TiVo Community
TiVo Community
TiVo Community
Go Back   TiVo Community > Main TiVo Forums > TiVo Premiere DVRs
TiVo Community
Reply
Forum Jump
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-17-2012, 12:52 AM   #31
awax
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Fayetteville, AR
Posts: 41
I agree it should be a configurable setting. At least give me an hour TiVo!
awax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:03 AM   #32
DonaldBurns65144
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 121
At least one hour. 2 hours better. User select would be okay too.
DonaldBurns65144 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:24 AM   #33
Ed_Hunt
Pokerpro
 
Ed_Hunt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Patterson, California
Posts: 247
Old

How about blank recordable cds were $7 each and you almost always had to do at least 2 burns because of buffer underruns. And my first computer was a commadore 64. Thats old. (born in '49). I would love the option of a longer buffer like on Media Center.



Quote:
Originally Posted by MeInDallas View Post
My graduation gift from my parents was a Sony Betamax

I remember searching for blank videotapes and comparing the prices and trying to find out what was the best brand. Then VHS came along and I had a hard time budging over to that format. I never dreamed one day I would have a house full of Tivo's and all those tapes would be sitting in a landfill somewhere

I've always wished there was an option for a longer buffer on Tivo. With the size of hard drives now it wouldnt make such a big difference. Sometimes when I turn the TV on theres something on the news that I would like to be able to go back farther but cant.

I have noticed however, if the buffer on a Premiere is at around 40 - 45 minutes you can hit record and it will save all the way back to when the show began. I just noticed that recently. There must be a buffer to the buffer.

__________________
"Luck is the residue of design"
1 S2 Tivo w/lifetime retired
1 HD Tivo Lifetime
1 Roamio OTA only
60" LG Plasma
60" Vizio 1080P
36" LG HD
Ed_Hunt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:33 AM   #34
aaronwt
HD Addict
 
aaronwt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern VA(Woodbridge)
Posts: 14,487
So does anyone use suggestions? With suggestions enabled on the Elites, many times it will put all tuners on the same channel when it's not recording a suggestion for some reason. So for me, the odds of it even being on a channel I want, is extremely slim. After all these years I've only recently started using suggestions. Both boxes had over 100 hours of HD suggestions pretty quickly after I enabled them. Anyway since the box isn't usually on a channel I want, it makes it even less likely that there would be a situation where I would want to take advantage of a longer buffer. It's always been 30 minutes on the TiVos I've used and it's not been an issue.
Also if they were going to change the buffer length you would think they would have done it by now. But you never know. I doubt its a simple task to make it longer. It would probably have a huge effect on the code to change it and would involve alot of effort to change it.
__________________
Roamio Pro
TiVo Mini x4
Roamio Basic OTA
40TB unRAID1--53TB unRAID2--36TB unRAID3
XBL/PSN: WormholeXtreme
aaronwt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 10:39 AM   #35
ShayL
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed_Hunt View Post
How about blank recordable cds were $7 each and you almost always had to do at least 2 burns because of buffer underruns. And my first computer was a commadore 64. Thats old. (born in '49). I would love the option of a longer buffer like on Media Center.
The burn errors started the coaster joke. The burners were 1X or 2X so you would spend a lot of time burner before you got the error. My first computer was a Vic 20 which is the predecessor to the Commodore 64. I will never miss the tape drive storage method.
ShayL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 12:23 PM   #36
JoeTaxpayer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
So does anyone use suggestions?
One amazing thing would be to be able to tell the TiVo who the shows are for. When I enabled suggestions, the TiVo latched onto the fact that my kid (maybe 6 at the time) had a few series recordings, so most suggestions were geared toward her. If shows could be tagged "mom" "dad" "kid1" etc, suggestions might follow into folders for that viewer. Too complex?
The folders would also make viewing easier, I can go right to my folder instead of wading through the shows for the others. With a 4 tuner on the way, that list will get long fast.
__________________
Toshiba SD-H400, Tivo Series 2, Tivo HD, TiVo Series 3 THX, TiVo Premiere (All upgraded with extra HD goodness) and an XL4.
JoeTaxpayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 04:29 PM   #37
todd_j_derr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Pittsburgh, PA, USA
Posts: 173
TC CLUB MEMBER
+1 astrohip. I'd love a longer buffer, and I'm certainly not going to be persuaded otherwise by claims I'm using my Tivo incorrectly. The last two non-Tivo DVRs I've used have had longer buffers, not to mention my old hacked S1. 90-120 minutes would be great, although if it were up to me I'd just let the buffer take up all the free space on the disk.
todd_j_derr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 05:24 PM   #38
DonaldBurns65144
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
So does anyone use suggestions? With suggestions enabled on the Elites, many times it will put all tuners on the same channel when it's not recording a suggestion for some reason. So for me, the odds of it even being on a channel I want, is extremely slim. After all these years I've only recently started using suggestions. Both boxes had over 100 hours of HD suggestions pretty quickly after I enabled them. Anyway since the box isn't usually on a channel I want, it makes it even less likely that there would be a situation where I would want to take advantage of a longer buffer. It's always been 30 minutes on the TiVos I've used and it's not been an issue.
Also if they were going to change the buffer length you would think they would have done it by now. But you never know. I doubt its a simple task to make it longer. It would probably have a huge effect on the code to change it and would involve alot of effort to change it.
Aaron, Hard drives used to be a lot smaller on earlier Tivo models and larger buffers would have eaten a large percentage of their space. Yes, we use suggestions. But I also use thumbs up and down and so we get very few suggestions. I can't tell you how many times that something unexpected (honey-do's, contractor issues, next door neighbor needing help and etc) had me jump up from a live show and by the time I got back the end of what I was watching was gone because the buffer was 5 or 10 minutes too little. But I can tell you that 99% of time is was for something that wasn't repeated at some later time.
DonaldBurns65144 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 06:35 PM   #39
aaronwt
HD Addict
 
