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Old 07-14-2013, 03:18 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by busyba View Post
I've always wondered if it matters if the "question" answer makes any sense, just as long as you answer in the form of a question.
Very little of the original 1960s/1970s run of "Jeopardy!" survives, but they did save a clip from a celebrity match in which Gene Shalit buzzes in and answers "the NBC peacock," gets reminded by Art Fleming to phrase it in the form of a question, and then says, "Has anyone around here seen the NBC peacock?" He's counted correct.

The contestant who was recently an 8-day champ answered most questions involving place names as "where is ______?", even though the clue wording almost always calls for a "what is ______?" (In the sense that "this U.S. state's capital is Sacramento," for example, elicits a "what.")
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Old 07-14-2013, 03:21 PM   #62
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Very little of the original 1960s/1970s run of "Jeopardy!" survives, but they did save a clip from a celebrity match in which Gene Shalit buzzes in and answers "the NBC peacock," gets reminded by Art Fleming to phrase it in the form of a question, and then says, "Has anyone around here seen the NBC peacock?" He's counted correct.
Ha! Love it!
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Old 07-15-2013, 05:47 AM   #63
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I think the "this game" wording was very clear, and the reason the other contestants got it wrong was that they just couldn't come up with the full name of the game.
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:44 AM   #64
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I think the "this game" wording was very clear, and the reason the other contestants got it wrong was that they just couldn't come up with the full name of the game.
The question was clear to me, but I couldn't come up with the full name of the game either!!
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Old 07-15-2013, 12:06 PM   #65
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I agree. The fact that all three came up with Zelda (and probably quickly) tells you it was too easy. That two of three answered incorrectly, but the same way, tells you it was worded awkwardly. A true J aficionado would catch it, but the average player wouldn't (and didn't).
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Just to be picky, the verbal emphasis has nothing to do with the correct answer. The wording of the clue, "this game", is all any contestant needed to give the proper answer.
I see your points and understand and pretty much agree.

Where I am getting hung up a bit is the subject of the sentence is "princess."

"The title princess of this game, which launched a best-selling franchise was named for F. Scott Fitzgerald's wife."

It's a very subtle nuance.

I think either answer can be correct. What you are saying that "Zelda" is just too easy. I thought the answer was "Zelda", but I also thought of the name "Legend of Zelda" while thinking about it. I never once suspected they wanted the name of the game.
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Old 07-15-2013, 04:09 PM   #66
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To side track even further...
I missed a few eps last week, so I don't know if the guy is still on, but the current champion is a world class a-hole when it comes to picking answers. Most people go from the top to the bottom, but not this guy. Give me this for 800, give me that for 400, give me this for 1000.
That style of random order picking gets on my last nerve when watching the show.

I hope he lost last week. I didn't like him one bit. Although he did seem to hit the double-jeopardy squares very early and often using that annoying style.
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Old 07-15-2013, 04:21 PM   #67
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To side track even further...
I missed a few eps last week, so I don't know if the guy is still on, but the current champion is a world class a-hole when it comes to picking answers. Most people go from the top to the bottom, but not this guy. Give me this for 800, give me that for 400, give me this for 1000.
That style of random order picking gets on my last nerve when watching the show.
Seems to me he only did that until the daily double was found. I think the strategy is that the lower payoff of finding it early is more that offset by the benefit of the higher odds of you being the one to find it.
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Old 07-15-2013, 04:22 PM   #68
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It's a very subtle nuance.

I think either answer can be correct. What you are saying that "Zelda" is just too easy. I thought the answer was "Zelda", but I also thought of the name "Legend of Zelda" while thinking about it. I never once suspected they wanted the name of the game.
It is subtle, but Jeopardy is very specific in how they phrase the answers. And since the two that answered "Zelda" missed, either answer is *not* correct.

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To side track even further...
I missed a few eps last week, so I don't know if the guy is still on, but the current champion is a world class a-hole when it comes to picking answers. Most people go from the top to the bottom, but not this guy. Give me this for 800, give me that for 400, give me this for 1000.
That style of random order picking gets on my last nerve when watching the show.

