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Old 12-05-2012, 08:32 AM   #1
VegasVic
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Sons of Anarchy - "J'ai Obtenu Cette" 12/4/12

"I Got This".

Pope dead, Clay and Tara in jail. Bobby resigns as VP. Disappointing IMO. We know how long people stay in jail on this show.

Glad Tig is still around and hopefully Smits will be back.
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:44 AM   #2
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Did the shot at the end mirror the closing shot from last season's finale just with Gemma replacing Tara?
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:58 AM   #3
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No Unser, no Donal Logue (hoping he's back next year). Goggins too.

And the bodyguard (August Marks, don't know if the character had a name), seemed to be with Pope at all times except at the end. I thought Jax had given him a heads up about what he wanted to do but maybe not.
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:17 AM   #4
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I was wrong about Pope surviving. I would have done things differently if I ran the show but I can't say that I was disappointed with how things played out. I guess Jax has become a criminal mastermind.

How many people has Jax killed this year? Seems like a lot.

Tara, how about telling Jax that his mom said that she would set you up? Maybe when they're putting the cuffs on you.

Looks like Clay survives until next year. Since Clay is the ultimate survivor, maybe Pope's murder blows back on Jax somehow.

I don't know what upset me the most, the dog fight footage or whoever sang the opening To Sir With Love song. Was that Katey Sagal?

Could Clay's fingerprints still be on the gun after Jax shot around eight guys with it?
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:30 AM   #5
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I was a little disappointed in the ending. Tara is stupid.... she should have told Jax about Gemma framing her.

She also should have understood just how much Jax can't tolerate Wendy. The way I see it, Tara is responsible for what Jax did to Wendy.

I think Juice was supposed to be the one that threw Clay under the bus. But, some how Gemma saw a way out of the situation with Clay and jumped on it. I was laughing until my sides hurt over the sheriff and the dumb founded look on his face! That was too funny!

And at least the Sheriff had the decency to look ashamed to be arresting Jax's wife after Jax served up Clay on a silver platter.

I think Tara will beat it, but I think the situation between Tara, Jax and Gemma is going to be way uglier next season than it was this season. I don't think Wendy is out of the picture yet either. We'll see.

Not surprised about Bobby, he isn't a good VP for Jax. I think Tiggy is showing he's earned VP back in my opinion.
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:57 AM   #6
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I think Tara will beat it, but I think the situation between Tara, Jax and Gemma is going to be way uglier next season than it was this season. I don't think Wendy is out of the picture yet either. We'll see.
That's what I'm afraid of. I hate this whole storyline.
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:59 AM   #7
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That's what I'm afraid of. I hate this whole storyline.
Me too! But, the old ladies have their own set of drama... I guess this is their way of giving us that. Though, I don't enjoy it much!
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:40 AM   #8
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Did the shot at the end mirror the closing shot from last season's finale just with Gemma replacing Tara?
I thought that. The pose with Tara and Jax was itself the same pose as Gemma and John Teller in the old photo when he was president.


While it looks like Clay is around until next season, I hope to heck we don't see some magical way that he survives in jail. The contract is supposedly already out on him, he's going in alone, so living for any length of time in jail would be a miracle. I guess some Feds could swoop in when he's getting out of the van and whisk him away to offer him a deal to replace Otto as the star witness in the RICO case.

As soon as Jax told Pope to go inside the building I knew something was up. I'd forgotten how much they'd highlighted Clay's gun, so I was thinking something like blowing up the warehouse, not saving Tig and letting him kill Pope. I think letting Tig kill Pope was the bit that kept him from turning on Jax for being bait.

Gemma framing Tara is still fuzzy in my mind. It sounded earlier with the meeting with her lawyer like Tara was out of the murder conspiracy charge, just the misdemeanor charge for bringing contraband to a prisoner. For Gemma to change that, wouldn't she have to testify that Tara told her the purpose for the cross was to kill the nurse? Seeing that the cross wasn't an actual dagger, Tara could have given him anything to accomplish the same purpose, it wasn't necessary to smuggle something in. Seems like a weak case, unless I'm missing something.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:41 AM   #9
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How'd I forget about Otto? Man, that was nasty!
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:54 AM   #10
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Tara and Clay will be out by the end of episode 1.
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Old 12-05-2012, 11:10 AM   #11
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How'd I forget about Otto? Man, that was nasty!
I will admit, I was horrified!! I wanted to forget that happened!!
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:04 PM   #12
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Tara, how about telling Jax that his mom said that she would set you up? Maybe when they're putting the cuffs on you.

I don't know what upset me the most, the dog fight footage or whoever sang the opening To Sir With Love song. Was that Katey Sagal?

