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Old 05-10-2012, 03:39 PM   #1
mikeyts
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TiVo's New Netflix Player Hands-On Review

Here at TechOfTheHub.com:
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TiVo has just released a new Netflix player as part of their 2012 spring software update. In addition to being able to browse the Netflix catalog, the new TiVo Premiere Netflix player comes with support for 1080P HD video, Dolby Digital Plus surround sound and closed captions. When you add in TiVo’s comprehensive search capability and the convenience it offers (given TiVo usually lives on HDMI1), this is one of the best Netflix streaming implementations available.
This has me considering buying a Premiere and selling my old Series3 w/PLS.
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Old 05-10-2012, 04:08 PM   #2
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i get a "page not found" when clicking on the link.

This link takes me to it.

http://www.techofthehub.com/2012/05/...on-review.html
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Old 05-10-2012, 04:16 PM   #3
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in the Endgadget review they mention the DD+ logo lighting up on their receiver. So the premiere would have been bitstreaming the DD+.

http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/10/t...re-xl4-review/

Quote:
...........The good news is that both 1080p and 5.1 are supported and we even saw the Dolby Digital Plus light on our AVR get some action..........

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Old 05-10-2012, 04:34 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
i get a "page not found" when clicking on the link.

This link takes me to it.

http://www.techofthehub.com/2012/05/...on-review.html
I fixed it.
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Old 05-10-2012, 04:38 PM   #5
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in the Endgadget review they mention the DD+ logo lighting up on their receiver. So the premiere would have been bitstreaming the DD+.

http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/10/t...re-xl4-review/
Thanks for answering my comment at the TechOfTheHub review . Good--I was surprised by the initial claim that it wouldn't be supporting DD+. I wonder if it can decode into LPCM or convert to basic DD for those whose AVRs can't handle DD+ (the Roku 2 can only bitstream DD+, which is slightly problematic inasmuch as not nearly all AVRs or connected televisions can handle that). Doesn't really matter to me, since my AVR can deal.
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Old 05-10-2012, 07:34 PM   #6
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FWIW, I can confirm 1080p/24 is working from the TiVo Netflix App. I think my AppleTV only gives me 1080p/30.

I haven't seen DD+ yet.
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Old 05-10-2012, 07:41 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by mikeyts View Post
Thanks for answering my comment at the TechOfTheHub review . Good--I was surprised by the initial claim that it wouldn't be supporting DD+. I wonder if it can decode into LPCM or convert to basic DD for those whose AVRs can't handle DD+ (the Roku 2 can only bitstream DD+, which is slightly problematic inasmuch as not nearly all AVRs or connected televisions can handle that). Doesn't really matter to me, since my AVR can deal.
It can convert down to regular Dolby Digital over the S/PDIF (digital optical) output of the TiVo. The TiVo can do PCM but it's only 2 channel from what my receiver reports (either HDMI or optical)
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Old 05-10-2012, 08:08 PM   #8
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The audio and video quality on the 1080p/24f streams are amazing! Destination Truth looks better on Netflix than on my Syfy linear channel!
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Old 05-10-2012, 08:41 PM   #9
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There is one particularly maddening part of this new app. From using my Tivo, when I play a video that has a progress bar visible, I immediately hit "Clear" out of habit to remove it. Also, when I'm text entry window that has a "Clear" button, I obviously expect that the "Clear" button on my remote will do the same thing - clear the text.

But, in the new youtube and netflix apps, Clear exits the application!

Please, please, please have them change this behavior, Tivo! Don't force us to retrain our brains to react differently based on which screen we're looking at!

Consistency = familiarity = comfort = happy customers.
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Old 05-10-2012, 08:55 PM   #10
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I used the new app today. It's a definite improvement!! The only thing I didn't like is that there seems to be a bit of a delay when using the pause/rewind/etc buttons. I don't recall it taking so long before.
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:39 PM   #11
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How am I getting DD 5.1 from these titles. On my secondary setup with a Sony speaker bar that can handle 7.1 pcm but it is not DD+ capable. Every title I try with DD+ 5.1 is giving me DD 5.1 audio. If I go to my main setup, the same titles will give me DD+ if I by pass my Algolith Flea which is only HDMi 1.1 or 1.2. If I try to go through it then I get no audio.

