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Old 08-16-2013, 10:29 AM   #781
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Originally Posted by zalta198000 View Post
Any chance that the mini will work with a 2 tuner tivo once the dynamic tuner allocation is in place ?
First what do you mean by "work with a 2 tuner TiVo"?

If you mean not require a 4 or 6 tuner TiVo for setup and be able to be setup and work fully with a 2 tuner Premiere - there is a chance but I think it is slim.

If you mean work in anyway with a Series 3 or Series 2 two tuner TiVo - never going to happen.

If you mean be able to stream from a 2 tuner Premiere after being setup with a 4 or 6 tuner TiVo DVR - it can do that now.
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Old 08-16-2013, 10:34 AM   #782
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It makes it easier to upgrade after the season has started. If starting form scratch, all the shows are on the schedule so you can find them in the guide to setup the Season Passes.

If you are upgrading then it's just a matter of using the online Season Pass manager which works great. I used it when I upgraded to my Elites without any issue. But since it was during the normal Tv season it was much easier than if it had been during Summer when most of the shows woudl not have been scheduled yet. It's easier to see if there will be any issues when the shows are being broadcast.

Plus when upgrading to a new model, I typically run the boxes concurrently for a few weeks.

I'm not even sure I've had a new TiVo released before the Tv season started. Excpet maybe the TiVoHD. I remember the DirecTV HDTiVo being launched in late May/early June after the season had ended and I remember I had wished it had launched during the TV season so I could have used it more.
I was thinking more in terms of the shows you have recorded. I'll have new shows being recorded each night once the fall season begins. It takes me a while to watch them all. That is not an ideal time to upgrade the Tivo. You can try and catch up on all of your shows before getting the new one, but as you do that, new shows are being record. Very difficult to get completely caught up.... You can say just transfer them to the new Tivo. But not everyone can transfer shows with because of copyright issues or just not that tech swavy. If it gets released mid-fall season, that might be enough reason to wait. Maybe wait until XMas time when shows go to re-runs for a while.
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Old 08-16-2013, 11:03 AM   #783
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do you have reason to believe that the launch is eminent? they are not going to do a press conference in front of a podium and a barely visible projector screen like the premiere launch?
Nothing concrete, but suspicions. And I could envision a scenario where an announcement precedes availability (as they did with the Premiere). But it's possible the retail & announcement timing will line up as it did with the Mini. The PR/Comms team is entirely different, new since the Premiere's launch - so anything is possible. Including Tebow as grandmaster of ceremonies.
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Old 08-16-2013, 04:56 PM   #784
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Yeah there's an awful lot of writing on the wall. I get the sense that I'm going to check back here and find pix from someone's local BB with stacks of Roamios sitting on a shelf.

That said, and as much as I really want to pounce on a Pro to replace my cable co DVR, I feel like so much is afoot right now that I may wait even if the TiVo hits tomorrow.

Between the upcoming intel, apple and Sony services, channels as apps, etc i wouldn't be surprised if a year from now the shelves in my entertainment system look very different than they do now.
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:00 PM   #785
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I'll probably pick up the 6 tuner just for the faster UI. The speed of the UI on my 4 tuner unit annoys me enough that I'm willing to spend hundreds of dollars just to replace it. I'll get the 6 tuner simply because it'll make it more future proof. Plus if it has a built in stream then that's one less device sitting on my desk sucking power.
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:14 PM   #786
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Excuse my ignorance but why is it important to have streaming built into the TiVo itself? Aren't the Premiers capable of streaming to each other now? I'm confused, unless you mean outside the home which would be very cool.
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:26 PM   #787
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Excuse my ignorance but why is it important to have streaming built into the TiVo itself? Aren't the Premiers capable of streaming to each other now? I'm confused, unless you mean outside the home which would be very cool.
One of the rumors is the top 6 tuner model has a chip in it that lets it do what the Tivo Stream can do.
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:48 PM   #788
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do you have reason to believe that the launch is eminent?
Wouldn't severely declining stocks at retailers suggest that? I supposed TiVo could be so incompetent as to allow stock to decline to zero while not releasing anything for months. That's the sort of thing that kills companies.
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:59 PM   #789
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One of the rumors is the top 6 tuner model has a chip in it that lets it do what the Tivo Stream can do.
yes but only 2 streams instead of 4.
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Old 08-16-2013, 11:51 PM   #790
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<snip>If you are upgrading then it's just a matter of using the online Season Pass manager which works great. I used it when I upgraded to my Elites without any issue<snip>
Once again, aarontwt (perhaps Aaron WITH TiVo), presents another "works great" and "without any issue(s)" statement regarding TiVo.

