Favorite channels disappear in TiVo Live Guide

BlankMan · 05-22-2003, 11:35 PM

<Added 29-jun-2004>

***** NEWSFLASH ***** NEWSFLASH ***** NEWSFLASH ***** NEWSFLASH *****

TiVo is looking for volunteers to help them acquire data regarding this problem. TiVoOpsMgr has posted an official request here (in this thread) requesting participants. The post also mentions that DirecTV is aware of this problem. Finally, an official statement to such, and I was so getting used to I've never heard of that problem...

***** NEWSFLASH ***** NEWSFLASH ***** NEWSFLASH ***** NEWSFLASH *****

<Addition end 29-jun-2004>

Anyone else having this occur periodically?

I use the TiVo Live Guide set to Favorites, my favorite channels are set. Every once in a while I press the Guide button and I get the following message:

This Channel list has not been set up.

To use a different channel list, press DISPLAY.
to set up this channel list, press the
TiVo button, then Messages & Setup,
then My Preferences, then Customize Channels.

This is very frustrating (as in it's happened more then once) and basically BS because they were set, the TiVo unit lost them and I have to set them up again. This has happened on a number of different Sony SAT-T60's. No one else erased them or reset the TiVo. The TiVo did it all on it's own. Software Version is 3.1.0-01-1-011.

<addendum 12-Dec-2003>

This problem also manifests itself as losing Channels I Receive. Then because the DTiVo no longer thinks it gets that channel anything that was suppose to be recorded on the missing channels is not. This is no longer a minor inconvenience it is now affecting the ability of the DirecTV Receiver with TiVo, or DirecTV DVR as DirecTV calls it, to do the one thing it is touted to do, and that is to record programs.

<updated 29-Dec-2003>

A synopsis of this problem, with thanks to kevinm for contributing parts of it.

A large number of DirecTV subscribers are experiencing a bug with DirecTiVo's that has gone publicly unacknowledged by DirecTV. This thread demonstrates the magnitude and scope of the problem as well as DirecTV's handling of it.

When this problem occurs you may loose some or all of the channels in your Favorite Channel list and/or some or all of the channels in your Channels I Receive list. The later impacts your ability to record programs. To restore the Channels I Receive requires you need to reboot your DTiVo, to restore the Favorite Channels list you must manually re-add them. Again and again and again.

It is known that many people have called into DirecTV on this issue and it is recommended that those who experience it also do the same. Reporting of this issue is one of the strongest methods of getting it resolved. Unfortunately the front line CSRs either do not know or instructed not to acknowledge this as a known issue. It is recommended that you ask for a Tivo Specialist and ask for N day's credit for days that you were unable to view or record DirecTV.

Contributed by Mark Lopez

Clear and delete won't fix it. Hacked or unhacked doesn't matter. Phone line or not has no bearing. Seasons passes or any recordings makes no difference.

BlankMan WARNING: SO DO NOT DO A CLEAR AND DELETE AS DIRECTV MAY SUGGEST IT WILL NOT FIX THE PROBLEM IT HAS BEEN TRIED, ALL IT WILL DO IS ERASE ALL YOUR RECORDINGS, SEASON PASSES, ETC.

<updated 28-Jun-2004>

stevel asked that the OP be updated with these facts:

- There is no fix available
- DirecTV has no clue if or when a fix would be made available - they are now, at least, sometimes acknowledging that they know about the problem
- If you complain enough, they'll likely offer to replace your S1 boxes with S2 boxes that don't have this problem. They will ask for a $49 fee, but sometimes they'll waive it.

However, as of 28-Jun-2004 as mentioned in this post, it mentions that a new software version is going out that is supposed to correct this issue. Let's all hope...

BlankMan · 05-23-2003, 04:16 AM

I can't believe this but I suppose I should not be suprised this was DirecTV's anwser to this problem:

Dear <BlankMan>,

Thank you for writing. We apologize for all the inconvenience this matter may be causing. Resetting your system can resolve many of the problems you could be experiencing. To reset your system, follow these steps:

1. Turn off the receiver box.
2. Unplug it from the electrical outlet.
3. Leave it unplugged for 15 seconds.
4. Reconnect it to the electrical outlet and return to normal viewing.

If this does not resolve your problem, please call our technical support
center. To reach them, call 1-800-531-5000 and select the option for
technical assistance. We appreciate you as a DIRECTV customer and hope
you continue to enjoy DIRECTV service.

