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Old 01-11-2010, 02:11 AM   #4531
richsadams
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Originally Posted by zeph55 View Post
Any recommendations for me?? Perhaps I should get a HD off the recommended list?
Hi Brian and welcome to the forum. Yes, you should stick to the recommended list on the first post...end of story. (See my post a little higher up for my most recent recommendations for another gentleman named Brian):

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...09#post7712809

BTW, the program to disable Intellipark (wdidle3) is only for Western Digital GP hard drives. (Nothing can be adjusted on a Seagate hard drive.)

FWIW I would return the Seagate 1.5TB drive. I had two that both failed almost instantly and they are notorious for problems (Google search should keep you busy for a while.) Here's my post on my recent experience with them.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...58#post7706658

Read all of the first post on this thread and it should answer all of your questions. If not, feel free to ask.

Happy upgrading!

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Old 01-11-2010, 06:32 AM   #4532
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Thanks for all the help in this post - I successfully upgraded my >3 year old Seagate DB35 drive (750 GB) to a new WD 1TB EVDS drive last night. I had seen a few signs that the old drive might be on its way out, and I figured the new drives are so cheap that it didn't make sense to NOT upgrade. It took like 7 hours to do the mfscopy (used SATA-USB cases), so I just let it run overnight and put it all back together this morning. Tivo S3 seems happy, and it is reporting 157 hours of space as expected. I haven't tried a soft reboot yet. I was unable to disable intellipark, so I set it to 25.5 sec as suggested in this thread.

Now I have 2 backup Tivo drives LOL I guess I can use the original drive for something else now. But at 250 GB, it's hardly worth installing it anywhere.

One thing I noticed inside the Tivo was the enormous amount of dust collected over the past 3+ years. I vacuumed/blew it all out. I'm guessing it's not a bad idea to do this every couple of years whether you are upgrading or not.
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Old 01-11-2010, 09:54 AM   #4533
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Originally Posted by wackymann View Post
............used SATA-USB cases........................ I was unable to disable intellipark, so I set it to 25.5 sec as suggested in this thread.
.....................
I'm confused. Based on my reading of posts here:

1. You cannot use widdle3 with USB-SATA adapters.
2. You can use widdle3 with SATA-USB cases.

(The issue being whether the drive is visible to the program.) Isn't a SATA-USB case electronically equivalent to using a USB-SATA adapter?
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Old 01-11-2010, 10:09 AM   #4534
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The WD drives have much to recommend them (reliability, price, quiet). I don't see why they shouldn't be 'recommended' for anyone who has a desktop PC. Disabling the intellipark is a trivial extra step.

Just my $.02.
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Old 01-11-2010, 12:38 PM   #4535
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I'm confused. Based on my reading of posts here:

1. You cannot use widdle3 with USB-SATA adapters.
2. You can use widdle3 with SATA-USB cases.

(The issue being whether the drive is visible to the program.) Isn't a SATA-USB case electronically equivalent to using a USB-SATA adapter?
I did the wdidle3 stuff with a direct connection to the SATA connector on the motherboard. I don't have enough SATA power connectors in my PC to have 3 drives going at once, so that's why I switched over to the enclosures for the mfscopy.
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:16 PM   #4536
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Series 3 Drive Upgrade Report

Greetings fellow TiVotees. I've successfully upgraded my TiVo Series 3 internal drive with a 1.5TB WD15EVDS, giving me 213 HD hours! Many thanks to the maintainers of the upgrading FAQ, to the creators of WinMFS, and to everyone who posts useful information here. There were a couple of snafus, though, and so I figured I'd post them here so as to help alert others who might have similar issues.

I checked and I do not have the "soft reboot problem". I.e., I can reboot the TiVo from the "Restart or reset system" menu, and it all works great. I know that the drive that I chose is likely to have that problem if the "wdidle3" program is not used to prevent it.

In order to guarantee that I did not have the soft reboot problem, I ran wdidle3 on the drives. This turned out to be an adventure, as I don't have any PC's with a sata controller, and my MacPro at work wouldn't boot off of the wdidle3 ISO posted in this forum. Fortunately, I was able to find a different wdidle3 ISO that uses FreeDOS, rather than MS DOS, and that worked fine on a MacPro. It took me a whole day to get to that point, however!

