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Old 11-28-2007, 07:22 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by tivoupgrade View Post
From what I remember of Powermax, there is also a low-level format and in some cases, if a problem is detected, the application will ask you if you want to attempt to repair. I don't recommend that, though - if there are bad sectors on the disk, then its likely that more will form, so unless this is just for temporary reasons, I would not rely on a 'repaired' drive for very long, if at all.
Agreed, but he wants this drive to work just long enough for it to upgrade to 9.1 finally and MRV his shows.
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Old 11-28-2007, 07:38 PM   #122
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Agreed, but he wants this drive to work just long enough for it to upgrade to 9.1 finally and MRV his shows.
Ok, I went back and re-read more. Why was SpinRite not looked into a little more closely? I saw that you recommended it - is it because it was too expensive?

I used SpinRite, ONCE before. I seem to remember that there was a 'demo' option where it could identify what *could* be repaired if you purchased the license.

I could be dreaming, too.
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Old 11-28-2007, 07:46 PM   #123
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Ok, I went back and re-read more. Why was SpinRite not looked into a little more closely? I saw that you recommended it - is it because it was too expensive?

I used SpinRite, ONCE before. I seem to remember that there was a 'demo' option where it could identify what *could* be repaired if you purchased the license.

I could be dreaming, too.
Yeah, for $70 $89 you could just buy a new drive.

http://www.grc.com/cs/prepurch.htm
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Old 11-28-2007, 08:03 PM   #124
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Yeah, for $70 $89 you could just buy a new drive.

http://www.grc.com/cs/prepurch.htm
Yikes.

Well, if the WGA strike continues, most of those recorded shows might be easier to catch as reruns...
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Old 11-28-2007, 10:31 PM   #125
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Actually, just so you know, you don't copy it to a floppy. You run it in Windows and it creates a floppy for you.
OK, I created the disk and ran the diagnostic, doing all the simpler test first and the disk passed them all. I then ran more extreme test and it took around an hour to run, maybe less, I wasn't watching it and when it was done:
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These HD's are nowhere near as fragile as many people think they are. In 15 years, I have never had a HD go bad.
until today.

It said the disk was failing and should be replaced and gave me all the things I needed to do to send it back to Maxtor. I guess that's just boilerplate and that even though it showed the serial and model numbers, it would not detect that the disc was beyond warranty.

It showed Diagnostic Code 579e6877, and I guess I can kiss using any KS options goodbye, but I am stubborn and see one more option. I have found several working 120GB HD's on e-Bay for under $25 including shipping. If I get one of those, can I still use the MFSLive rescue thing?
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Old 11-28-2007, 10:44 PM   #126
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Breaking Tivo's Thumbs

Can I ask a totally unrelated question or is there another Forum I should go to?

I NEVER use the Thumbs ratings, but since 9.1 arrived, we don't seem to have a choice anymore. I have several times cleared all thumb ratings on both S2's. These are supposed to stay cleared until I beging using Thumb ratings again. Now I see that just opting to record any show automatically gives that show a Thumbs up and you can't stop that from happening.

If I am looking at listings in my To Do list and see a show that runs several times a week is blocking a show that doesn't, I will look at the Upcoming Episodes list and choose another time to record the show with multiple show times. This will give that show a Thumbs up rating. Even if you immediately cancel it with the Thumbs down button and then pick another episode of the same show to record, it will still give it another Thumbs Up.
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Old 11-29-2007, 01:17 AM   #127
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Can I ask a totally unrelated question or is there another Forum I should go to?

I NEVER use the Thumbs ratings, but since 9.1 arrived, we don't seem to have a choice anymore. I have several times cleared all thumb ratings on both S2's. These are supposed to stay cleared until I beging using Thumb ratings again. Now I see that just opting to record any show automatically gives that show a Thumbs up and you can't stop that from happening.

