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Old 08-20-2013, 10:04 AM   #361
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Glad to see something on the low end with a tuner for us cord cutters. I was worried if I would have to abandon TiVO after my HD died. Looks like I will be ordering a Roamio in the next year. I hope the Netflix and Hulu performance is as good as the PS3.
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:10 AM   #362
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Is it beyond the realm of possibility that TiVo intentionally broke the Premiere in non critical areas because they knew the Roamio was coming out?
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:13 AM   #363
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The 4 is entry level so they did it to cut costs.

The Slingbox capability requires the Stream functionality.

That's understandable. At least the capability will be available with the Stream box (standalone). I hope they've fixed whatever fan issues I've read about here in the forums. Also, they need Android support.
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:21 AM   #364
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According to the video, Android support was hinted at being soon if that means anything.
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:23 AM   #365
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Engadget wrote: The other new update -- also coming to existing hardware -- is the long-awaited dynamic tuner allocation for the TiVo Mini, which frees up more tuners for recording and expands the new room limit to nine.

Does it mean they will apply a software update for current Premiere 4/4XL owners for DTA?
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:26 AM   #366
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Maybe. The problem according to the CNet article is that TiVo wouldn't confirm anything specifically and kept stating that "it's under consideration" which seems to be the standard party line at this point. I wouldn't be surprised if absolutely NOTHING was added to the Premiere line and they just did bug fixes and that's it.
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:43 AM   #367
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No Slingbox capability for the Roamio basic 4 tuner? Ouch, that burns. Along with the no Stream without a separate box... no love for OTA.
Well, many were expecting the death of the OTA Tivo in this iteration, so it got quite a bit of love. I imagine it was built to a price point and thus stream was jettisoned.

I bet used streams will start to hit the market shortly.
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Old 08-20-2013, 03:15 PM   #368
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I don't really like that there is either a choice for 1TB or 3TB, and nothing in between. The two top boxes seem the same, just HD space. Why would anyone buy the higher unit, and not simply get a nice external and buy the cheaper box?
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Old 08-20-2013, 03:39 PM   #369
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I don't really like that there is either a choice for 1TB or 3TB, and nothing in between. The two top boxes seem the same, just HD space. Why would anyone buy the higher unit, and not simply get a nice external and buy the cheaper box?
Because they are married to the internal drive. And once they are married, if anything happens to the internal or external drive, all your recordings will be lost.

I've always replaced the internal hard drive if I wanted to increase my storage. i've been doing that for almost twelve years now and it's worked out great so far.
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Old 08-20-2013, 03:47 PM   #370
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Is it beyond the realm of possibility that TiVo intentionally broke the Premiere in non critical areas because they knew the Roamio was coming out?
I would imagine so, yes.
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Old 08-20-2013, 04:32 PM   #371
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change

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Because they are married to the internal drive. And once they are married, if anything happens to the internal or external drive, all your recordings will be lost.

I've always replaced the internal hard drive if I wanted to increase my storage. i've been doing that for almost twelve years now and it's worked out great so far.
I see you updated your post.. ;-)...

Married or not, does it really make sense to pay 200$ just to have 2TB more internal drive space? Couldn't one just add some nice external for 150$ or so, get even MORE space,

or, have a 2TB drive internally (bout 90-100$), and have 300HD hours plus have the 1TB drive left over.

I GET the pricing model, we've all been around apple long enough to understand it. It just seems like quite a bit of margin to tivo for not as much value.

I would have thought they'd at least put a small premium on integrated, but not that much.
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Old 08-20-2013, 05:09 PM   #372
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I see it says that the Roamio's can do 1080p24/60. Can anybody confirm this in the setup menu? This will be a small plus over my two Premiere 4's.
https://www.tivo.com/shop/roamio#tab2
Other than this and two extra tuners I think I would need a good incentive and a discount on the box to move up any time soon. $399.99 is pretty steep for the plus.

