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Old 11-19-2014, 03:57 PM   #571
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Originally Posted by Marty1781 View Post
Apparently, the speed indicator LED is only present on the early run production units but was taken out on the later runs. I purchased a unit from Staples about a month ago and it had the speed indicator LED on it so I guess it had been sitting around for a while.
Thanks for the info!

I have the speed indicator on 2 units that I just bought from Amazon. I've got another on order (to replace my Roamio as a bridge), I hope it has it as well.

Have to say - love the product, not too impressed with the Actiontec non-existent documentation or their useless website.
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Old 11-19-2014, 04:23 PM   #572
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FYI - Just received and installed my second Actiontec ECB3500T01 and discovered that the Roamio isn't as good a performer as a ethernet/MoCA bridge as the Actiontec.

I did testing between a laptop and my desktop PC which has a web server running the Speedtest.net Mini Bandwidth Speed Test. With both on gigabit ethernet, the laptop running FireFox results in speeds of over 300 Mbps when running the speedtest on the desktop. When I moved the laptop downstairs and connected it to a gigabit switch connected to the Roamio Pro (so Desktop PC -> Actiontec1 -> MoCA -> Roamio Pro -> gigabit switch -> laptop), it would only do 105 Mbps. Just now testing it on the second Actiontec (so Desktop PC -> Actiontec1 -> MoCA -> Actiontec2 -> laptop) the laptop did 165 Mbps.

So the Roamio Pro with it's gigabit ethernet port is still an inferior bridge to the Actiontec ECB3500T01. And the Actiontec has 4 gigabit ethernet ports.
Yes, I mentioned earlier how using the Roamio as a Bridge was a little slower. But I didn't remember the difference being so large.
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Old 11-19-2014, 04:36 PM   #573
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The green light indicates a link speed of >225 mbps and an amber light indicates speed of 150-224 mbps. I had to call Actiontec in order to get this information (not available on the website). Apparently, the speed indicator LED is only present on the early run production units but was taken out on the later runs. I purchased a unit from Staples about a month ago and it had the speed indicator LED on it so I guess it had been sitting around for a while.
Odd they don't publish any of this info. I wonder how accurate the indicator really is. As I said mine is usually off or amber but I seem to get about 160-170mb/s data rate which is close to the 175mb/s data rate limit of moca 1.1.
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Old 11-19-2014, 04:54 PM   #574
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The Actiontec is also inferior as a GigE switch. For TiVo use it's perfectly fine but for GigE connections the speeds seemed to max out around 600mb/s if I remember correctly.

I initially had my TiVo PC connected directly to the Actiontec but since I couldn't get my normal 900mb/s + throughput to my PCs, so I switched it back to a Dlink GigE switch. So the Actiontec connects to my Minis over MoCA and then uses one of it's GigE ports to go to my Dlink switch which then gives it access to my Roamios, Premiere and TiVo PC. As well as internet access for the Minis.
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Old 11-19-2014, 05:13 PM   #575
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So you're going to stick with your untrue "absolute" story that if someone has cable tv as their service provider, as I do, that they can't use deca to transmit whole home signals to their minis and enjoy just like anyone else with a host Roamio and minis throughout their house on moca? How is this ANY different unless someone happens to have another full TiVo or wants a raw RF cable signal to their tv, etc. elsewhere in their home? In the Roamio whole home day and age (which you seem to ignore), there isn't really a reason to distribute the RF cable signal any further than where the host TiVo resides, except in the use cases above which I've agreed with and mentioned MANY times already, that it doesn't work ON TOP OF cable, but it can work WITH cable as your service. Get your head out of the "Absolutes" cloud!
What I said is 100% correct. DECA and cable are NOT compatible. Of course any two technologies, when they are running on totally separate networks, can run alongside each other. Running on a second, separate set of RG-6 cables is NOT working WITH cable. It's working on a totally SEPARATE network. So those two things have nothing to do with each other.

Most people don't have two RG-6 runs to where their Roamio is, and you still haven't shown why there is a point to adding a whole bunch of extra hardware to the TiVo setup, when MoCA can do it without the extra adapters on each Mini, and with a single coax network?

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Odd they don't publish any of this info. I wonder how accurate the indicator really is. As I said mine is usually off or amber but I seem to get about 160-170mb/s data rate which is close to the 175mb/s data rate limit of moca 1.1.
Is it MoCA 2.0 then? MoCA 1.1 can't get anywhere near the speeds posted above.
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Old 11-19-2014, 05:29 PM   #576
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Is it MoCA 2.0 then? MoCA 1.1 can't get anywhere near the speeds posted above.
Umm, these are standard moca 1.1 speeds. Maybe you were reading it as megabytes (capital B), not megabits. I wish I could get moca 2.0. I can't find any consumer devices.
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Old 11-19-2014, 07:45 PM   #577
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The above speeds are most likely PHY rates (PHY rates are always higher than data rates).

Moca 1.1 peaks at around 275-ish (175 mbps data).