aaronwt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern VA(Woodbridge)
Posts: 14,487
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonaldBurns65144

Aaron, Hard drives used to be a lot smaller on earlier Tivo models and larger buffers would have eaten a large percentage of their space. Yes, we use suggestions. But I also use thumbs up and down and so we get very few suggestions. I can't tell you how many times that something unexpected (honey-do's, contractor issues, next door neighbor needing help and etc) had me jump up from a live show and by the time I got back the end of what I was watching was gone because the buffer was 5 or 10 minutes too little. But I can tell you that 99% of time is was for something that wasn't repeated at some later time.
That is why in 2002 I started hitting the record key any time I watched something. Prior to that I did the same thing as you. Once I started hitting the record key I never had to worry about missing something.
__________________
Roamio Pro
TiVo Mini x4
Roamio Basic OTA
40TB unRAID1--53TB unRAID2--36TB unRAID3
XBL/PSN: WormholeXtreme
aaronwt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 07:30 PM   #40
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by gantt View Post
Just because a program isn't one of the top two or four "most interesting" (per whose definition?)
Per your definition. You are the one watching the TiVo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gantt View Post
doesn't mean I don't have an interest in viewing it from an earlier point in time.
You are missing the point, entirely. First of all, the number four only relates to the Elite. Let's take the number two, instead, since most people do not have an Elite. Of all the channels you receive, at the moment you sit down there will be two that are broadcasting the two most interesting programs of all. They may not in fact be of much interest, but they would be judged by you to be the best. Now, if those two are in fact less interesting than something you have already recorded, then I would wonder why you bother watching either one, but we'll set that aside. The point is, the odds of either of those programs being on a live channel is very small.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gantt View Post
they're typically on channels that I already watch, not tuned randomly across 200-500 channels.
That begs several questions.

1. Why do you watch a "channel". The TiVo makes channel assignments irrelevant. I haven't watched a "channel" in over 12 years. If an interesting program airs, the TiVo records it, continuously compiling several times more interesting programs than I could possibly ever watch. The odds of any active program even being in the top 100 are just about zilch, unless of course the TiVo is recording it.

