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Old 08-25-2014, 08:00 AM   #1
dave13077
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OTA only Tivo on the way

Looks like there will be a Tivo for OTA only. Limited edition.

http://www.engadget.com/2014/08/25/tivo-roamio-ota-dvr/

http://www.tivo.com/discover/antenna

Last edited by dave13077 : 08-25-2014 at 08:21 AM.
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Old 08-25-2014, 08:21 AM   #2
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For only $49 and with 4 tuners, you could use this a time shift device and not pay for the service. I am wondering if it would support standard definition TVs for those still living in the dark ages.
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Old 08-25-2014, 08:23 AM   #3
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TiVo Introduces OTA DVR

Simple, Brilliant and Legal -- TiVo Launches Over-the-Air DVR

With a Plethora of Popular TV Available Over the Air, TiVo Offering the $49.99 TiVo Roamio OTA

SAN JOSE, CA -- (Marketwired) -- 08/25/14 -- TiVo Inc. (NASDAQ: TIVO), a leader in the advanced television entertainment market, today revealed the limited edition TiVo Roamio OTA DVR with an initial retail price of $49.99, for those who do not have cable or satellite service, yet still want a DVR.

"Many top TV shows in America are available with a simple HD antenna," said TiVo CMO Ira Bahr. "TiVo is devoted to making the best possible cable TV user experience available through our operator partners and in retail, but we recognize some viewers opt not to receive the benefits a subscription with a cable provider offers. TiVo Roamio OTA makes sure that they too can get a best in class DVR experience through an antenna, including our world renowned interface

TiVo Roamio OTA enables consumers to record up to four shows simultaneously, storing 75 high-definition hours of programming. The new antenna DVR and streaming device allows consumers to enjoy and record entertainment from their favorite local networks, where available, including ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, PBS and Univision over-the-air and popular internet video services such as Netflix, YouTube, and many others.

TV lovers can expect the same great award-winning experience as the TiVo Roamio family of DVRs, including universal search, free mobile applications, browse and compatibility with TiVo Stream and TiVo Mini devices to extend the TV experience throughout the home and beyond. TiVo Roamio OTA does not require a cable card, providing consumers with a top-notch entertainment experience at a minimal price. For customers looking to access cable channels, TiVo offers the TiVo Roamio, TiVo Roamio Plus and TiVo Roamio Pro devices.

TiVo Roamio OTA Features Include:

-- Storage: 500 GB (75 HD hours)
-- Tuners: 4 tuners
-- Compatible with TiVo Stream: Stream live and recorded TV to smartphones and tablets
-- Content navigation:
-- Universal search across Over-the-Air and popular internet video services including Netflix and YouTube
-- "What to Watch" provides a personalized dashboard with recommendations for what's on now, next and tonight
-- Collections offers editorial collections based on current events or categories including new fall TV, Shark Week, Holiday, Academy Award winners, etc.
-- Channel guide with filters to enable users to get to what they want as quickly as possible
-- Free application for smartphones and tablets: manage your DVR with your phone or tablet through remote Season Pass(R) management, a recording scheduler that allows you to add or remove recordings and enhanced WishList(R) management
-- Networking: Ethernet & WiFi networking

Pricing & Availability
TiVo Roamio OTA, tailored solely for the best over-the-air experience, will appear at select BestBuy stores. The limited product release will be offered in select markets for $49.99, with a $14.99 per month service and a one-year commitment. Product and service pricing subject to change. For more information please visit TiVo.com/Roamio-OTA.
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Old 08-25-2014, 08:26 AM   #4
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Doesn't support using TiVo Mini, though.
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Old 08-25-2014, 08:29 AM   #5
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Doesn't support using TiVo Mini, though.
The Tivo page indicates it does. I think they (Engadget) meant to say no MOCA bridge included.
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Old 08-25-2014, 08:33 AM   #6
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Looks as if with this pricing, you can't get the Product Lifetime, at least not for the first year.
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Old 08-25-2014, 08:47 AM   #7
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The whole point of cutting the cord is to eliminate monthly fees. If they were to put the retail price at $100 and offer an OTA-only lifetime for $300 this just might become a hot cake.
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Old 08-25-2014, 08:50 AM   #8
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The Tivo page indicates it does. I think they (Engadget) meant to say no MOCA bridge included.
Okay, sounding better, then.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:13 AM   #9
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"Offered in select markets" = so as not to directly compete with TiVo cable partnerships.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:18 AM   #10
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The whole point of cutting the cord is to eliminate monthly fees.
Not true. Many many cord cutters supplement with Netflix/Hulu Plus/ect. It is to minimize fees, to be sure, but not necessarily eliminate. Especially for those who are tempted to utilize a DVR.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:30 AM   #11
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$15/month is not a fair price for an OTA only program guide... It's clearly subsidizing the hardware and is half the cost of what a basic cable subscription used to be. Adjusting the OTA pricing model to make any monthly fee no more than $10 would be the appropriate way to go.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:31 AM   #12
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"Offered in select markets" = so as not to directly compete with TiVo cable partnerships.
My guess is that it will only be available at the Best Buy Magnolia stores, hence limited markets.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:35 AM   #13
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$15/month is not a fair price for an OTA only program guide... It's clearly subsidizing the hardware
The TiVo service has never been about the cost of the "Program Guide".