Another issue that I came across is that wdidle3 wouldn't elimate the Intellipark "feature" of the WD15EVDS. If I tried to remove it, it would set it to 6300ms, which is less than the default of 8000ms! I was able to increase it up to 25,500ms, however, and that seemed to do the job.

I did have another serious issue, however. The most recent version of WinMFS has a feature that is not mentioned in the FAQ. When you go to expand the drive, WinMFS will ask you if you want to expand a partition past 1TB. If you say that you do want to do that, then you end up with your TiVo stuck in an infinite reboot loop. I learned this the hard way! At 3am last night.... Then I had to spend a couple more hours reading through this forum to find out what I had done wrong. So whoever is in charge of the FAQ might want to update it to warn people of this rather onerous snafu.

But all's well that ends well! And next weekend, I upgrade my girlfriend's TiVo. (Aren't I a swell guy, experimenting on my TiVo first?)

|>ouglas
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:20 PM   #4537
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It seems pretty straight forward, but I only have a laptop, and from what Ive read I wont be able to disable it using a SATA to USB adapter. Correct me if I'm wrong becasue I would rather go with a WD drive, but becasue of this I'm giong to have to go with a Seagate.
Brian...the problem is that wdidle3 runs under DOS. That does not mean a dos cmd prompt within XP, but straight DOS. The image that people are getting is a bootable DOS cd with the wdidle3 program included. The problem is that DOS does not support USB, so a SATA to USB adapter will not help. The SATA to USB adapter will work, but for WINmfs. That is because WINmfs is a Windows program, and that will support USB (and the adapter(s)).

The problem with a laptop is a WDidle3 issue as you can not hook the SATA drive to the motherboard. Even if you did open the laptop it may not work as the SATA drives I have seen in a laptop seem to have nonstandard connectors, but yours may not.

If you had the bootable CD with WDidle3 on it, can't you bring it and the new Drive to a friend, family, or work and just hook it up to a SATA port? It should only take a few minutes to just get it done.
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:26 PM   #4538
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Originally Posted by jeffw_00 View Post
The WD drives have much to recommend them (reliability, price, quiet). I don't see why they shouldn't be 'recommended' for anyone who has a desktop PC. Disabling the intellipark is a trivial extra step.

Just my $.02.
8-}
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Well, hardly trivial if you don't have a PC with SATA connectors, but I agree–the WD drives should be listed as "recommended" in the FAQ, with the caveat that you'll have to have a PC with SATA connectors or a MacPro, and with links to the PC and Mac CD-ROM ISOs. And a note saying that you might not be able to remove the Intellipark setting (it may get set to 6300ms instead of getting removed), but that you can increase the setting to 25,500ms instead, which appears to be good enough for all intents and purposes.

|>ouglas
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:34 PM   #4539
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I did have another serious issue, however. The most recent version of WinMFS has a feature that is not mentioned in the FAQ. When you go to expand the drive, WinMFS will ask you if you want to expand a partition past 1TB. If you say that you do want to do that, then you end up with your TiVo stuck in an infinite reboot loop. I learned this the hard way! At 3am last night.... Then I had to spend a couple more hours reading through this forum to find out what I had done wrong. So whoever is in charge of the FAQ might want to update it to warn people of this rather onerous snafu.

But all's well that ends well! And next weekend, I upgrade my girlfriend's TiVo. (Aren't I a swell guy, experimenting on my TiVo first?)

|>ouglas
I believe the FAQ covers this issue already - see step #16 from the internal drive upgrade instructions:
Quote:
Is there anything special I need to do for drives larger than 1TB?

You must use WinMFS to prepare drives larger than 1TB. Older tools such as MFSLive and InstantCake do not support >1TB capacities.

Under the latest version of WinMFS (v9.3f), the following message is displayed when you attempt to use a drive larger than 1TB:

Code:

You are about to create a partition larger than 1TB.
It's too large for a stock TiVo to support.
Do you want to limit it to 1TB?

You must choose 'yes' if you have a TiVo without a hacked PROM chip. This will restrict expansion to 1.1 TB (1.0 TiB) plus the capacity of the original drive, as indicated in FAQ #5 above.

If you fail to select 'yes', the TiVo will not work; it will reboot every five minutes.

