The Digital Transition (6 months later)

TiVo Steve · 12-17-2009, 06:04 AM

Ya know, I've been "time-shifting" television since I got my first Beta-Max Video Cassette Recorder in 1979. Since that time, I've always had cable TV service. In the days of analog TV transmission, I never have been able to receive all of the major networks with a good enough signal without the service. Times have changed...

For the first time in 30 years, I am finally considering pulling the plug on cable TV. I can receive 4 of the 5 networks with an indoor antenna (no FOX, no loss)! The main reason I am considering the switch is more one of convenience than of cost. Since getting my new (unlimited usage) Comcast Business Internet account, I no longer have to worry about a download cap. Add to that the abundance of commercial interruptions on TV programming nowadays, and it's time for a change.

So, I will use my TiVo for recording from the 3 major networks and will get the rest of my entertainment via Netflix and the newgroups. Even that may change. I may only use my TiVo to time-shift the news and get everything else from the internet. I'm sure you've noticed that shows have gotten shorter through the years... a 60's TV show was around 50 minutes long... that has fallen to under 42 minutes now. Over18 minutes of commercials for a one hour show! I'm developing C3T (or Carpal-Tunnel TiVo-Thumb) from all of the fast-forwarding!

After downloading a missed episode (or two) of my favorite TV shows, I became spoiled by the lack of these interruptions! (rant) Just rent a TV show on DVD, you'll see what I mean. The Fall TV Season is almost over, so it will be a perfect time to give this idea a try. I'll keep you posted on my experiment. Hey, if I miss a few shows due to bad reception, I can always download them to my HTPC.

TiVo Steve (maybe soon just TV Steve)

orangeboy · 12-17-2009, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiVo Steve

Ya know, I've been "time-shifting" television since I got my first Beta-Max Video Cassette Recorder in 1979. Since that time, I've always had cable TV service. In the days of analog TV transmission, I never have been able to receive all of the major networks with a good enough signal without the service. Times have changed...

For the first time in 30 years, I am finally considering pulling the plug on cable TV. I can receive 4 of the 5 networks with an indoor antenna (no FOX, no loss)! The main reason I am considering the switch is more one of convenience than of cost. Since getting my new (unlimited usage) Comcast Business Internet account, I no longer have to worry about a download cap. Add to that the abundance of commercial interruptions on TV programming nowadays, and it's time for a change.

So, I will use my TiVo for recording from the 3 major networks and will get the rest of my entertainment via Netflix and the newgroups. Even that may change. I may only use my TiVo to time-shift the news and get everything else from the internet. I'm sure you've noticed that shows have gotten shorter through the years... a 60's TV show was around 50 minutes long... that has fallen to under 42 minutes now. Over18 minutes of commercials for a one hour show! I'm developing C3T (or Carpal-Tunnel TiVo-Thumb) from all of the fast-forwarding!

After downloading a missed episode (or two) of my favorite TV shows, I became spoiled by the lack of these interruptions! (rant) Just rent a TV show on DVD, you'll see what I mean. The Fall TV Season is almost over, so it will be a perfect time to give this idea a try. I'll keep you posted on my experiment. Hey, if I miss a few shows due to bad reception, I can always download them to my HTPC.

TiVo Steve (maybe soon just TV Steve)

I wore out the FF button on my old Harmony remote. I hardly use the FF button now after installing kmttg coupled with pyTivo. kmttg automatically downloads and processes .TiVo files from your DVR, then uses various tools to mark and edit out commercials. With pyTivo installed, the now edited "cut" program gets "pushed" back to your DVR. These apps were written by very clever TCF members, so support can usually be found in the TiVo Home Media Features & TivoToGo forum.

I'm with ya, though. I dropped cable television service, but retain high speed internet service to support the TiVo Video on Demand applications, as well as provide an alternate source for other downloadable content. I use pyTivo to "push" downloaded content to my TiVo DVRs so I can continue to use the Trick Play features that the TiVo DVR offers.

slowbiscuit · 12-17-2009, 11:35 AM

*shrug* With 30-sec skip available, I don't see commercial skipping as that big of a deal. Is it as easy as the auto-skip on my Myth box or old Replays? No, but they don't auto-skip correctly 100% of the time anyway - on some channels it rarely works, on others it's very accurate. 30-sec skip is a decent workaround.

If you think FF'ing is bad, wait until you have to watch Internet video from the major TV network sites, which force you to watch commercials (albeit not many right now) in order to catch up on a show.

And if you want live sports for all your favorite teams, forget the Internet, it's not there yet.

nirisahn · 12-17-2009, 12:41 PM

I'm thinking I may have to move in the same direction. Cable is just too expensive. And to get a decent price on the package, I have to keep a landline I don't need. I would only save $8 by getting rid of the phone because I'd lose my package price.

I guess it's time to get an antenna to test out on my HDTiVo to see what kind of reception I get. I can probably get the rest via internet.

