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Old 11-08-2007, 05:11 PM   #301
richsadams
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v9.2.a Upgrade/eSATA Problem?

If you have an eSATA drive connected to your S3 and receive the latest upgrade, v9.2.a, can you please post a quick or if your drive continues to work?

A post on another thread indicates that the OP just received the latest/final upgrade, v9.2.a and that her eSATA drive continues to work normally on her S3.

However another post says that the latest upgrade killed the eSATA drive connection on his S3.

Historically existing eSATA drives have continued to work through all upgrades since May of this year. This is the first time someone has had a problem which appears to have been caused by the most recent upgrade.

Thanks!

EDIT: As noted in my post on another thread, we just received v9.2a and everything is working fine. Our eSATA drive continues to be recognized as usual. A number of other positive posts have come in as well, so it looks like there is no problem.

Last edited by richsadams : 11-08-2007 at 07:42 PM.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:12 PM   #302
JonHB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams
No idea what they're using to ID the "approved device". I'd bet it's the drive model number, but that’s just speculation based on the fact that that’s what appears on the System Info screen once an external drive is married up. I’m not sure how you could “fool” TiVo into thinking that a different drive had the same model number.

Based on posts from TiVo folks, I don't think there's any hope of adding an "unapproved device" via P&P to the TiVo HD any time soon. I think if someone like Spike had conquered it we'd know by now.

If you're going to open the box and use WinMFS to upgrade your unit (now or later) I'd just replace the internal drive with your 1TB drive and forget about the expansion...unless you need the few more gigs that your existing internal drive would give you.
I have an approved WD MyBook 500GB drive, but it was briefly used on a PC prior to trying it out with Tivo. Because of this, Tivo is refusing to use it as an expander.

Can anyone tell me what the "factory fresh" configuration is when the drive comes out of the box? e.g. what kind of partitions (Type id), size, drive signature id, etc.???

I've tried it by deleting all partitions, creating a single partition (of various types), etc. and it still won't add it. I know it is not a cabling issue as Tivo does recognize the drive as being there and shows the drive in the system info screen and I can see the drive access whenever Tivo tries to talk to it. (The MyBook blue light glows during access).

I know I could add it with WinMFS, but I don't have any SATA capable PC's at home. I can use the USB port on the drive to reconfigure it from my laptop prior to having Tivo try to boot from it, so I would like to just try it by having it in the same config as a factory fresh one. Would anyone pull their's and check the drive parameters? Or better yet, check the drive parameters prior to marrying it to your THD?

Last edited by JonHB : 11-08-2007 at 05:19 PM. Reason: typo...
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:18 PM   #303
drwho
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Exclamation Seagate 750GB FreeAgent Pro Drive

I just got 9.2a today on my S3.

Trying to connect new Seagate 750GB FreeAgent Pro using a PNY eSATA cable from Best Buy (Only cable I could find in Nashville, TN).

My TiVo sees nothing! Go to storage expansion menu, says no external drive found...

Is anybody using Seagate FreeAgent Pro drive?

Do I just have a bad eSATA cable?

Does 9.2a (both B1 and non B1) no longer support non-verified drives?
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:19 PM   #304
Raoul99
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Hi Rich...thanks for the quick response.

The "2 insides" was a goof...now corrected.

What I meant to ask was if the MX-1 comes with the cables to connect the hard drive to the case internally, NOT to the Tivo externally?

Rick
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:35 PM   #305
richsadams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonHB
I have an approved WD MyBook 500GB drive, but it was briefly used on a PC prior to trying it out with Tivo. Because of this, Tivo is refusing to use it as an expander.

Can anyone tell me what the "factory fresh" configuration is when the drive comes out of the box? e.g. what kind of partitions (Type id), size, drive signature id, etc.???

