Given the monopoly/duopoly in most places, and the dependence we now have on internet access, I really think ISPs should be declared utilities and regulated as such. They should not be allowed to hinder progress for their own selfish business interests. If bandwidth is really such a problem then they can start charging customers by the byte with different rates for peak vs off peak times.
This.
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Old 01-16-2014, 06:13 PM   #14
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I can't wait until they try. When Netflix pulls their content from a specific ISP because of this extortion, the ISP will never win that battle. Until then, I don't think most users understand what net neutrality is. But they will when this starts to happen.
Of course the ISP will win. Many people only have one option. Comcast is the only option at my address. They can do whatever they want. I'm stuck giving them my money anyway.

We just saw this happen with CBS. I major network was pulled just because these grown men couldn't sit down at a table like adults and work it out. They don't give a damn about customers.
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Old 01-16-2014, 06:16 PM   #15
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Netflix is trying to be the HBO of internet streaming.
Exactly. Look how much power HBO has.......very little. Comcast doesn't allow me to watch HBO on my Roku but I can watch on my other devices. HBO has no say in who gets to watch their content. Every bit of it is controlled by the puppet masters at Comcast. Comcast could put HBO out of business pretty easily if they wanted to.
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Old 01-16-2014, 06:18 PM   #16
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That's the problem. Most people only have 1 or 2 options when it comes to broadband. Here we only have Charter or AT&T DSL. I had DSL for years and it was pretty terrible. I'd hate to go back, but I would if Charter starts screwing with Netflix. However if they both decide to screw with Netflix then I'm SOL.
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Old 01-16-2014, 07:28 PM   #17
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That's the problem. Most people only have 1 or 2 options when it comes to broadband. Here we only have Charter or AT&T DSL. I had DSL for years and it was pretty terrible. I'd hate to go back, but I would if Charter starts screwing with Netflix. However if they both decide to screw with Netflix then I'm SOL.
Even if a person's DSL provider didn't mess with anything currently most peoples DSL only has enough band width for one stream and that might not be an HD one. Not very useful for most people. In fact I just speed tested my DSL go a whole 1.0 Mbps.
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Old 01-19-2014, 07:31 AM   #18
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I can't wait until they try. When Netflix pulls their content from a specific ISP because of this extortion, the ISP will never win that battle. Until then, I don't think most users understand what net neutrality is. But they will when this starts to happen.
In most areas, there is no real competition for high speed data to the home. The local Cableco has a monopoly. Netflix can pull what they want (likely will be network slowdowns to those routes, not gone altogether) but there will be little influence from the users from Cableco point of view. Users will subscribe to services that work. Netflix will loose.

Comcast is already doing this across the country. Many locations Comcast customers cannot get full bandwidth SuperHD steams from Netflix now due to bandwith shaping to those routes. Even with internet 'service' at MUCH higher than required rates.

The end of net neutrality is the beginning of the ISPs controlling and charging end users ala carte for usage. They already charge for data quantity. Now they will charge premium for specific services as well.
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Old 01-19-2014, 07:40 AM   #19
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That's the problem. Most people only have 1 or 2 options when it comes to broadband. Here we only have Charter or AT&T DSL. I had DSL for years and it was pretty terrible. I'd hate to go back, but I would if Charter starts screwing with Netflix. However if they both decide to screw with Netflix then I'm SOL.
Your SOL. AT&T now has data limits and overage charges nationwide that pretty much eliminate real usage of IP video services. $10/50Gb adds up. Especially at 6Mpbs limits for DSL.

The ISPs have a monopoly. They know it. As cable revenue drops, data services revenue will rise. This means one thing. higher monthly bills for data. One way or another. Lots of pricing models, but all mean more $$ flowing from my pocket to the Cableco.
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Old 01-19-2014, 03:31 PM   #20
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Your SOL. AT&T now has data limits and overage charges nationwide that pretty much eliminate real usage of IP video services. $10/50Gb adds up. Especially at 6Mpbs limits for DSL.