Kate
DIRECTV Customer Service

minorthr · 05-23-2003, 11:17 AM

I have been having a similar problem but its with the channels I receive. Ill take the box out of standby and it will say it is acquiring the sat signal it does its thing and all the channels are back even the ones I don't receive and had previously unchecked. Also then when I go into the suggestions it says I have no thumbs but you go in the guide and the thumbs are there. Then after a day the suggestions and thumbs are all back.

sendsley · 05-28-2003, 10:27 AM

I have that EXACT issue (as the original post) - and it seems to be more frequent on my Phillips 6000 than my Sony SAT 60 but it happens to both and it sucks!!! And yes, I got the same response from DirecTV - no help of course. And guess what....after you call they're going to make you do the same frigin' thing, and surprise, surprise it still won't work!

BlankMan · 05-29-2003, 10:46 PM

I knew this wasn't going to be fun.

After bantering (nicely) back and forth with TiVo Support they escalated the call and said someone would contact me. Well they did, today, Aaron from TiVo Corporate called. I explained the problem to him and he fully understood it. He said he would do some research, talk to some people and get back to me, but it might take a few days. I asked him if he had access to engineering and engineers and he explained that he did and it could be passed up to engineering to get an answer.

That was the good news. He called me back later today with the bad news, or as he put probably not what I wanted to hear. And it was/is exactly what I expected and was exactly what I was afraid of when DirecTV took over responsibility for DTiVo's.

He said, he was told, that I have to contact DirecTV and go through their support then if they determine it's a problem they have to contact TiVo. My worst fears realized. Unless I'm told differently, I don't think DirecTV writes the code, they can't fix the code, but I have to jump through their hoops.

I'd wish someone would explain to me how this procedure benefits customer satisfaction?

Joey303 · 06-02-2003, 05:20 PM

I've already been through this Tivo-DirecTV runaround, in order to resolve a similar problem -- it resets my Channels-I-Receive list, which totally screws-up TiVo's recording of Suggestions. I'm told by folks on these boards that DirecTV does this purposely and that it's not going to change. Good luck.

BlankMan · 06-07-2003, 12:21 AM

This just happened again on my tivo1, I'm going to start tracking this, this is just ridiculous and unacceptable. The units uptime is 19 days so it didn't just have a problem and reboot.

Boy, do I ever feel like I bought something and I'm left holding the bag as they say.

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 12:25 PM

Well it happened again, a week or two ago, I forget which of my T60's, 1 or 2, all that was left was the NASA channel, so I programmed it again.

Then last night it happened again, all favorite channels poof gone! On TiVo1. It's been up for 48 days so I doubt it a reboot issue.

I've PM'd TiVoPony twice, both seemed to be delivered, nary a response. I know DTV is suppose to support these, but this code came out at the same time DTV took them over so I'm betting TiVo still wrote it.

This isn't even poor customer support. This is no customer support.

A known problem. Repeatedly occurring. Nothing being done. Ignoring it does not seem to make it go away.

Think I'll try a more direct approach at getting TiVoPony's attention. Right after I borrow my friend's, who is a fireman, flame retardant suit...

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 01:22 PM

Thank you TiVoOpsMgr. No, I PM'd him back on May 29th and then on June 6th, it was either not received or ignored. I still have them in my Sent Items but they disappeared from Message Tracking.

stevel · 07-25-2003, 01:25 PM

This has happened to me three times so far in the last two months. The Favorites list gets wiped out. What has also happened twice so far is that the guide data index is wiped out and takes a day to get rebuilt, with the result that shows drop off the To Do list because they're "no longer in the program guide" even though you can go to the time and channel and see them.

Like you, I complained to DirecTV and got the brush-off.

I've had my DSR6000s for a year and a half now, and this problem is new in the last couple of months. No reboot occurred - just a loss of data.

My guess is that it's one of those infamous "APG Resets" that DirecTV denies knowing anything about, but in the past, they've been somewhat more benign (resetting the Channels You Receive to include all channels.) DirecTV's response to that is to use the Favorites list, which is not supposed to be touched. Except now it is...

Gunnyman · 07-25-2003, 01:28 PM

ok
so let me UNDERSTAND this...
My Directivo isn't a TIVO supported device AT ALL?

Jeeeze I feel like I am back in the same boat I was in with my buggy as bugy can be PVR 501 from E*

is my 5 bucks a month a licensing fee or something?

Chris Gerhard · 07-25-2003, 01:31 PM

I have never lost channels I receive or any channel list for that matter on any of mine and I have had a DTiVo since October 2000. The bug must be a result of something that I am not doing and maybe caused by a memory overload. It may be possible to dump error messages for review by DirecTV to identify the cause. Unfortunately intermittent bugs that occur once in a while in a small percentage of units are tough to identify.

Chris

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gunnyman2k3
is my 5 bucks a month a licensing fee or something?