Note specific discussion of PROM mods and hacks is not permitted on TiVo Community.

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Old 01-11-2010, 01:41 PM   #4540
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I believe the FAQ covers this issue already - see step #16 from the internal drive upgrade instructions:
Ah, indeed it does! Thanks.

But not in the step-by-step instructions, which is the only part that I printed out and had sitting next to me while doing the upgrade.

Perhaps the step-by-step instructions should either include this caveat directly, or say to see the apropriate FAQ entry.

|>ouglas
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Old 01-11-2010, 01:57 PM   #4541
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...In order to guarantee that I did not have the soft reboot problem, I ran wdidle3 on the drives. This turned out to be an adventure, as I don't have any PC's with a sata controller, and my MacPro at work wouldn't boot off of the wdidle3 ISO posted in this forum. Fortunately, I was able to find a different wdidle3 ISO that uses FreeDOS, rather than MS DOS, and that worked fine on a MacPro. It took me a whole day to get to that point, however!
Thanks for the great info Douglas. Can you post a link to the wdidle3 ISO that you used w/your MacPro? I and others here could benefit going forward.

Quote:
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But not in the step-by-step instructions, which is the only part that I printed out and had sitting next to me while doing the upgrade.

Perhaps the step-by-step instructions should either include this caveat directly, or say to see the apropriate FAQ entry.
Agreed.
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:01 PM   #4542
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Brian...the problem is that wdidle3 runs under DOS. That does not mean a dos cmd prompt within XP, but straight DOS. The image that people are getting is a bootable DOS cd with the wdidle3 program included. The problem is that DOS does not support USB, so a SATA to USB adapter will not help. The SATA to USB adapter will work, but for WINmfs. That is because WINmfs is a Windows program, and that will support USB (and the adapter(s)).

The problem with a laptop is a WDidle3 issue as you can not hook the SATA drive to the motherboard. Even if you did open the laptop it may not work as the SATA drives I have seen in a laptop seem to have nonstandard connectors, but yours may not. .
Thanks for the clarification. Apparently Douglas was able to take care of the Intellipark issue on a WD hard drive with a different ISO on his Mac laptop, but for Wintel laptops, it doesn't look like an option (yet anyway).
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:07 PM   #4543
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Thanks for the great info Douglas. Can you post a link to the wdidle3 ISO that you used w/your MacPro? I and others here could benefit going forward.

Agreed.
I think the boot CD that I created and posted a few pages back in this thread might be the one referred to. I used the FreeDOS OEM Bootdisk and then added wdidle3.exe to it. I'm not sure of the legality of that disk, but I hope it helps others. Here is the direct link to the wdidle3 ISO download : wdidle3 ISO (FreeDos)

Last edited by whitepelican : 01-11-2010 at 02:14 PM.
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:29 PM   #4544
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I think the boot CD that I created and posted a few pages back in this thread might be the one referred to.
Indeed it is! Thanks for posting about it again, as I would have had no idea where I got it from. I have several wdidle3 ISOs, from various places I can't remember, and that is the only one that would not hang while booting on my MacPro.

|>ouglas
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:34 PM   #4545
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Thanks for the clarification. Apparently Douglas was able to take care of the Intellipark issue on a WD hard drive with a different ISO on his Mac laptop
Ah, well, not quite. A MacPro is a desktop Mac with internal SATA connectors. (Actually ones that are extremely easy to get to. Popping disks into and out of a MacPro is a joy to behold.)

|>ouglas
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:52 PM   #4546
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Ah, well, not quite. A MacPro is a desktop Mac with internal SATA connectors. (Actually ones that are extremely easy to get to. Popping disks into and out of a MacPro is a joy to behold.)

|>ouglas
D'oh! My mistake...I was seeing MacPro but thinking "MacBook Pro" So it appears that you just can't adjust or disable "Intellipark" on WD GP drives with a laptop...at least so far.

BTW, one day my iMac will grow up to be a MacPro if I keep watering it right?
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Old 01-11-2010, 03:02 PM   #4547
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BTW, one day my iMac will grow up to be a MacPro if I keep watering it right?
Btw, you can get to the SATA connector on an iMac, but you have to pull the glass off of the monitor with a big suction cup! And then lift the motherboard out. I'm not sure that I would want to run the iMac with its guts hanging out like that, though.