You're paying for the TiVo service, whether it is for OTA, or Cable.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:47 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by series5orpremier View Post
$15/month is not a fair price for an OTA only program guide... It's clearly subsidizing the hardware and is half the cost of what a basic cable subscription used to be. Adjusting the OTA pricing model to make any monthly fee no more than $10 would be the appropriate way to go.
How would they make up the subsidy for the box itself if not charging enough in the monthly fees to cover the subsidy? That makes no sense.

My advice, if you think it costs too much, don't buy it.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:54 AM   #15
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My guess is that it will only be available at the Best Buy Magnolia stores, hence limited markets.
Which is really crazy, considering many of the smaller market Best Buy stores do NOT have Magnolia inside. There are plenty of folks in markets such as mine (Hickory, NC) that would consider this TiVo if BestBuy or even Walmart had a proper display explaining what it does and the benefits of it. I think a price point of $149, then $9.95 a month would be much easier to stomach for some folks.
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Old 08-25-2014, 10:00 AM   #16
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Reading the Engadget comments underscores why you don't see OTA built into the higher-end, expensive Roamios. They get a subsidized $50 box and still whine like children that service and guide data isn't free.

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Old 08-25-2014, 10:07 AM   #17
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no lifetime service available for this? im out.

http://www.cnet.com/products/tivo-roamio-ota/

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The catch? You still have to pay the same $15/month TiVo service fee--and there's no "lifetime" option.

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Old 08-25-2014, 10:14 AM   #18
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no lifetime service available for this? im out.

http://www.cnet.com/products/tivo-roamio-ota/
I am thinking this (continuous service fees) will be there focus going forward. The pencil pushers at Tivo would much rather see fee revenue every month instead of a one time payment (I know they spread the lifetime fee over a few years). Would not surprise me to see the lifetime option go away altogether at some point.
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:03 AM   #19
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For only $49 and with 4 tuners, you could use this a time shift device and not pay for the service. I am wondering if it would support standard definition TVs for those still living in the dark ages.
If you're happy with time-shifting only up to 30 mins., sure. You can't record anything without service so all you have are the live TV buffers.

Good price though, and we know all the usual whiners will come out railing about service costing extra.
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:07 AM   #20
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The TiVo service has never been about the cost of the "Program Guide".
Tivo service and the program guide are so directly correlated to be one and the same. If you want something other than a gradually eroding retail customer base you have to price according to the relative value the individual subscriber is receiving, not according to some elitist value placed on a trademark logo or what value Roamio Pro customers are receiving.

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You're paying for the TiVo service, whether it is for OTA, or Cable.
It's "never been about" the program guide whether OTA or cable? Not true. I've seen reports of Tivo offering reduced monthly rates for OTA-only users.

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Old 08-25-2014, 11:11 AM   #21
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How would they make up the subsidy for the box itself if not charging enough in the monthly fees to cover the subsidy? That makes no sense.

My advice, if you think it costs too much, don't buy it.
If you read the entire thread, or just my post previous to the one you quoted, you'd see I suggested raising the retail price of the box and offering lifetime service.

My advice to anybody is why bother buying a Roamio OTA when a Roamio Basic costs less?
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:11 AM   #22
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Tivo service and the program guide are so directly correlated to be one and the same.
Sure, in your head, just not in reality.