So is the TiVo playing a secondary audio track that is only DD 5.1? The Roku doesn't do this.
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Old 05-10-2012, 10:13 PM   #12
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I have no idea why it's sending DD 5.1 since it's DD+ in my main setup from the same titles. But I won't be using my Roku2 for Netflix any more in that room. Since the Roku2 can only do stereo to the legacy speaker bar while the TiVo is able to send DD 5.1.
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Old 05-11-2012, 02:33 AM   #13
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When I start up a Netflix title with DD+ audio, it seems like a roll of the dice will give me one of the following:

No audio at all (Receiver display just says the default of "Stereo")
Regular Dolby Digital
Dolby Digital + (with the blue "HD Audio" light on my receiver lighting up)

When the adaptive streaming kicks in and the video mode switches to 1080p/24 Hz, the audio mode continues to be the same as when the title started. It doesn't go from no audio to DD+, for example.

I am using a Denon AVR-2809CI receiver with HDMI only. If I don't get DD+ audio, I can usually arrow up out of the program, resume it, and then it will play the DD+ audio with the "HD Audio" blue light on the receiver lit as expected.

On my Roku2, I get DD+ audio 100% of the time for titles with a DD+ audio track indicated, so I'm not sure what might be happening on the Elite/XL4.

The 1080p/24 picture on the Breaking Bad and Mad Men episodes I've tried look freakin' awesome though. I hope the consistency of the audio track selection will work itself out.
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Old 05-11-2012, 06:48 AM   #14
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the new tivo app loads quickly for me, navigation is quick and loading a movie is almost instantaneous. menues not as fast as the roku or apple tv obviously, but its very quick, waaaaaaaaaay quicker than the boxee box. the BB is just slow on everything.

the 1080p24 and dd+ is great, definitely the best netflix device out there.
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Old 05-11-2012, 07:15 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djwilso View Post
When I start up a Netflix title with DD+ audio, it seems like a roll of the dice will give me one of the following:

No audio at all (Receiver display just says the default of "Stereo")
Regular Dolby Digital
Dolby Digital + (with the blue "HD Audio" light on my receiver lighting up)

When the adaptive streaming kicks in and the video mode switches to 1080p/24 Hz, the audio mode continues to be the same as when the title started. It doesn't go from no audio to DD+, for example.

I am using a Denon AVR-2809CI receiver with HDMI only. If I don't get DD+ audio, I can usually arrow up out of the program, resume it, and then it will play the DD+ audio with the "HD Audio" blue light on the receiver lit as expected.

On my Roku2, I get DD+ audio 100% of the time for titles with a DD+ audio track indicated, so I'm not sure what might be happening on the Elite/XL4.

The 1080p/24 picture on the Breaking Bad and Mad Men episodes I've tried look freakin' awesome though. I hope the consistency of the audio track selection will work itself out.
In my main setup I have a Denon 3808. Bypassing my Algolith Flea and going straight into my DVDO DUO I am getting DD+ almost every time. But a couple of times I did see DD show up instead.
When I go through the Algolith Flea, I am sometimes seeing DD and sometimes having no audio.(the Flea has HDMI 1.1 or 1.2 which can't handle DD+)
But in either situation I'm having an issue where I lose audio if I fast Forward through a good portion of the title. I have to exit out of the Netflix App and back to get audio back.

I've decided that I will continue to use the TiVo in my main setup only for Netflix content with stereo audio. Then there are zero issues with audio when I FF/REW during a title. And I will continue using my Roku2 for the 5.1 DD+ titles.
Part of this is because of the audio issue and part of it is because to even get DD+ from my TiVo I have to bypass my Algolith Flea, which results in a decrease in the video quality. Since the flea does a great job with filtering some of the video noise. If the TiVo were able to scale everything to 1080P24, it wouldn't have the resync issues that seem to be causing part of this problem for me.

In my secondary setup with my Sony speaker bar. I am consistently getting DD 5.1 audio from the 5.1 titles. I'm also having no audio issues when I FF/REW through a large portion of the title. I still have no idea why I am getting DD at all from any of the 5.1 titles since they are supposed to be showing up as DD+. And my speaker bar is incapable of decoding DD+. But I can't complain since I can use the TiVo now instead of my Roku2 in that room for Netflix.