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Old 11-19-2014, 08:08 PM   #578
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Setting up a MoCA Network for Tivo

Right. Marty1781 was referring to PHY rates in reference to the speed indicator on the ecb3500t01 units. I was referring to actual data rate on my network. That's why I indicated I am surprised that I'm getting close to full data rates with an off or amber light should indicate a low PHY rate and hence not close to full data rate.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:29 PM   #579
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If the above rates someone listed earlier were PHY rates wouldn't that be rather slow? On my four Minis the MoCA PHY rates are listed between 270Mbps and 290Mbps.

My Actiontec has a spot listed as speed. But I have never seen an LED light up there. I've only seen the power, Coax, and switch port LEDs light up.
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Old 11-20-2014, 02:24 PM   #580
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeba View Post
I have the speed indicator on 2 units that I just bought from Amazon. I've got another on order (to replace my Roamio as a bridge), I hope it has it as well.
I received my third ECB3500T01 and set it up. All three have the speed indicator. Doing my laptop <-> Desktop speed test, I can get 160Mbps through the Actiontecs. Here's the PHY status display (3 Actiontec units and the Roamio):

From/To:
# 000 001 002 003
0 266 272 268 271
1 265 265 269 269
2 270 269 268 275
3 280 269 271 274
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Old 11-20-2014, 05:25 PM   #581
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Umm, these are standard moca 1.1 speeds. Maybe you were reading it as megabytes (capital B), not megabits. I wish I could get moca 2.0. I can't find any consumer devices.
A post above says real-world 165mbps. I thought 175mbps was the theoretical max, with a real-world around 100mbps?

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Right. Marty1781 was referring to PHY rates in reference to the speed indicator on the ecb3500t01 units. I was referring to actual data rate on my network. That's why I indicated I am surprised that I'm getting close to full data rates with an off or amber light should indicate a low PHY rate and hence not close to full data rate.
Yeah, I didn't realize that 1.1 could do a real-world 165mbps.
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Old 11-20-2014, 06:03 PM   #582
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A post above says real-world 165mbps. I thought 175mbps was the theoretical max, with a real-world around 100mbps?



Yeah, I didn't realize that 1.1 could do a real-world 165mbps.
I guess it's a good thing I didn't know it couldn't!

My tests show 160 - 165 Mbps as measured by hooking a laptop with gigabit ethernet to one Actiontec ECB35000T01 going via coax to a second Actiontec ECB3500T01 to a desktop PC with gigabit ethernet. The desktop PC is running a recent version of the Speedtest.net Mini Bandwidth Speed Test.

Copying a file using TiVo Desktop from the Roamio Pro -> coax -> Actiontec ECB3500T01 -> desktop PC resulted in 105 Mbps transfer. As I'd noted before, the Roamio doesn't seem as fast as the Actiontecs. Hooking the laptop up to the Roamio ethernet port and running the speedtest.net resulted in a similar reading - 105 Mbps. So the speedtest.net seems a reliable measure.
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Old 11-20-2014, 11:11 PM   #583
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A post above says real-world 165mbps. I thought 175mbps was the theoretical max, with a real-world around 100mbps?



Yeah, I didn't realize that 1.1 could do a real-world 165mbps.
Just depends on the adapters ethernet speed. Most seem to be bottlenecked by 100mb/s ethernet but actiontec also makes an adapter with 4 gige ports, thus removing the ethernet bottleneck and allowing full moca 1.1 speed. I'm assuming devices that have moca built in such as tivo see full moca speeds as well since link is directly through coax.
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Old 11-21-2014, 07:08 AM   #584
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I'm assuming devices that have moca built in such as tivo see full moca speeds as well since link is directly through coax.
My testing of the Roamio Pro doesn't support that theory. When transferring from the Roamio Pro -> coax -> Actiontec -> PC I see 105Mbps transfers (transferred 5gb HD video file) . That's nowhere near the 165 Mbps I see between my desktop and laptop hooked to Actiontecs.

In my tests, transfers from the Roamio using ethernet or MoCA were of similar speeds - 105Mbps.
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Old 11-21-2014, 08:04 AM   #585
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My testing of the Roamio Pro doesn't support that theory. When transferring from the Roamio Pro -> coax -> Actiontec -> PC I see 105Mbps transfers (transferred 5gb HD video file) . That's nowhere near the 165 Mbps I see between my desktop and laptop hooked to Actiontecs.



In my tests, transfers from the Roamio using ethernet or MoCA were of similar speeds - 105Mbps.

Interesting. Wonder why that is.
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Old 11-21-2014, 09:24 AM   #586
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My testing of the Roamio Pro doesn't support that theory. When transferring from the Roamio Pro -> coax -> Actiontec -> PC I see 105Mbps transfers (transferred 5gb HD video file) . That's nowhere near the 165 Mbps I see between my desktop and laptop hooked to Actiontecs.

