All other things equal... S3 or TivoHD?

jeffster · 08-31-2007, 10:19 AM

If cost were not an object, which would you buy -- original Series 3 or Tivo HD?

And why?

Would it make a difference if you were FIOS? Cable? Etc.?

20TIL6 · 08-31-2007, 10:49 AM

Removing cost, I'd go with the S3. I have two S3's and one TiVo HD.

Bigger hard drive

OLED display (yeah, not necessary, but it's cool and at a glance I can see what's recording)

The Glo remote, it's nice, and it's a learning remote - I have the TiVo HD hooked up to an HP TV, and I STILL have not figured out the programming of on/off, volume, etc. There are no codes for HP TV's, the learning Glo remote would solve this for me.

and also
THX - not that I have an amazing AV system, I don't. But I think part of the THX cert is that the device has to be bone quiet, and the S3 is. Not that the TiVo HD hard drive is loud. It's no louder than any previous TiVo I've had (couple of SAT-T60's, DTV (Samsung) unit). But the S3 is very nearly silent. If you have both, you would notice the difference.

But that's all if cost were not an object. Otherwise, there is still roughly a $300 difference. If the TiVo HD had been out earlier, I'd have three TiVo HD units instead of two S3's and one HD.

Also, I think I saw that you are coming from DTV. I think I read that in another post. It's not officially advertised, but some here have said that TiVo will still grant the $199 VIP lifetime transfer to a new S3. You just have to ask. It used to be only offered to standalone lifetimes, but I think there was some confusion about lifetimes that people bought for their S1 DTV/TiVo's. I was one of them, and for about a week as the VIP deal was coming to a close, they honored the DTV/TiVo lifetimes. I got in on that, so I know it was true. Anyway, some folks are saying you can still get that, and if so, it might swing you to an S3 over an HD.

classicsat · 08-31-2007, 12:19 PM

Source would make no difference, they both basically work the same way (except the THD having single M-card dual tuner apability right now).

I'd chose the THD, because it has that Vixis (or whatver) media conversion chip in it.

Revolutionary · 08-31-2007, 12:27 PM

Series3.

Bigger native drive and ESATA works now, giving you much, much, much more recording space.

EVizzle · 08-31-2007, 12:38 PM

I was in the same situation, and I chose the S3 because it was more likely to be ready out of the box, with the software updates. If the THD had the same software and could be upgraded with an external HDD, I would have bought that because it has newer hardware.

I am extremely happy with the S3, I would buy a second S3 right now if I had another HDTV.

mike_camden · 08-31-2007, 01:28 PM

If price weren't important -- the S3 because of larger HDD size and OLED. However, since price is important to me, the Tivo HD was the solution I choose.

wmcbrine · 08-31-2007, 09:14 PM

If price were really no object, I'd get both.

The Classic S3 is more featureful today, but the new TivoHD may in the future gain capabilities that the old unit won't. We don't really know yet.

bkdtv · 08-31-2007, 09:24 PM

I would choose the TivoHD if your cable system uses Motorola CableCards.

The current TivoHD software is not fully compatible with Scientific Atlanta CableCards, which results in frequent pixelization. Hence, if your cable system uses Scientific Atlanta hardware, you should buy the Tivo Series3 or wait a few weeks for Tivo to resolve that problem on the TivoHD.

TivoHD Advantages

TivoHD has twice the usable system memory (256MB vs 128MB) and more than three times the memory available to the underlying Linux OS (128Mb vs 42Mb).
Supports MCARDs out of the box.
TivoHD has new hardware for MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 SD->SD and HD->SD transcoding in realtime.
- Could allow HD->SD MRV with older Series2 Tivos
- Could allow TivoToGo and MRV to support content flagged as "copy one generation" (via downres)
- Could allow Tivo to use TivoToGo and MRV to record and stream content for which they cannot obtain Cable Labs approval to pass (via down-res)
- Could allow place-shifting like Slingbox

The Tivo Series3 currently has the advantage with newer software (8.3.x vs 8.1.x) that offers better performance and unofficial eSATA support, but both should be on the same software with the same capabilities (eSATA, etc) within a few months.

jfh3 · 09-01-2007, 02:13 AM

If cost were no object, I'd buy one of each.

(Written by someone who has two of each

)

All kidding aside, unless you really like the front panel OLED and controls, I'd go with the THD box.

Dr_Diablo · 09-01-2007, 06:42 AM

An with the Series 3 you get an "exploding remote" what could be more interesting than that? Wondering if your house has burnt down from the Tivo remote going up in flames...

Think I better up my insurance a few notches...LOL

Adam1115 · 09-01-2007, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Diablo

An with the Series 3 you get an "exploding remote" what could be more interesting than that? Wondering if your house has burnt down from the Tivo remote going up in flames...

Think I better up my insurance a few notches...LOL

Uhm, is your post supposed to make sense?

What remotes are 'exploding' and 'burning down houses'?

Rawson819 · 09-01-2007, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam1115

What remotes are 'exploding'...

I'm guessing the doc is referring to this post:
Glow remote battery explosion

RandyDtg · 09-01-2007, 12:56 PM

I like the S3's display a lot, especially when my big TV is off, I can see what it is recording (unless its a TiVo suggestion), or when I am watching a recording and it starts recording, I can see what its doing without interrupting my show. I'd pay the extra for these features.

jeffster · 09-01-2007, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 20TIL6

Also, I think I saw that you are coming from DTV. I think I read that in another post. It's not officially advertised, but some here have said that TiVo will still grant the $199 VIP lifetime transfer to a new S3. You just have to ask. It used to be only offered to standalone lifetimes, but I think there was some confusion about lifetimes that people bought for their S1 DTV/TiVo's. I was one of them, and for about a week as the VIP deal was coming to a close, they honored the DTV/TiVo lifetimes. I got in on that, so I know it was true. Anyway, some folks are saying you can still get that, and if so, it might swing you to an S3 over an HD.

