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Old 02-03-2008, 04:58 PM   #541
richsadams
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Originally Posted by westtown73 View Post
My problem was solved by replacing the cable going to the THD. The signal strength on the problem channels fluctuated from 0 to no higher than about 60. I put in a call to Comcast. They measured the signal at the bad frequencies at the house and found it was okay. He said they look at the SNR and need to have a value greater than 32. Anyway, he created a cable to replace the Monster Video Mini and the signal strength jumped up to 87 and the SNR is stable 34 or 35. I've had a few brief hits of small tiling since the new cable was put in place but if I wasn't looking for it, Iwouldn't have noticed it.
Good feedback...and not the first time someone has replaced their coax and cleared things up. Sometimes it's the most basic things that help. Thanks for that.
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Old 02-03-2008, 05:55 PM   #542
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I have had this issue since I got my S3 TiVo almost three months ago. As it was happening on the Scientific Atlanta 8300HD I blamed the signal & dealt with Cox.

During this time Cox has been out no less than 10 times, swapped at least 6 sets of Cable Cards and r&r’d all of the cable between the tap & the TVs.

Thursday I had them bring a new Scientific Atlanta 8450HDC to see if it was happening on their box.

I recorded the same shows (Network HD, History, discovery, USA regular def) on the TiVo there is pixilation, on the Scientific Atlanta none.

This lead me to call TiVo, I told them all that has been done, they asked what the signal strength from the tap was in DB, I had no idea as the Cox people are talking about strength in 0-100 terms and I have 95-100. As I want to watch the Superbowl without issues I went to Radioshack & got a signal amp. Without it on the CC diag screen I had 97/35db sn ratio.

I put in the amp and the numbers went down to 80/32 but the pixilation has gone away! I have had it installed since 11am cst and have as yet to see anything but pure wonderful HDTV. I am hoping Cox has a way to reduce the sn so I can get my 40.00 back but if not that’s the solution so far for me.
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Old 02-03-2008, 09:43 PM   #543
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I put in the amp and the numbers went down to 80/32 but the pixilation has gone away! I have had it installed since 11am cst and have as yet to see anything but pure wonderful HDTV. I am hoping Cox has a way to reduce the sn so I can get my 40.00 back but if not that’s the solution so far for me.
That's a very interesting situation because the signal amp you are using is actually attenuating the signal, not amplifying it. (Is it one of those adjustable types?)

$40 is a lot for an attenuator...but if it works who can argue. You might still want to try some basic line attenuators to save some money.

Good info though. Keep us posted!

BTW, comparisons to the cableco DVR's is more-or-less apples and oranges. Cableco DVR's generally use proprietary processors, not cable cards.
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Old 02-03-2008, 09:50 PM   #544
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It is this:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...entPage=search

And there has still been no pixilation.

It actually has a Scientific Atlanta cable card.


Last edited by e30cabrio : 02-03-2008 at 09:56 PM.
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Old 02-04-2008, 12:53 AM   #545
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Thanks for that...one of the newer DVR's. Most cableco's are still issuing Motorola (no cable card) boxes. TiVo made some pretty big gains w/SA cable cards after their fall update, but they still appear to have more trouble with them than the Motorola cable cards for some reason.

I think I have one of the older versions of the Radio Shack "signal amp" and IIRC it didn't help...but that was way before TiVo. Is that an adjustment knob on the side?

I found one of the comments in the customer ratings interesting...

Quote:
Note: This device will not amplify a weak signal or improve a poor reception.(sic)
Seems at odds with what it's supposed to do.

In any case, glad it's working for you and let us know how things go.
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Old 02-04-2008, 08:17 AM   #546
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Per the cable guy it is the latest SA HDDVR & is using the same M card that is available on it's own.

The thing on the side is the wire for the wall wart. I think the people saying it killed signal installed it wrong. It has to have the "filter" looking part at the wall side of the cable and the power injector part at the end or it kills all signal.

Watching HBO HD on 780 I had a bit of minor pixilation. Check the cc diag screen it is at 33, change the cable for an older one, goes down to 31/32 pixilation gone.