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It's "never been about" the program guide? Not true. I've seen reports of Tivo offering reduced monthly rates for OTA-only users.
Sure, what does that have to do with the guide? Was the hardware discounted at that time?
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:16 AM   #23
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So I guess this is a base Roamio with the CableCard socket removed? It'll be interesting to see if there are any other differences.

Kinda surprising that it's a Best Buy exclusive. I've noticed the TiVo presence dwindling at my local Best Buy the last few times I've been there.
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:18 AM   #24
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So I guess this is a base Roamio with the CableCard socket removed? It'll be interesting to see if there are any other differences.

Kinda surprising that it's a Best Buy exclusive. I've noticed the TiVo presence dwindling at my local Best Buy the last few times I've been there.
They can save even more costs than just removing the cablecard slot. They don't have to have QAM tuners either.
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:21 AM   #25
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Two threads on this topic now... But I still think the pricing is going to be a problem for TiVo on this.

You can buy the TiVo Basic with lifetime service for $700 and the cost will be offset in 36 months and the device will still have significant resale value and more flexibility if you change your mind in the future. But I can see people with a short view finding the $50 initial purchase price appealing.

The OTA community is going to be a very hard place for TiVo to make a profit - but if they are going to try, they will need a pricing strategy that seems like a bargain compared to a full TiVo.

Maybe...

TiVo Basic: $200 / Service $15 / Lifetime $500
TiVo OTA: $150 / Service $12 / Lifetime $400
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:26 AM   #26
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SullyND, You mean I'm not factoring in the great customer service value provided by the Tivo.com web ordering system that operates like it arrived in a time capsule from 1993? Shame on me.

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Old 08-25-2014, 11:35 AM   #27
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$15/month in perpetuity? Ouch.

Do hi-end cord cutters exist?

Why not do $15/month for ~2 years to make a profit on the hardware and then $5/mo for updates, guide data and Tivo tax. And give the thing a chance out of the gate.
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:36 AM   #28
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Two threads on this topic now... But I still think the pricing is going to be a problem for TiVo on this.
I assume you're referring to the OTA DVR comparison thread as being the other one, which started well before this DVR was announced. I linked this thread into that one as it had a direct bearing on the discussion.

Personally, I'm all for just grabbing an inexpensive ATSC tuner and sticking it in any available Windows 7 or 8 PC and using Windows Media Center to record your OTA shows. There's no fee for the service and guide data is free. Of course, features may not be as sophisticated as Tivo's in some areas, but it does the job quite nicely. I've been recording OTA programs this way for about 7 or 8 years now (I used BeyondTV in Windows XP prior to switching to Windows 7) and it works great.
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:54 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by series5orpremier View Post
$15/month is not a fair price for an OTA only program guide... It's clearly subsidizing the hardware and is half the cost of what a basic cable subscription used to be. Adjusting the OTA pricing model to make any monthly fee no more than $10 would be the appropriate way to go.
Exactly, what in the world is TiVo thinking? Paying a fee for a guide when there are hundreds of channels is understandable but with OTA we are talking about perhaps 20 channels in a perfect area to perhaps 4 in areas were coverage isn't good.

$15 is excessive, a better idea would be to charge by the number of channels available OTA in a subscribers area with the TiVo reporting back nightly to audit the number of channels available. A prorated plan of say 25 cents per channel (with a channel qualified being a available if it is received at certain signal levels) would be a successful business plan.

Regardless what additional services are provided, the general consumer is only going to see that TiVo wants $15 a month for guide date on a dozen OTA channels. This will not work.
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Old 08-25-2014, 12:04 PM   #30
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... a better idea would be to charge by the number of channels available OTA in a subscribers area with the TiVo reporting back nightly to audit the number of channels available. A prorated plan of say 25 cents per channel (with a channel qualified being a available if it is received at certain signal levels) would be a successful business plan.

Regardless what additional services are provided, the general consumer is only going to see that TiVo wants $15 a month for guide date on a dozen OTA channels. This will not work.
Charging a guide fee based on the number of channels available is ludicrous....it changes almost monthly if not more often. An overnight audit simply won't happen. And, depending on your antenna and its location you could be getting twice the number of OTA channels as your neighbor. Just because it has a certain signal level doesn't mean I should be charged for it if I don't receive it.
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