In what pocket or parallel universe do you live? I'd like to move there.

I don't consider all my Season Passes getting re-organized in some random manner, and not being able to transfer any that aren't in the current Guide Data, to be working great, without issues, or problem free. That's just how it works in my universe, which seems to be shared by more than just myself, based on how many people post about these two issues...

I also experience far greater issues when transferring them from a HD to Premiere, which I expect to remain an issue, and may get even worse. Any new frustration with this on the next gen may push people just far enough to dump their HD models. TiVo wants to sell new TiVos and new subs, so what better way to push people in that direction... I hope that this actually won't be the case, but only time and the new product will tell...

I fully expect more "no issues", "problem-free", "works great", and "it is only a minor issue, which really doesn't affect me" posts. I usually know what aaronwt is going to say BEFORE he even posts. It's very similar to stealth PR campaigns. The always upgrading for free, or close to it, as well as always puffing up what his existing TiVo values should be at the time he resells them also reek of somebody on TiVo's payroll, or somebody who gets rewarded with special gift packages from TiVo.

Admittedly, I have no proof to base my suspicions on. I just see a pattern, and the hallmarks of what I suspect.

Anybody have a TCD746320 (original 2-tuner Premiere w/OTA support) or the 500GB equivalent, new in box, or never used for sale? Please PM me if you do. I'd like to have at least one virgin "parts" unit on-hand, like I do for my HD ones. If you know of a link to a site, or person, selling one, also please PM me. I'd prefer one that is of the latest revision (since TiVo DOES update the insides over time), and not one that has been sitting around for years, but beggars can't be choosers...

Last edited by nooneuknow : 08-16-2013 at 11:58 PM. Reason: added better specs for what I'm looking to buy
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Old 08-17-2013, 12:13 AM   #791
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Old 08-17-2013, 01:06 AM   #792
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Admittedly, I have no proof to base my suspicions on. I just see a pattern, and the hallmarks of what I suspect.
Although, I do know, that in the past, if I kept my TiVo problems, issues, bugs, and malfunctions between myself and TiVo, and only praised them publicly, as well as helping out others with things that I could, I *DID* get boxes of free gifts from TiVo (one of their PR reps), mostly TiVo swag, like hats, bags, breath mints (yes, they made TiVo breath mints), dolls, and remotes.

That was back in the end-of-life period of the HD, and the birth of the Premiere. The early period of the Premiere was just to much for me to remain silent about the problems (and to keep the TiVo praise going), and the gifts ceased (obviously).

Don't waste your time looking for where and when this public praise and help was posted. I redacted all of it. Although, I DO try to help, when I can, here.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled programming/arguing/bickering/guessing/speculating, and the one person (that I've noticed) of the whole TCF community who has nothing, but praise, for TiVo...
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Old 08-17-2013, 04:40 AM   #793
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yes but only 2 streams instead of 4.
If you only have one TiVo then the current one can really only do 3 streams. I know the Stream itself can transcode 4 streams at a time but it uses the MRS functionality to work and any one TiVo can only stream 3 things at a time.

My biggest question about the new 6 tuner unit is will it's built in Stream functionality work with shows stored on other TiVos on your network? Or only the shows in it's on My Shows list? I still need a 2 tuner Premiere to record my analog only stations and the main shows I stream are typically from those stations. So I need to be able to stream from the 2 tuner Premiere as well. If it can't then that means I have to keep my standalone Stream around.
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Old 08-17-2013, 05:47 AM   #794
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Once again, aarontwt (perhaps Aaron WITH TiVo), presents another "works great" and "without any issue(s)" statement regarding TiVo.

In what pocket or parallel universe do you live? I'd like to move there.

I don't consider all my Season Passes getting re-organized in some random manner, and not being able to transfer any that aren't in the current Guide Data, to be working great, without issues, or problem free. That's just how it works in my universe, which seems to be shared by more than just myself, based on how many people post about these two issues...