Last edited by e30cabrio : 02-04-2008 at 08:31 AM.
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Old 02-04-2008, 10:31 AM   #547
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Per the cable guy it is the latest SA HDDVR & is using the same M card that is available on it's own.

The thing on the side is the wire for the wall wart. I think the people saying it killed signal installed it wrong. It has to have the "filter" looking part at the wall side of the cable and the power injector part at the end or it kills all signal.

Watching HBO HD on 780 I had a bit of minor pixilation. Check the cc diag screen it is at 33, change the cable for an older one, goes down to 31/32 pixilation gone.
Good info, thanks. Minor tiling/pixelation once in a while is to be expected, especially with broadcast HD. It happens with our OTA antenna connected directly to our HD TV. But of course it shouldn't happen all of the time.

Your "fix" may be able to help others with the same issues.
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Old 02-04-2008, 11:28 AM   #548
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Glad to help. I am shocked that the solution is decreasing signal, seems backwards to me.
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Old 02-05-2008, 10:28 PM   #549
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Glad to help. I am shocked that the solution is decreasing signal, seems backwards to me.
Well after replacing my M-Card, things were fine for 3-4 days, but no more.. bad pixelation on hd channels, and i tried the suggestion of reducing the signal, I put 4 splitters in even right near the TivoHD and making sure the signal meter shows good signal strength, I still have pixelation/tiling bad...

Only thing left to do is switch the box out, not sure if that will fix the problem either...
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Old 02-06-2008, 01:49 AM   #550
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Well after replacing my M-Card, things were fine for 3-4 days, but no more.. bad pixelation on hd channels, and i tried the suggestion of reducing the signal, I put 4 splitters in even right near the TivoHD and making sure the signal meter shows good signal strength, I still have pixelation/tiling bad...

Only thing left to do is switch the box out, not sure if that will fix the problem either...
Bummer (technical term). Splitters, particularly good ones, won't necessarily attenuate the signal or do so enough to make a real difference. It might be worthwhile to give some actual attenuators a try. True attenuation will reduce your signal strength and enough of it will kill the signal completely. Otherwise it sounds like you've done what you can do.
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Old 02-06-2008, 07:29 AM   #551
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Well after replacing my M-Card, things were fine for 3-4 days, but no more.. bad pixelation on hd channels, and i tried the suggestion of reducing the signal, I put 4 splitters in even right near the TivoHD and making sure the signal meter shows good signal strength, I still have pixelation/tiling bad...

Only thing left to do is switch the box out, not sure if that will fix the problem either...
I would suggest that you repeat the 'RS uncorrected' test on both tuners and see if the pixelation is limited to only one tuner. If both tuners show the issue then I would expect that it is a signal issue and not the TiVo. Have you done some watching with a cableco box and see if the issue repeats there?
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Old 02-06-2008, 08:38 AM   #552
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I would suggest that you repeat the 'RS uncorrected' test on both tuners and see if the pixelation is limited to only one tuner. If both tuners show the issue then I would expect that it is a signal issue and not the TiVo. Have you done some watching with a cableco box and see if the issue repeats there?
I will check again. Last time I checked it (before replacing mcard) it was limited to one tuner, maybe it was because of the channel since it seems to be certain channels only.

Also I have a Comcast SA 8300HD hddvr, which has no pixelation problems what so ever and they are both connected at the same location and same jack.



Quote:
Originally Posted by richsadams View Post
Bummer (technical term). Splitters, particularly good ones, won't necessarily attenuate the signal or do so enough to make a real difference. It might be worthwhile to give some actual attenuators a try. True attenuation will reduce your signal strength and enough of it will kill the signal completely. Otherwise it sounds like you've done what you can do.
Thanks, can you recommend an attenuator to get?
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:25 AM   #553
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Thanks, can you recommend an attenuator to get?
This thread was started by folks w/FIOS a while back because they seem to have some real problems with signal strength (too strong). Attenuation appears to have helped in a number of cases. Some of it seems to apply to "regular" cable as well.