I hope he lost last week. I didn't like him one bit. Although he did seem to hit the double-jeopardy squares very early and often using that annoying style.
First, let me agree. It drives me absolute ape-sh*t when people do that. Part of my OCD makeup, I suppose.

Having said that... people do it for the very reason you mention, they are hunting the DD's. Getting them out of the way eliminates the possibility of a competitor using it to zoom past you.

Still drives me nuts though. STOP IT! Oh, and he finally lost.
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Old 07-15-2013, 05:09 PM   #69
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Seems to me he only did that until the daily double was found. I think the strategy is that the lower payoff of finding it early is more that offset by the benefit of the higher odds of you being the one to find it.
It used to be that the DD would never be in the top or bottom rows, but that's no longer the case.

Now that the DD can be anywhere, I don't think the scattershot strategy improves the chances of hitting the DD anymore.
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Old 07-15-2013, 07:59 PM   #70
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I see your points and understand and pretty much agree.

Where I am getting hung up a bit is the subject of the sentence is "princess."

"The title princess of this game, which launched a best-selling franchise was named for F. Scott Fitzgerald's wife."
I think I see the issue. "Princess" isn't the subject of a sentence. "Game" is the subject, "title princess" is a prepositional phrase modifying "this game".
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Old 07-15-2013, 08:54 PM   #71
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Quote:
"The title princess of this game, which launched a best-selling franchise was named for F. Scott Fitzgerald's wife."
I think I see the issue. "Princess" isn't the subject of a sentence. "Game" is the subject, "title princess" is a prepositional phrase modifying "this game".
No, if you strip out everything but subject/verb, you get "The princess [subject] was named [verb]"

"of this game" and "for F. Scott Fitzgerald's wife" are prepositional phrases, the first modifying the subject and the second serving as the object of the sentence.


But none of that is relevant to what the correct Jeopardy clue response should be.
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:41 PM   #72
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Very little of the original 1960s/1970s run of "Jeopardy!" survives, but they did save a clip from a celebrity match in which Gene Shalit buzzes in and answers "the NBC peacock," gets reminded by Art Fleming to phrase it in the form of a question, and then says, "Has anyone around here seen the NBC peacock?" He's counted correct.
Can you give me a summary of how much exists? Days? Weeks?

I remember reading a very detailed list of what of the 1970s Hollywood Squares remains, though IIRC, that was slightly out of date since they subsequently found some more.

Not like I'm actually going to go search for it, but I think it'd be interesting to see entire shows of the original Jeopardy!

BTW, I don't think it was unclear. It probably could have been worded BETTER, but I do think it's typical of the Jeopardy style wording.

I can't think of other "question styles", but every once in a while while watching the show, I wonder if it were worded in a different way, if they'd accept it.
(I probably would do the "Que es .." form for Spanish answers/questions.)
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:43 PM   #73
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To side track even further...
I missed a few eps last week, so I don't know if the guy is still on, but the current champion is a world class a-hole when it comes to picking answers. Most people go from the top to the bottom, but not this guy. Give me this for 800, give me that for 400, give me this for 1000.
That style of random order picking gets on my last nerve when watching the show.
Wait, he was the BEST Daily Double finder ever! I think I might try his technique if I'm ever on. Even simply starting at 600 and going up seemed to work.

(I also notice when people start on the RIGHT end, since Alex mentioned long ago that people usually go left->right.)
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Old 07-16-2013, 01:13 AM   #74
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I can't recall ever seeing a DD in the top row.

If I were a contestant I would be hunting DDs.

Finding the DD whenever is a big advantage.

I am surprised how few people make it a true DD, during the first round when they still have a relatively low score. Unless you are really unfamiliar with a category, I think you should always do this up to 3000 points give or take a few.

