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Old 12-09-2006, 10:37 PM   #1
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Advertisement at end of "Rudolph" - never seen this kind before

I just watched "Rudolph The Red-Nosed Reindeer", recorded yesterday.

When I got to the end and the options to delete or keep the recording show up, there was also a third option on the bottom in the form of a clickable banner-ad for some contest called "A home for the holidays".

It actually doesn't bother me - I prefer ads like these rather than ads during programming, and if TiVo can make money on it, great. But I've never seen this particular method of advertising before. Is this something new that will be done again, or has it been used before?

/Mike
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Old 12-10-2006, 12:45 AM   #2
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I've never seen it. But then again, I've watched very little TV in the last several weeks.
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Old 12-10-2006, 01:52 AM   #3
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TiVo announced this capability a couple of weeks ago: http://www.tivo.com/cms_static/press_120.html
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Old 12-10-2006, 06:39 PM   #4
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That is about a 100% chance of it being seen, plus it sounds like it is not very intrusive.
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Old 12-10-2006, 08:44 PM   #5
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Just got one also...

and does it SUCK
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Old 12-10-2006, 08:51 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovedvrs
Just got one also...

and does it SUCK
I haven't seen one yet. How does it suck? Does it force you to press additional buttons? Does it force you to watch a video ad? Or does it just present advertising on the "delete now?" page?
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Old 12-10-2006, 08:58 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovedvrs
Just got one also...

and does it SUCK
I don't understand... You'd prefer Tivo to not collect any advertising revenue and just raise your monthly rates? That doesn't jibe with your "Tivo should be free" subtitle - you don't want to pay the money, and you don't want it to come from advertisers. Do you think that it just grows on trees?

And did we really need a completely different thread on the same topic?
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Old 12-10-2006, 09:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdhenry
I haven't seen one yet. How does it suck? Does it force you to press additional buttons? Does it force you to watch a video ad? Or does it just present advertising on the "delete now?" page?




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Old 12-10-2006, 09:04 PM   #9
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So I'd have to cursor *down* to select the ad content? To delete or keep the recording I'd do the exact same thing I did before? Bring it on.
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Old 12-10-2006, 09:07 PM   #10
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OMG that sUX!!!111!!!

MY TIVo WIL NeVER B the SAME!!

Thanks for posting Greg, that's as non intrusive as can be, and I'm certainly glad to see Tivo get another revenue stream.
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Old 12-10-2006, 09:18 PM   #11
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I have same recording on my S3. But it doesn't do it... yet.
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Old 12-10-2006, 09:21 PM   #12
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I can see how TiVo could potentially make a lot of money from this if they insert ad links to the end of every show. A very ingenues idea, if I might say.
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Old 12-10-2006, 09:22 PM   #13
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I think its awesome! Bring it on TiVo. Increase your revenue and prosper.
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Old 12-10-2006, 09:46 PM   #14
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Big deal. It's unobtrusive. Some people will watch. Tivo can deploy to all shows for one advertiser.
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Old 12-10-2006, 10:07 PM   #15
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I'm sad that I'll probably never see this on my DTiVo. I do watch ads that interest me, and this would make it easier to do that. Seems pretty unobtrusive.
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Old 12-10-2006, 10:09 PM   #16
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still looking for that Victoria's Secret ad
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Old 12-10-2006, 10:13 PM   #17
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There are times when I actually would WANT to see an ad for something I am thinking of buying. Targeting it to those who might be interested, and making it easy to ignore if you don't want to see it, seems to be a winner for all except those who consider advertisements inherently and universally evil.
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Old 12-10-2006, 10:49 PM   #18
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Ads aren't evil - they pay for things (or help pay for things) so we don't have to. As long as they stay unobtrusive.

E.G. popup ads - open a new window, get in the way, and often have flash and other crap. They're bad (thank goodness Firefox blocks them)

this ad? not bad... it's out of the way, doesn't change how we interact with our TiVo, and will help out TiVo Inc. Don't like the ads? Don't watch them. Simple enough ;-}
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Old 12-10-2006, 10:58 PM   #19
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I figured TiVo would do this in a very unobtrusive manner, and it looks like they succeeded. I don't see how anyone could seriously have a problem with this system. The only people I could see this bothering are those who just dislike all advertising and wouldn't be happy with any thing but no ads at all.
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Old 12-10-2006, 11:04 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TydalForce
this ad? not bad... it's out of the way, doesn't change how we interact with our TiVo, and will help out TiVo Inc. Don't like the ads? Don't watch them. Simple enough ;-}
So how does it help Tivo if you don't watch them? It sure looks like "pay per click" type of ad. Even if it is not "pay per click", do you you think that anybody will pay for ads that are "unobtrusive" enough that most of the people will not watch them? As it is these ads are only available to about 1.2 million TiVos. If 90% of the viewers ignore them, then you can do better advertising in local community paper.
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Old 12-10-2006, 11:06 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megazone
I figured TiVo would do this in a very unobtrusive manner, and it looks like they succeeded. I don't see how anyone could seriously have a problem with this system. The only people I could see this bothering are those who just dislike all advertising and wouldn't be happy with any thing but no ads at all.
Some of us would probably object if HBO or Showtime began running advertising, wouldn't we? Would we be wrong for expecting a subscription service not to bother us with advertising?