Here is some of the step-by-step info for using attenuators as well as a link to an inexpensive source:

Quote:
Steps to Fix
1. Order a pack of attenuators. These screw on to the end of the coax.

http://www.smarthome.com/7800.html

2. Find a channel with pixelization.

3. Once you've found a channel with pixelization, open Settings -> System Information -> Diagnostics. With this screen, you can monitor your SNR and number of RS Corrected and RS Uncorrected errors.

Your goal is to completely eliminate the RS Uncorrected errors and the fluctuation in the SNR. A few occasional RS Corrected errors are fine; it is the RS Uncorrected Errors that indicate pixelization.

4. Disconnect the coax cable from the TiVo.

Note the process of disconnecting and reconnecting the coax will result in a lot of RS Uncorrected and RS Corrected errors, but don't worry about that. Only worry about errors that increment after the cable is firmly connected.

5. Most seem to require -10dB to -16dB of new attenuation. Some require as much as -20dB. I would start with -20dB and work your way down.

Screw one -20dB attenuator onto the end of the coax cable. Then reconnect the coax back to the TiVo.

6. Is the problem fixed? Wait 60 seconds. Have the RS Uncorrected errors stopped incrementing on the Diagnostics screen?

7. If not, or you aren't getting a picture, disconnect the coax again and repeat using one -10dB attenuator and one -6dB attenuator.

Is the problem fixed? Wait 60 seconds. Have the RS Uncorrected errors stopped incrementing on the Diagnostics screen?

8. If not, disconnect the coax again and repeat using one -10dB attenuator and one -2dB attenuator.

Is the problem fixed? Wait 60 seconds. Have the RS Uncorrected errors stopped incrementing on the Diagnostics screen?

9. If not, disconnect the coax again and repeat using a single -10dB attenuator.

Is the problem fixed? Wait 60 seconds. Have the RS Uncorrected errors stopped incrementing on the Diagnostics screen?

10. If not, disconnect the coax again and repeat using a single -6dB attenuator.

11. By now, the problem should be fixed.
Based on the various posts, using them has fixed the problems and people swear by them...others not so much and they swear at them.
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Old 02-06-2008, 10:28 AM   #554
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Since my last post I have had (much less) but still pixilation. As the 90 days are up today (on the free replacement) I decided to accept TiVo's offer of a replacement unit as this is not the first issue and I want to be sure I don't have a faulty unit and have to pay 49.99 to replace it after the 90th day.

When the new unit comes (man I really don't want to set up a new unit) I'll post the results.
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Old 02-06-2008, 02:21 PM   #555
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Originally Posted by richsadams View Post
This thread was started by folks w/FIOS a while back because they seem to have some real problems with signal strength (too strong). Attenuation appears to have helped in a number of cases. Some of it seems to apply to "regular" cable as well.

Here is some of the step-by-step info for using attenuators as well as a link to an inexpensive source:

Based on the various posts, using them has fixed the problems and people swear by them...others not so much and they swear at them.
Thanks! I will try this out...
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Old 02-08-2008, 09:16 AM   #556
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Cable Card vs. Hard Drive?

Tivo HD
Purchased a Tivo HD for my bedroom, Tuner never worked, tried 3 different M cards. No video signal just a grey screen whether cable cards were in or out. I was however able to transfer content from my Living Room Series 3 and watch it in the Bedroom. After 3 visits with Time Warner Cable, decided to replace Tivo HD unit. Tivo is sending out a new unit and waiving the shipping (which took some haggling since I was over 30 days,) not exactly an act of largesse on their part considering it never worked.

Series 3
Just over a year old, started randomly rebooting a week ago, oddly enough shortly after I added the Tivo HD to my network. When I was able to re-boot the Series 3, I would encounter problems whenever tuned to a HD Channel. I would have the screen freeze randomly, then start again, and eventually freeze up and the box would become unresponsive to the remote. Had cable rep check signal strength and everything seemed fine. Having another tech call today to replace the 2 S-cards. I have a sneaky suspicion it is the Tivo Series 3 unit and not the cable cards. Itís over a year old and off the warranty, things could get ugly on the Tivo hotline.