2. If that program is anything interesting, why isn't the TiVo already recording it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gantt View Post
I like a lot of what TiVo does, but you seem to be saying that TiVo's algorithm is so good it can read my mind.
Well, it can, of course, or at least it can and does read your recording habits. Add to that your input via the thumbs-up and thumbs-down buttons, and judicious use of wishlists, and the odds of missing an interesting program are pretty small, tuner conflicts aside. (Tuner conflicts don't count, however, because by definition a buffer cannot be active if a tuner conflict is in play.) Certainly the odds of what is on but not being recorded being better than the average of what has been recorded is vanishingly small.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gantt View Post
Better yet, it can anticipate the contents of a program like a news report where a story may have little or nothing to do with the program's title or generic content description.
That is the exception, but OTOH, recording the local and national news every day, or even three times a day is trivial.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gantt View Post
I'd say you're drinking the Kool-Aid, but I don't think even TiVo is serving that.
Nonesense. I like Alfred Hitchcock, so every time one of his films airs, no matter what the channel, it is recorded. Ditto Clint Eastwood, both as director and featuring him as an actor. Anything with Sandra Bullock, Peter O'Toole, Humphrey Bogart, etc. is similarly recorded. Anything whose similarities place it in close proximity to the things I have given a thumbs-up gets recorded. I record the local weather twice a day, and a local news feed once a day. All in all, typically more than 20 hours of programming gets recorded every day, and the odds of any program that happens to be on an inactive tuner being more interesting than even one of these is exceedingly low. That doesn't even take into account SDV channels. Until yesterday, I was on an SDV system, and almost all the programs I recorded were on SDV channels. Thus, once the recording was over, the SDV system would release the stream, so that unless one or both were actively recording, both buffers would almost always be busy.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 07:34 PM   #41
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhettf View Post
What if you want to watch more than just the current show on that channel? Its a hassel to hit record on the next 4 shows in the lineup if you just want to hit pause and go get your chore done.

Before I had a XL4 I used the extra tuner(s) to go to a channel I wanted to watch and would let it buffer up while I watch another program on live TV. Its because I didn't want to record the show, just watch TV without commercials.
The question is, "Why ever bring up live TV at all?" It offers no advantages.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 07:41 PM   #42
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonaldBurns65144 View Post
At least one hour. 2 hours better. User select would be okay too.
Anything more than zero is too much, but anythig more than the current 30 minutes that is not user selectable is unacceptable. Of course, the TiVos I own all have moderately large drives, but one I just got free from the CATV company only has about 48 hours recording capability, which is nowhere nearly enough. Take 2 or 4 hours off that, and it would be even more intolerable. I would wind up missing almost all the programs I recorded, let alone anything that might just happen to be in one of the buffers.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 07:44 PM   #43
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
Also if they were going to change the buffer length you would think they would have done it by now. But you never know. I doubt its a simple task to make it longer. It would probably have a huge effect on the code to change it and would involve a lot of effort to change it.
No, it's pretty trivial. Those of us with modified TiVos have been able to easily do it forever, now, if we care to.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 07:53 PM   #44
astrohip
Stuart F
 
astrohip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Houston & Brenham TX
Posts: 7,598
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrhorer View Post
Anything more than zero is too much, but anything more than the current 30 minutes that is not user selectable is unacceptable.
Unacceptable to you.

Just for once, consider the use of either "IMHO" or "YMMV".

Or not. YMMV.
astrohip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 07:57 PM   #45
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
For me, it's zero. I plan ahead, admittedly, a bit OCD.
I don't. I let the TiVo handle all that. I just sit down, hit the <SElect> button to enter the NPL, choose a video, and press <play>

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
Your 1% is incorrect. The tuners are not on random channels, they are on the last channel watched or recorded.
That is still a random channel. It may be unlikely that it is the Serbo-Croation Knittting Analysis channel, but it is still not deterministic. There is also a moderate likelihood the TiVo will have found and recorded something interesting on a channel that only occasionally holds anything of interest. Looking at the list of channel sources on my server, there are 91 different channels represented, with many of them only having aired 1 - 10 of the nearly 2000 videos there. Many of the channels which air programs I watch on a more or less regular basis are not represented there, at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
And (not me) I'm sure someone turns the TV on (lifetime was an example one poster offered) with a channel with a show that grabs one's interest.
The point is, if it is interesting, then if the Tivo is properly set up, the odds are exceedingly high it will be recording already. Conversely, if it is not recording, then the odds are extremely high it will be of little interest, and certainly of less interest than all the things that have been recorded. If neither of the two are true on any but the very rarest of instances, then the TiVo has not been set up properly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
This request is not at the top of my own wish list but I can see a case for it. That's all. To make my wife happy. Happy flows downstream....
By the way, this would seem a very minor SW update, the TiVo SW writers need to flip a few bytes and let them flow.
It is, but then those of us who have their TiVo's properly configured would scream, "Bloody murder!"