If I am looking at listings in my To Do list and see a show that runs several times a week is blocking a show that doesn't, I will look at the Upcoming Episodes list and choose another time to record the show with multiple show times. This will give that show a Thumbs up rating. Even if you immediately cancel it with the Thumbs down button and then pick another episode of the same show to record, it will still give it another Thumbs Up.
IIRC a single thumbs up doesn't do anything excpet let you know that you had a positive intereaction with that program at some point. I don't think it will cause anything to be recorded or not recorded, etc.
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Old 11-29-2007, 01:23 AM   #128
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OK, I created the disk and ran the diagnostic, doing all the simpler test first and the disk passed them all. I then ran more extreme test and it took around an hour to run, maybe less, I wasn't watching it and when it was done:
until today.

It said the disk was failing and should be replaced and gave me all the things I needed to do to send it back to Maxtor. I guess that's just boilerplate and that even though it showed the serial and model numbers, it would not detect that the disc was beyond warranty.

It showed Diagnostic Code 579e6877, and I guess I can kiss using any KS options goodbye, but I am stubborn and see one more option. I have found several working 120GB HD's on e-Bay for under $25 including shipping. If I get one of those, can I still use the MFSLive rescue thing?
Sorry to hear about the disk...not surprising based on what was happening though.

FWIW I would steer clear of Maxtor drives whatever you do (even though Seagate now owns them). Seagate’s and Hitachi’s seem to be getting the best feedback from the TCF folks now with WD's coming up from behind.

I'll leave Greg to give you a positive answer one way or another regarding the use of MFSLive rescue on another drive. My guess would be that whatever is wrong with your current drive - particularly having trouble with the OS - could impact a new drive though.
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Old 11-29-2007, 06:32 AM   #129
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I have found several working 120GB HD's on e-Bay for under $25 including shipping. If I get one of those, can I still use the MFSLive rescue thing?
You can check your warranty on line, but OEM drive are unlikely to covered. Would have had to go through Tivo.
http://support.seagate.com/customer/...validation.jsp

Used hard drive? Doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy.

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I'll leave Greg to give you a positive answer one way or another regarding the use of MFSLive rescue on another drive. My guess would be that whatever is wrong with your current drive - particularly having trouble with the OS - could impact a new drive though.
I would try the rescue if it were free (or the recording were that important to me). But no guarantees.

The assumption so far is that only the alternate partition has the bad sectors. dd_rescue will bring it over in the corrupt state. Then KS would redownload the installation, overwriting the corrupt partition (but on to a working disk). At least that was my thinking.
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Old 11-29-2007, 07:48 AM   #130
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You can check your warranty on line, but OEM drive are unlikely to covered. .....
I've never had a problem returning an OEM drive to the manufacturer within the warranty period and I've returned at least one Maxtor and a couple of WDs over the years.
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Old 11-29-2007, 08:27 AM   #131
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I've never had a problem returning an OEM drive to the manufacturer within the warranty period and I've returned at least one Maxtor and a couple of WDs over the years.
I know when I type in a S/N for a WD or Maxtor that comes installed in a Dell they are not covered. Pretty sure I saw the same when I plugged in my WD S/N from my origianl Tivo drive awhile back.

Perhaps I am using the term OEM incorrectly. Obviously, OEM drives purchased from NewEgg, ZipZoom, Fry's etc. are covered (although for shorter periods than retail).

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Old 11-29-2007, 10:25 AM   #132
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FWIW I would steer clear of Maxtor drives whatever you do (even though Seagate now owns them). Seagate’s and Hitachi’s seem to be getting the best feedback from the TCF folks now with WD's coming up from behind.
I'll chime in on this tidbit, as well.

Any drive labeled as a MAXTOR is likely to be at least two years old and should be avoided at all costs. Its not that the Maxtor drives are so bad, but if you are picking up a new drive, it just shouldn't say Maxtor on it any more. If I'm wrong about that, please let me know. In fact, I could very well be wrong as I haven't "shopped" for a Maxtor drive in quite some time.