I still believe if you get ads you should be compensated for them with a lower service fee. And if you don't want ads, you simply should be able to pay to not get them.

As far as I'm concerned, advertising is clutter; and I don't need more clutter in my life. I don't care one bit if using that otherwise empty space helps TiVo. I prefer that space to remain related specifically to functional services of my device, not advertising, or left blank.

Anybody who develops a hack to completely remove these sorts of ads should feel free to contact me anytime for free hosting space and bandwidth to distribute the hack.
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Old 12-10-2006, 11:24 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dswallow
Some of us would probably object if HBO or Showtime began running advertising, wouldn't we? Would we be wrong for expecting a subscription service not to bother us with advertising?
Actually, yes, I think you'd be wrong. Unless the subscription service is explicitly ad free. I subscribe to many magazines - they all have ads. I subscribe to cable TV - most of the channels have ads. In the past I've subscribed to things like Time-Life videos, and they come with ads in the box.

The TiVo service has never been promoted as ad free, in fact, quite the opposite. And TiVo is not profitable and need more revenue to remain in business. So they can increase user fees or find other revenue, such as ads. They've always been unobtrusive about them and that's the best they can do, IMHO.

If they offered a way to pay more instead of get the ads I doubt enough people would put their money where their mouth is to make it worth while. And tracking stuff like that is added overhead costs so it'd have to make up for the ads and pay for the administration of the program. I can't see it being worth the effort for them to do it. Especially since it only makes sense if it gains them enough business - who isn't buying TiVo because of the ads who would if they could pay more not to get them?

It sounds like you're one of the people who just dislike ads on general principal, so you won't be happy with any advertising.
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Old 12-10-2006, 11:36 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megazone
Actually, yes, I think you'd be wrong. Unless the subscription service is explicitly ad free. I subscribe to many magazines - they all have ads. I subscribe to cable TV - most of the channels have ads. In the past I've subscribed to things like Time-Life videos, and they come with ads in the box.

The TiVo service has never been promoted as ad free, in fact, quite the opposite. And TiVo is not profitable and need more revenue to remain in business. So they can increase user fees or find other revenue, such as ads. They've always been unobtrusive about them and that's the best they can do, IMHO.

If they offered a way to pay more instead of get the ads I doubt enough people would put their money where their mouth is to make it worth while. And tracking stuff like that is added overhead costs so it'd have to make up for the ads and pay for the administration of the program. I can't see it being worth the effort for them to do it. Especially since it only makes sense if it gains them enough business - who isn't buying TiVo because of the ads who would if they could pay more not to get them?

It sounds like you're one of the people who just dislike ads on general principal, so you won't be happy with any advertising.
Well... considering they continually expand the amount of ad clutter throughout the TiVo interface, there was a time people who subscribed did so with the belief they wouldn't have ad clutter.

The best they can do is eliminate the ads. They choose not to do the best they can do.

How much revenue do they really earn by having a unit receive such advertising? Triple it and charge the customer that amount to have them disappear; though I'd certainly prefer to see them credit everyone who wanted the advertising. I suspect the advertising income is very minimal anyway, at least from what I recall in prior 10Q's.

Contrary to what advertisers would like you to believe, there's nothing wrong with disliking ads and doing everything one can do to not have to endure them. And in fact at times I will specifically avoid purchasing brands or products when I'm faced with obnoxious advertising (remember the X-10 pop-under ad campaigns on web sites?; I will never buy an X-10 product. Ever. Good campaign for them. I'll exclusively buy equivalent stuff from their competitors.). So it'd be to the advertisers benefit to ensure their ads don't appear on any TiVo device I might subscribe.
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Old 12-10-2006, 11:51 PM   #24
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Ad revenue is a growing part of TiVo's revenue, taking on more importance with time. Each new system provides more revenue.

I'm not willing to pay more just to get rid of the ads. They don't bother me, in fact, I like some of them. I suspect that they don't bother most users enough to pay more. People already complain about paying too much, ask them to pay more just to avoid some unobtrusive ads and I don't see you getting many takers.

Anyone who had the belief there wouldn't be ads didn't read the user agreement, even back in the early days. Advertising has been part of TiVo's business plan since the beginning.

If you don't like the ads, there is always MythTV.

And it is only to the advertisers benefit to not have their ads appear if more people would NOT by their product because of it than WOULD buy their product. Since very, very few people actually bother to avoid buying something due to an ad, it doesn't matter. You just don't matter enough to sway them.