I've tried it by deleting all partitions, creating a single partition (of various types), etc. and it still won't add it. I know it is not a cabling issue as Tivo does recognize the drive as being there and shows the drive in the system info screen and I can see the drive access whenever Tivo tries to talk to it. (The MyBook blue light glows during access).

I know I could add it with WinMFS, but I don't have any SATA capable PC's at home. I can use the USB port on the drive to reconfigure it from my laptop prior to having Tivo try to boot from it, so I would like to just try it by having it in the same config as a factory fresh one. Would anyone pull their's and check the drive parameters? Or better yet, check the drive parameters prior to marrying it to your THD?
Are you trying to connect it to a TiVo HD or a Series 3? And when you say you have an "approved WD MyBook 500GB" is it this "approved device"?:

Western Digital My DVR Expander Hard Drive

If it's not that specific drive it will not work as a plug and play device on the TiVo HD.

It should work with a TiVo Series 3 however, but if not, can you post what software version your TiVo currently has? It has to be v9.2.j or higher for P&P to work on either model.

In any case, TiVo reformats all eSATA drives during the marriage process, so there is nothing (AFAIK) that can or needs to be done to a drive before connecting it as everything is lost at that time anyway.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:38 PM   #306
richsadams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raoul99
Hi Rich...thanks for the quick response.

The "2 insides" was a goof...now corrected.

What I meant to ask was if the MX-1 comes with the cables to connect the hard drive to the case internally, NOT to the Tivo externally?

Rick
In that case, yes. There's nothing else you'll need...except to possibly buy the recommended external replacement eSATA cable.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:48 PM   #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams
Are you trying to connect it to a TiVo HD or a Series 3? And when you say you have an "approved WD MyBook 500GB" is it this "approved device"?:

Western Digital My DVR Expander Hard Drive

If it's not that specific drive it will not work as a plug and play device on the TiVo HD.

It should work with a TiVo Series 3 however, but if not, can you post what software version your TiVo currently has? It has to be v9.2.j or higher for P&P to work on either model.

In any case, TiVo reformats all eSATA drives during the marriage process, so there is nothing (AFAIK) that can or needs to be done to a drive before connecting it as everything is lost at that time anyway.
Trying to attach it to my Tivo HD running 9.2a.B1. The drive is the WDG1SU5000.

I know Tivo is seeing the drive just fine, it's just refusing to marry it. I'm just guessing that its verification process is looking from more than just the drive model number and will only work if it is considered "new". Thus, I'm trying to find out what that "new" config really looks like.

Thanks,
Jon
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:56 PM   #308
richsadams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drwho
I just got 9.2a today on my S3.

Trying to connect new Seagate 750GB FreeAgent Pro using a PNY eSATA cable from Best Buy (Only cable I could find in Nashville, TN).

My TiVo sees nothing! Go to storage expansion menu, says no external drive found...

Is anybody using Seagate FreeAgent Pro drive?

Do I just have a bad eSATA cable?

Does 9.2a (both B1 and non B1) no longer support non-verified drives?
If you go back to the original Series3 eSATA Drive Expansion in 8.x: FAQ + Discussion thread you'll see that the Free Agent Pro drives are not recommended as expansion drives for TiVo (#36). Numerous posts indicated immediate problems...exactly like you're experiencing...or other problems later down the line due to overheating, etc. One of the main issues were the eSATA cables and the connections on the FAP drive causing problems. That said, there are people using them, but again many simply didn't work.

My suggestion would be to return the drive and purchase the "approved" Western Digital My DVR Expander Hard Drive from TiVo, one of the recommended all-in-one expansion drives or a bare drive and enclosure combo such as the Seagate DB35 7200.3 series and Antec MX-1 enclosure.

All that said, there has been one report of an eSATA drive failing after the latest software upgrade, v9.2.a, was installed, but we're waiting for more feedback to see if it is in fact a problem.
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:01 PM   #309
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonHB
I have an approved WD MyBook 500GB drive, but it was briefly used on a PC prior to trying it out with Tivo. Because of this, Tivo is refusing to use it as an expander.

