Half Baked Series3 at twice the cost.

MediaLivingRoom · 09-12-2006, 04:01 AM

1. No TiVoToGo
2. Multi-Room Viewing even if you have both S3?
3. No external-SATA hard drive support (not turned on)
4. No Built-in WiFi

megazone · 09-12-2006, 04:08 AM

So don't buy it and wait to see what comes.

BriGuy20 · 09-12-2006, 04:16 AM

Actually, there is SATA support for expandable external hard drives.

And I think that you'll be glad that you have the freedom to switch WiFi adapters when the new wireless standards come out in a few years.

bkdtv · 09-12-2006, 04:21 AM

It wouldn't really make sense for Tivo to incorporate WiFi because 802.11g doesn't provide sufficient bandwidth to stream HD in real time (in most scenarios)..

The Series3 does have a 100Mbps ethernet port. Ultimately, the thing to get will be a wireless 802.11n bridge or gaming adapter to plug into the ethernet port. That will provide sufficient bandwidth over wireless to stream HD in realtime.

MediaLivingRoom · 09-12-2006, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BriGuy20

Actually, there is SATA support for expandable external hard drives.

And I think that you'll be glad that you have the freedom to switch WiFi adapters when the new wireless standards come out in a few years.

I heard it's not turned on.

megazone · 09-12-2006, 04:27 AM

eSATA is NOT enabled in the initial release, it will be enabled later.

MediaLivingRoom · 09-12-2006, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by megazone

eSATA is NOT enabled in the initial release, it will be enabled later.

I hope TiVo means later in like 3 months. Not like soon meaning 2008.

tunnelengineer · 09-12-2006, 05:52 AM

get up on the wrong side of the bed this morning?

BlackBetty · 09-12-2006, 05:59 AM

it seems like every day someone is craping in your cornflakes.

TiVotion · 09-12-2006, 05:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MediaLivingRoom

1. No TiVoToGo
2. Multi-Room Viewing even if you have both S3?
3. No external-SATA hard drive support (not turned on)
4. No Built-in WiFi

Actually, those points, in the exact order you listed them, are kind of making me think twice about taking the plunge on the S3 right now.

TTG is important to me. Primarily so I can watch shows on my PC while I'm doing other stuff.

Multi room viewing is important as well. I'm constantly switching between TiVo locations (living room/bedroom).

# 3 and # 4 I could live with if I had to.

In the absence of # 1 and # 2, what this will force me to do is decide IN ADVANCE where I will always watch a recorded show. If I record it on the S3, then I know it has to stay there. No getting it to the PC, no getting it to the bedroom.

I think this may be enough to make me hold off on my purchase.

megazone · 09-12-2006, 06:14 AM

#4 is a non-issue, as far as I'm concerned - the TiVo adapter works. That's how my S3 is online.

#3 - eSATA *will* be turned on. There is another release planned for late 2006 to bring the S3 up to feature parity (KidZone, Recently Deleted, etc) - but I'm not sure if this will be in that release or a later one. But it has been stated it will come. (Cue some Mac owner to jump in here and bitch about TTG and promises.)

#1 and #2 - those are iffier. TiVo does want to enable these, and they have many reasons to do so - it is part of what sets them apart from other DVRs - so I'm sure they'll do everything they can do find ways to enable these.

bdraw · 09-12-2006, 06:21 AM

I have a feeling that number 1 and 2 may be enabled via Telnet.
But it remains to be seen if the Series 3 is as hackable as previous TiVos.

classicX · 09-12-2006, 06:22 AM

No MRV is a dealbreaker for me. Without those features, there is little difference between the S3 and the cable company DVR, except of course the $800.

I think I'll just build a Media Center PC (when Vista is out) and buy an Xbox360 for use as an extender.

Sorry Tivo, but with such a long wait, these things should have already been taken care of.

pkscout · 09-12-2006, 06:30 AM

My bet is they couldn't get CableLabs certification for the unit with MRV and TTG enabled, or it was going to take forever. So TiVo decided to ship the unit without those functions while they fight with the cable cartel's front about them.

Remember, TiVo needed the CableLab certification, and CableLabs primary job is to ensure that nobody gets certification so there can be no competition for the cable monopolies in your area.

megazone · 09-12-2006, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdraw

I have a feeling that number 1 and 2 may be enabled via Telnet.
But it remains to be seen if the Series 3 is as hackable as previous TiVos.

I am confident in saying - no, they aren't. Every generation of TiVo has been less hackable than the last. Every time they revise the box they make it harder - the most recent S2s require hardware hacking to do software mods.

jacksonian · 09-12-2006, 06:40 AM

So when did we find out that the eSata would be inactive. That really bites. So is that something that could be turned on with a software download? Or do you mean early adopters would never have that capability?

rainwater · 09-12-2006, 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacksonian

So when did we find out that the eSata would be inactive. That really bites. So is that something that could be turned on with a software download? Or do you mean early adopters would never have that capability?

