Drive Expansion and Drive Upgrade FAQ

[nab2z]

I just bought the WD10EVDS drive off Newegg and have been following the instructions in this forum.

1. Downloaded FDOEMCD.builder.zip from
2. Added wdidle3.exe to CDROOT folder.
3. Executed MAKEISO.BAT to create new FDOEM.ISO CD image file.
4. Burned FDOEM.ISO to CD using ImgBurn and viola - it will boot to DOS and allows wdidle3 to run. No need to change directory etc ... wdidle resides on C:\

My issue is that I do not get a message saying the timer is disabled. Running wdidle3 results in the following:

WDIDLE3 VERSION 1.03
COPYRIGHT INFO …
Configure Idle3.
Model: WDC WD10EVDS-63U8B0
Serial number: …
Idle3 Timer is enabled and set to 3720 seconds (62.0 minutes)

Also, it seems that any of the other wdidle parameters just cause the program to hang (like wdidle3 /R).

Any ideas?

Thanks.

[whitepelican]

Originally Posted by nab2z

Idle3 Timer is enabled and set to 3720 seconds (62.0 minutes)

Also, it seems that any of the other wdidle parameters just cause the program to hang (like wdidle3 /R).

Any ideas?

Thanks.

I might be off base here, but if it's really set to 3720 seconds, then I don't think you should have any problem with the drive at all. It should be good to go. People here have found that when they can't get the wdidle3 to disable the timer that setting it to longer time periods (even 25 seconds) makes the soft boot issue go away.

[rocko]

Originally Posted by nab2z

I just bought the WD10EVDS drive off Newegg and have been following the instructions in this forum.

1. Downloaded FDOEMCD.builder.zip from
2. Added wdidle3.exe to CDROOT folder.
3. Executed MAKEISO.BAT to create new FDOEM.ISO CD image file.
4. Burned FDOEM.ISO to CD using ImgBurn and viola - it will boot to DOS and allows wdidle3 to run. No need to change directory etc ... wdidle resides on C:\

My issue is that I do not get a message saying the timer is disabled. Running wdidle3 results in the following:

WDIDLE3 VERSION 1.03
COPYRIGHT INFO …
Configure Idle3.
Model: WDC WD10EVDS-63U8B0
Serial number: …
Idle3 Timer is enabled and set to 3720 seconds (62.0 minutes)

Also, it seems that any of the other wdidle parameters just cause the program to hang (like wdidle3 /R).

Any ideas?

Thanks.

Apparently, wdidle3 /d behaves differently depending upon the version. I created that boot disk with version 1.03, the one referenced in the FAQ. I used this version on my WD10EVVS and it reported the same results as you - 3720 seconds.

This seems to resolve the soft-boot issue, even though it doesn't appear to disable Intellipark. At least it did for my TiVo HD ...

[JTYoung1]

I have to say the instructions work great. I found one of the Hitachi 1TB drives at my local CompUSA yesterday and pulled the trigger. Copied my programs, season passes and everything over and had the S3 back together in about an hour and a half. Now I have a Series 3 with 157 hours of HD capacity.


It did take some trial and error getting HDDScan to work. Apparently it would only detect the drive as an IDE on my front panel eSATA connector since it connects to an actual SATA port on the motherboard. The back connector was seeing it as a SCSI drive.

[GrayeDog]

All, I just received my WD10EARS from Newegg with the free rosehill dock, and I tried to use WinMFS to copy to it. Problem is, it doesn't seem to work. Here's the rundown:

I went through the step as normal, did the truncated backup, everything seemed fine. Then I went to do the copy from the TiVo drive to my drive, went to sleep, woke up, checked on it, and noticed the external HDD had been turned off; WinMFS was stuck about 1/3 of the way through telling me there was 6.5 or so hours left.

I canceled the copy and started again...went smoothly to about 1/3 again, and the time jumped all the way to 16+ hours remaining. It slowly moved down to about 12, and then jumped to tell me (no joke) there were approximately 1139309 hours remaining. Clearly, something went wrong.

Is there a problem with WinMFS because of the 4k issue with the WD10EARS? If so, is there a workaround? If not, could it have stalled the second time because the first time did a partial data write? If so, is there a way to clear my new WD10EARS drive and start over? I'd really rather not have to return it and pay Newegg's 15% stocking fee if there's a way to make the WD10EARS work.

