Immensely slow UI (and boot up)

stiber · 04-12-2010, 01:42 AM

I have a new TiVo Premiere XL and find the HD UI to be immensely slow -- on the border of being unusable. I could see it being this slow if network access were required, but it would have to be network access for every single display element -- not just the preview bar. That clearly can't be the case, if only because in principle the machine is usable with only a phone connection. And a network access shouldn't be necessary to scroll the "My Shows" list (at least 4 seconds on a 38% full XL).

Even the boot up is incredibly slow. Why would it take so long to boot a Linux box? In fact, I believe it is slower than my old series 2. This despite a much faster processor.

Is this a common observation? Think there's hope that the TiVo folks will do something about this someday soon?

cydeweyz · 04-12-2010, 01:50 AM

Not familiar with previous Tivo performance, but a bootup time close to 5 minutes is unacceptable, expecially when it locks up for no good reason.

jwcooper · 04-12-2010, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiber

Even the boot up is incredibly slow. Why would it take so long to boot a Linux box? In fact, I believe it is slower than my old series 2. This despite a much faster processor.

I think someone here mentioned that the Tivo does a full check of the code to ensure there hasn't been any modifications. So it takes forever due to validating the integrity of the code that is booting up.

Quake97 · 04-12-2010, 08:12 AM

There are other threads about the slow UI. TiVos have always been slow to boot. This isn't something new and you should have seen in any review you've read about a TiVo from the last 3-5 years.

Joe

bkdtv · 04-12-2010, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiber

I have a new TiVo Premiere XL and find the HD UI to be immensely slow -- on the border of being unusable. I could see it being this slow if network access were required, but it would have to be network access for every single display element -- not just the preview bar.

Did you see the FAQ stickied at the top of this forum? It has an explanation.

Every single image is loaded from the network. TiVo doesn't currently save any images to the hard drive. Furthermore, the Premiere's second processor core is currently disabled.

There are clearly performance issues that must be addressed in software. For now, many have opted to switch to the classic interface.

lessd · 04-12-2010, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkdtv

Did you see the FAQ stickied at the top of this forum? It has an explanation.

Every single image is loaded from the network. TiVo doesn't currently save any images to the hard drive. Furthermore, the Premiere's second processor core is currently disabled.

There are clearly performance issues that must be addressed in software. For now, many have opted to switch to the classic interface.

What you just said does not change the 6 to 7 minute boot up time for the TP, the TiVo_HD was about 5 minutes.

aaronwt · 04-12-2010, 10:18 AM

I don't care aboout the bootup time becuase typically, the boxes will run 24/7. I have no issues with that. I guess for any device that uses a hard drive, if I want to get the fastest speed possible I would need to use an SSD. But even then the box still has to process everything.

TiVos have always taken a while to boot up. But I've always run my boxes on a UPS and very rarely rebooted them.

orangeboy · 04-12-2010, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lessd

What you just said does not change the 6 to 7 minute boot up time for the TP, the TiVo_HD was about 5 minutes.

Ideally, you should never see boot time beyond initial setup. This is probably why TiVO doesn't necessarily care about the amount of time it takes.

cydeweyz · 04-12-2010, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangeboy

Ideally, you should never see boot time beyond initial setup. This is probably why TiVO doesn't necessarily care about the amount of time it takes.

"Ideally" is the key, because "ideally", our Tivo's shouldn't lock up in the middle of a show. Tivo should care about us NOT having to pull power from the box, then have us wait an unbearable amount of time to get back to shows we might have been interested in watching/recording.

bkdtv · 04-12-2010, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cydeweyz

"Ideally" is the key, because "ideally", our Tivo's shouldn't lock up in the middle of a show. Tivo should care about us NOT having to pull power from the box, then have us wait an unbearable amount of time to get back to shows we might have been interested in watching/recording.

The current version of the HDUI software isn't as stable as it should be. That is obvious from the poll.

I have not had any lockups -- and thus no reboots, outside of software updates -- after switching to the "classic" SDUI.

oViTynoT · 04-12-2010, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Every single image is loaded from the network. TiVo doesn't currently save any images to the hard drive.

Whaat? No image is saved? Then how on earth are people with the "Phoneline Dongle" working?

shaown · 04-12-2010, 11:32 AM

Umm - Phoneline does not support HDUI
see
http://www.tivo.com/products/tivo-ac...ing/index.html

or more specifically:

NOTE: This adapter does not enable broadband functionality. In order to download Premiere's HD interface and to download and stream movies and web content, you must connect your Premiere to your Internet-enabled home network using an Ethernet cable or a wireless adapter. The TiVo USB Phone Line Adapter only works with Premiere and Premiere XL. For more information

aaronwt · 04-12-2010, 11:44 AM

The images load very quickly with my FiOS connection.

I know using Amazon VOD I got 32mbs download speeds for the VOD titles. And it seems like whatever tiVo is loading on it's screens does it very quickly too. The boxes seem to populate in half a second to two seconds.

orangeboy · 04-12-2010, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cydeweyz

"Ideally" is the key, because "ideally", our Tivo's shouldn't lock up in the middle of a show. Tivo should care about us NOT having to pull power from the box, then have us wait an unbearable amount of time to get back to shows we might have been interested in watching/recording.

