Has SDV affected your S3 enthusiasm?

FlippedBit · 02-08-2007, 12:39 PM

How has your knowledge of SDV affected your enthusiasm about the S3?

The first four options assume that SDV will be employed by the cable company your S3 is/will be hooked up to.

Select the fourth option if you became aware of SDV after you bought your S3 and are still happy with your S3 purchase. (If I could edit the poll wording I would)

The fifth option is for those that use OTA only or whose cable company is not going to implement SDV.

nhaigh · 02-08-2007, 12:44 PM

Not in the slightest.

My undersatnding is SDV is a resource sharing technology that really only suits obscure and seldom watched channels. Also the cable companies are not going to make their existing technology STB's etc redundant overnight.

If we do see SDV I don't expect to see it on the current lineup of most watched channels. If all the channels are all watched all the time SDV given no benefit.

ah30k · 02-08-2007, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhaigh

My undersatnding is SDV is a resource sharing technology that really only suits obscure and seldom watched channels.

Does having your head in the sand bother your neck? It has already been posted that significant portions of the digital lineup have already gone SDV.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhaigh

Also the cable companies are not going to make their existing technology STB's etc redundant overnight.

In fact, overnight the cable companies can spin out a new version of the guide app and 'presto' the whole footprint of STBs are SDV capable.

FlippedBit · 02-08-2007, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhaigh

Not in the slightest.

My undersatnding is SDV is a resource sharing technology that really only suits obscure and seldom watched channels. Also the cable companies are not going to make their existing technology STB's etc redundant overnight.

If we do see SDV I don't expect to see it on the current lineup of most watched channels. If all the channels are all watched all the time SDV given no benefit.

When I first learned about SDV I had the same thoughts as you. However, as I have learned more about what is really happening or what is really planned, I have concluded that my S3 with Comcast cable probably will not be satisfactory after SDV is rolled out.

fred_e_fender · 02-08-2007, 01:06 PM

I'm fortunate enough to be on a Comcast "triple play" promotion through this December. Part of that deal was free DVR for a year, since I was coming from Directv.

I just bought an S3 to replace my 2nd Comcast DVR in the bedroom, so I now have one of each. (And the $ savings with the S3 vs the 2nd Comcast box will pay for the lifetime transfer fee in about 18 months.)

I'll keep an eye on SDV developments, and re-evaluate in December when my promo pricing expires. (FIOS may be here by then as well.) I'm figuring that even if I decide I have to sell the S3, it will still fetch a pretty good price with lifetime attached to it.

Sirius Black · 02-08-2007, 01:10 PM

I voted that I wouldn't have bought an S3 if I'd known. I don't think I'm upset enough at this point to box the thing up and ship it back to Amazon (it's been less than a week and I haven't even activated it yet) but if come June Bright House does this SDV thing in Pinellas County, I suppose I'll look into switching to Knoledgy or FIOS.

Edit: I'm hoping that my apartment complex can get or is getting fios at all. More research to do.

ah30k · 02-08-2007, 01:11 PM

Yes, FIOS remains a good alternative for many of us. Hopefully my neighborhood will be lit up with FIOS in the very near future. They are already in surrounding neighborhoods.

FIOS may go SDV in the future but they have bigger fish to fry at the moment.

kjmcdonald · 02-08-2007, 01:32 PM

I voted for 'Was aware and bought anyway.'

But, if it wasn't for SDV, I would have bought 2 S3's, and maybe even 3.
I'm willing to take the risk on 1. Not on more.

-Kyle

20TIL6 · 02-08-2007, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlippedBit

How has your knowledge of SDV affected your enthusiasm about the S3?

The first four options assume that SDV will be employed by the cable company your S3 is/will be hooked up to.

The fifth option is for those that use OTA only or whose cable company is not going to implement SDV.

I knew about it beforehand, and I am not skeeered.

If TWC, which is becoming Comcast, in Houston implements SDV to the point that it negatively impacts my consumption of content using my S3 units, I'll simply shop for a different carrier. So far, I have not heard anything regarding SDV affecting Houston.

I will always have options. Maybe FiOS will enter my area, maybe AT&T will lay fiber and offer S3 compatibility like FiOS. Maybe the Amazon/TiVo deal will fill in the void and I can buy cable content ala carte (and spend even less!).

Maybe, and most likely, I will add some sort of peripheral to my S3 to handle SDV signaling requirements. Maybe, since TiVo is getting cozy with cable, a software update will be applied so that upstream signaling can go out the ethernet interface to a cable company web service, that in turn manipulates the downstream bits.