Can anyone tell me what the "factory fresh" configuration is when the drive comes out of the box? e.g. what kind of partitions (Type id), size, drive signature id, etc.???

I've tried it by deleting all partitions, creating a single partition (of various types), etc. and it still won't add it. I know it is not a cabling issue as Tivo does recognize the drive as being there and shows the drive in the system info screen and I can see the drive access whenever Tivo tries to talk to it. (The MyBook blue light glows during access).

I know I could add it with WinMFS, but I don't have any SATA capable PC's at home. I can use the USB port on the drive to reconfigure it from my laptop prior to having Tivo try to boot from it, so I would like to just try it by having it in the same config as a factory fresh one. Would anyone pull their's and check the drive parameters? Or better yet, check the drive parameters prior to marrying it to your THD?
Unfortunately I can't help you out with you situation however I'm excited because your experience tells me that there is the possibility that there is actually something imaged onto the drive itself to cause the THD to see it as an approved drive. If it was firmware or model number then using it on your PC should have no effect. Interesting...

Anyone willing to do a disk image of their MyBook DVR Expander?

EDIT ** After reading your post... is your drive a MyBook DVR Expander or just a MyBook? The only approved drive is the MyBook DVR Expander.

Last edited by tyoung88 : 11-08-2007 at 06:07 PM.
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:08 PM   #310
richsadams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonHB
Trying to attach it to my Tivo HD running 9.2a.B1. The drive is the WDG1SU5000.

I know Tivo is seeing the drive just fine, it's just refusing to marry it. I'm just guessing that its verification process is looking from more than just the drive model number and will only work if it is considered "new". Thus, I'm trying to find out what that "new" config really looks like.

Thanks,
Jon
The approved device is the WD My DVR Expander, WDG1S5000. If you have the WDG1SU5000, that is the My Book™ Premium ES Edition and it is not the approved device and will not work via P&P with the TiVo HD. Unfortunately TiVo HD's will recognize any drive that you attach to them, but they will not allow it to work.

As you mentioned, it can be added with the WinMFS program though.
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:19 PM   #311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tyoung88
Anyone willing to do a disk image of their MyBook DVR Expander?

EDIT ** After reading your post... is your drive a MyBook DVR Expander or just a MyBook? The only approved drive is the My Book DVR Expander.
As far as I know, the term "My Book" is not used anywhere in the DVR Expander package or product information. Western Digital lists it separately from the My Books on its web site.

As far as a disk image...there is nothing to image. The drive is empty. TiVo looks at the drive firmware to determine whether the drive is supported.
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:23 PM   #312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams
If you have an eSATA drive connected to your S3 and receive the latest upgrade, v9.2.a, can you please post a quick or if your drive continues to work?

Thanks!
hi rich... i was one of the posters on the other thread you mention... just some facts to give -my- experience (ymmv)

i have a July 2007 ST i received early last week... it had some flavor of 8.x on the unit when i received it (not sure) but after going through the initial guided setup i would up with a 9.1 version of the firmware...

i then went out to Frys and purchased the WD 1TB Green drive they were selling and installed it in a generic eSATA case (gonna upgrade the case this weekend) and did kickstart and the drive was recognized by the S3

i requested the priority upgrade a few times, but never got the 9.2j download

yesterday when TiVoPony mentioned that 9.2 had gone wide, i forced a network connection and got 9.2a-B1-01-2-648. checking System Info i found there was a new info line under HDMI status that says:

External Storage: WDC WD10EACS-00ZJB0 01.01B01

and my recording capacity was listed as "up to 165 HD hours, or 1561 SD hours"

today i noticed another pending restart and when i restarted the system i found that i now had software 9.1a-01-2-648

all else seems the same... drive still recognized, all programs intact

hope this is a useful datapoint for anyone else who may be trying to track down why their 9.2a upgrade pooches their kickstarted external drive.

