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Old 03-24-2012, 12:51 AM   #91
MeInDallas
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That's why I usually do a manual reboot about 20-30 minutes before 7pm to get it all set up. I can make it thru the prime time shows and sure enough about the time the local news goes off I expect it to mess up and poof it does. I'd love to be able to schedule stuff while I'm gone or asleep, but forget that it never works out. I've gotten in the habit of when I get up in the morning the first thing I do is turn on the TV and reboot the Tivo so I can watch the morning news, all before I start the coffee goin. I would really love to get mine going for a few days at least, but my other 3 Tivos work great and I have no issues with them, so I've just been recording everything on them while I'm gone and then stream everything or transfer. It's sad I have to do that though, and here I got this $450 "gorilla in the room" just sitting there.
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Old 03-24-2012, 01:20 AM   #92
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That's why I usually do a manual reboot about 20-30 minutes before 7pm to get it all set up. I can make it thru the prime time shows and sure enough about the time the local news goes off I expect it to mess up and poof it does. I'd love to be able to schedule stuff while I'm gone or asleep, but forget that it never works out. I've gotten in the habit of when I get up in the morning the first thing I do is turn on the TV and reboot the Tivo so I can watch the morning news, all before I start the coffee goin. I would really love to get mine going for a few days at least, but my other 3 Tivos work great and I have no issues with them, so I've just been recording everything on them while I'm gone and then stream everything or transfer. It's sad I have to do that though, and here I got this $450 "gorilla in the room" just sitting there.
Since the unit is always on and always recording, I assume it's not a heat issue, although I suppose some activities do generate a bit more heat than others. Failing (rebooting, scrambled video, whatever) after a certain amount of operating time could be a symptom of a memory management problem. Maybe some table overflows and steps on something. TiVo should have someone read through the code with that sort of thing in mind.

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Old 03-24-2012, 01:28 AM   #93
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See thats the thing, it doesnt reboot on its own, I have to manually reboot it to get the channels back. I've never had those random reboots like other people talk about. If I leave it on then it'll stay on forever that way, just no picture on the channels. My take on it is there is some conflict with the cable cards and tuning adapter models that TWC uses here. I had read somewhere else in another thread that the Elite uses a different type or brand of tuners than the other "2 tuner" Tivos. I dont know that for sure, but thats what I read here. Then theres all those RS corrected and uncorrected errors in the diagnostic screen, and everyone says thats normal, but none of my other Tivos have that on them. They are all at 0 errors. So I dont know what to make of it, but I'm on Elite #3 at this point and its getting old.
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Old 03-24-2012, 01:47 AM   #94
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See thats the thing, it doesnt reboot on its own, I have to manually reboot it to get the channels back. I've never had those random reboots like other people talk about. If I leave it on then it'll stay on forever that way, just no picture on the channels. My take on it is there is some conflict with the cable cards and tuning adapter models that TWC uses here. I had read somewhere else in another thread that the Elite uses a different type or brand of tuners than the other "2 tuner" Tivos. I dont know that for sure, but thats what I read here. Then theres all those RS corrected and uncorrected errors in the diagnostic screen, and everyone says thats normal, but none of my other Tivos have that on them. They are all at 0 errors. So I dont know what to make of it, but I'm on Elite #3 at this point and its getting old.
I realized you hadn't mentioned rebooting and edited my post, but you got there before I saved it. Your symptoms could still be caused by a memory management problem, but if nobody who's OTA sees the same symptoms then I'm inclined to agree with you that the problem is related to cable cards or tuning adapters. And since the new quad cable-only tuners in the Elite are presumably serviced by different code from that used in other Premieres, that may be where a bug was introduced. The greater number of errors seen by an Elite's tuner/demodulator circuitry actually worries me more, because that may require code optimization that could be a lot more difficult than just finding a bug causing the other symptoms.
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Old 03-24-2012, 02:16 AM   #95
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Yeah I saw you edited it, no worries

But I agree with you, I think its got to be something in the software, maybe a conflict of some kind that doesnt get along well with these tuners, then add these tuning adapters to it and it goes crazy. I can put one of my 2 tuner Tivos on the same line and the signal is perfect and after days of being on there theres not one error, but I'll go look at the Elite wherever I put it on the house and they just follow whatever jack I hook it to. The last one I sent back they said there were logs on it they can look at so I guess we will see. I'm just glad more and more people are buying them so maybe they can get out there and if enough people speak loud enough they will try to figure it out.
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Old 03-24-2012, 02:39 AM   #96
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I was going to say, it seems like people on FIOS dont have any problems, and I think they dont use tuning adapters? I dont know, but I've never seen anyone say they had an issue and then say they were on FIOS.
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Old 03-24-2012, 05:57 PM   #97
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That's why I usually do a manual reboot about 20-30 minutes before 7pm to get it all set up.
This is solution is nearly the same mickymouse bs I have to do with my S3. The difference is the tuning adapter has to be powered down (I use a $10 lamp timer from Ace Hardware) for 4 hours daily so the GC can complete. If GC does not complete, in a couple of weeks you start getting running out of guide data messages.