I should note I have a TiVoHD, and it's almost completely full of recordings, so I know the transfer won't be super fast, but 12-16+ hours seems a little extensive. Currently I have my tivo drive plugged into a SATA port on my motherboard and the WD10EARS plugged into the Rosehill dock via USB.

Thanks everyone.

[pl1]

Originally Posted by GrayeDog

<snip>I should note I have a TiVoHD, and it's almost completely full of recordings, so I know the transfer won't be super fast, but 12-16+ hours seems a little extensive. Currently I have my tivo drive plugged into a SATA port on my motherboard and the WD10EARS plugged into the Rosehill dock via USB.

You have nothing to lose by doing a truncated restore to test things out. You don't mention the size of the drive you are copying from, but if it is 1000g (1t) and full, of course that is 157 hours of HD recordings. The usual approach is to permanently delete all deleted programs and to eliminate as many recordings as possible. Copying a full drive is going to take a long time, for sure. 12-16 hrs may be possible.

[GrayeDog]

Thanks for the response, I'm copying from the original 160GB TiVo drive, so I'm even expecting a few hours. I cleared the format of the WD10EARS and I'm trying it again, I guess I'll let it run for awhile longer, maybe til tomorrow morning. Although I may stop it, clear the format, and try the truncated backup just to check. I'd rather not clear out my recordings because I've got a ton of movies I have on there that I haven't gotten around to watching.

[pl1]

Originally Posted by GrayeDog

Thanks for the response, I'm copying from the original 160GB TiVo drive, so I'm even expecting a few hours. I cleared the format of the WD10EARS and I'm trying it again, I guess I'll let it run for awhile longer, maybe til tomorrow morning. Although I may stop it, clear the format, and try the truncated backup just to check. I'd rather not clear out my recordings because I've got a ton of movies I have on there that I haven't gotten around to watching.

What I'm suggesting is to first restore a truncated backup. It only takes 5-10 minutes. If that works, you can STILL do a full copy from drive to drive.

[Majik45]

Thanks to all for the up to date information out there. I originally did an upgrade probably 1.5 years ago on my Tivo HD. My brother got a Tivo HD for Christmas, and I wanted to upgrade his internal drive for him, and just successfully did the process again. Had to run the wdidle3 utility to set the timer really high (my WDEVDS10 would not disable it, but set it to like 37000 seconds or something). Upgrade went flawlessly, and it doesn't have the soft boot problem.

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by JTYoung1

I have to say the instructions work great. I found one of the Hitachi 1TB drives at my local CompUSA yesterday and pulled the trigger. Copied my programs, season passes and everything over and had the S3 back together in about an hour and a half. Now I have a Series 3 with 157 hours of HD capacity.


It did take some trial and error getting HDDScan to work. Apparently it would only detect the drive as an IDE on my front panel eSATA connector since it connects to an actual SATA port on the motherboard. The back connector was seeing it as a SCSI drive.

Congrats on your "new" TiVo! Curious as to how the acoustics are on the Hitachi as compared to the OEM drive. Since you used HDDScan I'm assuming you changed the AAM to 128? I have two of them in an NAS and they were pretty quiet OOB but I'm wondering how much quieter they are after being adjusted. For me they are pretty solid, quiet and cool running drives. TIA and enjoy!

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by GrayeDog

Thanks for the response, I'm copying from the original 160GB TiVo drive, so I'm even expecting a few hours. I cleared the format of the WD10EARS and I'm trying it again, I guess I'll let it run for awhile longer, maybe til tomorrow morning. Although I may stop it, clear the format, and try the truncated backup just to check. I'd rather not clear out my recordings because I've got a ton of movies I have on there that I haven't gotten around to watching.

When you say "clear the format" what do you mean...what are you doing exactly? winMFS formats the drive automatically so I'm wondering what you are doing and if it's affecting your ability to make a copy.

Per the others, copying via USB can take quite a while and IIRC you can ignore the time counter as it can change often and not be accurate. If you watch your system's activity (under Task Manager or better yet Process Explorer) and winMFS is showing activity all should go well. It is possible that your new drive has some bad sectors and the copy process is being stopped at that point. Did you happen to run a drive diagnostic like WD's Lifeguard? If you still have trouble with it you might want to give that a try.

Best of luck and let us know how it goes.

[GrayeDog]

So, I did the restore from truncated backup, and the new drive took it just fine. Plugged it in, TiVo started fine. Tried a soft reboot from the menu, and that started up fine. Which is great. I figured I'd give it another go with WinMFS.