Could Clay's fingerprints still be on the gun after Jax shot around eight guys with it?
Wouldn't put it past Gemma to tell Jax how/why Tara was taking the kids and that she was going to frame her to keep them there. Got to hand it Tara, she kept herself together when she was cuffed.

Katey sang the opening song.
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:48 PM   #13
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Not surprised about Bobby, he isn't a good VP for Jax. I think Tiggy is showing he's earned VP back in my opinion.
Except that he's insane. I don't think anybody would ever trust him to make decisions.

That does raise an interesting question, though...who will be the new VP?

During Jax's first conversation with Pope, I got the vibe that he and Pope's sidekick had something going. But clearly not...yet, anyway. I knew Pope had to die (for reasons I explained last week), and I'm glad they came up with a way that didn't involve some vast conspiracy on Jax's part that we never caught a whiff of, or Jax just getting lucky. That was a surprisingly elegant solution, all of whose pieces we saw previously. And of course in the end it won't work out as neatly as Jax planned.

Much as I'd love to see it, I don't think Clay can die. Yet. I think he needs to be part of the show's end-game. It will be interesting to see how he gets out of his double predicament (being in jail, and having Pope's people after him).

Having Tara's face morph into Gemma's at the beginning was a bit on-the-nose. I think we have all gotten the point.
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Old 12-05-2012, 07:18 PM   #14
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I thought this was a fantastic episode. I was on the edge of my seat for the majority of it. For some reason I thought the cartel/CIA/etc guys would be in the building where Pope was killed. It was a bit odd though that Pope's number 2 guy wasn't with him for that meet.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:17 AM   #15
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That does raise an interesting question, though...who will be the new VP?
Who is left? The guy playing Happy probably can't act his way out of a paper bag. They destroyed Juice's character this season. No way he gets the VP slot. Filthy Phil? He had as many lines as a black guy on the Walking Dead. Not him either. My guess would be Chibs gets promoted to VP and Tig gets Sergeant At Arms. Or Jax leaves it vacant since he's not going to listen to anybody anyway. Whatever happens, SAMCRO definitely needs new members.

I thought Bobby was a great choice for Jax's VP. A voice of reason to keep Jax from becoming what his father wouldn't want - Clay.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:13 AM   #16
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I'd forgotten how much they'd highlighted Clay's gun, so I was thinking something like blowing up the warehouse, not saving Tig and letting him kill Pope.
Pretty sure that's Chekhov's gun you're thinking of, not Clay's.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:23 AM   #17
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Kurt Sutter refers to SOA as a soap opera. I wonder why nobody has developed amnesia or has a long lost evil twin yet.
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Old 12-06-2012, 02:09 PM   #18
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I seem to remember that Pope gave Jax the Charming Heights contract when then met outside the warehouse and then Jax told Pope's #2 that there were so many people at the warehouse that he didn't stop. He then mentioned the contract to Pope's #2. Am I remembering that correctly? If yes, I wonder if it will come back to bite him.

I think Donal Logue will be SOA's main antagonist next season, it seems like Sutter was setting that up in the last couple of episodes. And since Logue's character is an ex-US Marshall, will we be seeing Raylan Givens?
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Old 12-06-2012, 02:42 PM   #19
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Pope #2 was always right next to Pope, except at the warehouse to kill Tigs. That's why I thought he was in on it with Jax. But then it didn't appears as if he knew about it ahead of time.
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Old 12-06-2012, 03:16 PM   #20
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will we be seeing Raylan Givens?
that would be all kinds of awesome.

what was the very last thing Gemma whispered to Jax at the very end. Couldn't pick it up...
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Old 12-06-2012, 05:01 PM   #21
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I seem to remember that Pope gave Jax the Charming Heights contract when then met outside the warehouse and then Jax told Pope's #2 that there were so many people at the warehouse that he didn't stop. He then mentioned the contract to Pope's #2. Am I remembering that correctly? If yes, I wonder if it will come back to bite him.
Pope said he sent a copy of the contract to Hale. If so, then the copy Jax wasn't supposed to have received shouldn't be an issue.
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Old 12-06-2012, 05:31 PM   #22
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that would be all kinds of awesome.

what was the very last thing Gemma whispered to Jax at the very end. Couldn't pick it up...
'Call Lowen', the club lawyer.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:01 PM   #23
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'Call Lowen', the club lawyer.
No, that's what Tara said as she was being taken out.

Gemma said, "I'm here, baby."
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:13 PM   #24
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Oh sorry..misread. You're right.
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Old 12-06-2012, 07:43 PM   #25
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Pretty much glad it's over. Some entertaining and exciting moments scattered about the season but for the most part it was a prettly lame season.