Last edited by lrhorer : 06-17-2012 at 08:29 PM.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:03 PM   #46
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by astrohip View Post
Unacceptable to you.

Just for once, consider the use of either "IMHO" or "YMMV".

Or not. YMMV.
It is unacceptable, period. Forcing a really bad idea on everyone just because some fraction of the populace thinks it would be a good idea is unacceptable in an absolute sense. This is triply true when it negatively impacts experienced or talented users in favor of rookies or duffers. Allowing users to set higher values would be OK in an absolute sense albeit silly IMO. Forcing such folly on everyone is unacceptable in every sense.

BTW, I do use the qualifiers you mention above whenever my statements are not based upon either empirical data or strong mathematical analysis. My sister once insisted that it was only my opinion that a mobius strip is an object with only one surface. Despite popular notions, many things are not a matter of opinion.

Last edited by lrhorer : 06-17-2012 at 08:22 PM.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:12 PM   #47
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by todd_j_derr View Post
+1 astrohip. I'd love a longer buffer, and I'm certainly not going to be persuaded otherwise by claims I'm using my Tivo incorrectly.
If you are "using" your TiVo at all, then you are using it sub-optimally. An optimally configured TiVo WILL know what you like and WILL record it, without your ever turning it on, and rarely ever touching it except to watch one or more programs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by todd_j_derr View Post
The last two non-Tivo DVRs I've used have had longer buffers, not to mention my old hacked S1. 90-120 minutes would be great, although if it were up to me I'd just let the buffer take up all the free space on the disk.
An optimally configured TiVo will almost never have any free space on the disk. I have three TiVos, with a total of more than 5T of storage (plus 18T of network storage, but that is another matter), and all 3 are 100% full. I just got a 4th yesterday, so it is almost empty, but I surely expect its rather small hard drive to be full in a matter of a few days.

I certainly would not be particularly upset if TiVo decided to remove the option to watch "live" TV entirely, although it would not really be a good idea.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:41 PM   #48
JoeTaxpayer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrhorer View Post
It is unacceptable, period. Forcing a really bad idea on everyone just because some fraction of the populace thinks it would be a good idea is unacceptable in an absolute sense. This is triply true when it negatively impacts experienced or talented users in favor of rookies or duffers. Allowing users to set higher values would be OK in an absolute sense albeit silly IMO. Forcing such folly on everyone is unacceptable in every sense.
Mobius strips aside, I'm able to understand how a feature I have no use for myself is actually desirable to others. IMHO, by adding it as a buried menu item, it can be updated by the user. I've IM'ed everyone and heard back already. Every last one of us agrees not to tell you it's been made available. You'd probably take offense.

The walk in and turn the TV on is one use case, but the step away to answer the phone, or walk the dog is one I'd see as valuable.
__________________
Toshiba SD-H400, Tivo Series 2, Tivo HD, TiVo Series 3 THX, TiVo Premiere (All upgraded with extra HD goodness) and an XL4.
JoeTaxpayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:42 PM   #49
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by astrohip View Post
Just for once, consider the use of either "IMHO" or "YMMV".
That sparked my curiosity, so I did a handful of searches. Excluding the off-topic areas, I found three pages of posts where I used the term "IMO", twenty-seven posts where I used the phrase "YMMV", eighteen posts where I used the term "IMHO", and four posts where I used the term "IMNSHO".

I think more than 100 posts where I used one of those terms more than amply qualifies as "Just for once."
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 08:48 PM   #50
dboff01
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrhorer View Post
This is triply true when it negatively impacts experienced or talented users in favor of rookies or duffers.
This line literally made me laugh out loud.

The words "talented users" were used in regards to operating a TV appliance.

Dear God sir, get over yourself.