....................
And this is why I said it makes it easier to upgrade once the TV season starts up. Transferring the season passes is better. Since the shows are airing and will be in the guide. And you can also check to make sure there are no issues since they are being aired weekly. As far as a random order, I don't care what order the SPs are when I use the online transfer, just that they transferred. Since I can re-order them online after they have been transferred. Which is much better than a few years ago when I switched to the Premiere and had to redo all my season passes manually.

I call the fact that I can quickly transfer my season passes working great. That alone is a huge difference from spring 2010 when I switched from the S3 to the S4 and had to re-enter every season pass manually. From my perspective that is great. Having them show up in any order is no big deal since the hard part is getting the passes transferred. Once they are transferred you can re-order them online.

I have no experience using the online SP manager between an S3 and an S4. Only between an S4 and an S4(two tuner Premieres to 4 tuner premieres). SInce it was not implemented until fall 2010. This experience is from my point of view, not yours. Your frame of reference is obviously different than mine.

And why the crap about TiVos payroll? I wish I got paid by TiVo since I've certainly purchased enough TiVos over the last twelve years. But I have never worked for TiVo. I was in some beta programs in past years, but not in a while. And I have certainly never received any kickbacks from TiVo. When I sell my TiVos I have typically received some great prices for my lifetime TiVos. But I have also sold them when a new model has been released. Not years later after the price has gone down in the resale market.
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Old 08-17-2013, 06:02 AM   #795
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I don't consider all my Season Passes getting re-organized in some random manner, and not being able to transfer any that aren't in the current Guide Data, to be working great, without issues, or problem free. That's just how it works in my universe, which seems to be shared by more than just myself, based on how many people post about these two issues...
FYI, since the last TiVo software update on series 4 TiVos, season passes for series currently not in the guide now do transfer fine, at least when using kmttg SP manager (don't know about the online manager as I don't use that anymore). So true backup and restore for any and all series is now possible. When using kmttg the order in which you load SPs from a saved backup is preserved and any auto record wishlists are preserved as well, both of which I don't think ever worked with the TiVo online manager.
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Old 08-17-2013, 06:18 AM   #796
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FYI, since the last TiVo software update on series 4 TiVos, season passes for series currently not in the guide now do transfer fine, at least when using kmttg SP manager (don't know about the online manager as I don't use that anymore). So true backup and restore for any and all series is now possible. When using kmttg the order in which you load SPs from a saved backup is preserved and any auto record wishlists are preserved as well, both of which I don't think ever worked with the TiVo online manager.
I guess I'll have to get around to giving kmttg a try, then. What you just said had me go from "meh, I don't want any more software on my cluttered computer" to "it's worth trying it".

Although, it does strengthen my stance on TiVo's way of doing things, and how they aren't issue-free, or working great (as far as transferring SPs goes), since it takes a non-TiVo software to do it right.

You are also right about AR WishLists not transferring with TiVo's "solution".

Thanks for the info.
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Old 08-17-2013, 06:35 AM   #797
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<snip>And why the crap about TiVos payroll? I wish I got paid by TiVo since I've certainly purchased enough TiVos over the last twelve years. But I have never worked for TiVo. I was in some beta programs in past years, but not in a while. And I have certainly never received any kickbacks from TiVo. When I sell my TiVos I have typically received some great prices for my lifetime TiVos. But I have also sold them when a new model has been released. Not years later after the price has gone down in the resale market.
If TiVo isn't giving you some gift boxes, I'd be upset, if I were in your place, then.

Is there anything you own that breaks, or has issues you are bothered by (since nothing TiVo-related is ever in those categories)?

Why are you so active in saying how great everything TiVo is, and how much value it retains, while never posting any help for those who need help? That seems to be the main draw here (people who Googled a TiVo issue and found themselves here).

It's like as if an Apple iFanBoy droid lost his way and landed here and converted, where most people (seem to be) griping, or seeking help...

I'm not anti-TiVo. I am not upset at people who don't experience all the same issues I do. You are just so predictable, in what you will say, when people say they are having TiVo troubles, or ask questions that have even a hint of them feeling let-down by TiVo. Like I said, whatever universe you live in, where all your TiVos work great, generation after generation, and you upgrade for free, close to it, or even profit, I'd like to move to that universe!