I figured out during this that the "Clear Format" option is just to tell the drive it's not a TiVo drive anymore. I did this to the drive, then went to WinMFS and did the Mfscopy from my TiVo to the new drive. Everything was going well, the counter was using normal numbers, and it made it significantly farther than it had previously. However, it's been stuck at 00:39:45 or so for at least an hour. I saw that it's not a big deal if the counter is going, but the process is showing 0% CPU in taskmanager. I can feel the drives are still going, and the LED light on my dock (which has the original TiVo drive plugged in) flickers occasionally, but it doesn't seem to be moving.

Anyone have any suggestions? All I can think of now are
1) Let it run, hope for the best, or 2) Start over and try it again.

That comment about a bad sector seems to make sense as to why it can't get through -- is there any way to fix something like that? Or is it a hardware issue that's going to come up during use even if I don't copy over my recordings and just use the backup? Thanks again everyone.

[bkdtv]

Originally Posted by GrayeDog

That comment about a bad sector seems to make sense as to why it can't get through -- is there any way to fix something like that? Or is it a hardware issue that's going to come up during use even if I don't copy over my recordings and just use the backup? Thanks again everyone.

The software and recordings are stored on different parts of the drive, and if the part of the drive with the recordings is in bad shape, you may not be able to perform a full backup. If that is the case, you can only backup the software and settings.

I assume you've already disabled any security and antivirus programs, as those can interfere with the backup process. Just to be sure such programs are disabled, you might reboot Windows in safe mode and try the WinMFS backup from there.

[fljoe]

Originally Posted by nab2z

I just bought the WD10EVDS drive off Newegg and have been following the instructions in this forum.

1. Downloaded FDOEMCD.builder.zip from
2. Added wdidle3.exe to CDROOT folder.
3. Executed MAKEISO.BAT to create new FDOEM.ISO CD image file.
4. Burned FDOEM.ISO to CD using ImgBurn and viola - it will boot to DOS and allows wdidle3 to run. No need to change directory etc ... wdidle resides on C:\

My issue is that I do not get a message saying the timer is disabled. Running wdidle3 results in the following:

WDIDLE3 VERSION 1.03
COPYRIGHT INFO …
Configure Idle3.
Model: WDC WD10EVDS-63U8B0
Serial number: …
Idle3 Timer is enabled and set to 3720 seconds (62.0 minutes)

Also, it seems that any of the other wdidle parameters just cause the program to hang (like wdidle3 /R).

Any ideas?

Thanks.

Hi nab2z,

In case you are not satisfied with the 3720 seconds idle timer setting,
can you please try and download the wdidle3 ver 1.0 that drey posted:
http://home.arcor.de/ghostadmin/wdidle3_1_00.zip

Then follow from Step 2: above and after you make the bootable CD, boot into DOS and run wdidle3 /D. You will definitely see "Idle Timer is disabled" with this old version 1.0 of wdidle3. I just tried it and it works. If the wdidle3 program hangs, just reboot your PC and try again .. I have seen it hang after I have issued wdidle3 /R to report the idle timer and a subsequent wdidle3 /D hung the program. A reboot cured it and I was able to do a wdidle3 /D after that.

[uTivo]

Just replaced the stock 250GB drive in my S3 with a 750GB Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 ( ST3750528AS F/W: CC38 ). Here's what I did:

1. Created a truncated backup of the stock S3 drive using WinMFS "just in case."
2. Ran the SeaTools 'Long Generic' sector test on the new drive to confirm it was not DoA.
3. Performed a drive to drive backup/restore using the MFSLive v1.4 Linux boot CD. I couldn't use WinXP/WinMFS for the D2D copy since I didn't have enough SATA ports on my P4 to have both drives & my XP boot drive attached. Besides, I'm a grad of the TivoMad/Hinsdale howto days on my S1/S2, so it just felt right using the cmd line .
4. Booted back into XP & did the SuperSize in WinMFS.

Now I have an S3 that reports its capacity as 116 HD hours! Just wanted to say thank you to all the developers & contributors who made this happen.

[Efranzen]

I upgraded my drive tonight and just wanted to offer my profound thanks to bkdtv and others who came before me that developed this process to make it comically easy for the rest of us.

I upgraded my TivoHD to 1TB using the Hitachi HD31000. I set the AAM to 128 as recommended and I can just barely hear the drive if I put my ear right next to the Tivo. With my TivoHD recording 2 HD channels and the volume on my receiver turned off, I can not hear the hard drive from anywhere in the room unless I get very close to the Tivo.