P.S. I'm working on developing the symbiotic relationship with my toaster that Irhorer has apparently achieved with his Tivos. Wish me luck.
dboff01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 09:01 PM   #51
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
Mobius strips aside, I'm able to understand how a feature I have no use for myself is actually desirable to others.
It has nothing to do with desirability. It has everything to do with being useful in an optimal setting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
IMHO, by adding it as a buried menu item, it can be updated by the user.
There is no question of that. The question is, "Why bother". If the option to view live TV were eliminated altogether, then users would be forced to configure their TiVos in an optimal fashion. Catering to habits that allow users to obtain a poor experience from their device is akin to engineering co-dependency.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
I'm IM'ed everyone and heard back already. Every last one of us agrees not to tell you it's been made available. You'd probably take offense.
It's been available for the better part of a decade. It just offers nothing that makes the TiVo easier to use or more powerful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
The walk in and turn the TV on is one use case, but the step away to answer the phone, or walk the dog is one I'd see as valuable.
That still requires that one be watching "live TV". Very frequently, when I am watching TV, both tuners are already recording. The buffer is then completely irrelevant. Ditto when the TiVo has been inactive on an SDV channel. The rest of the time, going to a live feed is almost always nothing but a major waste of time, so why would I? If nothing is recording, then the odds of there being anything more interesting on than even a small fraction of the things that are recorded is so small it definitely is not worth my time. How many times must I point out that in the vast majority of cases, if there is anything on live TV that would be interesting, it would be recording? Browsing through every single channel (which takes more than an hour) whenever something is not already recording virtually never finds even one interesting program.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 09:32 PM   #52
supersportsfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 77
Oh boy...thats the one thing I have always loved about these forums...after all these years of being here, it has never changed. Someone comes in and gives a suggestion of something they personally would like to see. It isn't long before the TiVo "elitists" roll on through town to tell the individual why they are using the device incorrectly... Many of those individuals are still crying over the one inch by two inch real-estate space that was lost when the premiere was released with a free space indicator...Oh the humanity!

I have never been a suggestion fan. I don't have a whole lot of time to watch TV, so I can barely keep up with my season pass recordings. I never found that I enjoyed many of the suggestions anyway...but thats just my OPINION...a word that some obviously are not familiar with the meaning of.

Anyway, I myself would love to see the ABILITY to increase the buffer size. My best example is sports. Occasionally I will walk up to my TV, which is tuned to ESPN after recording PTI every afternoon, and there is a sporting event on (which I might sit down and become interested in.) The commentators might make reference to something that happened say 45 minutes prior. It would be nice to have an hour(+) buffer that would allow me to rewind and see the event that they are talking about. But I guess I am doing it wrong, considering that I wasn't already recording the national spelling bee, which I never dreamed I would watch

And get rid of live TV? Get outta here! You are probably 1% of TiVo's subscriber base and not even their target "audience" anymore...
supersportsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 09:47 PM   #53
dboff01
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 21
Agreed ... 30 minute buffer is lame, more would be better, as viewing habits for myself are a mix of live and recorded.
dboff01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 09:51 PM   #54
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by dboff01 View Post
This line literally made me laugh out loud.
That says a lot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dboff01 View Post
The words "talented users" were used in regards to operating a TV appliance.
The statement applies to much more than the TiVo, but it certainly does apply to the TiVo. The sad (not funny) statement above strongly suggests a rather large lack of understanding of what a TiVo is, or what it can do. A complete understanding would take a far greater familiarity with the platforms than I posses, and far more than a mere ten years of study. I come across new capabilities and undiscovered features of the TiVo almost every week.

The TiVo is a Linux based PC which is far, far more powerful not only than the coputers on board the Saturn V rockets which took men to the Moon and back, it is far more powerful than the computers on the ground that filled rooms whose total size was that of a gymnasium. It is far faster, far more flexible, and has vastly more storage space - millions of times more, in fact. It sports many of the very most creative utilities developed over the last 50 years, and devices that had not even a tiny fraction of its capabilities cost many tens of thousands of dollars in the 1960s. It has the ability to scan a database of several thousand programs, comparing them using clever heuristic routines to the programs one has watched and rated along with direct input from the user himself concerning the genre, key words and statements, actors, and directors.