The ISPs have a monopoly. They know it. As cable revenue drops, data services revenue will rise. This means one thing. higher monthly bills for data. One way or another. Lots of pricing models, but all mean more $$ flowing from my pocket to the Cableco.
I'd rather pay overage charges or metered per-byte rates then give them the ability to block or throttle specific services. Although the 6Mbps bandwidth probably wouldn't work well for me as I use both Netflix and VUDU a lot and Netflix Super HD is 6Mbps and VUDU HDX is closer to 10Mbps.
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Old 01-20-2014, 07:15 AM   #21
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I'd rather pay overage charges or metered per-byte rates then give them the ability to block or throttle specific services. Although the 6Mbps bandwidth probably wouldn't work well for me as I use both Netflix and VUDU a lot and Netflix Super HD is 6Mbps and VUDU HDX is closer to 10Mbps.
You may get your wish. Comcast has openly stated they are headed there and now have data allotments with home service and per GB chagres above the monthly allotment. Speeds and data allotment vary with service subscribed to. ALL Comcast home internet services will soon be metered. They are rolling out the meters in many new cities each month. To get unmetered service now requires a Comcast business data line and only some of those subs are unlimited.

TWC and Charter will follow suit when they see the additional revenue stream.

You will either pay the Cableco for the video programming, or the data to get it via IP.
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Old 01-20-2014, 02:31 PM   #22
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You may get your wish. Comcast has openly stated they are headed there and now have data allotments with home service and per GB chagres above the monthly allotment. Speeds and data allotment vary with service subscribed to. ALL Comcast home internet services will soon be metered. They are rolling out the meters in many new cities each month. To get unmetered service now requires a Comcast business data line and only some of those subs are unlimited.

TWC and Charter will follow suit when they see the additional revenue stream.

You will either pay the Cableco for the video programming, or the data to get it via IP.
The problem is that with this ruling they can do this AND still block/throttle a specific service like Netflix if they want. I'm willing to pay for metered network but only if it's completely neutral.

Honestly I don't think this is going to take off. Customers are going to revolt. We've been conditioned for unmetered internet access since the late 90s. Trying to go back is going to be a tough sell.
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Old 01-20-2014, 02:42 PM   #23
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I'd be fine with a metered plan, and some months we've consumed 200gb mainly though streaming, so I know if won't be cheap. Feel free to charge more during peak hours so that torrenters shift their behavior (and maybe some streaming companies will put storage in their boxes so I can cache stuff at 2am to watch during peak hours). But telling me that I need subscribe to your Ultra Plus Entertainment package bundle in order to stream Youtube is BS.
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Old 01-20-2014, 03:54 PM   #24
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The problem is that with this ruling they can do this AND still block/throttle a specific service like Netflix if they want. I'm willing to pay for metered network but only if it's completely neutral.

Honestly I don't think this is going to take off. Customers are going to revolt. We've been conditioned for unmetered internet access since the late 90s. Trying to go back is going to be a tough sell.
Actually the 2 ISPs in my area have found a solution they just let there networks grind to a halt when most people want to stream and make the experience so miserable that you don't bother.

I supposedly have 6Mbps Frontier DSL and from 6:00 am to maybe noon I get 6Mbps then it slow downs through the afternoon and by this time through the rest of the night the best I will get is maybe 1.5Mbps (just tested at 1.25Mbps, had 6Mbps this morning at 8:00 am) I have a friend on TWC and she said she has found the same thing dropping down to 2-3 Mbps or slower in the evening.

No idea what TWC problem is but Frontier told me straight out their equipment couldn't handle the demand and there would be no fix until/if they did an upgrade (they had no time frame). So there we have it, only solution is to not bother with streaming services and bit torrent/download anything I might want to stream in the morning instead.
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Old 01-20-2014, 04:24 PM   #25
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I typically watch TV late at night, like between 10pm and 2am, so I never really have a problem streaming. Although I have noticed that my connection gets a bit slow after 4:00pm. However it's not as bad now that we live in a house, vs back when we lived in the townhouse complex. (I'm guessing the bigger houses mean less people on our "node")
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