I'm wondering what will happen if more and more people abandon cable and satellite. Advertising is what pays for programming. If a substantial amount of viewers abandon the commercial based venues, who will want to produce new programming? How will it be paid for? The future of mass entertainment is going to get very interesting.

orangeboy · 12-17-2009, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nirisahn

...I'm wondering what will happen if more and more people abandon cable and satellite. Advertising is what pays for programming. If a substantial amount of viewers abandon the commercial based venues, who will want to produce new programming? How will it be paid for? The future of mass entertainment is going to get very interesting.

I think it will go back to the way it was before satellite and cable: only local channels broadcasting the major networks over-the-air. I don't see that happening though. Unless something changes radically, there will always be a market for satellite and cable, and consumers for those services.

I'm curious how much cable is watched other than what is available OTA? A lot? A couple additional channels? A couple additional shows? I cataloged my Season Passes when I had cable television service and found that only 6 out of the 67 shows could not be obtained OTA or through Amazon/Netflix. That was acceptable for me. A bigger impact was on my Wishlists and Guru Guides, but I can also live without the lesser amount of shows recorded by those features.

Rick313 · 12-17-2009, 02:32 PM

I don't think cable and satellite services are in any danger of extinction. There will always be people who are willing to pay for their services.

I dropped my cable almost two years and don't miss it that much despite the fact that I am a major TV addict. However, I have had many conversations with other people who couldn't imagine giving up their cable and/or satellite service. For these people, it is worth the money every month to have 100 channels or more from which to choose. Of course, these are often the same people who are willing to pay extra money every month to have access to all of the movie channels, something I have never been willing to do.

When I realized that the majority of programming that I was watching was available for free via over-the-air DTV, it was a no brainer for me to cancel my cable which was costing me about $80 per month. Since many cable TV shows are available on DVD for free from my local library, I don't feel like I'm missing anything.

JohnBrowning · 12-17-2009, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangeboy

I'm curious how much cable is watched other than what is available OTA? A lot?

Everyone has different tastes. The vast majority of what I watch is only available on cable. The only thing I watch that is also available OTA is some of my live sports.

real_goose · 12-17-2009, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiVo Steve

For the first time in 30 years, I am finally considering pulling the plug on cable TV.

I came close to dropping all cable TV and blinked. But I think I have found the sweet spot in the price curve. My wife was recording quite a bit on our Comcast DVR and I noticed they were almost entirely OTA stations. That got me on the trajectory to get a TiVo since it could handle OTA.

I ordered the TiVo and tried it with Cable and OTA both connected. OTA was not strong enough even with an outside antenna. I did suffer at least one gray screen that required rebooting the TiVo to recover. I turned in the DVR and switched Comcast to limited basic service for $15.99. Then I ordered cable cards for $1.99 and first one free. So for about $18 I get all the stations to keep my wife happy and won't suffer GSOD failures.

Yesterday I called Comcast because one of the local stations was missing from our analog TVs but still on the TiVo. They told me the digital switch was starting and this was the first station to leave analog. They are mailing 3 digital converters that are free of charge. So the analog TVs will be getting more stations and my Comcast bill is still about $18 before taxes and crap fees.

The good thing about the TiVo is that we do get some OTA stations (mainly from Canada) that Comcast does not carry. We hadn't watched these stations in years since starting with cable. So far this seems like a win-win.

nirisahn · 12-17-2009, 04:03 PM

I'm going to have to research this further. Aside from broadcast tv, I watch a lot of TCM, BBCAmerica, Discovery, and National Geographic. I'll have to see how much of this I can get online or thru Netflix. I wish Netflix had the rights to stream their entire catalog. Waiting for DVDs is a pain.

lrhorer · 12-17-2009, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnBrowning

Everyone has different tastes. The vast majority of what I watch is only available on cable.

In spades. With the exception of PBS, even if there were anything worth watching on the networks, I would still avoid them. I also avoid CATV netowrks, although a little less so.

orangeboy · 12-17-2009, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lrhorer

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnBrowning

Everyone has different tastes. The vast majority of what I watch is only available on cable.

In spades. With the exception of PBS, even if there were anything worth watching on the networks, I would still avoid them. I also avoid CATV netowrks, although a little less so.

Ok, so are you guys in the majority or the minority? Or is it a Texas thing?

johnf@home · 12-17-2009, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiVo Steve

I am finally considering pulling the plug on cable TV. I can receive 4 of the 5 networks with an indoor antenna (no FOX, no loss)!

You know, a couple of years ago I might have agreed with you. But now we watch as much on Fox (House, Bones, Fringe) as on any of the other networks.

In any case, much of what we watch is from cable channels. Quite apart from BBC America, there's Speed (Formula One), Versus (IndyCar, bicycle racing, yachting), whoever currently has the major tennis tournaments, and SyFy, plus a few other odds-and-ends.

mattack · 12-17-2009, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiVo Steve

For the first time in 30 years, I am finally considering pulling the plug on cable TV. I can receive 4 of the 5 networks with an indoor antenna (no FOX, no loss)! The main reason I am considering the switch is more one of convenience than of cost. Since getting my new (unlimited usage) Comcast Business Internet account, I no longer have to worry about a download cap. Add to that the abundance of commercial interruptions on TV programming nowadays, and it's time for a change.