Continue to either kill off (Opie, Laroy, Pope, Piney, Kip, Kozik, etc.) or severely limit(Unser, Romeo, Luis, Alvarez, etc.) anyone that is/were the most likeable and enjoyable characters, and continue to keep the most annoying(or deserving of a visit from Mr. Mayhem in Clay's case) around. Plus adding to the ranks of the nothing but annoying characters now(Jax, Bobby and Juice).

Enjoyed Nero/Smits for the most part, as well as Pope/Perrineau.
Was also glad to see Donal Logue added to the cast too, but would rather had him in a role as a SAMCRO member. I mean it isn't like the club doesn't need some new members and Logue would be a great addition I've no doubt. Seems pretty obvious he won't be around very long in the role they cast him.

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Old 12-06-2012, 09:13 PM   #26
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I thought it was a decent finale to an excellent season. I think the finale kind of lacked something, but I'm not sure what. I think it's "finality". It left just about everything up in their air, but I think in the overall arc in the show, it's a hugely critical season, so I'm gonna see how things play out next season. I loved this season--lots of stuff, tons of thematic elements, good twists, good acting. Once they killed Opie it did what I think it was supposed to do which is convince me that no one is safe.

If I had to change something about the finale, it would be the resolution of the Pope storyline. After 12 episodes and a ton of build-up, it was over in a few seconds. I also think it was weak that he was established as a super-human, well connected criminal mastermind, yet Jax was able to take out his bodyguards and prevent him from reaching his own gun in a matter of 10 seconds. And the fact that he had #2 with him in every single other scene except this one was just weird. I think it would have been better writing-wise if #2 was in on it...

I guess it's possible that even though they weren't "in" on it, maybe #2 saw right through Jax's set-up and knew exactly what the outcome would be (or at least that it was a possibility), and basically let it unfold. Jax's story is pretty implausible, and you can tell #2 doesn't believe it, but he's not upset about it either.

I did like the fact that he used Clay's gun to set him up. When Pope reminding him of what happens to whoever kills him and Jax says "I'm counting on it", I was wondering what the hell he was thinking--why would he provoke that? I had forgotten about Juice getting Clay's gun, etc, so I was all "ohhhhh... nice".

That's another story element that I love about this show--so many different elements came into play for him to execute that set-up. Pope telling him about his bounty, Juice bonding with Clay all season so it makes sense that Clay gives him his gun, Roosevelt's wife getting killed by the nomads so that Roosevelt loses it and makes a deal with Jax and (inadvertently) telling him about Juice which gives Jax the leverage he needs to have Juice steal the gun... Gemma crashing with the kids in the car putting her outside the family and having to earn her way back in by helping Jax set-up Clay... it all reminds me of season two and all the stuff that led up to Gemma being framed for killing the irish kid which then triggered all the stuff in season three.

I don't think I've ever seen such interconnectedness on a show--everything that happens has a purpose. Love it.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:35 PM   #27
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Agreed, I liked how it came together.

And if Pope had just shot Tig in the parking lot, Jax could just go to plan B.


Bobby's character bugs me. He's turning into Piney - just an old member who perhaps at one point was useful but now just a high and mighty pain in the ass. I'm fine with him leaving. I can't remember much more than him just tagging along or getting in the way. I'm all about Chibbs for VP.

I hope we get several episodes with Clay squirming and surviving in prison.

Otto and his tongue -- insane. That was intense.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:59 PM   #28
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Otto and his tongue -- insane. That was intense.
Yeah, the way Sutter has treated Otto over the years, I sense a bit of self-loathing...
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:43 AM   #29
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If I had to change something about the finale, it would be the resolution of the Pope storyline. After 12 episodes and a ton of build-up, it was over in a few seconds. I also think it was weak that he was established as a super-human, well connected criminal mastermind, yet Jax was able to take out his bodyguards and prevent him from reaching his own gun in a matter of 10 seconds. And the fact that he had #2 with him in every single other scene except this one was just weird. I think it would have been better writing-wise if #2 was in on it...

I guess it's possible that even though they weren't "in" on it, maybe #2 saw right through Jax's set-up and knew exactly what the outcome would be (or at least that it was a possibility), and basically let it unfold. Jax's story is pretty implausible, and you can tell #2 doesn't believe it, but he's not upset about it either.
Yup, that's how I see it too. But Jax is the star of the show so he gets to pull off the incredible no matter how unbelievable it is.
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Old 12-07-2012, 12:00 PM   #30
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Good Sutter interview on this past season as well as some thoughts on next season. Some spoilers on who will be back and possible plot spoilers.

http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com...wags-about.php

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My pitch on the first day in the writer's room was that I wanted to find a way for Otto to bite his tongue off so I don't have to learn any more lines.

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