All I am saying is that if you want to worry, you can, but it's wasted time. I don't think TiVo, nor the cable companies will allow the S3 to be orphaned. Especially since I think cable just gained a lot of DTV defections through the S3. Oh yeah, and DTV MPEG4 is going to obsolete HR10-250 units, yet there is still high demand for those.

So before cable does something to negatively impact a paying customer, you can be sure they will cover their bases to minimize things and keep that customer. Especially today since content is becoming available across more and more pipes other than their own.

GoHokies! · 02-08-2007, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 20TIL6

I knew about it beforehand, and I am not skeeered.

If TWC, which is becoming Comcast, in Houston implements SDV to the point that it negatively impacts my consumption of content using my S3 units, I'll simply shop for a different carrier. So far, I have not heard anything regarding SDV affecting Houston.

I will always have options. Maybe FiOS will enter my area, maybe AT&T will lay fiber and offer S3 compatibility like FiOS. Maybe the Amazon/TiVo deal will fill in the void and I can buy cable content ala carte (and spend even less!).

Maybe, and most likely, I will add some sort of peripheral to my S3 to handle SDV signaling requirements. Maybe, since TiVo is getting cozy with cable, a software update will be applied so that upstream signaling can go out the ethernet interface to a cable company web service, that in turn manipulates the downstream bits.

All I am saying is that if you want to worry, you can, but it's wasted time. I don't think TiVo, nor the cable companies will allow the S3 to be orphaned. Especially since I think cable just gained a lot of DTV defections through the S3. Oh yeah, and DTV MPEG4 is going to obsolete HR10-250 units, yet there is still high demand for those.

So before cable does something to negatively impact a paying customer, you can be sure they will cover their bases to minimize things and keep that customer. Especially today since content is becoming available across more and more pipes other than their own.

That was surprisingly lucid and well thought out - almost too high a quality to be posted on a web forum.

I agree with you completely. I'm not happy about it, but we'll just have to wait and see where the road takes us.

20TIL6 · 02-08-2007, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoHokies!

That was surprisingly lucid and well thought out - almost too high a quality to be posted on a web forum.

I agree with you completely. I'm not happy about it, but we'll just have to wait and see where the road takes us.

Thanks, I remembered to take my medication today.

davecramer74 · 02-08-2007, 01:42 PM

i voted wont buy one now. Mainly, i dont have an alternative to cable besides IPTV, satellite or OTA. I am moving and have decided to go with the Dish Network and their HD DVR getup. Mainly, because its free now. If the S3 was more in the 299 price range, id definately consider it for OTA to record my locals and save space on my satelite one.

ewilts · 02-08-2007, 02:35 PM

There should be another poll option: I wasn't aware of SDV, bought an S3, and am I now very disappointed. I'm definitely in this category - even though I've had a Series 1, and Series 2, and then a Series 3, I didn't hear about SDV until just recently - a couple of months after buying my S3. At no time during the buying cycle was I aware that Comcast could make my S3 a paperweight.

.../Ed

pmiranda · 02-08-2007, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 20TIL6

I will always have options. Maybe FiOS will enter my area, maybe AT&T will lay fiber and offer S3 compatibility like FiOS. Maybe the Amazon/TiVo deal will fill in the void and I can buy cable content ala carte (and spend even less!).

Maybe, and most likely, I will add some sort of peripheral to my S3 to handle SDV signaling requirements. Maybe, since TiVo is getting cozy with cable, a software update will be applied so that upstream signaling can go out the ethernet interface to a cable company web service, that in turn manipulates the downstream bits.

If the Amazon thing is HD, that might fill in some of the void, but I'd need my Speed channel to really fix this. I wouldn't count on AT&T laying any fiber... they came by my house a week ago and were selling bundles with Dish... F that madness.

For SDV to really work with cable, the TiVo would have to ask (via ethernet) the headend to send a new channel map to YOUR cablecard. I'm not sure if it's possible to address a channel map that specifically.
Or they'd always have to use the same channel mappings for switched channels, which wouldn't save them any bandwidth in the last mile, and would make it a pain/impractical to deploy SDV throughout the system.