As for drive reliability, having seen a large volume of drives from different vendors, my personal experience has been that Samsungs have been the most reliable, overall in the past 5 years or so. Seagates have been good, but not nearly as good as the Samsungs short and long term. Western Digitals have had their problems and as a result, I haven't touched them much, but in all fairness, I think they have gotten a lot better in the past few years and I haven't seen nearly as many bad original TiVo drives (which are almost all Western Digital) as I have in the past.

Hitachis have been good, but we don't have a long history with them; only a few months. Time will tell.
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Old 11-29-2007, 01:18 PM   #133
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I'll chime in on this tidbit, as well.

Any drive labeled as a MAXTOR is likely to be at least two years old and should be avoided at all costs. Its not that the Maxtor drives are so bad, but if you are picking up a new drive, it just shouldn't say Maxtor on it any more. If I'm wrong about that, please let me know. In fact, I could very well be wrong as I haven't "shopped" for a Maxtor drive in quite some time.

As for drive reliability, having seen a large volume of drives from different vendors, my personal experience has been that Samsungs have been the most reliable, overall in the past 5 years or so. Seagates have been good, but not nearly as good as the Samsungs short and long term. Western Digitals have had their problems and as a result, I haven't touched them much, but in all fairness, I think they have gotten a lot better in the past few years and I haven't seen nearly as many bad original TiVo drives (which are almost all Western Digital) as I have in the past.

Hitachis have been good, but we don't have a long history with them; only a few months. Time will tell.
Agreed on all points. I completely spaced and forgot to put Samsung's at the top. D'oh!
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Old 11-29-2007, 06:46 PM   #134
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IIRC a single thumbs up doesn't do anything excpet let you know that you had a positive intereaction with that program at some point. I don't think it will cause anything to be recorded or not recorded, etc.
You are right, I remember seeing something about the Thumb ratings recently.
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Old 11-29-2007, 07:32 PM   #135
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You are right, I remember seeing something about the Thumb ratings recently.
Actually I've had shows given a thumb up just because I recorded it one time to see if I liked it. I didn't dislike it but I didn't like it much either.
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Old 11-29-2007, 08:01 PM   #136
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Actually I've had shows given a thumb up just because I recorded it one time to see if I liked it. I didn't dislike it but I didn't like it much either.
The program or the thumb?
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Old 11-30-2007, 01:38 AM   #137
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You can check your warranty on line, but OEM drive are unlikely to covered. Would have had to go through Tivo.
http://support.seagate.com/customer/...validation.jsp

Used hard drive? Doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy.



I would try the rescue if it were free (or the recording were that important to me). But no guarantees.

The assumption so far is that only the alternate partition has the bad sectors. dd_rescue will bring it over in the corrupt state. Then KS would redownload the installation, overwriting the corrupt partition (but on to a working disk). At least that was my thinking.
Sorry I took so long to get back, but after replying to Rich about the Thumbs thing I checked out the link you sent for the warranty check. I thought my S2 was older than it is, but its about 2 years old. Anyway, there was a link there for Seatools, a diagnostic similar to the Max tool. It also said it might be able to repair a "failing" disk which is exactly how Max tool rated my drive.

I created the floppy and ran it, but after booting, I was unable to get it to do anything and it did not seem to recognize any drives, not even zip drives and cd drive that the Max tool recognized.

When I typed in my drive's model and serial numbers, I was told it is an OEM item and had to be returned to the seller, in my case, Toshiba who I bought the S2 w/DVD from. I know Toshiba would probably make me return the entire unit even if it is under warranty, and that option hardly seems worthwhile.

About the used HD, I only need it to work for a few days so if I get one for under $20 I would like to try the MSFLive rescue thing as much out of curiosity as saving the recordings.
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Old 11-30-2007, 06:19 AM   #138
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About the used HD, I only need it to work for a few days so if I get one for under $20 I would like to try the MSFLive rescue thing as much out of curiosity as saving the recordings.
They'll get you with shipping, don't forget!

