TiVo Community
TiVo Community
TiVo Community
Go Back   TiVo Community > Main TiVo Forums > TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion
TiVo Community
Reply
Forum Jump
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-13-2014, 11:46 AM   #1
Banker257
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 219
PETITION OF TIVO INC. FOR WAIVER OR CLARIFICATION OF 47 C.F.R. § 76.640(b)(4)(iii)

"TiVo Inc. (“TiVo”) respectfully requests further waiver or clarification with respect to the requirement that TiVo products supplied wholesale to cable operators must include an industry-standard, interactive, and recordable home networking interface, as set forth in Section 76.640(b)(4)(iii) of the Commission’s Rules."

http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7521828214
Banker257 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2014, 11:49 AM   #2
tarheelblue32
Registered User
 
tarheelblue32's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 1,705
Shoo, go away troll.
tarheelblue32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2014, 03:08 PM   #3
Dan203
Super Moderator
 
Dan203's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Nevada
Posts: 25,998
Honestly I don't think they should get the waiver. TiVo is selling to MSOs and those MSOs need to follow the rules just like the big guys if we want the rules to hold. If TiVo gets a waiver then Comcast, TW, Charter, etc... will be next to ask for one.

In addition TiVo implementing an industry standard means that we might get more choices in the future. It could mean that 3rd party companies could release cheaper Mini type devices that can communicate with, and play recordings from, our TiVos.

TiVo, like all corporations, is just looking out for it's own interests. Consumer interest is the purpose of these rules.
__________________
Dan Haddix
Super Moderator
Developer for VideoReDo
Dan203 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2014, 05:14 PM   #4
Banker257
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 219
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan203 View Post
Honestly I don't think they should get the waiver. TiVo is selling to MSOs and those MSOs need to follow the rules just like the big guys if we want the rules to hold. If TiVo gets a waiver then Comcast, TW, Charter, etc... will be next to ask for one.

In addition TiVo implementing an industry standard means that we might get more choices in the future. It could mean that 3rd party companies could release cheaper Mini type devices that can communicate with, and play recordings from, our TiVos.

TiVo, like all corporations, is just looking out for it's own interests. Consumer interest is the purpose of these rules.
I think the FCC not granting this waiver is next to zero. Nobody is opposing it, including Verizon.

I do agree with you that the FCC has to step up and come to some kind of solid rules that EVERYONE must follow.

There is to much time and resources wasted the way things stand now.
Banker257 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2014, 06:31 PM   #5
dcline414
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 148
So if I understand correctly, the notion of open network standards would allow interface with universal home automation platforms such as wink or harmony rather than just the proprietary Tivo app?

If so, I think a waiver would be a horrible thing for consumers, but would benefit Tivo and have a neutral impact on content providers. Of course, Logitech already has a universal solution that allows for controlling proprietary devices via IR blasters, but it is an inferior solution that costs consumers $250+ for additional hardware.

Nearly every home entertainment device has some sort of network interface at this point, many of which are proprietary. A universal open interface requirement is long overdue, and really should be mandated without exception at this point. Lack of competition in the DVR space probably makes this niche among the most critical.

That said, I doubt that anyone will stand firm against Tivo here.
dcline414 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2014, 06:39 PM   #6
Dan203
Super Moderator
 
Dan203's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Nevada
Posts: 25,998
I think the rule they're referring to is the one that requires MSO STBs to output a standard IP signal that can be captured/used by 3rd party devices. I think most MSOs are planning on using DLNA for this, but TiVo is petitioning the FCC for a waiver basically saying that their proprietary networking protocol, which they use for the Mini, already meets the requirements except for the "open" part.

I really hope the FCC denies them, even if no one stands against them. It's in the best interest of consumers for everyone, including TiVo, to be forced to use open standards.
__________________
Dan Haddix
Super Moderator
Developer for VideoReDo
Dan203 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2014, 07:51 PM   #7
dcline414
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 148
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan203 View Post
I think the rule they're referring to is the one that requires MSO STBs to output a standard IP signal that can be captured/used by 3rd party devices. I think most MSOs are planning on using DLNA for this, but TiVo is petitioning the FCC for a waiver basically saying that their proprietary networking protocol, which they use for the Mini, already meets the requirements except for the "open" part.

I really hope the FCC denies them, even if no one stands against them. It's in the best interest of consumers for everyone, including TiVo, to be forced to use open standards.
Thanks for the clarification; I think we're talking about the same functionality, just different aspects of how the connectivity could be used.

It is my experience that general home automation stuff can be controlled with one app and all entertainment devices (including Tivo) with another (but limited to one-way communication). Anything interactive like viewing/modifying DVR content has historically required switching to a proprietary app.

Logitech (and probably others) already bridged the gap between entertainment and home automation with two-way communication with connected home devices (lights, doors, smart locks, Wi-Fi thermostats), advanced home entertainment devices (Apple TV, Roku, Sonos), and IR or Bluetooth game consoles.

Now one device (app/controller/system) can control any open platform device via IR, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, or network. This includes over 270,000 compatible devices from more than 6,000 brands, but not Tivo DVRs.

Tivo isn't well-positioned to compete in the market for unifying devices, which could largely replace the stream/mini plus do so much more, so they are petitioning to take their ball and go home.
dcline414 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2014, 08:10 PM   #8
Dan203
Super Moderator
 
Dan203's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Nevada
Posts: 25,998
CableLabs and the industry as a whole have pretty much settled on DLNA CVP-2 as the standard they're going to use to meet these requirements. With DLNA CVP-2 the host presents the client with an HTML5 UI and then streams the video to the client using one of a few approved encrypted video formats. (DASH, DTCP-IP, etc...) It also carries with it protection flags which tell the client what it can do with the stream, such as whether or not it can record it.

This is sort of the evolution of the AllVid idea. Except that AllVid was going to be a headless tuner only technology, and this allow the host device to present the client with whatever UI it decides via the HTML5 UI portion.
__________________
Dan Haddix
Super Moderator
Developer for VideoReDo
Dan203 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Forum Jump




Thread Tools


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Advertisements

TiVo Community
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Skins by: Relivo Media

(C) 2013 Magenium Solutions - All Rights Reserved. No information may be posted elsewhere without written permission.
TiVo® is a registered trademark of TiVo Inc. This site is not owned or operated by TiVo Inc.
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:08 PM.
OUR NETWORK: MyOpenRouter | TechLore | SansaCommunity | RoboCommunity | MediaSmart Home | Explore3DTV | Dijit Community | DVR Playground |