If you're referring to the TiVo fee in my mind it covers getting the Program Guide info.

TiVoStephen · 07-25-2003, 01:45 PM

Folks, thanks for the description of the problem. We're investigating with DIRECTV. (As was announced previously, DIRECTV is responsible for the technical and customer support for all DIRECTV with TiVo DVRs.)

Can anyone who is experiencing this issue please send me their 15-digit TiVo Service Number, and the timeframe of when the favorites or other channel lists were cleared?

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chris Gerhard
I have never lost channels I receive or any channel list for that matter on any of mine and I have had a DTiVo since October 2000. The bug must be a result of something that I am not doing and maybe caused by a memory overload. It may be possible to dump error messages for review by DirecTV to identify the cause. Unfortunately intermittent bugs that occur once in a while in a small percentage of units are tough to identify.

Chris

No offense but this doesn't add a lot of value, the fact that it's not happening to you and your speculation as to the cause and that intermittent bugs are hard to fix. I never knew that.

And it's probably not happening to a lot of people but it is happening to some and has been reported and was blown off. Very frustrating. Very.

If it's a bug tell us it's going to be fixed or not, if it's on purpose tells us it's on purpose, just own up to it. We may not be happy with the answer but at least we'll know whether is a software glitch that will be fixed or we have to live with, or some executives idiotic idea.

Chris Gerhard · 07-25-2003, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gunnyman2k3
ok
so let me UNDERSTAND this...
My Directivo isn't a TIVO supported device AT ALL?

Jeeeze I feel like I am back in the same boat I was in with my buggy as bugy can be PVR 501 from E*

is my 5 bucks a month a licensing fee or something?

Part of the fee goes to TiVo and the balance offsets part of the cost to provide the service. Despite what some write about the product here, it is very stable and the service provided by DirecTV is a great value in my opinion. This product works better than any audio video product I have owned and I have been buying home audio video equipment for over 30 years. There have been a few bugs and bug fixes have not been has quick as I would like but I accept that. The Dish PVRs have more serious bugs and offer performance that is not even close to this product.

Without exception, I have turned the TV on for almost 3 years now and programming of my choice is waiting to be viewed at my convenience. This disappearing channel list bug must be annoying to those that have it and I understand their frustration.

Chris

Chris Gerhard · 07-25-2003, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BlankMan
No offense but this doesn't add a lot of value, the fact that it's not happening to you and your speculation as to the cause and that intermittent bugs are hard to fix. I never knew that. And it's probably not happening to a lot of people but it is happening to some and has been reported and was blown off. Very frustrating. Very.

Your whining adds absolutely no value. Try to determine what you have done before it happens and see if you can help determine the cause. Just whining will never fix the problem. If you are too frustrated and expect DirecTV to fix it based on your complaining, get something that works better. If not and you want to help fix the problem do something about it.

Chris

BrettStah · 07-25-2003, 02:07 PM

Are you guys using Standby mode, by any chance? Someone earlier in the thread seemed to link the symptoms with Standby mode, so I'm curious if everyone else reporting the same symptoms also use it. I never use Standby mode and have never seen this issue yet.

stevel · 07-25-2003, 02:09 PM

Here is my earlier thread on this problem.

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chris Gerhard
Your whining adds absolutely no value. Try to determine what you have done before it happens and see if you can help determine the cause. Just whining will never fix the problem. If you are too frustrated and expect DirecTV to fix it based on your complaining, get something that works better. If not and you want to help fix the problem do something about it.

Chris

This shows how much you don't know.

I did absolutely nothing. Wasn't even using it. Haven't in probably a week or more. Last time I used it the Favorite Channels we're there, last night they were gone.

I haven't watched any recorded shows. I haven't changed or added any Season Passes. I haven't altered it's recording habits in any way nor manually deleted or added any recordings.

And whining? You must have a very different Dictionary then the rest of us. I do believe I am reporting a problem. I do believe I now have the attention of TiVoOpsMgr, someone who may be able to do something about it. I do believe he is trying to help.

And what are you doing? Nothing. At least nothing that is of any value that can solve the problem. Unless you're a TiVo software/hardware engineer and not letting on.

Now please, let TiVoOpsMgr handle this.

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BrettStah
Are you guys using Standby mode, by any chance? Someone earlier in the thread seemed to link the symptoms with Standby mode, so I'm curious if everyone else reporting the same symptoms also use it. I never use Standby mode and have never seen this issue yet.

No, I never use Standby, I leave them on all the time and they are on a UPS also. This way if I happened to turn on the TV in the middle of some program that looks good I have it in the 30 minute buffer.

BrettStah · 07-25-2003, 02:19 PM

Oh well, it was worth a shot!