You haven't said why you don't want to use one of your two 500GB drives temporarily. Just MRV your shows to the other. When redone just IC again. No?
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Old 11-30-2007, 05:57 PM   #139
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They'll get you with shipping, don't forget!

You haven't said why you don't want to use one of your two 500GB drives temporarily.
I meant $20 including shipping. The one I had put a bid on was for $11 with $9 shipping, but I can't believe it has now been bid up to $33. Another guy has four up for bid with high bid for 3 of them being $1.04 or less with $10.50 shipping. Problem is they all end at the exact same time so I can only watch them because bidding on more than one could end up with multiple wins.

When you first suggested using on of the 500GB drives, I could have done that easily. The good news and the bad news is almost the same. Both drives now have enough recordings that I hesitate to go that route. Many of those new recordings are of shows sitting on the problem drive.

There are two shows on the science channel that I find fascinating and that run dozens and dozens of times per week, "How it's made" and "How do they do that?". It’s not ALL fascinating, but much of it is.

If the rescue thing doesn't work, plan B (or maybe plan K by now<g>) will be to see what’s left after re-recording shows on the new drives. Once down to a minimum, I can play the remaining recordings on the bad drive connecting the output from it to the input on the other S2 and record them that way. Or I can just watch them and delete them.
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Old 11-30-2007, 06:04 PM   #140
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Beyond Tivo

Just curious, I also have a HD cable box that records about 20 hours in HD. Is there any thing like Instant Cake that would enable me to put a larger drive in that unit? It is a Scientific Atlanta model Explorer 8300HD.
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Old 12-02-2007, 05:10 PM   #141
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my s3 now wont get pass the Tivo Central Screen. After unplugging to restart the machine, it goes thru the startup as usual, but when it comes to the Tivo Central screen, only the background appears at first. After a few minutes, then the menu items appear. But at that point I cannot move to another menu item. Only option at this point is to unplug and then it's the same cycle. Since I cannot get to Messages & Setup to do a restart, is there another way to do kickstart 52? I tried pushing the pause button after restarting via unplugging, but I don't see the yellow lights come on.
I have seen the exact same sequence. I should also mention that the animation in the background of the Tivo Central Screen (without or with menu) is very choppy (displays 1 or 2 frames, freezes, repeat). This is a one-year-old stock S3, with a broadband connection. It started happening last night. I have tried KS57, KS58, KS52. Nothing seemed to help. Any ideas?
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Old 12-03-2007, 01:36 AM   #142
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I have seen the exact same sequence. I should also mention that the animation in the background of the Tivo Central Screen (without or with menu) is very choppy (displays 1 or 2 frames, freezes, repeat). This is a one-year-old stock S3, with a broadband connection. It started happening last night. I have tried KS57, KS58, KS52. Nothing seemed to help. Any ideas?
If you've tried the kickstarts, etc. and nothing has worked it sounds like a failing HDD. A call to TiVo is in order. They may have some other ideas, but it's more likely they'll offer to exchange the unit (for a price, s/b $49).
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Old 12-03-2007, 08:16 PM   #143
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If you've tried the kickstarts, etc. and nothing has worked it sounds like a failing HDD. A call to TiVo is in order. They may have some other ideas, but it's more likely they'll offer to exchange the unit (for a price, s/b $49).
Thanks. If I were a betting man I would say that the Tivo is trying to do something in the background that is eating up 90% of the processor time. Strange though that this happened *exactly* after getting the latest update, no?

The only reason I know I got an update is that (after a full day of rebooting) it finally showed me the message about the unbox and adding drives (is that the message for 9.2?). The response of the remote was *very* sluggish and after about 3-4 clicks the Tivo reset. This really sucks. Shouldn't a HDD last for more than a year?
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Old 12-03-2007, 08:25 PM   #144
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Strange though that this happened *exactly* after getting the latest update, no?
Yes and no. After every update there is a deluge of these kinds of questions. For the few that bother to check their drive they usually find out there is something wrong with it.