So should TiVo divert their resources to making the box boot faster (essentially addressing a symptom), or continue to work on preventing the cause of the problems?

cydeweyz · 04-12-2010, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangeboy

So should TiVo divert their resources to making the box boot faster (essentially addressing a symptom), or continue to work on preventing the cause of the problems?

Tivo should deliver what they sold us on, which was a stable Tivo Premiere, running a new HD Flash UI.

jmill · 04-12-2010, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cydeweyz

Tivo should deliver what they sold us on, which was a stable Tivo Premiere, running a new HD Flash UI.

Well, you have 30-day money back policy and more than welcome to return the product if it doesn't work. There is not much we can do here for you, we don't write TiVo software.

TrueTurbo · 04-12-2010, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cydeweyz

Tivo should deliver what they sold us on, which was a stable Tivo Premiere, running a new HD Flash UI.

Sorry, but from my perspective, they pretty much already have. It's clear from this forum that there are a lot of people experiencing lock-ups and incredibly slow HD menus. How many more people who have bought a Premiere are experiencing no real issues though? We have no idea. People who are happy with their TiVo rarely post anything to say so and when they do, the disgruntled folk with issues call them 'fanboys'! Forums like this are always biased towards people who have problems with their gadgets.

The HD UI is far from perfect. I do agree with others that TiVo should have finished more of it before releasing the product, but there's enough of it there to keep me satisfied, for now. If there are no UI or performance updates within the next few months, I may change my opinion.

My Premiere XL is still behaving itself. The HD UI does slow down occasionally, but never to the point where I would call it unusable. Mostly, the HD UI is snappy and the remaining SD menus are noticably faster than on my TiVo HD. I haven't experienced a lock-up yet. I hope I never do. Personally, I don't care how long any TiVo takes to boot up. The only time it happens is after a service update and that usually occurs while I'm asleep. I also power all my critical AV equipment through a UPS. Not only does it ensure the devices never lose power but a UPS cleans up and regulates the power to each device too.

MichaelJHuman · 04-12-2010, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrueTurbo

...The HD UI does slow down occasionally, but never to the point where I would call it unusable.

I was in the same boat until a few days ago. I would now call my 'My Shows' menu unusable. Not sure if a reboot would fix it. It's been rebooted relatively recently, due to a lockup.

There are definitely some issues Tivo needs to fix to make this a stable box.

richsadams · 04-13-2010, 03:10 AM

Our Premiere XL has been up and running for about a week now. We're on FIOS and it's connected by Ethernet to our network. As more and more recordings accumulate the "My Shows" menus get slower and slower.

I've experienced one semi-lockup when I paged down the My Shows menu and the green loading ring stayed on and no additional pages could be displayed. It was still responsive so I went back to TiVo Central and everything returned to normal.

The various images load fairly quickly although it's very apparent that it has to communicate back-and-forth with their servers during every menu change. I'd imagine that folks using WiFi see things moving even slower.

Maybe it's me, but it really annoys me that TiVo has to switch back and forth between the HD and SD menus when you want to make settings changes, etc. It seems half-baked that way. All of the menus s/b HD IMO (unless of course you want to use all SD menus).

I can see the potential with the HDUI. I like the playback window feature in the menus as well as some of the more convenient ways to get things done, but compared to our TiVo HD and especially our Series3 I am less than impressed overall so far. To date, the new Premiere has not been an "upgrade". Hopefully the tweeted updates will be released soon.

mvnuenen · 04-13-2010, 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrueTurbo

People who are happy with their TiVo rarely post anything to say so and when they do, the disgruntled folk with issues call them 'fanboys'! Forums like this are always biased towards people who have problems with their gadgets.

+1

I have to say though, when I got my S3 initially I was so disappointed due to the pixelation issues I had. At that time I just couldn't believe ANYONE could be happy with it, and I posted here left & right venting my frustration. A few months later a software update fixed my issues and I don't think I posted on TCF in one or two years till I started looking into the Premiere. Currently I am a happy PXL upgrader but start indeed to wonder if I am one of the lucky few. I'm curious to know as well if the complaints on the Premiere XL are as prevalent as they are on the Premiere (basic model)...

stiber · 04-14-2010, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwcooper

I think someone here mentioned that the Tivo does a full check of the code to ensure there hasn't been any modifications. So it takes forever due to validating the integrity of the code that is booting up.

Even if that were true, they could do the check as a process that is spawned off after boot time. Are they afraid of people hacking their machines? Like with the iPhone, that would be a vanishingly small fraction of users.

stiber · 04-14-2010, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkdtv

Did you see the FAQ stickied at the top of this forum? It has an explanation.

Every single image is loaded from the network. TiVo doesn't currently save any images to the hard drive. Furthermore, the Premiere's second processor core is currently disabled.

There are clearly performance issues that must be addressed in software. For now, many have opted to switch to the classic interface.

Agreed. There's no excuse for loading so many UI elements across the net. But even in that situation, the rest of the UI shouldn't slow down and wait for those images. Of course, this doesn't explain why scrolling the list in "My Shows" is so slow -- no image changes, and one core should be more than enough for that task. Perhaps Flash is as big a piece of crap as Steve Jobs says? I know my Mac is much stabler and faster now that I've installed Click to Flash.