This reminds me of the sporadic problem with the time drifting on DirecTivos... took a long time (too long) for DirecTV to acknowledge the problem, and it has occurred again once or twice at least since they initially fixed it. It appears to be related to receivers that get local channels off of the 119° satellite. If both tuners were on channels from that satellite, the clock would drift, sometimes winding up over a minute slow. Then when it would switch channels (late, of course) to channels on another satellite (like 101°) the time would re-sync correctly, but the recording would wind up a minute or so short.

Mark Lopez · 07-25-2003, 02:22 PM

Here is where it happened to me http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...hreadid=121914

Chris Gerhard · 07-25-2003, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BlankMan
This shows how much you don't know.

I did absolutely nothing. Wasn't even using it. Haven't in probably a week or more. Last time I used it the Favorite Channels we're there, last night they were gone.

I haven't watched any recorded shows. I haven't changed or added any Season Passes. I haven't altered it's recording habits in any way nor manually deleted or added any recordings.

And whining? You must have a very different Dictionary then the rest of us. I do believe I am reporting a problem. I do believe I now have the attention of TiVoOpsMgr, someone who may be able to do something about it. I do believe he is trying to help.

And what are you doing? Nothing. At least nothing that is of any value that can solve the problem. Unless you're a TiVo software/hardware engineer and not letting on.

Now please, let TiVoOpsMgr handle this.

I am not stopping anybody from doing anything and I am happy to let anybody fix the problem that can. So that is an absurd request for me to let TiVoOpsMgr handle it. Show me where I have done anything to impede anybody from fixing it. DirecTV is responsible for the fix and I have read about 10 posts from you complaining about the problem including requests for DirecTV to acknowledge deliberately doing it or that there is a problem and since they haven't fixed it, at least respond to you acknowledging the problem. That reads like whining to me. If I had the problem on one of mine and not the others I would make an effort to determine what might be different with the affected unit. The bugs on DTiVos have always been fixed slowly including the reversed right and left audio when using the digital audio output that affected all units a couple of years ago. This bug is rare and so far the cause unidentified as far as I know. Reporting the problem is fine, I would have reported it if I had it as well. My posts acknowledge a problem that needs to be fixed and were to the point in my opinion.

Chris

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 02:32 PM

You know, reading your other threads got me to wondering if the box looses it's list of channels I received from DTV and it thinks I don't receive a particular channel, it then removes it from the Favorite Channels list. That would be logical. So for some reason it loses all channels and then goes and removes them one by one from the Favorite Channels list. So the root cause may be something DTV signal/receiver related, due to a problem or glitch or on purpose, and not really a TiVo software problem.

But when this happens, it does not happen across the board, usually to 1 out of 4 DTiVo's, the other 3 do not loose the list, so that would say that particular DTV receiver is targeted.

<edit spelling>

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chris Gerhard
I am not...

I'm trying to say this as nicely as I can, I don't care about your opinion, I don't care for your help. So, read between the lines.

TiVoOpsMgr is handling it, he just PM'd me.

Fustanella · 07-25-2003, 03:08 PM

That explains the hidden face on the avatar.

BlankMan · 07-25-2003, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fustanella
That explains the hidden face on the avatar.

I don't get it? What does?

Actually not hidden, the camera adjusted the exposure based on the background, I just thought it fit the moniker. That's a un-retouched pic, it's surprising, the detail is there, just can't see it, gamma adjustment will bring it out.

neilaevans · 07-25-2003, 07:25 PM

Just wanted to add that I've had a similar problem twice within the last year...my DSR6000 has forgotten which channels it receives (and thinks it receives none), causing my favorite channels to disappear as well. The only way to fix it has been to go back and manually re-add all of the channels back to the "channels I receive" list.

As I said, this has happened twice in the last year, after working flawlessly for about a year before that. And no, standby mode is not used.

BeauB · 07-27-2003, 01:45 PM

I have had this happen many times and on at least two of my three DSR6000's and on my Sony SAT-T60. I have had it drop my favorite's list settings as well as my modified "Channels You Receive" list. It is very frustrating since DTV puts so many useless channels in the mix (like between ESPN and HGTV, all the stupid shopping channels, the religious channels, etc...)

BlankMan - thanks for pushing this issue with Tivo! I must have reset my fav's 10+ times on each box. It will be great if they come up with a fix!

Just to add - never use standby and I have seen this happen on a Tivo with no hack's/upgrades. I have left my vacation home with everything working just fine and then when I return in a couple of weeks the lists are blown away. Another time I was watching TV, surf the guide - selected a channel from the guide watched for a second and then pressed guide again to find an empty guide.