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Old 10-23-2014, 12:15 PM   #1
Davepl
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TiVo Mini same cabling as CATV?

I have Comcast service and was trying their X1 master/slave boxes but its pretty brutal. Since I already have a Roamio and a couple of slightly older boxes, I figured TiVo minis would be a good solution.

Unfortunately I do not have Ethernet at all of the TVs. My question is whether its as simple as connecting the mini to the household cable on the MoAC jack and it will magically communicate with the Roamio because it too is connected to the cable. By cable I mean the household coax system that currently delivers CATV.

According to the Wikipedia article they're -supposed- to operate on different frequencies than CATV service, but does the scenario I describe above actually work? And work at the same time as CATV service in the same house on the same cabling?

That would also mean the Roamio would have to support MoaC on it's "CATV In" and I just never knew about it.

Thanks!
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:41 PM   #2
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What model Roamio?
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:45 PM   #3
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Where can I find that? In System Info it says "Series5" and software version 2.4.4.something
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Old 10-23-2014, 12:47 PM   #4
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Where can I find that? In System Info it says "Series5" and software version 2.4.4.something
How many tuners does it have?
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:36 PM   #5
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I only see 5 in the Live Tv mode (where the red or grey circles show you what's being viewed or recorded) but in DVR Diagnostics it lists tuners 0 through 5.

So, I think it is 6 tuners.
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:43 PM   #6
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So, you have a Roamio Plus or Roamio Pro. How is this connected to your home network? Ethernet or wireless?

If it's Ethernet, you will be able to setup the Roamio to create a MoCA network, thereby allowing you to simply connect the Mini to a coax outlet and provide network access that way.

If it's connected via wireless, you would need to buy a single MoCA adapter (Tivo.com website sells a single adapter for ~$50. You would have to connect this via Ethernet to your home router, and then connect the MoCA adapter to a coax outlet. This would provide the MoCA network and you could setup both the Roamio and any additional Mini's to connect that way.
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Old 10-23-2014, 01:51 PM   #7
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You should also look into having a MoCA POE filter installed.
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Old 10-23-2014, 04:56 PM   #8
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The Roamio itself is one a gigabit LAN. When you say "you will be able to setup the Roamio to create a MoCA network", can you expand on that a bit?

I'm not sure if you mean a hardware bridge, a setting on the Roamio, or what that entails.
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Old 10-23-2014, 05:13 PM   #9
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The Roamio itself is one a gigabit LAN. When you say "you will be able to setup the Roamio to create a MoCA network", can you expand on that a bit?

I'm not sure if you mean a hardware bridge, a setting on the Roamio, or what that entails.
He's talking about using the Roamio as a bridge between the MoCA network and your wired Ethernet LAN.
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Old 10-23-2014, 07:33 PM   #10
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Yep moca really does work.

As long as the Roamio Plus/Pro is connected by ethernet, you can go into Settings > Network and select "Use this DVR to create a moca network" and then the Minis will only need a coax connection. (select moca when setting them up.)
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Old 10-23-2014, 10:44 PM   #11
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Can the Roamio be on wireless an mini on wired Ethernet plus coax and work? I had a Dish Hopper on wireless and Joey just on the coax and that MoCa worked great. Just not sure if I will have to cable the Roamio (basic).
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Old 10-24-2014, 01:49 AM   #12
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Can the Roamio be on wireless an mini on wired Ethernet plus coax and work? I had a Dish Hopper on wireless and Joey just on the coax and that MoCa worked great. Just not sure if I will have to cable the Roamio (basic).
Unfortunately no. If you elect to use a Roamio's internal wifi card, it will be unable to connect to a Mini. You can use a wireless bridge, however, to wirelessly connect the Roamio to your network. However, depending on the quality/strength of the wireless signal, this may result in a compromised experience on the Mini (or not, just depends on the wireless signal).