(btw, this is a GREAT community...)

cheers
r
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Old 11-08-2007, 06:32 PM   #313
richsadams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robingo88
hi rich... i was one of the posters on the other thread you mention... just some facts to give -my- experience (ymmv)

i have a July 2007 ST i received early last week... it had some flavor of 8.x on the unit when i received it (not sure) but after going through the initial guided setup i would up with a 9.1 version of the firmware...

i then went out to Frys and purchased the WD 1TB Green drive they were selling and installed it in a generic eSATA case (gonna upgrade the case this weekend) and did kickstart and the drive was recognized by the S3

i requested the priority upgrade a few times, but never got the 9.2j download

yesterday when TiVoPony mentioned that 9.2 had gone wide, i forced a network connection and got 9.2a-B1-01-2-648. checking System Info i found there was a new info line under HDMI status that says:

External Storage: WDC WD10EACS-00ZJB0 01.01B01

and my recording capacity was listed as "up to 165 HD hours, or 1561 SD hours"

today i noticed another pending restart and when i restarted the system i found that i now had software 9.1a-01-2-648

all else seems the same... drive still recognized, all programs intact

hope this is a useful datapoint for anyone else who may be trying to track down why their 9.2a upgrade pooches their kickstarted external drive.

(btw, this is a GREAT community...)

cheers
r
Thanks for that...but Are you saying that yesterday after an upgrade your System Info screen listed your software version as 9.2a-B1-01-2-648, but today you rebooted and it now reads 9.1a-01-2-648?! Are you sure?

Not doubting you but AFAIK there's never been an occasion for software to go backwards. If so...you're headed for the TiVo Record Book!
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Old 11-08-2007, 07:06 PM   #314
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It's my understanding that the options for upgrading the internal drive are essentially the same for the HD and S3, but the HD requires an approved external drive whereas you have lots more external options with the S3. Is that basically correct?
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Old 11-08-2007, 07:09 PM   #315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drwho
I just got 9.2a today on my S3.

Trying to connect new Seagate 750GB FreeAgent Pro using a PNY eSATA cable from Best Buy (Only cable I could find in Nashville, TN).

My TiVo sees nothing! Go to storage expansion menu, says no external drive found...

Is anybody using Seagate FreeAgent Pro drive?

Do I just have a bad eSATA cable?

Does 9.2a (both B1 and non B1) no longer support non-verified drives?
I am using the FAP750 that you are trying. I did have to trim a cable and expose more metal connector to get it recognized. I used the original kickstart method and it has survived firmware upgrades to the current 9.2 (no alpha in the release version) I have been using it since about June.

I don't know how they recommend attaching and powering on the various devices but I would suggest powering down the tivo (the very sophisticated UNPLUG it!!!). Connect and power up the FAP. Power up the Tivo. I have not looked for the connection storage screen....

Good luck

PS: Rich or others.... I am seeing reference to Firmware/software as 9.2axxxx - my recent upgrade does not have an alphabetic in the release which I thought was appropriate?????)
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Old 11-08-2007, 07:30 PM   #316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by opus472
It's my understanding that the options for upgrading the internal drive are essentially the same for the HD and S3, but the HD requires an approved external drive whereas you have lots more external options with the S3. Is that basically correct?
Yes and no. Currently Series 3’s with the latest software, v9.2.x will accept most eSATA drives using P&P. The TiVo HD will only accept the one approved eSATA drive using P&P.

If you use WinMFS to upgrade the internal drive on either the TiVo HD or Series 3 you can no longer add an eSATA drive via P&P. However there are a few more steps that can be followed during the upgrade process that will allow you to add most eSATA drives to either model. Full directions can be found here:

http://www.mfslive.org
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Old 11-08-2007, 07:33 PM   #317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fred2
PS: Rich or others.... I am seeing reference to Firmware/software as 9.2axxxx - my recent upgrade does not have an alphabetic in the release which I thought was appropriate?????)
So your System Info screen shows 9.2-01-2648, or something of that nature?