Why after the upgrade? You have heard of the alternate partition thing that Tivo uses when it installs an upgrade? Apparently that portion of your disk is worse off than the other, hence the problem surfaces after the update. Had the whole drive had bad sectors, you would have noticed these problems before the upgrade.

That is my theory anyways.

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Shouldn't a HDD last for more than a year?
Most do. Some don't.
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Old 12-03-2007, 09:02 PM   #145
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Yes and no. After every update there is a deluge of these kinds of questions. For the few that bother to check their drive they usually find out there is something wrong with it.
Cool. But I'm using this device like a consumer instead of as a geek. The behavior sure doesn't *look* like it's hard drive related, but I'll admit, looks can be deceiving.

Switching to geek mode. If I open the box and test the hard drive and the hard drive is bad, I can replace it. If it's not the hard drive, then I'm boned, right? By that I mean, Tivo will not repair it as I have violated my warranty. I'd hate to be right and then own a brick.

Quote:
Why after the upgrade? You have heard of the alternate partition thing that Tivo uses when it installs an upgrade? Apparently that portion of your disk is worse off than the other, hence the problem surfaces after the update. Had the whole drive had bad sectors, you would have noticed these problems before the upgrade.
Yeah, I thought the KS52 might have helped if the alternate partition thing went sour.

What I really wish is that Tivo was sold as a RAID system as well. I'd pay extra for that. Oh well, you know what they say about wishes...
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Old 12-03-2007, 09:12 PM   #146
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Switching to geek mode. If I open the box and test the hard drive and the hard drive is bad, I can replace it. If it's not the hard drive, then I'm boned, right? By that I mean, Tivo will not repair it as I have violated my warranty. I'd hate to be right and then own a brick.
My S3 has no stickers that would indicated whether the cover was removed or not.

Although the hole I cut in the bottom might be a dead giveaway.



Quote:
Yeah, I thought the KS52 might have helped if the alternate partition thing went sour.
I would agree, but testing the drive is pretty simple thing to try.

Quote:
What I really wish is that Tivo was sold as a RAID system as well. I'd pay extra for that. Oh well, you know what they say about wishes...
With a TivoHD it is pretty simple to setup something ike this by moving the the internal sata connector to use the eSata one. And of course connecting a raid system.
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Old 12-06-2007, 11:48 AM   #147
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“Kickstart 52” Downloads a fresh copy of the TiVo software version that is currently installed (not newer, not older) on your TiVo to the alternate partition on the hard drive. This may help if a recent upgrade was interrupted or corrupted for some reason.

Are you sure kickstart 52 downloads the software, instead of just reinstalling from the slices currently present in mfs?
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Old 12-06-2007, 12:32 PM   #148
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Are you sure kickstart 52 downloads the software, instead of just reinstalling from the slices currently present in mfs?
Apologies, good catch. Kickstart 52 - is an emergency reinstall
of the existing software on the alternate root partition.

IIRC, Kickstart 56 - is the software/download and install procedure.
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Old 12-06-2007, 01:49 PM   #149
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so a kickstart 56 should download the current software, and install it?

I'm trying to get a 6.1a box to download the current software, so that I can capture the 6.1a slices, and I had thought the kickstart method in this thread would do it.
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Old 12-06-2007, 02:34 PM   #150
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so a kickstart 56 should download the current software, and install it?

I'm trying to get a 6.1a box to download the current software, so that I can capture the 6.1a slices, and I had thought the kickstart method in this thread would do it.
Hmmm...I believe, and I could certainly be wrong...that KS56 downloads the current version of the software already residing on the box...nothing newer or older. So if that's the case, yes, that should work.

If it does, can you confirm?
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