I also just realized that you just admitted you can't speak for all, or even many TiVo users, since you don't keep older gen TiVos around long enough to experience interoperability issues.

As I've said before, since somebody will ask: I have two choices in my market. I can either rent the cableco equipment (which I know sucks), or use TiVo. If I had a better alternative, I'd have bailed, and wouldn't still be here. Maybe the next gen TiVo is the solution. But, I refuse to hold my breath, hoping they learned their lessons and don't repeat mistakes of the past (or come up with terrible new ones).
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Old 08-17-2013, 07:06 AM   #798
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My biggest question about the new 6 tuner unit is will it's built in Stream functionality work with shows stored on other TiVos on your network? Or only the shows in it's on My Shows list? I still need a 2 tuner Premiere to record my analog only stations and the main shows I stream are typically from those stations. So I need to be able to stream from the 2 tuner Premiere as well. If it can't then that means I have to keep my standalone Stream around.
Thats's a great question. I'm guessing that the dual-transcoding of the BCM7425 SoC expected to be in the 6-tuner will only Stream shows stored internal to the box. If they can keep The Streaming software generic enough to act like the networked Stream box that would be surprising. I suppose this is a use-case where the quad-stream external unit makes a lot of sense.
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Old 08-17-2013, 07:14 AM   #799
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Thats's a great question. I'm guessing that the dual-transcoding of the BCM7425 SoC expected to be in the 6-tuner will only Stream shows stored internal to the box. If they can keep The Streaming software generic enough to act like the networked Stream box that would be surprising. I suppose this is a use-case where the quad-stream external unit makes a lot of sense.
I could also envision them winding down Stream production - simplifying their product line while encouraging folks to upgrade.

Somewhat unrelated to this, related more to a recent Investor forum post, I had wished TiVo would have leveraged their strong brand love (a few years back) and expanded the product line into universal remotes and TiVo Blu-ray players, etc in addition to or in lieu of going after the cable market.
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Old 08-17-2013, 08:31 AM   #800
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I could also envision them winding down Stream production - simplifying their product line while encouraging folks to upgrade.

Somewhat unrelated to this, related more to a recent Investor forum post, I had wished TiVo would have leveraged their strong brand love (a few years back) and expanded the product line into universal remotes and TiVo Blu-ray players, etc in addition to or in lieu of going after the cable market.
What about the power supply? In the Premiere 4-tuner models/Elites they went with an internal PS, but one output at 12v (IIRC), which to me, seems like a step towards a wall-wart or brick-type PS is in the future, since they already have the voltage being split up on the mainboard of what is already on the market.

Anybody else worried about losing the ease of repairing power supply problems, since part of what *was* on the PS is now part of the mainboard? Before anybody says their still-living 4-tuner model, or Elite, is *proof* that we need not worry, think about how short it's current life has been, compared to how long the older generations have lived, and keep on living (maybe with an *easy* repair, or two, along the way, or none at all).

The natural, admittedly cynical, side of me feels like this will result in a more certain "life" in the "lifetime" service, which can only be transferred ONCE under any warranty, even alternate extended ones, without purchasing a new warranty. Then, there's the fact that sometimes TiVo charges a fee for transferring said lifetime service.

I'm actually On-Topic, with some valid points and concerns. Any takers?
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Old 08-17-2013, 08:53 AM   #801
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What about the power supply? In the Premiere 4-tuner models/Elites they went with an internal PS, but one output at 12v (IIRC), which to me, seems like a step towards a wall-wart or brick-type PS is in the future, since they already have the voltage being split up on the mainboard of what is already on the market.

Anybody else worried about losing the ease of repairing power supply problems, since part of what *was* on the PS is now part of the mainboard? Before anybody says their still-living 4-tuner model, or Elite, is *proof* that we need not worry, think about how short it's current life has been, compared to how long the older generations have lived, and keep on living (maybe with an *easy* repair, or two, along the way, or none at all).