I don't have any cellular telephones or Ipads so the stream portion is a waste to me. I really don't see the use for this as I paid some serious cash for my two HD televisions and it would be stupid to watch HD programming on something as small as a phone.
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Old 08-20-2013, 05:59 PM   #373
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The TiVo Roamio supports 1080p24 and 1080i60, just like the TiVo Premiere does. It's 1080i for TV and the interface, and 1080p24 for some Netflix streams. It does NOT support 1080p60.

They should have labeled it 1080p24/1080i60.
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Old 08-20-2013, 06:00 PM   #374
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Can anybody confirm this in the setup menu?
No one actually has one yet. We wont be seeing people with actual units in hand for at least another day or two.
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Old 08-20-2013, 06:27 PM   #375
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Overall, very disappointed.

1) There is no larger storage option for those that want the ability to have OTA + cable.

2) No built-in Stream option for those that want the ability to have OTA + cable.

3) The new RF remote has NO KEYBOARD like the Slide remote. STUPID!!!!

4) No mention of Flash or cloud storage for settings, so they will all be lost again with every device failure. Along with channels and all your ratings.

5) Haven't seen the actual performance yet, but even the optimistic claims of 1.7 times as fast still isn't the screaming performance I was hoping for (I was hoping for 2 to 3 times)

6) Still have to put up with a damn tuning adapter (Yes, I know it is not TiVo's "fault")

7) The 4 tuner model is not standard component width, which is very annoying for those of us stacking things.

8) Released with lots of incomplete features. Here we go again. How many months or years until custom folders? Android streaming? Amazon Instant or Prime video? Streaming outside the local network?

9) Still slow booting. Perhaps faster than the Premiere, but still... it is 2013. My Linux desktop takes about 10 seconds to boot... waiting several MINUTES seems like forever. Hopefully it will be a lot more stable so reboots are rare. But during troubleshooting, it is a pain waiting so long.

10) Blech- the 4 tuner model uses a freaking power brick. It also lacks component output like the other models. AND the composite/analog audio is non-RCA with no mention of an appropriate cable included in the box.

11) We still can't disable the Discovery bar....

I get so frustrated with the Premiere performance, I might upgrade AGAIN, despite all the limitations.
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Old 08-20-2013, 06:30 PM   #376
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philmatic View Post
The TiVo Roamio supports 1080p24 and 1080i60, just like the TiVo Premiere does. It's 1080i for TV and the interface, and 1080p24 for some Netflix streams. It does NOT support 1080p60.

They should have labeled it 1080p24/1080i60.
how do you know that? HW at least supports 1080p60
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Old 08-20-2013, 06:42 PM   #377
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The TiVo Roamio supports 1080p24 and 1080i60, just like the TiVo Premiere does. It's 1080i for TV and the interface, and 1080p24 for some Netflix streams. It does NOT support 1080p60.

They should have labeled it 1080p24/1080i60.
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No one actually has one yet. We wont be seeing people with actual units in hand for at least another day or two.
I would hope that TiVo did because my cable company's Pace RNG200 DVR I just turned in when I got my two TiVo's had the ability of 1080p60 output.

Anyway it is not a deal breaker to me as I pass everything to my Kuros in native mode. Besides there is no 1080p60 content available over OTA, cable, or satellite.
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Old 08-20-2013, 07:13 PM   #378
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Originally Posted by crxssi View Post
Overall, very disappointed.

1) There is no larger storage option for those that want the ability to have OTA + cable.

2) No built-in Stream option for those that want the ability to have OTA + cable.

3) The new RF remote has NO KEYBOARD like the Slide remote. STUPID!!!!

4) No mention of Flash or cloud storage for settings, so they will all be lost again with every device failure. Along with channels and all your ratings.

5) Haven't seen the actual performance yet, but even the optimistic claims of 1.7 times as fast still isn't the screaming performance I was hoping for (I was hoping for 2 to 3 times)

6) Still have to put up with a damn tuning adapter (Yes, I know it is not TiVo's "fault")

7) The 4 tuner model is not standard component width, which is very annoying for those of us stacking things.

8) Released with lots of incomplete features. Here we go again. How many months or years until custom folders? Android streaming? Amazon Instant or Prime video? Streaming outside the local network?