It's a software only issue. Hopefully TiVo has atleast worked out the design so it will not be a long time before its possible. I don't think users are going to be satisfied without expansion capabilities.

megazone · 09-12-2006, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacksonian

So when did we find out that the eSata would be inactive. That really bites. So is that something that could be turned on with a software download? Or do you mean early adopters would never have that capability?

Offiicially - you all found out today. Those of us with review boxes have known for a few weeks. :-) It is a software update, it'll be enabled in the future.

davezatz · 09-12-2006, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by megazone

Offiicially - you all found out today. Those of us with review boxes have known for a few weeks. :-) It is a software update, it'll be enabled in the future.

While I didn't get a definitive "it will be enabled" answer on the eSATA option, all signs indicated it will be... and sooner rather than later - I'd guess this year. I also assume internal storage can be expanded just as it is with existing models. As far as MRV and TTG support, who knows when or if and in what capacity. :/ It seems like more of a certification/political issue than a technical one.

aaronwt · 09-12-2006, 07:16 AM

Well I hope they have MRV. Without that I would need 5 S3 boxes instead of 3.

rainwater · 09-12-2006, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davezatz

I also assume internal storage can be expanded just as it is with existing models.

It seems it uses proprietary WD SATA connectors so it may not be so easy.

megazone · 09-12-2006, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronwt

Well I hope they have MRV. Without that I would need 5 S3 boxes instead of 3.

There is no MRV at this time.

TechDreamer · 09-12-2006, 07:55 AM

Tivo screwed us.
So were supposed to trust them that all this stuff will be turned on someday? There is no reason for this box to be crippled. It sounds like the MPAA/RIAA and the Cable Companies run Tivo now. This box is still born.

skaeight · 09-12-2006, 08:08 AM

This is making the HR20 look better and better. It sounds like there's about as much of a chance of the HR20 offering "MRV" or "Directv2go" as there is of Tivo enabling these features on the S3.

If they can't get these features enabled on the S3, they are really in trouble. They are tivo's "killer apps." Without them, what differentiates a S3 from a cable/sat proprietary dvr enough to justify $800? Even cable dvrs have firewire ports.

TiVotion · 09-12-2006, 08:33 AM

By the time I got to work today, I'd made up my mind. I flirted with the Buy Tivo ordering page, then when I realized I needed to add the service fee on top of the box totalling nearly $1000 at the lowest rate, I came to the conclusion that $1000 for a TiVo that can't to MRV and TTG just ain't gonna cut it for me right now.

I'll keep watching in standard def until TiVo decides what they are going to do about these features and lowers the price. It's simply not that big of a deal.

Stormspace · 09-12-2006, 08:50 AM

Up until today I was all pumped up about the new Series 3 release, but as I read the reviews and realized...

1) It was indeed priced out of my range
2) No MRV with S2 or S3 boxes
3) No TTG
4) No MRV with S2 or S3 boxes

and did I mention no MRV?

I'm kinda in a let down mood at the moment and given that TiVo isn't the one making the decisions about MRV and TTG I'm not optimistic about getting these features back any time soon. For me I will not even consider a TiVo that doesn't let me transfer content around my network to other S2's AND S3's. To me that what makes it TiVo my way.

vman41 · 09-12-2006, 08:52 AM

Any issues with CableLabs should have been clear to TiVo last April (or whenever it was) when the box was certified. The certainly made an effort to set expectations about the price, but not about the feature restrictions.

DTSDude · 09-12-2006, 08:57 AM

Yup, there it is, in all it's glory. The $800 TiVo that most TiVo lovers will only be able look at when they visit CC and BB. And at no added cost they've released a crippled version of their product in hopes that it'll be out in time to rake in the bucks over the holiday season. (and meet their publicly stated release timeline so wall street doesn't kill them.) Goes to show ya, be careful what you wish for. We all poked and prodded to get this thing released. This is what you end up with.

Sad thing is, I'll end up buying one for christmas.

HiDefGator · 09-12-2006, 09:12 AM

Are you guys really that surprised that Tivo did the same thing DirecTV did and released the box when it was 75% ready? Would you rather they wait 6 months and then start getting the early bugs reported? The only people that are going to buy an S3 at the current price are the Tivo faithful anyway.

skaeight · 09-12-2006, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HiDefGator

Are you guys really that surprised that Tivo did the same thing DirecTV did and released the box when it was 75% ready? Would you rather they wait 6 months and then start getting the early bugs reported? The only people that are going to buy an S3 at the current price are the Tivo faithful anyway.

The problem with comparison is you can get an HR20 for $299 (possibly less if you do some negotiating) and it's included in the $6 / account dvr fee. S3 weighs in at $800 and $12.95/ month but fails to offer the features that set it appart.