The natural, admittedly cynical, side of me feels like this will result in a more certain "life" in the "lifetime" service, which can only be transferred ONCE under any warranty, even alternate extended ones, without purchasing a new warranty. Then, there's the fact that sometimes TiVo charges a fee for transferring said lifetime service.

I'm actually On-Topic, with some valid points and concerns. Any takers?
I've had ten plus TiVo since my Philips Series 1 many ions ago. I've never had a power supply failure. I've had two hard drive failures (Series 3 & Premiere XL4) and one tuner failure (Premiere XL4). I'm not concerned about power supply issues but hope TiVo keeps the PS internal to the box versus an external wall-wart. BTW, the Best Buy extended warranty is one-time use and TiVo had no issues transferring lifetime once I faxed them a copy of the Best Buy warranty exchange receipt.
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Old 08-17-2013, 09:11 AM   #802
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The S3/HD power supply failures due to bad caps are well known and it was a very common issue for a variety of electronics from the mid-2000s. I had two LCDs die with the same problem.

I wouldn't worry about it with the S4s or S5s however.
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Old 08-17-2013, 10:06 AM   #803
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I don't think anyone has a a lower opinion of TiVo's current s/w development and testing process than I do, but IMNSHO one of the things that makes TiVo preferable to other DVRs is that fact that third party s/w such as kmttg and pyTivo actually work with a stock TiVo.
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Old 08-17-2013, 10:22 AM   #804
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I'll probably pick up the 6 tuner just for the faster UI. The speed of the UI on my 4 tuner unit annoys me enough that I'm willing to spend hundreds of dollars just to replace it. I'll get the 6 tuner simply because it'll make it more future proof. Plus if it has a built in stream then that's one less device sitting on my desk sucking power.
Yeah that's why I've avoided the premiere line for this long. I experienced the lagginess at a friend's house and...yeah it would make me crazy day in and day out. So I've been suffering the cable co DVR waiting. It's awful in many many ways, but I didn't pay $400 for it

It's going to be tough for me to resist the Roamio pro...it's sort of the box I've been waiting for. I just have a sneaking suspicion that a year from now I'll wish I hadn't spent the money on it.
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Old 08-17-2013, 10:54 AM   #805
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Frankly, I use the iPad as a remote far more often then the old peanut remote.

With the new processor, I am sure that the S5 line will have a more responsive HDUI, but that won't change my behavior... I suspect that I will hardly even notice the improvement.

As I have said before, I am really looking for that next innovative idea from TiVo, hopefully focused around remote viewing. They need to differentiate this unit from both the existing Premier line and from the other high end CableCo offerings.

I will probably wait until after the first of the year to upgrade. I will put my two S3 units up for sale, so I suppose it depends what kind if deal I get on them.

I would like to average $300 apiece. If I can do that - I will pull the trigger on the base 6 tuner unit and one Mini.
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Old 08-17-2013, 11:14 AM   #806
davezatz
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Originally Posted by bradleys View Post
With the new processor, I am sure that the S5 line will have a more responsive HDUI, but that won't change my behavior... I suspect that I will hardly even notice the improvement.
If you use YouTube or Netflix you probably will...
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Old 08-17-2013, 11:15 AM   #807
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I could also envision them winding down Stream production - simplifying their product line while encouraging folks to upgrade.

Somewhat unrelated to this, related more to a recent Investor forum post, I had wished TiVo would have leveraged their strong brand love (a few years back) and expanded the product line into universal remotes and TiVo Blu-ray players, etc in addition to or in lieu of going after the cable market.
Wasnt that Best buy tv trying to do that? That seem to flop pretty badly.
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Old 08-17-2013, 11:18 AM   #808
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If you only have one TiVo then the current one can really only do 3 streams. I know the Stream itself can transcode 4 streams at a time but it uses the MRS functionality to work and any one TiVo can only stream 3 things at a time.

My biggest question about the new 6 tuner unit is will it's built in Stream functionality work with shows stored on other TiVos on your network? Or only the shows in it's on My Shows list? I still need a 2 tuner Premiere to record my analog only stations and the main shows I stream are typically from those stations. So I need to be able to stream from the 2 tuner Premiere as well. If it can't then that means I have to keep my standalone Stream around.
As mentioned by sbill that is not the normal use case for the BRCM chip so wouldn't count on it. They could probably get it to work if they wanted to though.
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Old 08-17-2013, 11:30 AM   #809
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Originally Posted by nooneuknow View Post

If TiVo isn't giving you some gift boxes, I'd be upset, if I were in your place, then.