9) Still slow booting. Perhaps faster than the Premiere, but still... it is 2013. My Linux desktop takes about 10 seconds to boot... waiting several MINUTES seems like forever. Hopefully it will be a lot more stable so reboots are rare. But during troubleshooting, it is a pain waiting so long.

10) Blech- the 4 tuner model uses a freaking power brick. It also lacks component output like the other models. AND the composite/analog audio is non-RCA with no mention of an appropriate cable included in the box.

11) We still can't disable the Discovery bar....

I get so frustrated with the Premiere performance, I might upgrade AGAIN, despite all the limitations.
1) You can add an eSATA drive. Or you can wait and see what Weaknees can do with them.

2) You can get a free standalone Stream right now if you use the coupon GROUPER

3) The keyboard on the Slide was problematic and prone to breakage. They wouldn't want to include something like that with every unit. Think of this as a step up from the basic IR remote included with previous TiVos and not as a step down from the Slide which was an $80 option.

4) There actually was some talk of cloud "services" in a report from Dave. He wasn't sure exactly what it was referring to though. Maybe they will add cloud backup in the future.

5) From what I've been told it's faster then the Mini, and the Mini, in my opinion, is at least 3x faster then the Premiere. Basically it's as fast as it should be when responding to the remote with the only lag coming when it's having to load something from the internet.

6) As you said, not TiVo's fault and nothing they can do about it.

7) Just put it on the top of the stack

8) The CEO has publicly said that Android and streaming outside the home will be available in the "Fall". They have not said anything about Prime or custom folders. Although they upgraded to a new HTML5 based apps platform so that could lead to more apps like Prime. I don't think custom folders is anything we'll ever see.

9) Agree. Modern OSes boot in seconds, TiVo should be faster.

10) I actually think this is a good thing. Power supply failures have been one of the major causes of TiVo deaths in the past. Being able to replace a $10 power brick to fix it is a lot cheaper and easier then having to crack the thing open and replace a $100 power supply from Weaknees.

10a) I assume the A/V port on the Roamio is the same as the one on the Mini and uses the breakout cable to get standard yellow/white/red RCA outputs.

11) Did you really expect that? This is TiVo's new advertising space. It's never going away.

Edit: Based on your comments it seems like you might use a combination of OTA and Cable. Is that the case? If so you'll also be disappointed to know that the Roamio can only be setup to do one or the other, not both like previous units. So it may not be a suitable replacement for your current Premiere.
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Old 08-20-2013, 08:27 PM   #379
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The TiVo Roamio supports 1080p24 and 1080i60, just like the TiVo Premiere does. It's 1080i for TV and the interface, and 1080p24 for some Netflix streams. It does NOT support 1080p60.

They should have labeled it 1080p24/1080i60.


What??!! So even with the newer chip they use they still don't have 1080P60 or 1080P24 scaling. Just 1080P24 pass through again?

Is this actually true? If so it really makes no sense. Although I guess the Mini is the same way which also made no sense either.
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Old 08-20-2013, 09:15 PM   #380
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Is it beyond the realm of possibility that TiVo intentionally broke the Premiere in non critical areas because they knew the Roamio was coming out?
Yes, it is beyond the realm of possibility. It's pure paranoia.
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Old 08-20-2013, 09:50 PM   #381
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Dan, the coupon code GROUPER only takes 49.99 off the price.
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Old 08-20-2013, 09:52 PM   #382
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Dan, the coupon code GROUPER only takes 49.99 off the price.
pay attention to the price of the stream AND the TiVo...both get discounted making the stream free...
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:30 PM   #383
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Edit: Based on your comments it seems like you might use a combination of OTA and Cable. Is that the case?
Yes. OTA is much better picture than cable. Plus it never has any outages.

Quote:
If so you'll also be disappointed to know that the Roamio can only be setup to do one or the other, not both like previous units. So it may not be a suitable replacement for your current Premiere.
Are you kidding me? WTF????? I read every word on their site and didn't see anything about that HUGE GLARING limitation! So now I search and see other people saying that. Great going, TiVo. Way to ruin the product completely for many people. I actually had it in my cart was was ready to click on buy and saw your response and stopped. I honestly don't know what to do now.

