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Old 09-24-2007, 05:55 PM   #1
nikkicola11
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Static between screens on TivoHD

I searched all of the forums and I didn't see any other posts on this issue. For some reason when switching from live tv to Tivo Central or between menus within tivo central, there is about 1 second of static between screens, the picture is otherwise fine, and it's not really a big problem....just annoying. Any thoughts?
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Old 09-24-2007, 06:11 PM   #2
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Mine does the same thing between TV and the menu. For me it happens when the resolution in below the 720p that the menu is in. As for within the menu you got me there.
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Old 09-24-2007, 10:54 PM   #3
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It happens when you switch resolutions depending on the TV. My TVs just turn blue screen or black screen so I don't see any static. If you leave it on one resolution for output you also won't have the problem.
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Old 09-24-2007, 11:52 PM   #4
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If you set the Tivo's output to 720p fixed or 1080i fixed under Settings -> Video, you'll avoid those resyncs.
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Old 09-25-2007, 01:07 AM   #5
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To explain a bit more - all the TiVo HD menus are 720p. So if you jump from the menus to a show that is 480i or 1080i your TV has to re-sync to the new resolution. And again when you return to the menus. Some TVs handle this faster than others, and some do it more cleanly that others.
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Old 09-25-2007, 04:19 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megazone
To explain a bit more - all the TiVo HD menus are 720p. So if you jump from the menus to a show that is 480i or 1080i your TV has to re-sync to the new resolution. And again when you return to the menus. Some TVs handle this faster than others, and some do it more cleanly that others.
Are you sure the menus are always 720p? I was having this re-synch problem big time (Mits DLP) until I switched to 1080i Fixed. Now I don't ever see the problem, not even when going to menus. Made me think that the menus were 1080i also. I can't check right now, my Mits bulb died and I'm waiting for UPS.
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Old 09-25-2007, 07:21 AM   #7
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Menus are 720P for all my boxes when I have it set for Native mode.
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Old 09-25-2007, 08:22 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megazone
To explain a bit more - all the TiVo HD menus are 720p. So if you jump from the menus to a show that is 480i or 1080i your TV has to re-sync to the new resolution. And again when you return to the menus. Some TVs handle this faster than others, and some do it more cleanly that others.
So this is a TV issue? When I experienced this, I assumed that the TiVo itself created the static because it had to change its output resolution. I don't have different HDTVs to test this on, though. Makes sense, I guess.
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Old 09-25-2007, 08:41 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrm01
Are you sure the menus are always 720p? I was having this re-synch problem big time (Mits DLP) until I switched to 1080i Fixed. Now I don't ever see the problem, not even when going to menus. Made me think that the menus were 1080i also. I can't check right now, my Mits bulb died and I'm waiting for UPS.
The menus are 720p, but they are converted to 1080i when you choose 1080i fixed.

You should not see the resyncing in any fixed mode on the Tivo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kosherbacon
So this is a TV issue? When I experienced this, I assumed that the TiVo itself created the static because it had to change its output resolution. I don't have different HDTVs to test this on, though. Makes sense, I guess.
Yes, the static is created by the TV. Some displays switch in 0.5s with no static, others switch in 4.0+s with static. It varies by make and model of TV.
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Old 09-25-2007, 08:43 AM   #10
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If it really bugs you, change the video output mode to something fixed and let the Tivo HD scale it. You will eliminate the "static", but then you will be relying on the scaling of the THD and not your TV.
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Old 09-25-2007, 07:24 PM   #11
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Ok...I have it set to "Native" since I have a Sony HD that supports all formats. What would be the downside to having it set to 1080i fixed? Does it make the stuff coming in lower appear bad?
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Old 09-25-2007, 07:27 PM   #12
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All content is scaled to your display's resolution in the end. If you have a 1080p TV the question is - is the scaling done on the TV or the TiVo. The scaler in the TiVo is pretty good, so most people won't notice a difference. But if your TV has a really good scaler than lower resolution content may look better scaled by the TV than by the TiVo.

Personally I didn't notice a real difference and I switched from Native to 1080i once the transitional flickers got to me.
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Old 09-26-2007, 11:24 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megazone
All content is scaled to your display's resolution in the end. If you have a 1080p TV the question is - is the scaling done on the TV or the TiVo. The scaler in the TiVo is pretty good, so most people won't notice a difference. But if your TV has a really good scaler than lower resolution content may look better scaled by the TV than by the TiVo.

Personally I didn't notice a real difference and I switched from Native to 1080i once the transitional flickers got to me.
So you switched to 1080i fiixed? I have left it at native figuring the standard def would look lousy. The flicker makes my wife nuts. I have a 46" Bravia (1080P). Any suggestions??
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Old 09-26-2007, 11:58 AM   #14
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Set it to 1080i fixed and forget it.

Like MZ said, SD is getting scaled anyways, so you may as well let the Tivo do it and not have the hassle.
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Old 09-26-2007, 03:24 PM   #15
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V9.1 does give static audio noise not picture problem about 1/2 second between screens and I have it set on 1080i fixed, never happened on V8.3 on my TiVo series 3. I can live with it as it is but it should get fixed.
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Old 09-26-2007, 05:06 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clcbmason
So you switched to 1080i fiixed? I have left it at native figuring the standard def would look lousy. The flicker makes my wife nuts. I have a 46" Bravia (1080P). Any suggestions??
You and the OP need to switch-away from "Native" mode, which as has been described already causes the Tivo to switch its output according to the Menu, or the Station/broadcast.

My Sony is a 1366x768, and while in theory you might think 720p would be the way to go, it has to scale EVERYTHING anyway to 768, and I've found after much testing that fixed 1080i into this set is the bee's knees.