The one small contribution I can make to this thread is a recommendation of a SATA to USB device for those of us that have to do the upgrade in this manner. In reading the various reviews at Newegg and other sites, it seems that many of the SATA to USB devices tend to be flaky at best, with some of them appearing to be outright dangerous with a risk of catching on fire. The one I used is made by Apricorn, and while it's a little more expensive than some others, it worked flawlessly for me. Here's a link to the one I used:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-002-_-Product

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by uTivo

Besides, I'm a grad of the TivoMad/Hinsdale howto days on my S1/S2, ...

Ah, the good old days. Enjoy!

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by Efranzen

I upgraded my TivoHD to 1TB using the Hitachi HD31000. I set the AAM to 128 as recommended and I can just barely hear the drive if I put my ear right next to the Tivo. With my TivoHD recording 2 HD channels and the volume on my receiver turned off, I can not hear the hard drive from anywhere in the room unless I get very close to the Tivo.

The one small contribution I can make to this thread is a recommendation of a SATA to USB device for those of us that have to do the upgrade in this manner. In reading the various reviews at Newegg and other sites, it seems that many of the SATA to USB devices tend to be flaky at best, with some of them appearing to be outright dangerous with a risk of catching on fire. The one I used is made by Apricorn, and while it's a little more expensive than some others, it worked flawlessly for me. Here's a link to the one I used:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-002-_-Product

Thanks for the feedback (especially on the Hitachi drive...which is rapidly approaching being a favorite, at least for me) and the recommendation. Apricorn makes some very good products.

Enjoy your "new" TiVo!

[pl1]

I posted this question on mfslive.org, but I thought maybe I'd try here as well.

I have a 1T drive I upgraded from an original 160g THD. All went well.

I had new cableCARDs installed while the 1T drive was still installed. So, as a backup, I wanted to restore the cableCARD info to the 160g drive.

I tried to copy the 1T to the 160g drive with WinMFS. Although it did complete, I noticed that WinMFS thought the 160g drive was also a 1T drive and there was an error message when trying to access it.

So, instead I did a restore of the truncated 1T backup to the 160g drive. This worked fine. Except, when I booted up in the THD, with the 160g drive, it went from Power Up, to Almost There, back to Power Up, and then I got a 3 hour green screen repair message. It took about 10 minutes to repair, and rebooted normally, and everything appears to be working fine now.

So now I have a few questions: Do you think this method worked successfully, or could there be problems down the road? Also, is there another way I should have handled this? From everything I've read (searching after the fact), I should not have even been allowed to do this anyway, at least based on what Ive seen regarding an Instacake restoration. Should I have used MFS tools maybe?

[GrayeDog]

So, not all is well in upgrade land. I tried one more attempt with WinMFS in Safe Mode, but after 16 hours, it's still stuck at about 2/3 of the way through (which looks to be just about where it's gotten stuck every other attempt I've made). I downloaded the WD Lifeguard, and wanted to run the expanded test, but it looks like it's going to take 100 hours, since it's a 1Tb drive. I think I also remember seeing that, even when I did the truncated restore to the new drive, TiVo's settings said I only had 21 HD hours and 188 SD hours, which is totally wrong.

It certainly seems like the new drive is the problem. Does anyone have any thoughts on anything else I can try, or can anyone agree that the drive might be the problem, so I can look into returning it and getting the Hitachi HD31000 from Amazon for $89.99?

Thanks everyone.

[pl1]

Originally Posted by GrayeDog

I think I also remember seeing that, even when I did the truncated restore to the new drive, TiVo's settings said I only had 21 HD hours and 188 SD hours, which is totally wrong.

When the restore completes, you should have had a dialog box come up that asked if you wanted to expand the drive. You have to say Yes. And you can optionally do the expand after the fact. There is a drop down for that. Plus, you can also Supersize, adding even more space.

[ajburgh]

Originally Posted by chestnu1

Hey guys I am on the verge of upgrading the internal drive in my Tivo HD and I am in the process of getting everything I need to do it together. I have downloaded WinMFS and just bought a vantec sata usb adapter from amazon the only thing left is to pick a drive. I want to go with one of the western digital green 1TB drives (yes I know about that darn intellipark issue). Is there one in particular that is better then the rest? I was thinking about the WD10EVVS but I thought I should get some feedback before I order does anyone have any suggestions.