For now, I have my old TiVo controlling a cableco set-top for the switched channels, and I just don't watch the two switched HD channels they added in my area.

tivotivotivo · 02-08-2007, 02:50 PM

I'm going with Time Warner Cable first then if things get out of hand (i hope) Verizon will have rolled out FIOS in my area so I will have the choice to jump.

pmiranda · 02-08-2007, 03:05 PM

Why would FiOS help? As far as I can tell, it isn't cablecard compatible. [edit: oops, it is, but you can't tell from the verizon website.]
Verizon thread

FlippedBit · 02-08-2007, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ewilts

There should be another poll option: I wasn't aware of SDV, bought an S3, and am I now very disappointed. I'm definitely in this category - even though I've had a Series 1, and Series 2, and then a Series 3, I didn't hear about SDV until just recently - a couple of months after buying my S3. At no time during the buying cycle was I aware that Comcast could make my S3 a paperweight.

.../Ed

Your situation falls into the second option.

nhaigh · 02-08-2007, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ah30k

Does having your head in the sand bother your neck?

Trying not to feel insulted....

Quote:

Originally Posted by ah30k

It has already been posted that significant portions of the digital lineup have already gone SDV.

So far I haven't seen any reference to any of the Major channels, NBC, CBS etc or the Main premium channels. I've seen Starz Comedy, PPV, Sports subscriptions etc but nothing that is really worrying. Universal HD, and A&E HD are ones I don't have at the moment and would like but it only accounts for small quantity of programming that interests me. Even if I had that quantity of SDV I'd still have bought the S3.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ah30k

In fact, overnight the cable companies can spin out a new version of the guide app and 'presto' the whole footprint of STBs are SDV capable.

True as that may be, unless I misunderstand completely how this technology works, there is little chance it will be the mainstream channels. They can probably move 100 channels off my current package and I'd not even notice they had done it.

Lastly, as mentioned here, I still have options - OTA and FIOS. In fact I'm pretty sure when FIOS finally arrives in my street I'll migrate to that anyway.

I don't feel I have my head in the sand, I just feel I haven't seen a compelling argument so dissuade me from buying an S3 given my viewing habits. In fact I'll go further and say if MRV gets enabled I'll buy another for the bedroom.

RFEngineer · 02-08-2007, 03:24 PM

I was pretty excited about the prospect of the S3, and (im)patiently awaited availability of the device. Once they were available I grabbed a "virgin" image off a P-to-P network and started pricing larger drives for it

Then I read that Comcast execs declared that their next 50 HD offerings would be utilizing SDV on the cable. My tastes tend to run counter to the mainstream, so I am pretty sure that a sizeable portion of the viewing I desire would be included in the selection of channels destined for switching.

Not only would I be disappointed with the inability to record 50+ HD channels becoming available over the next year or so, but more importantly I have absolutely no desire to explain to my wife why "we can't record that show" on a box I spent $860 to purchase and "lifetime".

It was a deal-breaker for me.

I now have the Motorola 3416(III) and it has been fault-free since October when I picked it up. I've experienced exactly zero of the issues others have attributed to it.

Even with the significantly smaller drive, it has been quite satisfactory -- as my 300hr+ S1 still keeps chugging along with the standard-def duty, leaving the 3416's capacity dedicated entirely to HD content.

In summary:
No $860 up-front cost
No channels lost to SDV
Still have 300 hours of SD + 25 hours of HD capacity

Bummed I didn't get one? Sure.
Will I be REALLY bummed after SDV gets deployed? Nope.

Sirius Black · 02-08-2007, 03:30 PM

I don't understand how someone who owns an S3 can say SDV will not affect them. It will affect all of us (S3 owners) in some way. While I'm in the boat that won't miss the removal of WE and Lifetime from the overall channel lineup, I will miss being able to watch Firefly and Battlestar Galactica in HD (Universal HD) and all the other channels that are added as a result of SDV.

I also don't understand how someone who owns an S3 can say they don't care (essentially this is option 3). I would certainly care that the channels I pay for whether I watch them or not are still being charged to me and are now unavailable to me but still part of my bill. I can pretty much confine my TV viewing to about 10 of the 150+ channels that digital cable receives, not including the big four. That isn't reflected in my bill however. I'm charged for WE and Lifetime just the same.

The cable company has no reason to change their current billing scheme because the whole reason (as far as I can tell) they are going to SDV is to cut costs and cut out 3rd party DVRs. One would think that those costs being cut would be passed on to consumers as lower bills but that won't be the case. In fact the opposite is likely to happen because SDV will be marketed as a new feature.

So now not only will I be paying for channels I can't receive, I'll likely be paying more for them.