Also, the Mini cannot utilize coax and ethernet simultaneously. You connect either coax (with MoCA) OR ethernet to the Mini, but not both. Either connection on its own is sufficient for the Mini to function properly.
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Old 10-24-2014, 04:48 AM   #13
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Thanks, I will either swap to locations of the mini and Roamio then or run another eithernet drop. Both are easy enough options. Appreciate the help.
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Old 10-24-2014, 06:36 PM   #14
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So I looked behind the cabinet where I plan to put the Mini and Ethernet isn't there like I thought just coax. No access to run Ethernet either so here is my plan, let me know if it wouldn't work. Roamio basic will be connected via Ethernet. Install a MoCa adapter in the wire closet, connect Mini using MoCa.
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Old 10-24-2014, 07:28 PM   #15
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Unfortunately no. If you elect to use a Roamio's internal wifi card, it will be unable to connect to a Mini. You can use a wireless bridge, however, to wirelessly connect the Roamio to your network. However, depending on the quality/strength of the wireless signal, this may result in a compromised experience on the Mini (or not, just depends on the wireless signal).

.............
SUre you can use wireless. My Roamio Basic is using wireless right now. I just went to the Mini in this room and changed the DVR connection to my Roamio Basic. It works without issue here. I can stream the live channels or recorded content over wireless just like if the Roamio Basic was using a wired connection. From a user point of view with the Mini, the performance is identical for me whether the Roamio is connected with a wired connection or the ethernet cable is unplugged and it is using wireless like it is right now..
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Old 10-24-2014, 07:41 PM   #16
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How is your Mini connected (Ethernet or coax) if coax I'm guessing you have a MoCa adapter?
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Old 10-24-2014, 07:54 PM   #17
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How is your Mini connected (Ethernet or coax) if coax I'm guessing you have a MoCa adapter?
Yes my four minis are currently connected over MoCA(I switch the Minis between MoCA, Ethernet, and wireless Bridges periodically) and I have an Actiontec MoCA adapter with GigE switch ports that gives network access to the four Minis.

But I can also use a wireless Bridge with the Minis and it will also work without issues on my network.
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Old 10-24-2014, 07:58 PM   #18
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Yes my four minis are connected over MoCA and I have an Actiontec MoCA adapter with GigE switch ports that gives network access to the four Minis.

But I can also use a wireless Bridge with the Minis and it will also work without issues on my network.
Sounds exactly how I planed to do it. Good to know the wireless works. Then I won't need to run the Ethernet. Bridge would work for me too but I'd rather do MoCa.

Every room has Ethernet in my house but the previous owner chose poorly where to install the jacks.
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Old 10-24-2014, 08:01 PM   #19
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Sounds exactly how I planed to do it. Good to know the wireless works. Then I won't need to run the Ethernet. Bridge would work for me too but I'd rather do MoCa.

Every room has Ethernet in my house but the previous owner chose poorly where to install the jacks.
It has been a while since I've done a long term test with wireless on my Roamio Basic. There have been several updates since I last did it. I guess I should leave the Mini connected to the Roamio as a host over wireless for a while to see if any issues crop up.
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Old 10-24-2014, 10:22 PM   #20
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SUre you can use wireless. My Roamio Basic is using wireless right now. I just went to the Mini in this room and changed the DVR connection to my Roamio Basic. It works without issue here. I can stream the live channels or recorded content over wireless just like if the Roamio Basic was using a wired connection. From a user point of view with the Mini, the performance is identical for me whether the Roamio is connected with a wired connection or the ethernet cable is unplugged and it is using wireless like it is right now..
I don't know why that is seemingly working for you because according to this page on Tivo's website (http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2557), a Mini cannot interact with a Roamio that is on a wireless connection:

"IMPORTANT: TiVo Mini does not support wireless connections and cannot interact with DVRs in your home that are on a wireless connection."

Last edited by Marty1781 : 10-24-2014 at 11:17 PM.
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Old 10-24-2014, 11:04 PM   #21
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So I looked behind the cabinet where I plan to put the Mini and Ethernet isn't there like I thought just coax. No access to run Ethernet either so here is my plan, let me know if it wouldn't work. Roamio basic will be connected via Ethernet. Install a MoCa adapter in the wire closet, connect Mini using MoCa.
That should work well!
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Old Yesterday, 07:38 AM   #22
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It has been a while since I've done a long term test with wireless on my Roamio Basic. There have been several updates since I last did it. I guess I should leave the Mini connected to the Roamio as a host over wireless for a while to see if any issues crop up.
From what I can see here
http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2557 it could be using MoCa on both ends. This is under "I don't want to use my DVR to create a MoCa network"
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Old Yesterday, 09:24 AM   #23
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From what I can see here
http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2557 it could be using MoCa on both ends. This is under "I don't want to use my DVR to create a MoCa network"
The Roamio Basic doesn't have MoCA. So it is impossible for it to be using MoCA when I have the Ethernet cable unplugged. WHen the Ethernet cable is unplugged the only way it can connect is over wireless. WHich is what I did last night. I unplugged the EThernet cable to force it to use wireless.
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Old Yesterday, 09:26 AM   #24
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I don't know why that is seemingly working for you because according to this page on Tivo's website (http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2557), a Mini cannot interact with a Roamio that is on a wireless connection:

"IMPORTANT: TiVo Mini does not support wireless connections and cannot interact with DVRs in your home that are on a wireless connection."
I only know that last night I forced my Roamio Basic to use wireless by unplugging the EThernet cable(I only use the wireless connection when I take it to my GFs house and I have her WiFi AP setup identical to one of my APs). And then I changed the host DVR of one of my Minis from my Roamio Pro to my Roamio Basic. Then I went to live TV and switched between several OTA channels. And then streamed some content from the My SHows list. It worked the same as when I had the Ethernet cable connected.
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Old Yesterday, 09:45 AM   #25
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I just checked the Mini I setup last night with my Roamio Basic as the host. The Mini is still able to stream Live OTA TV and stream from the My Shows list without any issues. The ROamio Basic is still connected to one of my 5Ghz Access Points and the Ethernet cable is still unplugged from the Roamio BAsic which forces it to use the wireless connection.

I get a link rate from the Roamio Basic to the AP of 300Mb/s. Which means useable bandwidth is no more than 150Mb/s. Of course an OTA stream is no more than 19Mb/s. Which is why it can stream flawlessly over wireless. And the wireless in the Roamio BAsic is also limited to the same speeds as the 100BT connection. So it won't exceed the transfer speeds than can be achieved when using it's Ethernet connection. So max transfer rates I get from my Roamio Basic are around 95Mb/s when transferring to a PC running KMTTG.
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Old Yesterday, 10:38 AM   #26
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It's just that Tivo doesn't officially support wireless on the Mini because of so many variables as to signal strength. For some it works fine and others it doesn't ... YMMV ...
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Old Yesterday, 10:52 AM   #27
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It's just that Tivo doesn't officially support wireless on the Mini because of so many variables as to signal strength. For some it works fine and others it doesn't ... YMMV ...
Yes. You need a properly setup WiFi network to avoid issues. And unfortunately the vast majority of residential WiFi networks are not setup properly. Many only have one AP. A properly setup Wifi Network will have multiple APs in multiple locations. To avoid over crowding, congestion issues, and signal strength issues.
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Old Yesterday, 10:58 AM   #28
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Yes. You need a properly setup WiFi network to avoid issues. And unfortunately the vast majority of residential WiFi networks are not setup properly. Many only have one AP. A properly setup Wifi Network will have multiple APs in multiple locations. To avoid over crowding, congestion issues, and signal strength issues.
So a properly setup wireless network has wired Ethernet to multiple APs? Why not just run the wire to your equipment?
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Old Yesterday, 11:15 AM   #29
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So a properly setup wireless network has wired Ethernet to multiple APs? Why not just run the wire to your equipment?
All equipment doesn't use ethernet connections. And you can't easily get an ethernet cable to all locations. I use thirteen IP cameras. Eight I use over wireless because I can't easily get an Ethernet cable to those locations. I have wireless tablets, a wireless phone. Several Chromecasts which are wireless only. Laptops using wireless and many other devices where it's just more convenient to use a wireless connection. But I also have dozens of devices using wired connections too.

At work we setup many clients with wireless networks. There are always multiple APs to get the proper coverage at each location. Of course these are commercial locations but the same difficulties apply to residential. And the only way to have a robust wifi network, to work properly from multiple areas, without congestion, is to have multiple APs in multiple locations.
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Old Yesterday, 11:19 AM   #30
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You may not be able to. In my brother's house he had his modem/router/ap in his basement. His daughter had a second story BR on the opposite side of the house. There was no way to run a cable. Older house with plaster walls etc. He already was able to run a cable to his office (almost directly above), and relocated the AP. This was enough to get his daughter's laptop connected again. Not everyone has a house that you can run cabling reasonably ...
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