Mythbusters - The one with the President - 12/8/10

DancnDude · 12-09-2010, 11:06 AM

This episode was really boring. Another revisit on the "death ray" myth? Sorry Mr. President but why did we need to see this again? There was just no point to it.

The Hellboy myth didn't really fare much better but at least we got to see some cars smashed. It's at least a little more interesting to see them try to get that complex timing together to try and hit the front of the cars with the huge weight.

wmcbrine · 12-09-2010, 11:36 AM

The net aiming thing was cool, but yeah, I thought it had been pretty well busted after the first two times. I think people just want to believe in the awesomeness of Archimedes or something, so they can't let it go. (And I have to admit, the first time they did it, that was kind of my reaction -- "OK, Adam and Jamie couldn't make it work, but Archimedes was way smarter than them -- maybe he could?")

LoadStar · 12-09-2010, 12:33 PM

I think the only reason they did the Archimedes myth again was that it was a myth that could easily involve the participation of a large group of kids. The whole thing was done to promote STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering, Math) education programs, and I believe all the students were STEM students. You're right, other than that, it was a pointless rehash of a rehash.

Although, I'm still wondering why they never tested a true parabolic mirror... they sort of did a rudimentary parabolic surface coated with flat mirrors in the original testing. I'd be curious what a series of aligned and focused parabolic mirrors would do.

squint · 12-09-2010, 12:44 PM

Well, parabolic mirrors could probably work as well as solar ovens or solar concentrators. The latter can far exceed the 410F mark the Mythbusters were looking for.

trausch · 12-09-2010, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoadStar

I think the only reason they did the Archimedes myth again was that it was a myth that could easily involve the participation of a large group of kids. The whole thing was done to promote STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering, Math) education programs, and I believe all the students were STEM students. You're right, other than that, it was a pointless rehash of a rehash.

Although, I'm still wondering why they never tested a true parabolic mirror... they sort of did a rudimentary parabolic surface coated with flat mirrors in the original testing. I'd be curious what a series of aligned and focused parabolic mirrors would do.

I disagree. They could have done the Lemmings Myth with a bunch of kids.

Enrique · 12-09-2010, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DancnDude

Sorry Mr. President but why did we need to see this again?

I wonder if it was a presidents choice or they just had a myth and President had time so why not.

Jon J · 12-09-2010, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enrique

I wonder if it was a presidents choice or they just had a myth and President had time so why not.

Actually some consider the pres a myth so it worked out.

Shaunnick · 12-09-2010, 03:30 PM

LOL

Obama: Guys, uhhhhhhh, I want you to, uhh, bust the myth, uhhhhhhhh, that I am a natural born Kenyan.

Jamie and Adam: OK Mr. President.

DancnDude · 12-09-2010, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoadStar

Although, I'm still wondering why they never tested a true parabolic mirror... they sort of did a rudimentary parabolic surface coated with flat mirrors in the original testing. I'd be curious what a series of aligned and focused parabolic mirrors would do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by squint

Well, parabolic mirrors could probably work as well as solar ovens or solar concentrators. The latter can far exceed the 410F mark the Mythbusters were looking for.

No!! Please don't give them another reason to revisit this for the 3rd time!

balboa dave · 12-09-2010, 05:24 PM

They completely misread the physics of the Hellboy stunt. It wasn't just a punchdown. It was a punchdown from an immovable object. If they had put the barriers at the spot immediately after where the fist dropped, then they would be closer to recreating what was on film.

justen_m · 12-09-2010, 06:08 PM

The death ray myth was predictably boring, but I LOL a few times during the Hellboy myth. Watching the fist repeatedly miss the vehicle or just squash the vehicle and the vehicle careening into the fence never got old.

rickertk · 12-09-2010, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoadStar

I think the only reason they did the Archimedes myth again was that it was a myth that could easily involve the participation of a large group of kids. The whole thing was done to promote STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering, Math) education programs, and I believe all the students were STEM students. You're right, other than that, it was a pointless rehash of a rehash.

Although, I'm still wondering why they never tested a true parabolic mirror... they sort of did a rudimentary parabolic surface coated with flat mirrors in the original testing. I'd be curious what a series of aligned and focused parabolic mirrors would do.

One problem with a true parabolic mirror is that it has a fixed focal length, so that at any significantly different distance you won't get a tight spot at all. Parabolic mirrors with extremely long focal lengths compared to their width are just barely this side of flat, and it's probably going to be difficult to get several different mirrors made to a very similar focal length. I can ask a bit in the amateur telescope making forums about making f/30 to f/100 types of mirrors, but I think that's the range that you need to be in to make something that would work over a distance.

I've seen more than enough stories about people's telescopes or nearby items being caught on fire when the mirrors were accidentally exposed to the sun to be reasonably sure that it's not going to take much if you are at the right focal length.

Keith
Keith

Idearat · 12-10-2010, 02:02 AM

I'll give Adam his due for the aiming mechanism with the net. That was pretty good. Handheld mirrors though? Lame.

If I were trying to reproduce the setup I'd arrange the mirrors on stands where they stay aimed when you're not holding them. Use many people to do the aiming, creating a hot spot in front of an approaching boat.

The big fist made for the Hellboy myth was pretty cool, just implemented poorly. Like someone mentioned it's not pushing down, but pinning the nose to the ground. They glossed over that showing the SUV not going to the ground, then saying seconds later that it had. Pinning the nose to the ground would have given it a real pivot point and let the higher COG vehicle start to rotate. It's still possible ( likely? ) that they couldn't reproduce, but they didn't copy the scene from the movie either.