I'm hoping that the FCC can put some pressure on the cable companies to keep all of this open and avoid the mess completely.

pkscout · 02-08-2007, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhaigh

So far I haven't seen any reference to any of the Major channels, NBC, CBS etc or the Main premium channels. I've seen Starz Comedy, PPV, Sports subscriptions etc but nothing that is really worrying. Universal HD, and A&E HD are ones I don't have at the moment and would like but it only accounts for small quantity of programming that interests me. Even if I had that quantity of SDV I'd still have bought the S3.

Time Warner Cable in North Carolina will be putting all digital simulcast of the basic and standard channels on SDV. In the short term that means that the S3 can't get digital versions of the analog channels. If and when TWC decides to turn off analog channels, that would mean the S3 could get no channel below 99. When it happens, that would be a big impact.

pkscout · 02-08-2007, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirius Black

I don't understand how someone who owns an S3 can say SDV will not affect them. It will affect all of us (S3 owners) in some way. While I'm in the boat that won't miss the removal of WE and Lifetime from the overall channel lineup, I will miss being able to watch Firefly and Battlestar Galactica in HD (Universal HD) and all the other channels that are added as a result of SDV.

While this would be a small group, there are folks who only need the S3 to record OTA HD from an antenna. What the cable company does is of absolutely no concern to those folks.

As for the FCC, the reasonable course would be to prevent cable companies from moving any existing channels to SDV until the standard is complete and published and CE companies are given some time to bring competing devices to market.

Of course in the current climate, there can be no reasonable discourse or action, so folks may as well lawyer up and ensure that the attorneys at least get something out of all this.

ashu · 02-08-2007, 04:03 PM

What 20TIL6 said

DeathRider · 02-08-2007, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirius Black

I will miss being able to watch Firefly and Battlestar Galactica in HD (Universal HD) and all the other channels that are added as a result of SDV.

I can see BSG, but there are only 14 Firefly episodes

- and if I remember correctly, there wasn't enough $$$ made with Serenity to make a sequel feasible

tivotivotivo · 02-08-2007, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathRider

I can see BSG, but there are only 14 Firefly episodes

- and if I remember correctly, there wasn't enough $$$ made with Serenity to make a sequel feasible

Yep. I thought for sure it would make lots of money seeing as so my many Slashdot techie types loved the show.

hookbill · 02-08-2007, 04:54 PM

Nice poll. I heard about SDV through my local guys in the AVS forum. I think it will affect me but not for some time since we were just recently bought by Time Warner (old Adelphia).

So far other then the name change not much has changed and I don't anticipate any major changes until June at the earliest. And since I heard that from a tech at my house you can probably tag some additional time on to that. That's suppose to be when we all get on the same channels, which will be some task since most of Adelphia in N.E. Ohio wasn't even on the same channels.

I think it will be quite a while before it hits us.

kdmorse · 02-08-2007, 04:56 PM

Knowing full well what was coming down the road, I purchased my first S3.

Knowing full well what was coming down the road, prevented me from purchasing a second S3.

As someone else said, I'll take the gamble on one, but not on two.

-Ken

MickeS · 02-08-2007, 05:14 PM

Won't affect me, since I only plan to use OTA signals. I'll get any premium content over the Internet or on HD disc-based media.

Initially I was worried about it because I was thinking of using it for cable, but I realize that I have zero interest in paying that much for TV.

Forcelite · 02-08-2007, 05:45 PM

I would not have bought an S3 and also would love to see what all the new HD channels have to offer, but NOPE, SDV is in the way!

jeffsinsfo · 02-08-2007, 05:53 PM

I didn't make a choice in the poll because none of the options quite suits me. While I didn't understand the potential of SDV interfering with the channels I might be able to receive in the future on my Series 3, I don't think that I would have been bothered by that enough to prevent my purchasing a Series 3 if I also knew how easily I could receive OTA HD channels. I really didn't expect most of them to come in so easily with an indoor antenna haphazardly placed. So what will I do if Comcast rolls out SDV in my area and ends up putting channels I want on the switched channels? That depends on which and how many channels are affected. The only channel that isn't OTA that I'd miss tremendously is Comedy Central. If that goes then I'd probably just disconnect my cable service entirely as a protest (unless, of course, there was some solution to enable to Series 3 to still record the switched channels). There are other channels currently in my digital lineup that I would miss a little, but if those end up on switched channels I could easily just downgrade my service and not miss that programming very much.