You can probably do something equivalent with most laptops. I looked at trying to do that with mine, but then I gave up when I looked at the crazy Swiss-watch-like insides of my notebook....

In the end, either of those options would have probably been faster than the route I took to getting wdidle3 working, though.

|>ouglas

P.S. And people have done minor surgery on Mac minis in order to give it an eSata connector. I'm not sure why Apple doesn't provide one, as doing so would give better performance than Firewire or USB.
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Old 01-11-2010, 03:12 PM   #4548
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Ah, well, not quite. A MacPro is a desktop Mac with internal SATA connectors. (Actually ones that are extremely easy to get to. Popping disks into and out of a MacPro is a joy to behold.)
Second that endorsement of the MacPro. I used mine about 3 months ago to upgrade both a TiVoHD and a Series3 with no problems (WD10EVVS--20 Sept. date--in the HD and Seagate ST31000322CS in the S3). Although I haven't yet seen the soft boot problem, I'd like to have the FreeDOS wdidle3 CD available in case a problem crops up with the WD drive. I'll try to download it from whitepelican's link.

Nessus, is booting from this CD just a matter of putting it in the MacPro and setting it as a startup disc? (I run WinMFS on Windows XP under Boot Camp.) Any tricks to getting wdidle3 to recognize the correct hard drive in the MacPro?
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Old 01-11-2010, 03:22 PM   #4549
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Nessus, is booting from this CD just a matter of putting it in the MacPro and setting it as a startup disc? (I run WinMFS on Windows XP under Boot Camp.) Any tricks to getting wdidle3 to recognize the correct hard drive in the MacPro?
To boot from the CD, put the CD into the CD-ROM drive before you power it down. Then reboot the Mac, and as soon as the Mac has shutdown, hold down the Option key, and keep it held down for a minute or two, until you see the display which lets you pick the boot drive. After another minute or so, the CD-ROM will appear, although it will be labeled "Windows". Select the CD-ROM with the arrow keys and press Enter.

You then don't have to do anything special to boot into FreeDOS. It just happens automatically. (There is some message while FreeDOS is booting to type Enter within the next 30 seconds. You may have to do that.)

Then you will have a DOS prompt and wdidle3 will be right there. You don't have to do anything to have wdidle3 recognize the drive. It automatically recognizes all WD drives.

|>ouglas
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Old 01-11-2010, 03:46 PM   #4550
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Btw, you can get to the SATA connector on an iMac, but you have to pull the glass off of the monitor with a big suction cup!
Precisely why I keep a PC I built a while back around.
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P.S. And people have done minor surgery on Mac minis in order to give it an eSata connector. I'm not sure why Apple doesn't provide one, as doing so would give better performance than Firewire or USB.
What Jobs has against eSATA is beyond me.
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:10 PM   #4551
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First time poster here! I'll be upgrading my TivoHD I received for Xmas straight out of the box with the WD10EVDS drive. I ordered it from Amazon on Jan 6th and received it today with a manufacture date of Oct 10, 2009. Looks like pre-November EVDS drives are still being shipped. Upgrading my Series 2 was a headache after the original drive had failed so I'd like to upgrade now and get a head start on an easy recovery solution. Is there any trouble I may run into by perfoming the upgrade before ever powering the unit on?
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:28 PM   #4552
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First time poster here! I'll be upgrading my TivoHD I received for Xmas straight out of the box with the WD10EVDS drive. I ordered it from Amazon on Jan 6th and received it today with a manufacture date of Oct 10, 2009. Looks like pre-November EVDS drives are still being shipped. Upgrading my Series 2 was a headache after the original drive had failed so I'd like to upgrade now and get a head start on an easy recovery solution. Is there any trouble I may run into by perfoming the upgrade before ever powering the unit on?
Yes. Turn it on and set it up to make sure it works. If it's a new box, you'll be voiding the warranty once you open it up, so you should make sure it works first. I would then have it force a few connections to the Tivo mothership to upgrade to the latest software. After doing that and being sure it works OK, then you can go ahead with the disk upgrade.
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:29 PM   #4553
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Most of us feel that you should at least power up the NEW TiVoHD and get it running first. That means making sure that all is OK and that the Cable Cards work (if you use them). However, the biggest thing is to get the new software by forcing several connections first. In that way, the backup and image from the original drive will already be configured. I waited a few weeks to be sure all was working OK before I did the upgrade.
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:32 PM   #4554
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Like everyone, my TiVo HD 1TB uprade is a long story but I will spare the details. Used a laptop/sata-USB adaptor to backup from 160 GB. After reading this forum, Spike's forum and Ross Walker's forum until my head ached and eyes were sore and my stomach churned about the intellipark issue I probably did a stupid thing - I got a WD10EARS from Newegg hoping for plug'n play. Now I hear (no pun) not only is intellipark an issue but there is some kind of misalignment thing that can cause problems. Here's my question: does anyone think the WD10EARS will work? Is the Hitacchi Deskstar refered to above @$69 from Frys a plug'n play solution?