I also have a cable box on my system and encounter no problems with tuning HD channels. I think signal strength is the least likely culprit. I think it is a battle between the Series 3 Hard Drive and the Cable Cards. I am open to any suggestions from the Tivo Community.
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Old 02-08-2008, 09:37 PM   #557
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I got the replacement today, set it up it has 37DB & 95-100 signal & 0 RS Uncorrected & 0 Corrected errors on the same channels that had errors spinning like the electricity meter during the Super Bowl.

No pixilation. Apparently the old unit had issues.
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Old 02-09-2008, 12:43 AM   #558
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I got the replacement today, set it up it has 37DB & 95-100 signal & 0 RS Uncorrected & 0 Corrected errors on the same channels that had errors spinning like the electricity meter during the Super Bowl.

No pixilation. Apparently the old unit had issues.
Thanks for the update...and glad to hear the new one is behaving!
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Old 02-13-2008, 04:08 PM   #559
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Pixilation and Cable Cards

I have had the TIVO HD for about 7 weeks with 2 cable cards and have had two ongoing problems-one involved a gray screen for channels 23 and above (occurring about every 2 weeks) and the second pixilation but only the last 2 weeks.

It just so happened that my cable provider sent out a letter on quality of image, promising a free on-site visit and so I made an appointment.

A tech spent 4 hours upgrading cabling and connections which generally improved images on my non-TIVO TV's but the pixillation continued (strangely enough only on a few channels but not the high def ones). The signal was coming in strong and clear according to his meter.

He then proceeded to change the cable cards and the pixilation disappeared.

Three days later I lost all channels above 22 (about the third time) and callerd TIVO. Their response was not too comforting. The claimed the problem was the NDS cable cards which has "issues" with TIVO's which are being worked out. There was no time estimation when this would be completed.

I then called Cablevision and their "Cable card expert" seemed to know exactly what the problem was and it was resolved in 5 minutes. I have no way of knowing how accurate his assessment was but this is what he said which appeared reasonable to me.

He stated the real problem was between TIVO and the cablecards in how they communicate. It appears that when TIVO sends out updates to my box the cards often have problems causing pixilation and the gray screen. The solution (which worked for me) was to reset the system and then have Cablevision "refresh" the cards and now they are back to communicating.

This means that until TIVO resolves the issues with Cablevisions NDS cable cards I will have to do this every couple of weeks.

It appears that the Cablevision tech is more knowledgeable on this issue than the TIVO techs.

John
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Old 02-14-2008, 08:16 AM   #560
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Pixilation and Cablecards

This is an update to the previous post by me. Several days later pixilation is back but only on 2 channels. Of course TIVO support had no answer and this time I called corporate offices in California to file a complaint about the uselessness of their support. I spoke to an individual who was sympathetic, stated that there are known problems between TIVO HD's and cable cards, especially NDS and promised to speak to a very high level engineer and get back to me.

He stated it might also be a hardware issue as we have a second TIVO HD in the house which doesn't seem to have the same problems despite using Cablevision's NDS cards.

John
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Old 02-14-2008, 03:11 PM   #561
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Pixelation update

Update from me as well...

Purchased the attenuators that were recommended earlier, added a 6db,3db,10db and got my SNR down to 31db-33db levels..

Pixelation has gone away so far, but there is still quite a few of uncorrected and correct errors in the diagnostics... I have gone ahead and ordered another TivoHD replacement anyway, I've had other issues with the box so it can't hurt to just swap out the unit, will update once I get the new unit tomorrow.
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Old 02-15-2008, 03:09 AM   #562
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Pixilation and Cablecards

Second update. Dave from Tivo called in response to my call to corporate and he had me go through all sorts of diagnostics on the "bad" channels. You can actually see signal loss every few minutes with one cable card worse than the other. According to Dave this is a known problem with NDS cards. We repeated the diagnostics with the second box which has no pixilation problem and sure enough the card diagnostics showed a steady signal for the same channels.

The second TIVO is much further away from the source coming into the house and Dave thought that it is getting a slightly weaker signal which sometimes helps. He recommended getting an attenuator to weaken the signal to my first box. He suggested that I swap boxes but my daughter is paranoid that the result will ruin her picture.