For your 1080p set too, go with 1080i fixed-out from the Tivo.
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Old 09-27-2007, 08:46 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megazone
To explain a bit more - all the TiVo HD menus are 720p. So if you jump from the menus to a show that is 480i or 1080i your TV has to re-sync to the new resolution. And again when you return to the menus. Some TVs handle this faster than others, and some do it more cleanly that others.
There are some menus that are still 480i, are there not? Like if you go into "Download TV Shows and Movies" and similar? Mine switches resolutions going into those.

EDIT TO ADD: Just read more closely (duh). I'm on a Series3. Has this been updated (read: corrected) for TiVoHD?
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Old 09-27-2007, 09:41 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knarf829
There are some menus that are still 480i, are there not? Like if you go into "Download TV Shows and Movies" and similar? Mine switches resolutions going into those.
Well, kinda, those are HME apps not part of the native menus and the official HME toolkit is still 480i. But there are ways to do HD in HME - as various 3rd party apps and TiVo's own HD Photos app have shown.
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Old 10-27-2007, 06:50 PM   #19
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I am fairly sure these "transitional flickers" are caused by the TiVo, not the TV.

My TV is set to Native. I am using HDMI.

During the transition to a channel with a different format , I can see program information for the channel I am changing to. The program information's size and location is changed, but it is still readable if you can read fast. In this distorted information panel I see the current format in the distorted information panel, and then the screen goes black, then I get the channel I switched to. When I press the info button, I see the correct format in the information panel.

What seems to be happening is this; I am watching 1080i, I switch to a 480i channel. The TiVo sends the 480i channel to the TV with a switch indicating it is 1080i. The TV chokes on this. The TiVo then sends the 480i channel with the switch indicating it is 480i. The TV is now happy.

So for that brief moment, TiVo is sending the wrong format switch, screwing up the TV.
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Old 10-27-2007, 07:16 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by snash22
I am fairly sure these "transitional flickers" are caused by the TiVo, not the TV.

My TV is set to Native. I am using HDMI.
Any delay caused by the Tivo is only a fraction of a second. Maybe 1/5th of a second?

We know this because some people with high-priced video processors can change from one format to another on their Tivo in about 0.5s. In contrast, some TVs require as long as six seconds to change resolutions.
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Old 10-27-2007, 10:09 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snash22
I am fairly sure these "transitional flickers" are caused by the TiVo, not the TV.

My TV is set to Native. I am using HDMI.

During the transition to a channel with a different format , I can see program information for the channel I am changing to. The program information's size and location is changed, but it is still readable if you can read fast. In this distorted information panel I see the current format in the distorted information panel, and then the screen goes black, then I get the channel I switched to. When I press the info button, I see the correct format in the information panel.

What seems to be happening is this; I am watching 1080i, I switch to a 480i channel. The TiVo sends the 480i channel to the TV with a switch indicating it is 1080i. The TV chokes on this. The TiVo then sends the 480i channel with the switch indicating it is 480i. The TV is now happy.

So for that brief moment, TiVo is sending the wrong format switch, screwing up the TV.
This has more to do with HDCP and HDMI. I see it on every device with HDMI and HDCP when switching resolutions in NAtive mode.
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Old 10-27-2007, 11:29 PM   #22
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"...some people with high-priced video processors can change from one format to another on their Tivo in about 0.5s."
Interesting, I didn't realize that some TVs switch formats fairly quickly.

The TiVo definitely seems to be sending a bad signal first though. Perhaps some TVs handle the momentary bad signal better than others?
"I see it on every device with HDMI and HDCP when switching resolutions in NAtive mode."
But don't you understand that if this is not a TiVo problem it won't get fixed?
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Old 10-28-2007, 08:12 AM   #23
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TVs handle this change in a different way. My Samsung set shows a Blue screen do that shows up for 1 to 2 seconds, My Westinghouse shows staic and my Toshiba shows a black screen.
But even with my $3500 video processor it is not instant when switching resolutions.
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Old 10-28-2007, 08:30 AM   #24
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I've just noticed this with the last update. Is it worse for 9.2?

Al
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Old 10-28-2007, 10:56 AM   #25
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OK, I just tested this with component, rather than HDMI, it still happens!

So there may be 2 separate issues:

1. TiVo momentarily sends a bad format switch to the TV, some TVs chokes on it.

2. HDMI handshake may be slow on some TVs.
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Old 10-28-2007, 11:12 AM   #26
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I'm using component (through my a/v receiver). I had the problem with TiVo set to Native. I switched it to 1080i fixed and the problem seems to be gone. (BTW I use the component so that I can run the composite through a modulator that feeds the other TVs in the house. If I plugged in the HDMI it turns the composite off.)
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Old 10-28-2007, 11:49 AM   #27
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david4788 - What TV do you have? I have a Sony KDS-60A2000.

When it is in Native format and you switch from a 1080i channel to a 480i channel, do you get a distorted screen for a moment where the information panel momentarily says 1080i?
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Old 10-28-2007, 11:52 AM   #28
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For the record - I have version 9.1. I don't know if the problem was occurring when I was at the earlier version for other, unrelated reasons.
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Old 10-28-2007, 01:13 PM   #29
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I have a 50" LG Plasma that I got in 2005. No distortion now at all.
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Old 10-28-2007, 01:42 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt
TVs handle this change in a different way. My Samsung set shows a Blue screen do that shows up for 1 to 2 seconds, My Westinghouse shows staic and my Toshiba shows a black screen.
But even with my $3500 video processor it is not instant when switching resolutions.
There's also the time associated with tuner channel changes on the TiVo, which should not be confused with resolution switching delays.

It takes ~2 seconds for the TiVoHD's tuner to change to a new digital channel with the same resolution, and at least ~1 second to swap tuners.
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