Any harm in giving someone the 15 digit service code on the back of the unit?

[ned4spd8874]

I'm selling my Series 3 TiVo on eBay and a buyer is interested and is asking me for the 15-digit code. I'm not sure why. Is there any harm in giving that out?

[orangeboy]

It's possible that they are trying to determine the true model of the DVR. That can be accomplished usually with just the first 3 or 6 numbers, with the first 3 representing the model number, and the next 3 representing drive size. My Series 3 is a 648250, and I have no fears giving that much information on a public website.

I would give the buyer the first 6, and ask the buyer "why" they want the whole number if they insist on having it...

To note, this topic has come up in the past, with no real consensus (that I recall) to what harm could be done if the whole number was shown or provided.

[Robbdoe1]

Does the unit have lifetime? Maybe they are trying to confirm that via the TSN?

Robb

[ned4spd8874]

Thanks for the reply!

No, it doesn't have lifetime.

[lessd]

Originally Posted by ned4spd8874

Thanks for the reply!

No, it doesn't have lifetime.

Without Lifetime Service no harm can come from giving out the TSN, a scam could be pulled if the unit had Lifetime.

[ned4spd8874]

Ah, I heard back from the potential buyer and she says "that code tells the age of the unit".

[scandia101]

Originally Posted by ned4spd8874

Ah, I heard back from the potential buyer and she says "that code tells the age of the unit".

The manufacture date is printed right on the back label. The service number only indicates the model number.

[lafos]

When looking at the TSN, the first three numbers represent the model, the second set of 4 are usually 0001 for a unit acquired new, and 0011 if refurbished. The last two sets of four digits are the unique qualifiers.

The model number uses the first three digits of the TSN, and the second three digits are the hard drive size as mentioned above.

The two key pieces of information a buyer would need is the model number and the manufacture date. If the unit has an upgraded drive, that's usually listed as a feature.

[tcfcameron]

Originally Posted by lafos

When looking at the TSN, the first three numbers represent the model, the second set of 4 are usually 0001 for a unit acquired new, and 0011 if refurbished. The last two sets of four digits are the unique qualifiers.

The model number uses the first three digits of the TSN, and the second three digits are the hard drive size as mentioned above.

The two key pieces of information a buyer would need is the model number and the manufacture date. If the unit has an upgraded drive, that's usually listed as a feature.

There's more to it than that. I have four TiVo HDs, and the revision level can be determined from the second set of numbers of the TSN:

652-0001 - Rev. 0 - not refurb (Known for having low grade caps on output side of power supply)

652-0101 - Rev. 1 - not refurb (Newer, has updated power supply, with better caps)

652-0201 - Rev. 2 - not refurb (This is the newest, and has the newest hardware, newest hard drive model, and newest PROM)

Then there's the third set of digits, 652-0201-XXXX, which can tell you even more about further secondary revisions to the internal hardware.

The buyer is probably making sure that the unit isn't a Rev. 0, which would potentially have power supply issues, and would also have the older, non Green Power, hard drive.

[lessd]

Originally Posted by tcfcameron

There's more to it than that. I have four TiVo HDs, and the revision level can be determined from the second set of numbers of the TSN:

652-0001 - Rev. 0 - not refurb (Known for having low grade caps on output side of power supply)

652-0101 - Rev. 1 - not refurb (Newer, has updated power supply, with better caps)

652-0201 - Rev. 2 - not refurb (This is the newest, and has the newest hardware, newest hard drive model, and newest PROM)

Then there's the third set of digits, 652-0201-XXXX, which can tell you even more about further secondary revisions to the internal hardware.

The buyer is probably making sure that the unit isn't a Rev. 0, which would potentially have power supply issues, and would also have the older, non Green Power, hard drive.

The XXXX in your post also will give you some indication of the mfg date, but do you know for a fact that the 2nd set of digits are part of the rev number, as i have not seen any physical difference in 0101 to 0201 in the TiVo-HD units.

[Resist]

Originally Posted by lessd

a scam could be pulled if the unit had Lifetime.

How's that? This number is plastered on the outside of the Tivo box, for the world to see.