If you really didn't like ads you wouldn't use TiVo.
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:01 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dswallow
Well... considering they continually expand the amount of ad clutter throughout the TiVo interface, there was a time people who subscribed did so with the belief they wouldn't have ad clutter.
Believing in something doesn't necessarily make it fact (see also: easter bunny, tooth fairy). As far as the continual expansion, we're look at what? Tivo Central, and the "Delete this program?" dialog, two screens that are up for less than 3-5 seconds each time they appear? While that is an expansion over no ads, it's hardly the ad littered landscape that you make it sound like.
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The best they can do is eliminate the ads.
Only if you want your service fee to go up of Tivo to go out of buisness.
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They choose not to do the best they can do.
Not really, see above.
Quote:
How much revenue do they really earn by having a unit receive such advertising? Triple it and charge the customer that amount to have them disappear; though I'd certainly prefer to see them credit everyone who wanted the advertising. I suspect the advertising income is very minimal anyway, at least from what I recall in prior 10Q's.
And how many of those quarters had this advertising mechanism in them?
None at all?
Exactly.
Quote:
Contrary to what advertisers would like you to believe, there's nothing wrong with disliking ads and doing everything one can do to not have to endure them. And in fact at times I will specifically avoid purchasing brands or products when I'm faced with obnoxious advertising (remember the X-10 pop-under ad campaigns on web sites?; I will never buy an X-10 product. Ever. Good campaign for them. I'll exclusively buy equivalent stuff from their competitors.). So it'd be to the advertisers benefit to ensure their ads don't appear on any TiVo device I might subscribe.
That's a shame, since X-10 products are sold by a lot more people than just X-10.com (the horrible ad people). Sounds like it's your misinformation that's the problem, not the product.
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:03 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megazone
If you really didn't like ads you wouldn't use TiVo.
Actually in a sense I don't. The DirecTV w/TiVo units aren't littered with advertising.
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:07 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by GoHokies!
Only if you want your service fee to go up of Tivo to go out of buisness.
If TiVo isn't charging enough that they go out of business with advertising revenue, I think I'd place the blame on TiVo not charging enough to begin with.

Though considering for all practical purposes, they just increased prices $7/month, one would wonder if every subscriber on older pricing plans is helping put TiVo out of business, if you follow your line of reasoning.

Over the years, all that's happened is TiVo charges higher and higher prices for service; and TiVo adds more and more intrusive advertising to the service. And that's ignoring the money they make on selling viewing data, which since it's non-intrusive, doesn't bother me at all.
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:17 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by dswallow
Over the years, all that's happened is TiVo charges higher and higher prices for service; and TiVo adds more and more intrusive advertising to the service.
Which is exactly they should be trying to do - bring in more revenue, in the hopes of turning a profit.

The fact that Tivo has to either increase revenue or decrease expenses is a given. I certainly prefer this to higher service fees or decreased expenses which would decrease the quality of the product that they put out.

Obviously you'd prefer another revenue stream - any suggestions?
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:34 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by GoHokies!
.
That's a shame, since X-10 products are sold by a lot more people than just X-10.com (the horrible ad people). Sounds like it's your misinformation that's the problem, not the product.
But they paid the ad company to do that crap, thus they get no money from him, which is his right.

Me, I don't care right now about the ads, but what happens when they are no longer unobtrusive and pop up on every screen you use to access now playing? Imagine hitting the Tivo button, and instead of seeing the now playing list immediately, you see a screen for an ad and you have to select no to get to the now playing list, then after doing that, you select your program, and when you hit play, instead of starting what you selected, another ad pops up where you have to hit no to start watching the program. Then after the program ends, instead of getting the normal delete or keep message, you get another ad where you have to say no, before being allowed to delete. You honestly think that won't happen in the future if this new way doesn't work?

Remember, websites never relied on pop ups until the ad market went south, now many websites have numerous pop ups to bring in revenue.
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:42 AM   #30
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But they paid the ad company to do that crap, thus they get no money from him, which is his right.
, but irrelevant.

Quote:
Me, I don't care right now about the ads, but what happens when they are no longer unobtrusive and pop up on every screen you use to access now playing? Imagine hitting the Tivo button, and instead of seeing the now playing list immediately, you see a screen for an ad and you have to select no to get to the now playing list, then after doing that, you select your program, and when you hit play, instead of starting what you selected, another ad pops up where you have to hit no to start watching the program. Then after the program ends, instead of getting the normal delete or keep message, you get another ad where you have to say no, before being allowed to delete. You honestly think that won't happen in the future if this new way doesn't work?
That would suck, and there would be a mass exodus of subscribers. Yes, I honestly think that Tivo knows that and wouldn't go that far. Do you honestly think that Tivo would be that foolish?

Instead, I just focus on what is actually happening now, and not speculating on what may happen with the ads in the future. So far, not offended.
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