I am coming out of DTV with 2 HD DTivos and 4 SD DTivos -- maybe they'll do me this one favor...

If so, I'll probably try an S3 and a THD and compare (got 3 HDTVs, so the third will test the std. FIOS HDDVR).

sammydee · 09-01-2007, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkdtv

I would choose the TivoHD if your cable system uses Motorola CableCards.

Yes, exactly. If your cable provider will give you an M-card instead of two S-cards it will save you money on your monthly cable bill. So far it seems only Motorola-based systems have M-cards...and M-cards only work in the HD, not the S3.

...Sam

jfh3 · 09-01-2007, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammydee

So far it seems only Motorola-based systems have M-cards...and M-cards only work in the HD, not the S3.

Not entirely correct.

MCards work fine in an S3, but currently only in single-stream mode.

So until Tivo releases the anticipated software upgrade to allow the MCards to use multi-stream mode, you would need two MCards for full functionality.

hospadam · 09-01-2007, 04:44 PM

I saw someone made the comment about the S3 supporting eSATA.

it was my impression that the TivoHD supported eSATA as well?

Am I wrong? Thanks!

Adam1115 · 09-01-2007, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hospadam

I saw someone made the comment about the S3 supporting eSATA.

it was my impression that the TivoHD supported eSATA as well?

Am I wrong? Thanks!

Yes, the TiVo HD does not support esata at this time.

jfh3 · 09-01-2007, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hospadam

I saw someone made the comment about the S3 supporting eSATA.

it was my impression that the TivoHD supported eSATA as well?

Am I wrong? Thanks!

Tivo doesn't yet officially support eSATA on either box.

The eSATA port works on the Series 3 box with the 8.3 level of code, if you use the Kickstart 62 method.

Official support for eSATA on both boxes is expected later this year.

hospadam · 09-01-2007, 09:43 PM

Can you do the Kickstart 62 method on the Tivo HD though? (Sorry, just want to clarify)

Adam1115 · 09-01-2007, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hospadam

Can you do the Kickstart 62 method on the Tivo HD though? (Sorry, just want to clarify)

No.

Only on the original Series 3.

ZPrime · 09-02-2007, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammydee

So far it seems only Motorola-based systems have M-cards...

This isn't true, IIRC.

I'm on TWC, and I just got a brand new Sci. Atlantic Explorer 8300HDC.

The C stands for cable card, it's one of the newly mandated CC-equipped boxes.

It's a single M-card. I did pull it, and I think it was a Sci. Atl. card. (I didn't take pictures and that was a few weeks ago so I'm not 100% sure.)

I just ordered my THD to replace this thing, it's my first foray into Tivo... We'll see what I get when I call TWC and ask for a single M-card. I have this feeling that even if I get a single card, they'll find a way to charge me the price of two S-cards ($2.50 "per card")

sammydee · 09-02-2007, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZPrime

This isn't true, IIRC.

I'm on TWC, and I just got a brand new Sci. Atlantic Explorer 8300HDC.

I should have said, "I've never heard of a customer in a non-Motorola area receiving an M-card when they ordered a cablecard."

aaronwt · 09-02-2007, 09:03 AM

Without cost being a factor I would definitely pick the Series3. The TiVoHD can't even play back a recording from an analog channel in stereo. I'm keeping my TiVoHD(no choice now) but if I had it over again I would have jumped on the Fathers day deal and purchased a fourth Series 3.

hybucket · 09-02-2007, 09:31 AM

So ..let me see if I understand this....the TiVOHD will play back anything recorded in SD in MONO? No stereo at all??

bkdtv · 09-02-2007, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hybucket

So ..let me see if I understand this....the TiVOHD will play back anything recorded in SD in MONO? No stereo at all??

For analog channels, yes. It plays back in stereo for digital SD channels.

This is a bug that should be fixed soon.

Adam1115 · 09-02-2007, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkdtv

For analog channels, yes. It plays back in stereo for digital SD channels.

This is a bug that should be fixed soon.

Wow, you've got to be kidding me...

I'm so glad I have the original Series 3.

Is STEREO PLAYBACK not something they tested????

I get Dolby Pro-Logic on most analog cable channels. Can't believe that it sends it MONO!

bkdtv · 09-02-2007, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam1115

Wow, you've got to be kidding me...

I'm so glad I have the original Series 3.

Is STEREO PLAYBACK not something they tested????

I get Dolby Pro-Logic on most analog cable channels. Can't believe that it sends it MONO!

I believe the Series3 had the same problem when it was originally released with the 8.0.x software.

jeffster · 09-02-2007, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bkdtv

I believe the Series3 had the same problem when it was originally released with the 8.0.x software.

They ARE looking to merge codebases, right?

jfh3 · 09-02-2007, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffster

They ARE looking to merge codebases, right?

No one outside Tivo can say for sure, but, based on the history of past platform and software releases, I say that's a safe bet.

I would say either:

- There is an 8.3.x release for the Tivo HD, to catch it up with the S2 and S3 levels OR

- All three will catch up at the next point release (8.4 or 8.5 or whatever)

In the meantime, I would expect incremental critical fixes (e.g. the forthcoming SA CableCARD pixelization update) to be released as needed.