[tcfcameron]

Originally Posted by lessd

The XXXX in your post also will give you some indication of the mfg date, but do you know for a fact that the 2nd set of digits are part of the rev number, as i have not seen any physical difference in 0101 to 0201 in the TiVo-HD units.

Yes, I know that for a fact. I verified it myself, and also verified it with TiVo (more than one source, as well).

Just keep in mind that a "revision" can sometimes be more of a change in manufacturing and/or assembly procedures, as opposed to different components. When they make procedural changes, they need to be able to identify what units were built under the "revised" procedures.

[scandia101]

Originally Posted by Resist

How's that? This number is plastered on the outside of the Tivo box, for the world to see.

The world doesn't have access to the back of most people's entertainment centers to see the TSN printed on the back of their Tivo(s).

[steve614]

Originally Posted by Resist

How's that? This number is plastered on the outside of the Tivo box, for the world to see.

Originally Posted by scandia101

The world doesn't have access to the back of most people's entertainment centers to see the TSN printed on the back of their Tivo(s).

I think he's referring to the outside of the retail box as it sits on a store shelf.

[Resist]

Yes I was referring to that number being on the Tivo packaging box.

[tcfcameron]

Originally Posted by Resist

Yes I was referring to that number being on the Tivo packaging box.

OK, but the part about the scam on lifetime service is real (fact). Nobody would bother going for anything less than lifetime (my opinion).

New units don't have any form of service, including lifetime, when they are in the box on the store shelves.

Once the TiVo is out of the box, and activated, under certain circumstances, some people have manged to scam (I think it has to do with eBay), if the owners post the FULL TSN for all to see.

Just leaving out the last four digits, should suffice, to protect your unit/service from being used in a TSN scam.

[lessd]

Originally Posted by tcfcameron

OK, but the part about the scam on lifetime service is real (fact). Nobody would bother going for anything less than lifetime (my opinion).

New units don't have any form of service, including lifetime, when they are in the box on the store shelves.

Once the TiVo is out of the box, and activated, under certain circumstances, some people have manged to scam (I think it has to do with eBay), if the owners post the FULL TSN for all to see.

Just leaving out the last four digits, should suffice, to protect your unit/service from being used in a TSN scam.

What type of scam could one do with the TSN and not have the TiVo itself, if the scammer got the TiVo into his own account via a TiVo CSA, that person could program some stuff for your TiVo to record, but what would be the value that one would have with a TiVo in their own account that they did not have possession of until or unless TiVo made a Lifetime xfer offer. For that matter one could copy from any store with TiVos on display the TSN and than wait until the unit is sold and activated. I don't think the scammer could get that far as TiVo does know the history of any TiVo.

[Robbdoe1]

Originally Posted by lessd

What type of scam could one do with the TSN and not have the TiVo itself, if the scammer got the TiVo into his own account via a TiVo CSA, that person could program some stuff for your TiVo to record, but what would be the value that one would have with a TiVo in their own account that they did not have possession of until or unless TiVo made a Lifetime xfer offer. For that matter one could copy from any store with TiVos on display the TSN and than wait until the unit is sold and activated. I don't think the scammer could get that far as TiVo does know the history of any TiVo.

I guess you could get a MSD by just putting the unit on your account. You could also save $100 if you then Lifetime another unit on your account.

When I got my S2 with Lifetime all I did was call Tivo and transfer it to my account. They asked for the TSN only. Within 1 day my account showed I was able to get an MSD or discounted Lifetime. The guy I got it from on CL gave me the full TSN on the phone and I called Tivo and confirmed that the unit had Lifetime on it. I guess I could have just transfered it to my account without buying it.

Robb

[tcfcameron]

Originally Posted by lessd

What type of scam could one do with the TSN and not have the TiVo itself, if the scammer got the TiVo into his own account via a TiVo CSA, that person could program some stuff for your TiVo to record, but what would be the value that one would have with a TiVo in their own account that they did not have possession of until or unless TiVo made a Lifetime xfer offer. For that matter one could copy from any store with TiVos on display the TSN and than wait until the unit is sold and activated. I don't think the scammer could get that far as TiVo does know the history of any TiVo.