All of the advice here has been great and I thank all who have contributed.

Ray.
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:33 PM   #4555
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And save your original drive in case you ever have a problem with the new one. My new drive had problems after about 4 months, thank goodness I was able to swap the original back in and have a working Tivo so I didn't miss any shows while diagnosing the problem drive.
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Old 01-11-2010, 06:05 PM   #4556
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I did the wdidle3 stuff with a direct connection to the SATA connector on the motherboard. I don't have enough SATA power connectors in my PC to have 3 drives going at once, so that's why I switched over to the enclosures for the mfscopy.
Ah so! Doesn't matter ... I'm sure I'll have a new PC with SATA connectors by the time I do another TiVo upgrade. Thanks for the explanation.
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Old 01-11-2010, 06:39 PM   #4557
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I got a WD10EARS from Newegg hoping for plug'n play. Now I hear (no pun) not only is intellipark an issue but there is some kind of misalignment thing that can cause problems.
"some kind of misalignment thing?" Details, por favor...
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Old 01-11-2010, 06:56 PM   #4558
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"some kind of misalignment thing?" Details, por favor...
I think the "misalignment thing" is a Windows problem only, having to do with the 4K sectors of these new drives. I wouldn't think it would be an issue with a Tivo, but it would be nice to get some firsthand reports.

See here for the Windows XP misalignment problem with these 4K sector drives.
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Old 01-11-2010, 07:04 PM   #4559
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Wink

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See here for the Windows XP misalignment problem with these 4K sector drives.
D'oh!

That said, to backyard: Yeah, sounds like a Windows thing. From whitepelican's link: "Notably, Linux and Mac OS X are not affected by this issue. Western Digital has tested both of these operating systems, and officially classifies them as not-affected."

Tivo, I believe, lives in Linuxland, and WinMFS is intended to respect/emulate the data structures that Tivo uses.

Didn't someone in here say they set up some EARS without issue?
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Old 01-11-2010, 07:23 PM   #4560
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Thanks for the responses. It would be great to know if someone had success and there was no intellipark problem.

This is from Spike on the MFSlive.org forum. The EARS note was added a few days ago.

Recommended SATA drives for TiVo S3, TiVo HD, TiVo HDXL
by spike » Sat Mar 22, 2008 12:54 pm

The following drives seem to work well with Tivo S3 (TCD648250B), Tivo HD (TCD652160) or Tivo HDXL (TCD658000).

Western Digital AV-GP (WD10EVDS) Best choice
Seagate Pipeline HD 5900 RPM (ST31000322CS)
Seagate Pipeline HD 7200 RPM (ST31000533CS)
Western Digital AV-GP (WD10EVCS) EOL
Western Digital AV-GP (WD10EVVS) EOL
Seagate Barracuda LP 5900 RPM (ST31000520AS) Bit loud so don't want it in your bedroom


Drives to Avoid for TiVo Series 3:
Western Digital GP (WD10EACS) *soft reboot problem on S3 but works on THD
Western Digital (WD10EADS) *soft reboot problem on S3 but works on THD


Stay Away from WD "EARS" Drives
WD10EARS or "EARS" drives have 4KB physical sector aka. Advanced Format.
Drives currenlty have 512 Byte physical sector and TiVo File System is designed with that in mind.
So with the 4K sectors, partitions will be misaligned and MFS (TiVo File System) read/write will be misaligned...
I would think this will cause major slow down, so you should stay away from them until further studies have been conducted on TiVo.
Stay tuned....
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