'Fascinated with volcanoes? Create wishlists with keywords for geology, tectonic, lava, magma, pyroclastic, and of course, volcano. 'Like the Fred & Ginger musicals? Create a wishlist for Fred Astaire + Ginger Rogers. 'See a Christmas special you like? Give it two or three thumbs-up. Get creative with the boolean expressions in some otherwise broadly defined wishlists. Bowse the list of upcoming Suggestions, and give thumbs-down on any you don't like. It takes a few weeks to tune really finely, but once done, it requires almost no intervention of any sort from then on.

That said, even the manual processes can be enhanced by a better understanding of how the TiVo works. For example, the "Title" search isn't really a title search, at all. It is an index search, and I almost never use the title search to look for a title. Instead, once every couple of weeks, one may go to Search by Title => HD => Movies => 0 to see a complete list, starting at the top, of all the HD movies broadcast over the next 12 days or so. (It's not the way I do it actually. I use TiVoWebPlus, but then you know how much TWP is only a toaster, right?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dboff01 View Post
Dear God sir, get over yourself.
It is hardly myself over which I need to come. I can't take any credit for the TiVo, other than those modifications I have created myself and applied to my TiVos. That said, I don't think it is at all unreasonable that an individual who has bothered to learn the intricacies of a powerful and flexible computer system consider himself and other users of a similar competency at least moderately talented and experienced users. Certainly I would credit the judgments of Jaime P, William McBrine, Omikron, Unitron, bkdtv, and the other veteran TiVo users more than someone who has owned a TiVo only a few months, and perhaps has never even had the cover off.

OTOH, I don't recall seeing you explain at length to people how to build a video server for the TiVo, how to modify it to obtain better performance and access to a wider range of applications for the TiVo, or writing and publicly offering scripts and tutorials for the platform. Indeed, I only see 11 posts from you, total. Now, there is nothing wrong with being a rookie (well, nothing one can help, anyway), but with a join date of February of this year, I have to wonder how long you have owned a TiVo or how many of its myriad features you have investigated, at all?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dboff01 View Post
P.S. I'm working on developing the symbiotic relationship with my toaster that Irhorer has apparently achieved with his Tivos. Wish me luck.
I am going to refrain from going into delighted detail how dangerous an intimate relationship with a toaster would be for you, and only mention fleetingly that my handle is not Irhorer. I submit if you were at all familiar with the underlying technology of the TiVo, however, then you would be very unlikely to make such a mistake.

It is also one thing to be enamored of artifacts that appeal only to a rookie when one is ones' self a rookie, but it is quite another to dismiss with derision the ruminances, right or wrong, of someone who is experienced. Please do us all a favor and state your opinions - backed by whatever level of expertise you may have, but leave the nasty sarcasm at home.

Last edited by lrhorer : 06-17-2012 at 11:11 PM.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 10:41 PM   #55
lrhorer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Posts: 6,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
It isn't long before the TiVo "elitists" roll on through town to tell the individual why they are using the device incorrectly...
For some unfathomable reason, some people are offended by the notion that there is a set of methods and procedures that produce a peak of efficiency, and that there is somehow some sort of value in wasting time because it is tied to a bad habit. "It is the way I like / know / am used to doing it" is the worst possible reason for maintaining or implementing a system feature, second only to "it's new and the old way hasn't changed in a long time".

Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
Many of those individuals are still crying over the one inch by two inch real-estate space that was lost when the premiere was released with a free space indicator...Oh the humanity!
It is not the amount of screen space used by the indicator (although any unnecessary use of screen real-estate is not acceptable). It is the fact its existence encourages users to waste their time, and time is a precious commodity. Looked at one way, it is a form of theft, or at least, as I said, co-dependence. All of my TiVos have always had the ability to measure free space. I never, ever implement or use those capabilities, but guess what? My TiVos do a far, far better job of achieving the results which those who cried for the space meter get now they have it, and it doesn't require hours - or even milliseconds - of my own time to achieve them. Why ask for something that will allow the user to spend countless hours of tedious time to accomplish an inferior job of what the TiVo does far better without any input from the user?

Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
I have never been a suggestion fan. I don't have a whole lot of time to watch TV, so I can barely keep up with my season pass recordings.
I have rather few season passes, but that's not really the point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
I never found that I enjoyed many of the suggestions anyway...but thats just my OPINION...a word that some obviously are not familiar with the meaning of.
And how many times did you apply a thumbs-down to any of those suggestions you did not like? Did you even give a single one a thumbs-down? How often did you give a program you were watching a thumbs-up, or perhaps more rarely a thumbs-down? It is a matter of fact - not opinion, but FACT - that the percentage of less desirable suggestions will diminish rapidly as one applies thumbs-down to undesirable content. It will never tend to diminish much, if at all, if one never applies the thumbs-down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
Anyway, I myself would love to see the ABILITY to increase the buffer size. My best example is sports.
I never watch any sports, and indeed I should not be burdened with the cost of buying ESPN so that you can watch sports, but that is also another matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
But I guess I am doing it wrong, considering that I wasn't already recording the national spelling bee, which I never dreamed I would watch
Once again, you completely miss the point. If YOU are recording anything, then you are not only wasting your time, you are getting a poor result from it.

Nothing is perfect, certainly not the TiVo, but the odds the TiVo would recognize the spelling bee was something you might like to watch are many times greater than the odds of your just happening to come across it, or even being able to select it. No matter what one does, with several thousand programs airing each and every week, one is inevitably going to miss a significant number of programs they might like to watch, even if they get recorded, but surely if they do not. Configuring the TiVo properly, allowing it to do its job, and keeping one's bloody hands off the remote will by a very wide margin maximize the number of interesting programs one may view in the limited time one has to view them. It is a bit like sorting a mountain of coins of various denominations and nationalities. To be sure, a human being can do it, and if one is obsessed about the outcome one can take on the job ones' self, but a machine can do the job much, much faster and far, far more accurately.

Is it possible you might miss that spelling bee using properly automated methods? Absolutely. The point is, however, while you might (or perhaps not) miss that spelling bee, depending upon the buffer to catch anything will inevitably miss many hundreds or perhaps thousands of programs over a period of many years that employing automated methods will not miss, and the time not wasted on manual processes will allow one to watch many, many more. On the one side we have one program that did not get missed. On the other we have hundreds. Exactly how is the former better? Because it wears out more batteries?

Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
And get rid of live TV? Get outta here! You are probably 1% of TiVo's subscriber base and not even their target "audience" anymore...
Once again, I am not suggesting it should happen, but it would improve both the quality (by your own judgement, not mine) and number of the programs you watch while diminishing the amount of time you waste fiddling with the remote, waste being defined as "not watching an interesting program".

Answer me this, however. Changing the buffer size requires a trivial change to the source code and a modification of literally only a handful of bytes in the binary. So why has TiVo left the buffer at 30 minutes? There are actually a couple of reasons, but one of them is the TiVo engineers realize, as do I, that it is a waste of drive space for no significant gain in system performance.

Last edited by lrhorer : 06-17-2012 at 11:15 PM.
lrhorer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 11:23 PM   #56
lonewoolf47
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Denver, CO.
Posts: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
Oh boy...thats the one thing I have always loved about these forums...after all these years of being here, it has never changed. Someone comes in and gives a suggestion of something they personally would like to see. It isn't long before the TiVo "elitists" roll on through town to tell the individual why they are using the device incorrectly... Many of those individuals are still crying over the one inch by two inch real-estate space that was lost when the premiere was released with a free space indicator...Oh the humanity!

I have never been a suggestion fan. I don't have a whole lot of time to watch TV, so I can barely keep up with my season pass recordings. I never found that I enjoyed many of the suggestions anyway...but thats just my OPINION...a word that some obviously are not familiar with the meaning of.

Anyway, I myself would love to see the ABILITY to increase the buffer size. My best example is sports. Occasionally I will walk up to my TV, which is tuned to ESPN after recording PTI every afternoon, and there is a sporting event on (which I might sit down and become interested in.) The commentators might make reference to something that happened say 45 minutes prior. It would be nice to have an hour(+) buffer that would allow me to rewind and see the event that they are talking about. But I guess I am doing it wrong, considering that I wasn't already recording the national spelling bee, which I never dreamed I would watch

And get rid of live TV? Get outta here! You are probably 1% of TiVo's subscriber base and not even their target "audience" anymore...
I totally agree. I can't count the times that i've turned the tv on and there was a movie or just a tv program that I didn't know would be on. There are just too many channels to keep track of. This day and age a 30 minute buffer is just not enough. I had Directv DVR's and I loved their 90 minute buffers.
lonewoolf47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 11:40 PM   #57
JoeTaxpayer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by supersportsfan View Post
I have never been a suggestion fan. I don't have a whole lot of time to watch TV, so I can barely keep up with my season pass recordings. I never found that I enjoyed many of the suggestions anyway...but that's just my OPINION...a word that some obviously are not familiar with the meaning of.