I can't divulge exactly how I know that TiVo does NOT want people posting their full TSNs, due to an NDA. I don't even know the full details of what somebody could do with it. I just know that, for example, if TiVo actually ran this forum, they would XXXX out part of the TSN, if somebody were to post it, in full.

God, I wish I never would have agreed to what I agreed to. I have to castrate nearly everything I post. Then I have to dance around when people question me on such posts. Then, in-turn, people will say I'm full of **it, when I say it's due to an NDA. Then, in-turn, people will claim I violated the NDA by merely mentioning it. Fun, fun, fun...

[lessd]

Originally Posted by tcfcameron

I can't divulge exactly how I know that TiVo does NOT want people posting their full TSNs, due to an NDA. I don't even know the full details of what somebody could do with it. I just know that, for example, if TiVo actually ran this forum, they would XXXX out part of the TSN, if somebody were to post it, in full.

God, I wish I never would have agreed to what I agreed to. I have to castrate nearly everything I post. Then I have to dance around when people question me on such posts. Then, in-turn, people will say I'm full of **it, when I say it's due to an NDA. Then, in-turn, people will claim I violated the NDA by merely mentioning it. Fun, fun, fun...

So why does TiVo post on each retail box the TSN for anybody to see, if somebody can make use of it when the TiVo is activated, why would somebody wait until someone posts the full TSN on E-Bay or this form as that does not happen that often for somebody to make a lot of money on.

[Resist]

Originally Posted by tcfcameron

I can't divulge exactly how I know that TiVo does NOT want people posting their full TSNs, due to an NDA.

I have found that when people pop off saying this kind of thing, they usually are full of s**t. If they knew something, they would talk. If they can't talk due to an NDA, then they wouldn't have said anything to begin with. I'm just saying.

[tcfcameron]

Originally Posted by Resist

I have found that when people pop off saying this kind of thing, they usually are full of s**t. If they knew something, they would talk. If they can't talk due to an NDA, then they wouldn't have said anything to begin with. I'm just saying.

I find that when people pop off saying your kind of thing, that they usually are just a**holes. I'm just saying.

Easy way to get the answer: Call TiVo and ask them about it.
Easier way to get the answer: Use a TiVo web CSR to ask about it.
Easy way to verify that TiVo doesn't leave full TSNs posted in areas they control: Post your full TSN in TiVo's own support forum, with some sort of question, and check back to see if they leave it there, un-obscured.

You'll either do one of three things:

1. Nothing, except flame-bait some more.
2. Try any one of the three, and then lie about it.
3. Same as 2, but tell the truth

Option #3 works for everybody, that is, if you give a flying fart about actually answering the question. But, then again, how do we know you are telling the truth?

Since you won't even give me the benefit of the doubt, I'll return, in-kind, by betting that you'll do #1. I'd certainly hope that you wouldn't do #2.

I'm going to suggest that the original poster contact TiVo, and ask them, their self. If they could please share what they are told, this thread will have served it's purpose, and further postings won't be necessary.

[davezatz]

Originally Posted by Resist

If they can't talk due to an NDA, then they wouldn't have said anything to begin with.

Eh, I don't know that to be true. Not only do I know people put under NDA who respond similarly, I myself am often under NDA and feel comfortable to admit that. (Having said that, TiVo tries to run a tighter ship than most.) But my interpretation/assumption of what he's saying is simply that people have posted their TSNs in the beta forum and they have been removed and/or an employee said don't do that.

[ZeoTiVo]

Originally Posted by tcfcameron

Then I have to dance around when people question me on such posts. Then, in-turn, people will say I'm full of **it, when I say it's due to an NDA. Then, in-turn, people will claim I violated the NDA by merely mentioning it. Fun, fun, fun...

so why even post this one then - people gave a clear answer as to why not to post it already. The rest is just typical forum clutter.

PS the simple answer is that TiVo employees here in TCF doing any troubleshooting ALWAYS ask for TSNs to be PMed to them, never posted. Of course that really only means that TiVo is being careful with customer info that is unique to that person.