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I was going to say, it seems like people on FIOS dont have any problems, and I think they dont use tuning adapters? I dont know, but I've never seen anyone say they had an issue and then say they were on FIOS.
From what I understand FIOS does not use SDV. They have big enough pipes so they can provide all channels 24/7.

The tuning adapter is pure evil.
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Old 03-24-2012, 06:39 PM   #98
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The tuning adapter is pure evil.
Amen!

I NEVER had an one issue with Tivo's until TWC went to SDV.
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Old 03-24-2012, 07:19 PM   #99
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I was going to say, it seems like people on FIOS dont have any problems, and I think they dont use tuning adapters? I dont know, but I've never seen anyone say they had an issue and then say they were on FIOS.
I've seen several, here's 1 long thread about it where OP is with FIOS:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...ght=fios+elite
I've seen enough posts about tuning issues with Elite that it put me off buying one. The fact that they switched to new Maxlinear-based tuners means there is a learning curve ahead to fix any issues.
What's more worrisome is in these threads people say if they use same coax and connections for a Series 3 in place of the Elite there are no issues which points the finger squarely at the Elite.
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Old 03-25-2012, 06:11 PM   #100
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Amen!

I NEVER had an one issue with Tivo's until TWC went to SDV.

And, TiVo has yet to admit a problem exists.
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Old 03-26-2012, 04:09 PM   #101
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Just curious, what cable system are you on? I'm on TWC. Thats pretty much the same time it happens to my Elite as well. Always during prime time hours when I record most my of shows. I try to manually reboot mine around 6:30pm or a little bit after that so its coming off a fresh reboot going into prime time. Also I'm on my 3rd Elite now as of this week. If I cant get this one to work soon I'm just going to cancel it for awhile until they get the bugs worked out.
Yeah, I am in Dallas as well (Lakewood) with TWC. I have an older Scientific Atlanta cable card that I switched from my S3. I am thinking of trying to switch it out for the Motorola cable card to see if that works. I never had any issues with the S3 at all.

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Old 03-26-2012, 06:09 PM   #102
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<del>
What's more worrisome is in these threads people say if they use same coax and connections for a Series 3 in place of the Elite there are no issues which points the finger squarely at the Elite.
my s3 had been working 2-3 years after i got all the issues from the tuning adaptor rollout sorted out. then it died (hard drive, most likely) and i purchased the elite and here's the damming phrase: under the exact same environment and conditions and with the exact same class 'm' cards that were in the s3, the elite has given me 3 months of nightmares, hence this thread.

and, like @meindallas, i have no issue with random reboots, just losing all the channels, usually with a 'signal not found' error message. a reboot or reseating the card brings back the channels 99% of the time, power cycling the tuning adaptor does nothing.

/guy
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Old 03-26-2012, 08:16 PM   #103
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I am having the exact same problem. No reboots but it loses signal often - particularly around prime time. Exact same set up as my series 3 and my normal premiere in the other room has no issues. My signal strength is over 80. If I reboot, everything works fine.
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Old 03-26-2012, 08:40 PM   #104
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Yeah, I am in Dallas as well (Lakewood) with TWC. I have an older Scientific Atlanta cable card that I switched from my S3. I am thinking of trying to switch it out for the Motorola cable card to see if that works. I never had any issues with the S3 at all.
You can't swap Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) with Motorola. The system is either one or the other. The CableCARDs are not compatible. Your provider if using SA/Cisco will not have any Motorola CCs.
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Old 03-26-2012, 09:16 PM   #105
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Aren't these things supposed to be using some sort of standatds?
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Old 03-26-2012, 09:23 PM   #106
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You can't swap Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) with Motorola. The system is either one or the other. The CableCARDs are not compatible. Your provider if using SA/Cisco will not have any Motorola CCs.
If he's in Dallas and I'm in Dallas and both on the TWC system then how come he has a different type of Cablecard than I do? I have 4 Motorola Cablecards and 4 Motorola Tuning Adapters.
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Old 03-26-2012, 10:15 PM   #107
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TWC told me today they carry both models. The guy I talked to said the Motorola is easier to pair. They have no idea what they are doing but it is nice they at least have a cable card call center.
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Old 03-26-2012, 10:58 PM   #108
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If he's in Dallas and I'm in Dallas and both on the TWC system then how come he has a different type of Cablecard than I do? I have 4 Motorola Cablecards and 4 Motorola Tuning Adapters.
Dallas is a big place, 2 different headends, serving 2 distinct systems with 2 different hardware vendors, Motorola and SA/Cisco. TWC most likely purchased the 2 systems from other providers and never consolidated the systems into one vendor protocol. Whatever the headend is Motorola or SA/Cisco will determine the CC vendor also.