Tivo, according to Dave, is working with Cablevision and NDS on the card problem and hope to have a solution in the near future. I will report back on the results with the attenuators.

John
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Old 02-16-2008, 09:12 AM   #563
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Replaced both units from Tivo. Both working fine. Bad Tuner on Tivo HD, and I think I had a bad hard drive on the Series 3.
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Old 02-16-2008, 09:38 AM   #564
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I think I've finally cleared up my pixelation, after 2 months of trying. What seems to have done the trick was Cox putting a signal equalizer/tilt compensator on the line (this levels out the signal on all frequencies). Then I replaced one last piece of older (though RG-6) coax, and finally I attenuated down -3db. My problem channel still shows higher-than-normal corrected errors if I leave it on for a number of hours, but no uncorrected errors. My feeling is there is some problem with the signal -- maybe higher than normal bit errors or something -- and the imperfect cabling, too hot a signal, too much signal from lower-frequency channels, plus the mere existence of cable cards was enough to turn this into pixelation on that channel. There's probably still a problem on the channel, but it's not enough to cause significant pixelation anymore.

Too bad I'm still having other serious problems with the Tivo, like inexplicably missing channels...
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Old 02-18-2008, 09:01 AM   #565
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Channel Bits?

I too am having pixelation troubles with Verizon FIOS. I have a question I have not seen anybody touch on. I have two TiVos. One Series 3, one HD. The Series 3 works perfect, hardly ever seen a corrected packet and never a an uncorrected one. While the HD has all kinds of issues and many channels are only useable only after 24db of attenuatuation. Believe me all things are equal between the units from a signal standpoint as I have swapped cable cards / cables / splitters everyway possible and the results are the same.

The one thing that I find different between the two is the Series 3 shows Channel Bits: 30750 in the diagnostics screen, while the HD unit shows 30746. What does this number mean? Could this be the cause of my problems?
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:14 AM   #566
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I too am having pixelation troubles with Verizon FIOS. I have a question I have not seen anybody touch on. I have two TiVos. One Series 3, one HD. The Series 3 works perfect, hardly ever seen a corrected packet and never a an uncorrected one. While the HD has all kinds of issues and many channels are only useable only after 24db of attenuatuation. Believe me all things are equal between the units from a signal standpoint as I have swapped cable cards / cables / splitters everyway possible and the results are the same.

The one thing that I find different between the two is the Series 3 shows Channel Bits: 30750 in the diagnostics screen, while the HD unit shows 30746. What does this number mean? Could this be the cause of my problems?

I get the same "30750" on my tivoHD. All we can do is speculate, don't expect any Tivo people who read this board to respond with the truth.

It is MO that they made an executive decision to deny the problem is theirs. It is probably a hardware deficiency that cannot be corrected by the software. You will probably see the next generation (s4?) have different tuner circuitry or a new rev of the present s3 with the circuitry fixed. Either way they will never admit the error. If they did they would have to replace every S3 and HD out there, which they are too cheap to do, or more realistically will tip them into chap. 11.
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Old 02-18-2008, 02:28 PM   #567
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I get the same "30750" on my tivoHD.
Are you saying that you have 30750 and you have problems? My unit that shows that number has ZERO problems.
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Old 02-18-2008, 04:36 PM   #568
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Are you saying that you have 30750 and you have problems? My unit that shows that number has ZERO problems.
ah, my mistake. I meant the other number
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Old 02-18-2008, 06:40 PM   #569
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ah, my mistake. I meant the other number
Ok then, maybe we are onto something here. What channel bits do others have that are having the problem? For that matter how about any of you that are not having problems, what number do you show?

So far this is the count

30746 - two units WITH problems
30750 - one unit and NO problems
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Old 02-18-2008, 06:58 PM   #570
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Ok then, maybe we are onto something here. What channel bits do others have that are having the problem? For that matter how about any of you that are not having problems, what number do you show?

So far this is the count

30746 - two units WITH problems
30750 - one unit and NO problems
30750 and no problems (S3).
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