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Old 10-11-2008, 03:26 AM   #1
gmcmurry
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Network TIVO Multi Room Viewing over VPN

I am itching to try this concept full on. I would love to share the experience with anyone out there that has done or tried the same thing.

At my main home, I have 4 DSR7000 DirecTV DVRs with Multi Room Home Media Options. They work fine. I can record on one TIVO and watch on another.

I have REAL DSL with fixed IP numbers and a Linksys Router

I also have a Cabin in another state, also with a REAL DSL and fixed IP numbers.

I have been thinking about getting two Lynksis BEFVP41 VPN Routers and installing them on either end.

I would then bridge my two networks together. I can easily make sure I have no IP number conflicts so all devices are on the same subnet.

Tivo at Home 192.167.0.73
Gateway at Home 192.168.0.1
Tivo at Cabin 192.168.0.76
Gateway at Cabin 192.168.0.2
Computer at Home running Tivo Desktop Server 192.168.0.5

Shouldn't this work? Would the TIVOs find each other?

If configured this way, shouldn't normal outbound internet traffic at home go out the home gateway through 192.168.9.1 and normal outbound internet traffic at my cabin gateway through 192.168.9.2?

I should also be able to file share between computers if I make there is no IP conflict with the two dhcp servers. I could have one of them only serve 100 - 150 and the other one serve 151 - 200

What is wrong with this idea?

Stop me before I waste about three days and a bunch of money...

Greg
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Old 10-11-2008, 10:13 AM   #2
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I've never done this, but you can turn a Windows XP machine into a VPN server and try it without buying all the hardware.

http://www.zdnetasia.com/insight/net...0223c-1,00.htm

If it's properly bridging the two networks, I don't see why it wouldn't work. Note that the Tivo network communication protocol depends on UDP broadcasts for the various devices to find each other.
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Old 10-11-2008, 11:18 AM   #3
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Even if the setup technically worked, seems like the limiting factor would be upstream bandwidth in either direction. You didn't mention what your Internet speed was at either location, but think about it this way. You need 12-15Mbps performance on your local network to have a hope of watching a show in real-time as it transfers from one box to another. Put another way, at that bitrate a one-hour show will take about one hour to transfer. Most residential Internet connections max out at about 1Mbps upstream, which means that would be the maximum rate your box in one location could transfer to another (and it probably wouldn't be that high). So you're looking at 10 hours or more to transfer a one-hour show from one box to another, and that's assuming your upstream speed is that high.

Still might be worth doing for the technical exercise of it, or if you were fine with starting a transfer one day and planning to watch the show the next. But the speed constraints limit the practicality of the setup, it seems to me.
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Old 10-11-2008, 11:35 AM   #4
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Why not use a Slingbox instead? They have already done all the work for you...
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Old 10-11-2008, 03:11 PM   #5
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The other important thing is that the TiVos all have the same MAK number, which they should if they're all on the same account. Otherwise they won't talk to each other.
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Old 10-11-2008, 03:34 PM   #6
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One other little bitty detail...

Transferring outside of your residence is against the TiVo terms of service. Take a look at the language on the Media Access Key screen on the TiVo. That's not to say that it can't be done, but it appears that then TiVo would have the right to discontinue your service.

It's also likely that the TiVo lawyers made them put this into the terms of service -- to protect them from any copyright actions that might be taken against them.
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Old 04-11-2009, 09:52 PM   #7
JasonRossSmith
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I'd love to know if you ever did this and if it worked... I've been dying to try it myself.
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Old 04-11-2009, 10:15 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bedelman View Post
One other little bitty detail...

Transferring outside of your residence is against the TiVo terms of service. Take a look at the language on the Media Access Key screen on the TiVo. That's not to say that it can't be done, but it appears that then TiVo would have the right to discontinue your service.

It's also likely that the TiVo lawyers made them put this into the terms of service -- to protect them from any copyright actions that might be taken against them.
And it would be trivial for TiVo , Inc to detect since each TiVo has to check in with the mothership. They'd see the requests from two different external IP addresses
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Old 04-11-2009, 10:37 PM   #9
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And it would be trivial for TiVo , Inc to detect since each TiVo has to check in with the mothership. They'd see the requests from two different external IP addresses
Not really. Depending on how you route traffic to the Internet. You could route all traffic over the VPN tunnel, and out the 'main house' Internet.

With all the bouncing in the Internet cloud, I doubt real time viewing would be very good.
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Old 04-11-2009, 10:46 PM   #10
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Thanks Yostmatt, I was just thinking the same thing. Bedelman is probably right that it "could" be detected if both locations went straight out, but I have to think you could configure it so it is undectable.

I accept it's a technichal violation of Tivo's rules, but since they still have to be on the same account and have the same MAK it really isn't violating any "laws".

Realtime viewing would not be practical without un-economical service fees for the needed speed.

I'm more interested in trying it for two reasons:
  1. Intelectual curiosity
  2. The rare occasion I miss a show at home, I could get it from another location in a different time zone.

Anyone actually made it work, and willing to admit it or share?
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Old 04-12-2009, 07:59 AM   #11
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I checked cmontyburns math and while I got lower numbers, it still doesn't seem possible to transfer in realtime due to bandwidth. The original poster is using hacked DirecTivo's, and a 1 hour show requires about 1 GB. So the upload connection would need to be 2.22 Mbps - which is about 2.5 times faster than most residential DSL links (assuming 3 Mbps down and .864 Mbps up).

The Tivo MAK argument doesn't even enter into the equation - this is a Superpatched DirecTivo and the files aren't encrypted.

I think the Slingbox would be the best method to accomplish this task.
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