EDIT: Also
Motorola Tuning Adapters only work with Motorola CableCARDS and headends
Cisco Tuning Adapters will work with SA and NDS CableCARDS and headends
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:16 PM   #109
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Problem: no channels
Fix: reseated cc
Note: i am getting concerned that i have lost channels several times in the last two weeks after a 3 week string of proper operation.

anyone else on twc in dfw lose channels this afternoon?

/guy
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Old 03-27-2012, 08:19 PM   #110
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Problem: no channels
Fix: reseated cc
Does reseating the cable card involve unplugging it or disconnecting or power cycling anything? Or do you mean that just moving it slightly in its socket actually fixes something?
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Old 03-27-2012, 08:40 PM   #111
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Problem: no channels
Fix: reseated cc
Note: i am getting concerned that i have lost channels several times in the last two weeks after a 3 week string of proper operation.

anyone else on twc in dfw lose channels this afternoon?

/guy
I've been seeing a new problem. I'll have something set to record, and if I'm sitting there and tuned to that channel when it stops, then an error pops up saying the channel is not authorized and I have to switch the channel to another one and back again to get that channel back. Joy!
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Old 03-28-2012, 10:17 PM   #112
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Dang it. Missed more recordings today. Normal Premiere works great but Elite has missed shows at least 4 times in the last two weeks. I am going to try to replace the cable card this weekend. I love the Elite but I can't handle missed recordings.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:00 PM   #113
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Problem: no channels -- 'problem with signals on this channel' on every screen.
Fix: reseated cc
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Old 03-30-2012, 11:06 AM   #114
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Old 03-30-2012, 06:48 PM   #115
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i would kill to have fios. i called verizon the other night to ask if it was coming to my area and what surrounding areas had it now. clueless is the most kind term i can apply to the person who answered the phone. she claimed that since my address would not show up in her computer that meant she could not tell me where fios was offered--not down to a city not even down to the state. what does my address have to do with whether they offer it in any given city? idiots reading from a script ...

i later found a map and fios is very scattered around north texas, mainly in the 'high-dollar' communities. alas, my neighborhood is old and has seen better days and i doubt fios will ever make it here. if i could splice fiber i'd drive 40 miles and hijack a switch port.

i also bought a roku and an apple tv. the apple tv was more for the airplay so i could mirror my iphone and ipad to my mac and hd tv--the content is pretty restricted. the roku is more open, but i already had access to my netflix and amazon streaming video accounts via a panasonic blu-ray dvd player and my tivo, so there's not much new there either. and i'll be dammed if i'll pay hulu for streaming content _and_ watch ads on it (although i already do that with a lot of cable content, damm their eyes).

and i heard that direct tv got tivo now, but you can't pick your tivo box and the one they offer seems like very bare bones. and it doesn't matter anyway because i have no view of the satellites.

the outlook for the consumer seems very dismal and the content providers and the carriers are losing billions of dollars because they are locked in their dinosaur-era thinking and marketing models and worshiping at the altar of drm. damm all their eyes. i no longer fault anyone who pirates content that they will not offer for sale or rent to consumers.

/guy
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Old 03-30-2012, 07:50 PM   #116
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gteague,

I called Verizon, several months ago, to ask when FIOS would be available in my area (make that neighborhood.) I was told Verizon would not spend the $$$ for infrastructure, in my area. Because we already had TimeWarner cable and ATT Uverse.

WELL NUTS!
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Old 03-30-2012, 09:09 PM   #117
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i would kill to have fios.
/guy
Guy,

I have Fios, and the Elite did not perform a heck of a lot better.