A warning if you want to use a WD Green drive with a USB-SATA adapter.

You probably will not be able to disable the intellipark with wdidle3 if you hook up the drive to a USB-SATA adapter. It will most likely need to be directly connected to a SATA port on the computer for wdidle3 to work.

[GrayeDog]

One more question -- Let's say the drive is the problem in using WinMFS to transfer from one TiVo to the other. If I do a restore from truncated backup, and do the "expand drive" (which is clearly the step I forgot), am I going to see problems down the line in saving recordings? As in, if the drive has a bed sector or something similar, could that cause a problem later on even if I can successfully install it and get TiVo to start with the drive?

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by pl1

When the restore completes, you should have had a dialog box come up that asked if you wanted to expand the drive. You have to say Yes.

Correct, and it's possible that if you didn't see the dialog box it appeared behind the regular winMFS box. It's a bit of a bug that happens now and then but not always. Keeping the regular winMFS box to one side of your screen (or if you have multiple screens, on another screen) will ensure that you see everything that appears.

[rocko]

Originally Posted by GrayeDog

One more question -- Let's say the drive is the problem in using WinMFS to transfer from one TiVo to the other. If I do a restore from truncated backup, and do the "expand drive" (which is clearly the step I forgot), am I going to see problems down the line in saving recordings? As in, if the drive has a bed sector or something similar, could that cause a problem later on even if I can successfully install it and get TiVo to start with the drive?

Possibly. That's why it's a good idea to save the truncated backup as well as the original 160/250GB drive. Just in case.

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by ajburgh

A warning if you want to use a WD Green drive with a USB-SATA adapter.

You probably will not be able to disable the intellipark with wdidle3 if you hook up the drive to a USB-SATA adapter. It will most likely need to be directly connected to a SATA port on the computer for wdidle3 to work.

That is correct. As stated in Section IV, #29 of the FAQ:

At this time, the procedure only works for drives connected directly to a computer with SATA or eSATA. It does not work for drives connected with a USB -> SATA adapter.

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by GrayeDog

One more question -- Let's say the drive is the problem in using WinMFS to transfer from one TiVo to the other. If I do a restore from truncated backup, and do the "expand drive" (which is clearly the step I forgot), am I going to see problems down the line in saving recordings? As in, if the drive has a bed sector or something similar, could that cause a problem later on even if I can successfully install it and get TiVo to start with the drive?

The answer is "maybe". There's no way of knowing how things might turn out because there's no way of knowing if the drive is problematic and if it is how extensive the problem is. If there's one bad sector it probably wouldn't be an issue...but where there one there is almost always more. All drives (especially as large as they are today) have bad sectors and other issues but there are built in programs, etc. to resolve things (either on the drive or via the software accessing the drive) but some problems are simply too big to be overcome.

Your best bet is to run WD Lifeguard or another deep diagnostic OR just get an RMA and a new drive.

That's probably not what you wanted to hear, but it's about the only way to find out if it's a problem with your new drive or not.

Me? I wouldn't risk things going south sometime down the road even if you can get a basic truncated restore working. It just wouldn't be worth losing my recordings later.

[pl1]

Originally Posted by rocko

Possibly. That's why it's a good idea to save the truncated backup as well as the original 160/250GB drive. Just in case.

That's where I'm kicking myself now. I had so many problems with a bad cableCARD, I was afraid to mess around with re-installing the original 160g drive back in my TiVo when Comcast came, for fear they would change cards, and my 1T would have the wrong cableCARD info. So, now I've blown out my original 160g drive. Plus, I overwrote the truncated backup of it, not thinking it mattered. Duh! But I did do a restore of the truncated 1t drive to the 160g drive and it is still working normally day 2. So, maybe I'll be OK with that as a backup.

[richsadams]

Originally Posted by pl1

So, maybe I'll be OK with that as a backup.

If you put it through its paces and everything is working okay you'll be safe keeping it as a backup IMHO.

[pl1]

Originally Posted by richsadams

Me? I wouldn't risk things going south sometime down the road even if you can get a basic truncated restore working. It just wouldn't be worth losing my recordings later.

The only other thing, is that he used a USB adapter instead of hooking up directly to the MB. If it was me, I would try that first. I was reading that USB 2.0 is twice as slow as a direct SATA connection while 1.0 is another 2x slower. It may be timing out for a 160g full drive. Maybe Windows is not recognizing any activity.