You mean Comcast Business Internet at home, right?

Have you tried just plugging the cable into the Tivo or a TV? You may still be getting channels there.. (and if so, you would need a cablecard to get the tivo to work with the digital channels)

At least with 'home' cable Internet connections, typically they still include (or charge very little) the lowest end TV -- presumably because they don't want to trap it out at every house.

steve614 · 12-17-2009, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangeboy

Ok, so are you guys in the majority or the minority? Or is it a Texas thing?

Certainly not a Texas thing. But I think us OTA only users are the minority. Virtually everyone I know uses a paid TV service.
When I lived with my parents, the only reason we got cable, was because it was something new. Having HBO, Showtime, and Skinemax (

) was great as a teenager.
When I got my own apartment, I couldn't afford cable and learned to live with OTA supplemented with Blockbuster rentals. One time, somehow the wires got crossed and I was able to recieve basic cable for a short while. It was great being able to watch the Discovery Channel, etc., but I still didn't think it was worth paying for.
FlashForward(

) to now, using a TivoHD OTA with a Netflix sub, I've got too many things I can watch and not enough time to watch them (I have lots of stuff archived).
The only way the cable companies are going to get me is when they start offering channels ala carte (which means never

).

Bierboy · 12-18-2009, 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnBrowning

Everyone has different tastes. The vast majority of what I watch is only available on cable. The only thing I watch that is also available OTA is some of my live sports.

+ me......traditional OTA networks are NOT producing much worth watching anymore. The edgier stuff is on cable....

TiVo Steve · 12-18-2009, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattack

You mean Comcast Business Internet at home, right?

Have you tried just plugging the cable into the Tivo or a TV? You may still be getting channels there.. (and if so, you would need a cablecard to get the tivo to work with the digital channels)

At least with 'home' cable Internet connections, typically they still include (or charge very little) the lowest end TV -- presumably because they don't want to trap it out at every house.

I still have my "Digital Starter" discount until the end of January ($25/mo). After that. I'll find out...

timckelley · 12-21-2009, 03:38 PM

I'm getting locals via antenna, and if it were just me, I'd dump cable save my $61+ / month (no premiums are included in that).

But my wife has too many shows not available via OTA that she wants, making it not economically very feasible for us to dump cable.

schwinn · 12-22-2009, 09:09 AM

Hulu, baby... works pretty darn well with a decent computer and software like PlayOn... I'll admit, there is a great deal of convenience with cable, which I can't give up "yet"... but if Hulu were more reliable, I'd definitely consider dumping cable and going that route.

pkscout · 12-22-2009, 09:20 AM

We dropped our cable service about six months ago. Most of what we watch is available OTA, and the little that isn't we are able to get from Amazon OnDemand and have it downloaded directly to the TiVo. Even with that I'm spending a quarter what I was for plain old analog cable and getting all my content at a much higher quality.

We don't watch much sports, and all the major channels (including PBS) come in rock solid for us OTA. I think if you're a big sports fan cable/satellite still provides value for you.

steve614 · 12-22-2009, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkscout

I think if you're a big sports fan cable/satellite still provides value for you.

I guess I'm not a sports fan. I like sports, but not enough that I'd pay extra to see it.
I'm satisfied with what I can get OTA.
However, take away my NASCAR and I'm on the fence. Take away football, I might have to jump over.

Nugent · 12-23-2009, 02:28 PM

Come on over and join this rapidly growing club.

You will find that you don't miss what you don't have.

slowbiscuit · 12-24-2009, 11:44 AM

I will, so I'm not. I am a big sports fan.

Maybe someday, but not now.

isbellHFh · 12-24-2009, 06:32 PM

I gave up directv over a year ago, so I am doing TiVo OTA + itunes (w/AppleTV) for all my TV goodness. The latter is for the few cable shows I watch and a ton of the kids shows (often on cable and I do like many of them... Phineas and Ferb is the greatest show ever made).

It's awesome. I'm saving a LOT of money and i have no plans on going back.

The only thing I miss is ESPN and honestly that's more of a thing where I feel comfortable knowing it's there more than I actually ever watched with any regularity.

TiVo Steve · 12-26-2009, 08:46 AM

I made the switch yesterday. Antenna only now. One pleasant surprise was to find my SPs migrated to the OTA channel numbers. I had to remove a few cable-only SPs (and 2 from FOX).

I think the quality is superior to that of cable (no compression), by my view is tainted by the cost of service... FREE. (I have a lifetime sub on my TiVo HD)

The only bummer yesterday was a glitch with the Netflix server. When I tried to watch something on Netflix, it crashed my TiVo... reboot city! I haven't had that happen since the first few days/weeks of Netflix on the TiVo.

Happy New Year/Decade to all my fellow TCF readers... best wishes to all.