I purchased an Elite + 3 XLs on the same day. The XLs all perform admirably - zero (or near zero) RS corrected/uncorrected, and no pixelation. I also have never had a recording lost to a dropped signal.

The Elite, on the other hand.... Within my 30-day return window, I had most shows recorded with pixelization whenever there was sudden movement on the screen. I had programs that were unwatchable because the channels would drop out and come back. The signal strength for these channels on the Elite were in the high 80's and would still drop off.

I tried everything suggested on this board - swapping CC, swapping the Elite with a Premiere in a different room, adding attenuators. It didn't work for me. I was not using the internal MOca adapter; I had a direct coax and a direct Ethernet.

BTW, that Elite was my SECOND one. The first one was DOA out of the box.

The final straw was when the Elite rebooted twice in one day (on the 29th day of ownership). I had not had a spontaneous reboot prior to that, and I certainly didn't want to venture down that road. On the 30th day, I returned it and exchanged it for another XL. That XL is using the same cable and same CC, and is working flawlessly.


What amazes me is that you have been banging your head against a wall for three months, posting almost hourly for the first 30 days, and never once considered returning it like I did. Now it's too late for you. Heck, even now I have to ask - why don't you sell the damned thing on E-bay, take a $200 loss, and buy a Premiere? Seriously, it will lower your blood pressure by 50 points. Pass the curse to someone else.

I have no doubt that the Elite issues will be eventually addressed by some SW update; I just didn't want to wait around for that magical day.
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Old 03-31-2012, 05:12 PM   #118
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Ugh. I got a new cable card today. Worked for all of 6 hours before it lost a signal. The frustrating thing is that is loses all channels - even the ones you get without a cable card. It must be the elite. My premiere and HD always work.
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Old 03-31-2012, 06:41 PM   #119
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I'm on my 3rd Elite. Next week I'm going to get a regular Premiere and put the Elite in the closet for awhile until they get this issue worked out. I'm sick of dealing with it.
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Old 04-01-2012, 01:43 AM   #120
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Guy,

<del>
What amazes me is that you have been banging your head against a wall for three months, posting almost hourly for the first 30 days, and never once considered returning it like I did. Now it's too late for you. Heck, even now I have to ask - why don't you sell the damned thing on E-bay, take a $200 loss, and buy a Premiere? Seriously, it will lower your blood pressure by 50 points. Pass the curse to someone else.
<del>
this is my 2nd elite and there's not a dime's worth of difference between the two i've tried. also, aside from banging my head against the wall hourly [g], i've been working with an 'executive level' team at tivo up until a few days ago when we closed the ticket thinking the latest cable card had, if not solved the 'problem', but at least made the symptoms bearable. at this point i could live with 'only' one signal loss per 3-4 weeks and i had a run of nearly 24 days.

up until we closed the ticket i would have said that all my options were still open, but now i suspect tivo will not be as willing to listen if i wanted to re-open the issue. tivo did try to help, but in reality they did very little except to log the symptoms. they (eventually, when i couldn't get more cable cards) indicated they were willing to contact time-warner in my behalf because tw was completely stonewalling me, but it never came to that because we got my last card (about the 7th or 8th) to work, at least for that one long string. and even then, i provided them with the info of a tw supervisor which i had left over from the clusterfsck tuning adaptor fiasco 3 years ago. if i hadn't had that number, i have no idea who they would have called left to their own devices.

at one point they did conference me in to a tw group they called 'time-warner level3 support', but all we did was pair up a cable card--something i've done nearly 2 dozen times using the two time warner centers set aside for that purpose and the level3 tech did not seem that much more competent that the other techs i worked with and he said he was unable to open a ticket to time-warner on my behalf, so he was pretty well useless and the card we paired up only lasted a day or two.

as i've said before, the damming portion of all this is that two elites would not work under the _exact_ same environment and conditions that a s3 tivo box was working under. is it possible to get a cable card that the elite will work with? obviously it is, because there are only a handful of us complaining. so the problem is limited to certain cable vendors and environments, it seems.

my conclusion is that the 'problem' is poor hardware, firmware, or programming in the elites. it does have the completely new tuning system where we went from two class 'm' cards supporting two tuners to one class 'm' card supporting 4 tuners, and if i was troubleshooting the issue i'd look at the firmware/software that supports the point where the cable cards feed those tuners.

as far as going to a premier, what i should have done, knowing what i know now, was to slap a new hd in my s3.

/guy
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