I'm pretty sure the second place contestant on Friday wagered pretty close to 10,000 on his DD. It did put him in the lead which I believe he maintained until FJ when he gave the name of the princess and not the name of the game.
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Old 07-16-2013, 01:21 AM   #75
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It is subtle, but Jeopardy is very specific in how they phrase the answers. And since the two that answered "Zelda" missed, either answer is *not* correct.
lol. I was talking real world, not Jeopardy world. I don't pay all that close attention to the nuances of the questions. It's usually not an issue. I guess after I watch a few more hundred shows I will understand Jeopardy's secret language a bit better.

BTW - I just want to state for the record pretty much no matter what the category I would wager zero dollars on FJ. I don't keep track, but I think I know the answer less than 10% of the time.
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Old 07-16-2013, 10:48 AM   #76
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lol. I was talking real world, not Jeopardy world. I don't pay all that close attention to the nuances of the questions. It's usually not an issue. I guess after I watch a few more hundred shows I will understand Jeopardy's secret language a bit better.

BTW - I just want to state for the record pretty much no matter what the category I would wager zero dollars on FJ. I don't keep track, but I think I know the answer less than 10% of the time.
Ken Jennings rarely got a Final Jeopardy. I think the only times he did were the very rare occasions when he didn't go into FJ safe (with more than twice #2's total).
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Old 07-16-2013, 10:53 AM   #77
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I can't think of other "question styles", but every once in a while while watching the show, I wonder if it were worded in a different way, if they'd accept it.
(I probably would do the "Que es .." form for Spanish answers/questions.)
You'd definitely get away with it if you did it in french.

Alex loooooves his french.
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Old 07-16-2013, 10:59 AM   #78
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You'd definitely get away with it if you did it in french.

Alex loooooves his french.
He apparently is rather fond of his spanish as well. Yesterday I heard him pronounce "Nicaragua" like he was Speedy freaking Gonzalez.
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Old 07-16-2013, 11:27 AM   #79
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Not like I'm actually going to go search for it, but I think it'd be interesting to see entire shows of the original Jeopardy!
Don't have to put too much effort in.


Jeopardy! June 27, 1974
You need to upgrade your Flash Player

(that's a 1974 ep and, for me, the 2000th ep from 1972 is on the sidebar. There are others, but that's probably enough to tide you over.)
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Old 07-16-2013, 12:09 PM   #80
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Ken Jennings rarely got a Final Jeopardy. I think the only times he did were the very rare occasions when he didn't go into FJ safe (with more than twice #2's total).
I'm not sure this is correct. I do know he was a lock on 65 out of 75 shows, which is incredible. But that doesn't mean he didn't get most of those 65 locks correct.

But I can't find this out from searching, so I don't know this for a fact.
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Old 07-16-2013, 12:16 PM   #81
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I'm not sure this is correct. I do know he was a lock on 65 out of 75 shows, which is incredible. But that doesn't mean he didn't get most of those 65 locks correct.

But I can't find this out from searching, so I don't know this for a fact.
He's on twitter. Ask him.
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Old 07-16-2013, 01:13 PM   #82
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I see your points and understand and pretty much agree.

Where I am getting hung up a bit is the subject of the sentence is "princess."

"The title princess of this game, which launched a best-selling franchise was named for F. Scott Fitzgerald's wife."

It's a very subtle nuance.

I think either answer can be correct. What you are saying that "Zelda" is just too easy. I thought the answer was "Zelda", but I also thought of the name "Legend of Zelda" while thinking about it. I never once suspected they wanted the name of the game.
This should clear it up - imagine if the clue was this, instead of what it actually was:

"The primary antagonist of this game, which launched a best-selling franchise steals a powerful magical relic known as the Triforce of Power."

Would you still say the answer could be anything other than The Legend of Zelda?
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:17 PM   #83
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This should clear it up - imagine if the clue was this, instead of what it actually was:

"The primary antagonist of this game, which launched a best-selling franchise steals a powerful magical relic known as the Triforce of Power."

Would you still say the answer could be anything other than The Legend of Zelda?
No, I don't think this helps. If anything it makes it worse.

I don't know the game all that well. I only know it because it is my sons favorite game/series and discussions with him or watching him play.