Is there anything you own that breaks, or has issues you are bothered by (since nothing TiVo-related is ever in those categories)?

Why are you so active in saying how great everything TiVo is, and how much value it retains, while never posting any help for those who need help? That seems to be the main draw here (people who Googled a TiVo issue and found themselves here).

It's like as if an Apple iFanBoy droid lost his way and landed here and converted, where most people (seem to be) griping, or seeking help...

I'm not anti-TiVo. I am not upset at people who don't experience all the same issues I do. You are just so predictable, in what you will say, when people say they are having TiVo troubles, or ask questions that have even a hint of them feeling let-down by TiVo. Like I said, whatever universe you live in, where all your TiVos work great, generation after generation, and you upgrade for free, close to it, or even profit, I'd like to move to that universe!

I also just realized that you just admitted you can't speak for all, or even many TiVo users, since you don't keep older gen TiVos around long enough to experience interoperability issues.

As I've said before, since somebody will ask: I have two choices in my market. I can either rent the cableco equipment (which I know sucks), or use TiVo. If I had a better alternative, I'd have bailed, and wouldn't still be here. Maybe the next gen TiVo is the solution. But, I refuse to hold my breath, hoping they learned their lessons and don't repeat mistakes of the past (or come up with terrible new ones).
Any time I have had an issue with a TiVo I have always posted about it. Most recently with Netflix on the Mini. I was the first one to post about the Mini rebooting when it switched to 1080P24 output. I verified multiple times with both of my Minis. This has always been the case if I've run into any issue with my TiVos. For some reason you seem to think everything I post about TiVo is positive. I've always posted positive and negative. I've posted many times about any issue I've had with the TiVo or with TiVo customer service. Of course I can only post about my experience or an experience my GF may have had. But the positive has far out weighed the negative. Again from my experience, not yours.

My two oldest TiVos are two lifetime S3 (OLED) TiVos that I got in 2006. They have been running 24/7/365 except for when I upgraded the hard drives(once to 500GB and then to 1TB) and when I took them to my GFs house after giving them to her. They have worked without any power supply problems or other issues(I probably replaced the fans before I gave them to her, but that was just being proactive since I had already used them for several years before giving them to her). When I upgraded to the Premieres my GF had a couple of S2 TiVos I had given her. So I gave her the option of getting two of the new S4 TiVos or two of the older S3 boxes. She chose the S3 boxes because of the 1TB drive in them. ANd the Premiere could not be upgraded initially. So I sold the two lifetime Premieres that I had purchased with the promotion for those two S3 boxes. My TiVos have always been on a UPS. Even at my GFs house they are on a UPS. And I'm guessing that is one of the reasons why I have not had major issues with my TiVos over the last twelve years.

Hopefully my good luck with the TiVos continue with the S5 series.
But you never know. After using hundreds of hard drives over the last twenty years I finally had one die while in service this month. That was a first for me. Typically any issue I've run into with a hard drive was when it was brand new before being used for storage. Like one of several 3TB Seagates I purchased this week. One of them failed the seagate diagnostics so I need to send it back to Newegg for an exchange.
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Last edited by aaronwt : 08-17-2013 at 11:58 AM.
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Old 08-17-2013, 11:33 AM   #810
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Originally Posted by davezatz View Post
If you use YouTube or Netflix you probably will...
Kids use Netflix - me, not so much. Their pain doesn't bother me all that much I suppose.

Once again that is nice and all - but if the only improvement TiVo is offering is an upgraded processor and 2 more tuners then why not just call it the Premier Gen 2 line? We already had an upgrade to the line going from 2 to 4 tuners.

With a name like Roamio and rumors of cloud storage - they have a real opportunity to take this to the logical next step and provide a "competitive technology" to sling box.

Now that would be exciting! That would generate a buzz on the tech blogs and that would provide a real incentive for current users to upgrade and also entice new subscribers!

A simple incremental hardware refresh will do nothing but generate a collective - meh...
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Last edited by bradleys : 08-17-2013 at 12:13 PM.
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