IJustLikeTivo · 12-10-2010, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justen_m

The death ray myth was predictably boring, but I LOL a few times during the Hellboy myth. Watching the fist repeatedly miss the vehicle or just squash the vehicle and the vehicle careening into the fence never got old.

Followed by: "Add another fence section to the bill" LOL

mrdbdigital · 12-10-2010, 05:11 PM

I'm sorry, but almost any idiot could see that most of the mirrors were not even hitting the boat. They need to use a fixed mount; hand held is never going to be accurate enough. But I guess this would not conform to the terms of the myth of the soldiers holding the mirrors.

morac · 12-10-2010, 09:55 PM

The Archimedes myth is possible, you'd just need a lot more participants. Use a few thousand mirrors and I bet it would work.

jbernardis · 12-10-2010, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morac

The Archimedes is possible, you'd just need a lot more participants. Use a few thousand mirrors and I bet it would work.

Now you're just giving them a reason to revisit it AGAIN!

I'm tired of this myth.

john4200 · 12-10-2010, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Idearat

The big fist made for the Hellboy myth was pretty cool, just implemented poorly. Like someone mentioned it's not pushing down, but pinning the nose to the ground. They glossed over that showing the SUV not going to the ground, then saying seconds later that it had. Pinning the nose to the ground would have given it a real pivot point and let the higher COG vehicle start to rotate. It's still possible ( likely? ) that they couldn't reproduce, but they didn't copy the scene from the movie either.

I was thinking all during the trials that I would like to see them combine the dropped weight with cable(s) attached at or near the front axle, with the cable length set up so that the cable(s) would go taut at the instant that the weight hit the front.

In their final trial, you could see that the weight hit and then sort of bounced, allowing the car to move forward while the weight was in the air, then the weight came down again, hampering a flip. But if the car had stopped at the instant the weight hit, maybe it could have flipped, especially with the cables providing an unmoving fulcrum.

taronga · 12-12-2010, 10:50 PM

What a coincidence that the president just happened to be wearing the same tie on both of Adam and Jamie's visits.

Jesda · 12-12-2010, 11:46 PM

I also enjoyed the Hellboy myth. I didnt think it would work, and it didnt, but it was a lot of fun watching them try.

I wonder why the president chose to recycle an old myth?

Hoffer · 12-13-2010, 06:55 AM

I also thought the death ray thing was boring. I don't remember how interested the first time they did it. I know I was bored with the second. When they said they were doing it a third time, my eyes rolled.

The car flipping thing was cool. At least that they showed punching down hard on a car isn't going to flip it.

eddyj · 12-13-2010, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jesda

I also enjoyed the Hellboy myth. I didnt think it would work, and it didnt, but it was a lot of fun watching them try.

I wonder why the president chose to recycle an old myth?

The whole purpose seemed to be to encourage kids in science. That myth allowed them to "use" a lot of kids to help. I can't think of another one offhand that would allowed such participation.

netringer · 12-13-2010, 10:10 AM

Mythbusters is out of ideas.

You know what myth they need revisit? The Archimedes death ray! What if they had like 1000 parabolic mirrors!

Like anybody wouldn't have known that the SUV flip was movie magic? I had worked out the pivot point issue in my head from the beginning.

What's next? Can a really strong man really fly by sticking his arms out in front and jumping really hard?

I liked how Adam put on a coat and tie to visit the White House but Jamie just wore his same old clean white shirt and black beret. We know that Jamie could wear a tux from last week's show.

DevdogAZ · 12-13-2010, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrdbdigital

I'm sorry, but almost any idiot could see that most of the mirrors were not even hitting the boat. They need to use a fixed mount; hand held is never going to be accurate enough. But I guess this would not conform to the terms of the myth of the soldiers holding the mirrors.

Exactly. Whenever they would show the camera angle from the boat back to the shore, you could see that the majority of the mirrors were not aimed properly.

RonDawg · 12-13-2010, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoffer

The car flipping thing was cool. At least that they showed punching down hard on a car isn't going to flip it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by netringer

Like anybody wouldn't have known that the SUV flip was movie magic? I had worked out the pivot point issue in my head from the beginning.

For one thing, the "fulcrum" the narrator made so much of a big deal about is simply too close to the front end of the SUV. Then you have to deal with the crushing of the front end, and the collapsing of the suspension, wheels, and tires which will absorb quite a bit of the energy from the falling object.

How do I know this? Let's just say I was a bit rough with my toys as a child

I FFW'd through the death ray part. In fact I had originally deleted this episode, but the posts about the Hellboy myth involving flipping SUV's piqued my interest so I recorded a repeat episode

pmyers · 12-13-2010, 04:52 PM

I swear I watched the part about the nets twice and I STILL don't understand what function the nets served. How did that improve anything?

morac · 12-13-2010, 04:57 PM

The nets allowed for easier aiming. Rather than a person having to try to figure out which of the 500 separate beams belong to him/her, the person could simply look at the net to see where his/her light shown. If the light on the net was on top of the ship as seen through the net then the beam was aimed correctly, since light travels in a straight line (at those distances anyway)

Basically the idea is that it's easier to aim the light at something a few feet away with only one or two lights on it, than a few hundred feet away with hundreds of lights on it.

pmyers · 12-13-2010, 05:03 PM

So they could see their own light on the net? I guess that makes sense then.

doom1701 · 12-13-2010, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by taronga

What a coincidence that the president just happened to be wearing the same tie on both of Adam and Jamie's visits.

Just like every other host segment, it was obviously filmed some time after the experiment,

jbernardis · 12-13-2010, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by taronga

What a coincidence that the president just happened to be wearing the same tie on both of Adam and Jamie's visits.

I think adam and jamie were wearing the same things too.