I like the new Netflix App on the TiVo but the issue where is resyncs when it goes from 720P to 1080P24 or 1080i to 1080P24 causes you to miss a second or two of the program. The boxes that scale to 1080P60 have an advantage since they don't have this issue. But on the flip side, with the TiVo having native resolution output capability with Netflix, it allows you to use an external scaler giving better scaling video results than other devices, like the Roku2 or the PS3. SO either way there is going to be some kind of trade off.
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Old 05-11-2012, 11:16 AM   #16
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I like the Netflix App a lot but I hate the Youtube App and I hate how the navigation is totally different from the Tivo experience. What were they thinking?
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Old 05-11-2012, 11:20 AM   #17
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I like the Netflix App a lot but I hate the Youtube App and I hate how the navigation is totally different from the Tivo experience. What were they thinking?
Google designed the App so it is what Google was thinking
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Old 05-11-2012, 11:40 AM   #18
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Google designed the App so it is what Google was thinking
That's such a cop out from Tivo. I noticed in the spring update message they specifically stated that the apps were designed by Netflix and Youtube. That's total crap. It's Tivo's product and Tivo is responsible for the overall user experience. Tivo should play a more hands on role.
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Old 05-11-2012, 11:44 AM   #19
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That's such a cop out from Tivo. I noticed in the spring update message they specifically stated that the apps were designed by Netflix and Youtube. That's total crap. It's Tivo's product and Tivo is responsible for the overall user experience. Tivo should play a more hands on role.
I dont think it is a cop out at all. I wouldnt be surprised and even more so with netflix trying to have a consistent design across platforms they said, if you want our product on your box, we will dictate how it looks and works
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Old 05-11-2012, 11:59 AM   #20
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That's such a cop out from Tivo. I noticed in the spring update message they specifically stated that the apps were designed by Netflix and Youtube. That's total crap. It's Tivo's product and Tivo is responsible for the overall user experience. Tivo should play a more hands on role.
I agree whole heartedly. Unfortunately when that happens with TiVo you get a 1.0 product for nearly 4 years with little meaningful updates. I agree it stinks that the apps are loosing the TiVo fit and finish. Some of the button choices are horribly annoying. But if it means we'll get quicker updates and more content partners than I guess I'll take that poison pill. But I also don't have to be happy about it.
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Old 05-11-2012, 04:33 PM   #21
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I dont think it is a cop out at all. I wouldnt be surprised and even more so with netflix trying to have a consistent design across platforms they said, if you want our product on your box, we will dictate how it looks and works
How does this process work on iOS devices? Can you imagine what Apple would tell an app provider who refuses to conform to the iOS UI conventions?
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Old 05-11-2012, 04:37 PM   #22
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I get an error when trying to use netflix after the update.
its the usual "an unexpected error has occurred" I have restarted the tivo as well.
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Old 05-11-2012, 04:38 PM   #23
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Netflix Program Info

Is there a way in the new Neflix App to bring up the Program Info while a program is playing? Info button used to work, I cant seem to find anything now.

EDIT: NVM - http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...d.php?t=487218

1080p looks great...
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Old 05-11-2012, 04:44 PM   #24
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How does this process work on iOS devices? Can you imagine what Apple would tell an app provider who refuses to conform to the iOS UI conventions?
Good lord, Tivo is not Apple, and is not in the position to drive that kind of bargain. It would be a better comparison to Android.

Tivo can certainly express their opinion, but they clearly set this up so that everyone knows they don't own the code. We can work on compiling the list for Tivo to show Netflix, but we should complain to Netflix as well. That is hard to do, but their facebook page seemed to be a popular target last fall...
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Old 05-11-2012, 04:54 PM   #25
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the 1080p24 and dd+ is great, definitely the best netflix device out there.
I'd disagree. The 2012 Panasonic BD players have the same capabilities and UI; other players have the same capabilities sans 24p video output (I'm assuming that TiVo can output video at 24p through HDMI). Of the 6 devices I currently own which can stream Netflix, my favorite is probably Roku 2--I prefer the TiVo/PS3/BD-player UI, but the Roku is so much faster than anything other than PS3 (and operates on literally 1% the power drawn by my launch model 60GB PS3); it starts the player in about 5 seconds and titles start to stream in about the same amount of time. It cannot, however, output video in 24p or convert Netflix's DD+ into basic DD for AVRs and televisions which can't handle DD+ but that doesn't bother me.

EDIT: Looking at the video in Engadget's XL4 review, the new TiVo player seems to start stream playback pretty quickly, much faster than the typical BD player.
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