There seem to be a couple of recent iterations downloading today. We (and all but one other that I have seen) received 9.2a today. That was an upgrade from v9.2.j. I did see another listed as 9.2a-B1.

Historically any version that included a letter was generally a trial, but according to Pony, this is a final.
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Old 11-08-2007, 07:41 PM   #318
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v9.2.x and eSATA Working

As noted in my post on another thread, we just received v9.2a and everything is working fine. Our eSATA drive continues to be recognized as usual. Phew!
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:16 PM   #319
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Big Grin SpellCheck won't help!

Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams
Thanks for that...but Are you saying that yesterday after an upgrade your System Info screen listed your software version as 9.2a-B1-01-2-648, but today you rebooted and it now reads 9.1a-01-2-648?! Are you sure?

Not doubting you but AFAIK there's never been an occasion for software to go backwards. If so...you're headed for the TiVo Record Book!
nah... i'm an idjit hoo kant tyep...

it went from 9.2a-B1-01-2-648 to 9.2a-01-2-648 (lost the B1)

cheers!
r
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:25 PM   #320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robingo88
nah... i'm an idjit hoo kant tyep...

it went from 9.2a-B1-01-2-648 to 9.2a-01-2-648 (lost the B1)

cheers!
r
Ohhhhh. That makes perfect sense then. Sorry...no place in the record books for you today.



Although Yosemite Sam would be proud...you silly Idjit!
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Old 11-08-2007, 09:08 PM   #321
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I just bought the Antec enclosure, the WD 1 TB drive, and the SIIG cable. I haven't hooked it up to my S3 yet - but the SIIG cable is extremely loose in the Antec, the male connector is just too long for the female end in the Antec, while the supplied eSATA cable fits very snugly. Seems like the opposite problem some people have. It's making me nervous to hook things up.

Any suggestions?
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Old 11-08-2007, 09:36 PM   #322
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Thumbs up S3@9.2a - Antec enclosure with Seagate DB35 750mb

Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams
If you have an eSATA drive connected to your S3 and receive the latest upgrade, v9.2.a, can you please post a quick or if your drive continues to work?
Just received v9.2a and the eSata appears to be functioning same as before the upgrade.

S3@9.2a - Antec enclosure with Seagate DB35 750mb
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Old 11-08-2007, 09:58 PM   #323
richsadams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chazas
I just bought the Antec enclosure, the WD 1 TB drive, and the SIIG cable. I haven't hooked it up to my S3 yet - but the SIIG cable is extremely loose in the Antec, the male connector is just too long for the female end in the Antec, while the supplied eSATA cable fits very snugly. Seems like the opposite problem some people have. It's making me nervous to hook things up.

Any suggestions?
Hmmm...I think this is the first time we've heard that the SIIG cables are loose in any manner.

We're still using the cable that came with the MX-1 and it's been fine. (We have one of the SIIG cables in a drawer JIC.) I haven't seen any complaints about the MX-1 cables for a while now...perhaps they just ran through a bad batch? The complaints started about the time the enclosures became super popular; going on back order. They may have made a deal with the devil to get some more on the street...hard to say. If you just received it the cable might be a very good one. Everything else I've ever gotten from Antec has been first-rate. After they heard about the earlier problems I'd think they would have changed to a better manufacturer.

Me? I'd just use the supplied cable. After setting everything up and married I'd try wiggling the cable around a bit to see if you get the error screen from TiVo. If you do you can always pop the other one in.

Sounds like a sweet setup. Let us know how it goes.
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Old 11-08-2007, 09:59 PM   #324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kohi
Just received v9.2a and the eSata appears to be functioning same as before the upgrade.