Anyway, I myself would love to see the ABILITY to increase the buffer size. My best example is sports.
@supersportsfan People have their own situations. To me, it sounds more convoluted to tell you you should be recording your sport event, or that TiVo should know to record it, than it does to just know that the buffer is running. I love my TiVos, but I have no goal to use their features to the nth degree. Season passes are great, but like you, I killed the suggestions, never found one that I wanted to watch. The wish list is fine, but one can live a full and happy life not have one wish programmed.

@lrhorer - I've tinkered with my TiVos. Swapped out drives, imaged new ones, etc. Encoded Video off the TiVo to view on an iPad, and encoded video to send to TiVo from ripped DVDs or home movies. That doesn't make my feature wants/don't cares any better or worse than the new TiVo users. I hope TiVo adds this option, and then I'll explain to my wife why it should exist, that its very nature offends some people.

By the way, I saw your last response to supersportsfan. I tried the thumbs down to help the suggestions get better. I even thumbs downed every kid show that had a season pass, hoping that would stop suggestions from recording more kid shows. When that didn't work, I stopped.

It seems that there are three groups here. Those who want the option, those who might never use it, but understand its value, and you. Hmm. You're an engineer, why does a hundred bytes on a TB+ drive bother you?
__________________
Toshiba SD-H400, Tivo Series 2, Tivo HD, TiVo Series 3 THX, TiVo Premiere (All upgraded with extra HD goodness) and an XL4.
JoeTaxpayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2012, 11:56 PM   #58
L David Matheny
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: SE Ohio
Posts: 1,242
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTaxpayer View Post
You're an engineer, why does a hundred bytes on a TB+ drive bother you?
HD requires several gigabytes per hour of video, but it's still a drop in the bucket with TB drives. And I can't imagine how anybody could seriously object to making buffer space a user choice, which should be easy enough for TiVo.
L David Matheny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2012, 12:18 AM   #59
aaronwt
HD Addict
 
aaronwt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Northern VA(Woodbridge)
Posts: 14,487
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrhorer View Post
No, it's pretty trivial. Those of us with modified TiVos have been able to easily do it forever, now, if we care to.
If it's a trivial matter then there must be some reason why they have never offered a user adjustable buffer.

Any idea why? I have no idea.
__________________
Roamio Pro
TiVo Mini x4
Roamio Basic OTA
40TB unRAID1--53TB unRAID2--36TB unRAID3
XBL/PSN: WormholeXtreme
aaronwt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2012, 01:28 AM   #60
supersportsfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 77
I feel like I am reliving fahrenheit 451 all over again...

Thinking is not allowed! The machine must chose what to watch for you!

Quote:
I never watch any sports, and indeed I should not be burdened with the cost of buying ESPN so that you can watch sports, but that is also another matter.
That statement alone sums it up for me...

The bottom line is, one of the most amazing things about human life is, we all are different...have our own thoughts and opinions...and do things our own way. And THAT is the beauty of devices having settings and options so that we may use them how we each see fit. To each his own.

Alas, I will continue to use my TiVo the way that I have for nearly 10 years and will continue enjoying it, and continue to believe that it is the best investment that I have ever made...even if I am using it at such a low efficiency level...so don't lose too much sleep, because I never intend to use it as "hardcorely" as you. My loss I guess?...
supersportsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Forum Jump




Thread Tools


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Advertisements

TiVo Community
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Skins by: Relivo Media

(C) 2013 Magenium Solutions - All Rights Reserved. No information may be posted elsewhere without written permission.
TiVoŽ is a registered trademark of TiVo Inc. This site is not owned or operated by TiVo Inc.
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:56 PM.
OUR NETWORK: MyOpenRouter | TechLore | SansaCommunity | RoboCommunity | MediaSmart Home | Explore3DTV | Dijit Community | DVR Playground |