I could care less about 6 tuners. And I don't really need more space than the base model. But I have always used both OTA and cable on the TiVo HD and Premiere for what, 7 years?


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Old 08-20-2013, 10:50 PM   #384
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pay attention to the price of the stream AND the TiVo...both get discounted making the stream free...

If you have a Plus or Pro in your cart, it applies an $80 discount to the $130 Stream only, making it $50.

If you have a base Roamio in your cart, it applies an $80 discount to the $130 Stream AND a $50 discount on the base Roamio, making it essentially free.

Why would one do the former?
If one has a TiVo Premiere already with no Stream, it could be a way to pick up a cheap Stream for your older DVR while buying the newer DVR.
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Old 08-20-2013, 11:03 PM   #385
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crxssi: You extremely high expectations, which is unusual because you have been a TiVo customer for a while and should know better. How you can be anything less than completely blown away with the out of home streaming and rebuilding of the app platform is beyond me.
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Old 08-20-2013, 11:20 PM   #386
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crxssi: You extremely high expectations, which is unusual because you have been a TiVo customer for a while and should know better.

LOL- You are right that I have high expectations. And at least I wasn't surprised by all of this, just pissed.

Quote:
How you can be anything less than completely blown away with the out of home streaming
Well, since it doesn't work with Android, it does nothing for me at all. And there might be other strange limitations I don't know about quite yet.

Quote:
and rebuilding of the app platform is beyond me.
Well, the speed and new platform are the two best things about it.

EDIT: I must be an idiot. I just ordered a Pro with Lifetime and max warranty. I don't even know if it will work with PyTiVo yet, AND I am throwing away OTA. I don't need 6 tuners, and I certainly don't need 450 hours of storage. Yeesh, this is what happens when I stay up too late.
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Old 08-20-2013, 11:57 PM   #387
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I must be an idiot. I just ordered a Pro with Lifetime and max warranty. I don't even know if it will work with PyTiVo yet, AND I am throwing away OTA. I don't need 6 tuners, and I certainly don't need 450 hours of storage. Yeesh, this is what happens when I stay up too late.
Ditto. But I went one step further and got a base box for OTA as well.
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Old 08-21-2013, 01:05 AM   #388
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Originally Posted by crxssi View Post
If you have a Plus or Pro in your cart, it applies an $80 discount to the $130 Stream only, making it $50.

If you have a base Roamio in your cart, it applies an $80 discount to the $130 Stream AND a $50 discount on the base Roamio, making it essentially free.

Why would one do the former?
If one has a TiVo Premiere already with no Stream, it could be a way to pick up a cheap Stream for your older DVR while buying the newer DVR.
The Plus/Pro have built in Streams and can still stream from any TiVo Premiere/Roamio on your network, not just itself. So the standalone Stream is completely redundant, and basically useless, if you're buying a Plus/Pro. Although you could probably sell it for a profit since the still go for $97 on Amazon.
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Old 08-21-2013, 01:08 AM   #389
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Are you kidding me? WTF????? I read every word on their site and didn't see anything about that HUGE GLARING limitation!
Must have missed the picture where it shows it only has one coax input.
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Old 08-21-2013, 05:57 AM   #390
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Overall, very disappointed.

I might upgrade AGAIN, despite all the limitations.
that's why they continue to release products the way they do.

I just bought my PremiereXL4 & Mini -- I was considering returning it (Amazon/TiVo) and going for the Series 5 Roamio - however it appears that there really isn't much more there for me, 2 extra tuners I really don't need, Streaming I don't use much and I have an SlingBox HD already ...

It seems like improving and or adding features while retaining previous model features is not the way they seem to be going. I lost my OLED display from my Series3-> Premiere. Continue to have a NetFlix app that I don't use because of it's so so performance and ability to work without issues. Don't have the OTA option that I will need when I move to my retirement home ...

TiVo still makes the best DVR, but how much longer will I be able to say that? They had plenty of time to develop a "knock your socks off" DVR, but we got what we got.

The improved 'speed' issue should just be a given between models, not perceived as a feature!
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