S3@9.2a - Antec enclosure with Seagate DB35 750mb
Excellent!
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Old 11-09-2007, 02:24 AM   #325
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Ditto here as well. I have a Series 3 with an upgraded internal 750GB and a MFSLive Tools added 750GB Antec MX-1 eSata and after 9.2a it is still working fine.
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Old 11-09-2007, 05:49 AM   #326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams
Me? I'd just use the supplied cable. After setting everything up and married I'd try wiggling the cable around a bit to see if you get the error screen from TiVo. If you do you can always pop the other one in.

Sounds like a sweet setup. Let us know how it goes.
I did and it seems to be working. The supplied cable is nice and tight; the SIIG connector is both too long and too loose. Very odd.

The only problem I have is noise. The Antec is quite buzzy. I think it's probably the fan, it doesn't sound like the hard drive, the noise is too high-pitched and constant. For now I put it in a cabinet below my TiVo. Is this common?

If not I may try to get buy.com to cross-ship me a new one. I'm assuming TiVo would recognize it as the same drive even if in a different enclosure, true?
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Old 11-09-2007, 08:10 AM   #327
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I woke up this morning to see that the latest TiVo upgrade now officially supports expansion! I never got around to upgrading mine. How are people that had taken on the homegrown workaround faring with the new update? I have all the pieces I just need to hook them up

Thanks!
-Nuttzy
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Old 11-09-2007, 09:59 AM   #328
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The instructions at mfslive.org describe using SATA-to-USB adapters to connect your SATA drives to the PC in order to perform the upgrades.

Is it actually necessary to use such adapters if your SATA drive enclosures also have USB connections? Can you just connect those enclosures directly via USB?

I'm planning to upgrade a new (250GB) Series 3 to a configuration with an internal 1TB drive and an external 1TB drive. From the mfslive instructions it looks like I can do this all in one go, with a single command, if I connect all three drives at the same time. I don't have three SATA-to-USB adapters on hand (only two), but I do have three SATA/USB enclosures.

I expect it's not a big deal because I can just do it in two passes if necessary (upgrade the internal drive first, and then marry the second drive).
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Old 11-09-2007, 10:53 AM   #329
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams
The approved device is the WD My DVR Expander, WDG1S5000. If you have the WDG1SU5000, that is the My Book™ Premium ES Edition and it is not the approved device and will not work via P&P with the TiVo HD. Unfortunately TiVo HD's will recognize any drive that you attach to them, but they will not allow it to work.

As you mentioned, it can be added with the WinMFS program though.
Well, that answered that question! Note to others....make sure you get a "My DVR" and not a "My Book" expansion drive. That one little character in the model number makes a huge difference. It's all good though, I still need an external drive for PC backups, so I'll just go get the "My DVR" one for the Tivo.

Thanks for the help.
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Old 11-09-2007, 11:37 AM   #330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chazas
I did and it seems to be working. The supplied cable is nice and tight; the SIIG connector is both too long and too loose. Very odd.

The only problem I have is noise. The Antec is quite buzzy. I think it's probably the fan, it doesn't sound like the hard drive, the noise is too high-pitched and constant. For now I put it in a cabinet below my TiVo. Is this common?

If not I may try to get buy.com to cross-ship me a new one. I'm assuming TiVo would recognize it as the same drive even if in a different enclosure, true?
IIRC our MX-1 fan was a bit noisy too. I think I remember tapping on it while the drive was out on my desk and it seemed to quiet it down. Maybe it just needed seating or something. It's whisper quiet now and like yours sits in a cabinet, but on a shelf above our S3.

I'm also using the little stand that came with the MX-1 so it sits vertically. I found that if I slide it into the stand and then pull it up just a bit, away from the bottom, that it doesn't transmit any of the drive or fan hum to the shelf...very quiet that way.

The enclosures are transparent to TiVo so no problem if you have to swap it out. Just unplug TiVo first, unplug the eSATA drive, disconnect it, pop your current drive into the new enclosure, connect it to TiVo, power it up and then plug TiVo back in.
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