Seems to me you are looking for whoever stole the Tirforce of Power. I am not sure if that is Link or Zelda. (I assume those are the two main protagonists of the game and you meant protagonist and not antagonist.) And if you are referring to someone Link is chasing, then I don't have a clue. :-)

Thanks for trying to help.

Anyway, I am over it. I understand the subtle nuance that they used which is not so subtle if you are an expert Jeopardy watcher. I only started watching it again consistently a month or two ago. So I assume this is some of the type of experience knowledge that you gain over time.
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Old 07-16-2013, 03:16 PM   #84
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I'm not sure this is correct. I do know he was a lock on 65 out of 75 shows, which is incredible. But that doesn't mean he didn't get most of those 65 locks correct.

But I can't find this out from searching, so I don't know this for a fact.
Sorry, I stand corrected. I just double checked his games and found that Ken had FJ 2/3 of the time.

For some reason at the time he seemed to miss when he was safe, and when he was in danger get it and win.

I should say that about half way through his run I started to root for the challengers, and kept hoping they would knock him out.

Sorry Ken, nothing personal but it just didn't seem fair to the other players after a while.
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Old 07-16-2013, 10:01 PM   #85
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To recap . . .
"The title princess of this game, which launched a best-selling franchise was named for F. Scott Fitzgerald's wife."
Spoiler:
Two of the contestants wrote down "What is Zelda" and where judged incorrect. The correct answer was "What is The Legend of Zelda."
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I also want to note that without having to come up with the title of the game, the question becomes "name F. Scott Fitzgerald's wife," which isn't Final Jeopardy!-level information, it's more like top-to-middle-board in the first round.
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I agree. The fact that all three came up with Zelda (and probably quickly) tells you it was too easy. That two of three answered incorrectly, but the same way, tells you it was worded awkwardly. A true J aficionado would catch it, but the average player wouldn't (and didn't).
Today's FJ answer blows the "too easy" theory out of the water.
"In 2013 Britain marked this show's 50th Anniversary with a series of stamps of the 11 actors who have played the lead role."
Spoiler:
What is Dr. Who?

I think this answer/question is way easier and with no trick!

BTW - I didn't have a clue to what Fitzgerald's wife was named.

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Old 07-16-2013, 10:39 PM   #86
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Today's FJ answer blows the "too easy" theory out of the water.
"In 2013 Britain marked this show's 50th Anniversary with a series of stamps of the 11 actors who have played the lead role."
Spoiler:
What is Dr. Who?

I think this answer/question is way easier and with no trick!
Depending on how precise they choose to be, you very well could have lost.

Spoiler:
"Dr. Who" is incorrect. It's "Doctor Who"


I wonder if just the answer on it's own would be considered being in the form of a question?



But yeah, that was a ridiculously easy FJ.
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:08 AM   #87
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It did seem too easy. But I suppose if there had been a contestant who absolutely knows nothing about geekazoid TV shows and British cultural icons, it's possible they might have missed it. While I got it in .03 seconds, my wife had NO clue what they were asking about.

Notice they used "this show's anniversary" in the clue. It's always the word THIS that clues you in as to what they want.

They probably would accept DR or Doctor. In FJ, they will accept mistakes in spelling if the intent or pronunciation you are going for is clear. Slightly different rule than in the game itself.
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:29 AM   #88
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Notice they used "this show's anniversary" in the clue. It's always the word THIS that clues you in as to what they want,
Sounds like good advice! I will have to pay attention to that. (Or "this!")

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Old 07-17-2013, 11:45 AM   #89
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Yesterday's FJ was simple. Something tells me the girl on the end didn't beat her dad's score.
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Old 07-17-2013, 12:36 PM   #90
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One of the things that I think has changed sometime in the last 20 years is the requirement for first and last name. I thought the rule used to be in Jeopardy you could use only the last name, but in Double Jeopardy you needed both first and last. Now they seem to accept just the last name unless answering with only the last name is ambiguous.

Anybody recall?
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