In my tests, transfers from the Roamio using ethernet or MoCA were of similar speeds - 105Mbps.
I get over 170Mb/s transfer rates from my Roamio Pro using the GigE port as reported on the transfer history page on the Tivo. I'll typically hit 175Mb/s speeds as reported from KMTTG.
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Old 11-21-2014, 10:27 AM   #587
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I get over 170Mb/s transfer rates from my Roamio Pro using the GigE port as reported on the transfer history page on the Tivo. I'll typically hit 175Mb/s speeds as reported from KMTTG.
I did not see that in the testing I did. Is the Roamio hooking into an Actiontec unit or into your gigabit backbone? Maybe it's the Actiontec limiting my Roamio.... though when I hooked my laptop up to this same Actiontec, I did see higher speeds (165Mbps).
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Old 11-21-2014, 11:00 AM   #588
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I did not see that in the testing I did. Is the Roamio hooking into an Actiontec unit or into your gigabit backbone? Maybe it's the Actiontec limiting my Roamio.... though when I hooked my laptop up to this same Actiontec, I did see higher speeds (165Mbps).
I do not use the GigE switch on the Actiontec to connect my other devices. It is lacking in speed. In my tests the GigE ports maxed out around 600Mb/s when I tested PC to PC(somewhere around those speeds. i don't remember exactly but it was much slower than my Dlinks). My Dlink GigE Switches can hit up to 950Mb/s throughput when I transfer PC to PC. So the only thing connected to my Actiontec is my four minnis over MoCA, and then i use one GigE port that connects to a Dlink GigE switch. And that switch is what my data goes through to get to my other TiVos and PC running KMTTG. So I only use my Actiontec to feed data to my four Minis using MoCA.
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Old 11-21-2014, 11:36 AM   #589
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Just retried the transfer tests.

Roamio -> MoCA -> Actiontec -> PC
using KMTTG : 96.27 Mbps [5gb file]

Roamio -> Actiontec Ethernet -> MoCA -> Actiontec -> PC
using KMTTG : 106.77 Mbps [same 5gb file]

Again, my testing using my laptop:
Laptop -> Actiontec Ethernet -> MoCA -> Actiontec -> PC
using speedtest.net mini test : 166 Mbps

So not sure what's going on with the Roamio.
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Old 11-21-2014, 12:33 PM   #590
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The Roamio's moca may be bandwidth bottlenecked. Either technically or intentionally for the sake of stability. (Even its ethernet path has a bandwidth limit of 160ish on the Plus/Pro, an improvement over S3 and Premieres).

A single one-way transfer won't max out a moca network, but multiple transfers could. If someone were to transfer multiple things to/from the Tivo at once over moca, the combined throughput would probably show something closer to the moca cap.

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Old 11-21-2014, 02:46 PM   #591
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I get over 170Mb/s transfer rates from my Roamio Pro using the GigE port as reported on the transfer history page on the Tivo. I'll typically hit 175Mb/s speeds as reported from KMTTG.
The best transfer speed I have gotten from a Roamio to a Roamio (using MoCa) is 95mb/s and I have a GieE system. You must have a great network to get up to 170Mb/s on your xfers. My MoCa reports about 260 on all TiVo units.
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Old 11-21-2014, 02:54 PM   #592
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The bandwidth limit is at least in the 170's for the GigE port. This was a transfer from my Roamio Pro to a PC running KMTTG.


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Old 11-21-2014, 05:18 PM   #593
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Just depends on the adapters ethernet speed. Most seem to be bottlenecked by 100mb/s ethernet but actiontec also makes an adapter with 4 gige ports, thus removing the ethernet bottleneck and allowing full moca 1.1 speed. I'm assuming devices that have moca built in such as tivo see full moca speeds as well since link is directly through coax.
Interesting. It could be that back when I read the reviews and got the <100mbps stuck in my head they didn't have gig adapters to remove that bottleneck... MoCA is pretty darn impressive considering how widespread coax cabling is compared to CAT-6.
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Old Today, 07:45 AM   #594
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I have a Roamio Basic hard wired to my AT&T 20 Mbps modem and want to set up a MoCA network on the existing RG-6 cables. I know I will need an adapter at each demarcation point. My question is: will I further need two additional adapters - one for the modem and one for the main Roamio, or just one more with the Roamio and modem combined together? I've read varying thoughts on this so any advice would be helpful.
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Old Today, 08:49 AM   #595
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I have a Roamio Basic hard wired to my AT&T 20 Mbps modem and want to set up a MoCA network on the existing RG-6 cables. I know I will need an adapter at each demarcation point. My question is: will I further need two additional adapters - one for the modem and one for the main Roamio, or just one more with the Roamio and modem combined together? I've read varying thoughts on this so any advice would be helpful.
1. They are not "demarcation points". There is one "demarcation point", which is where your cable provider hands off the coax from their RG-6 or RG-11 to your RG-6. There's also one for AT&T at the NID, but that's irrelevant.

2. Since your Roamio is already hardwired to the U-Verse gateway, keep it that way, and add an adapter connected to the U-Verse gateway, and not to the TiVo. That way, you'd bridge the Ethernet network to MoCA without having multiple adapters, which would be silly since you already have a hardwired link between the TiVo and the U-Verse RG. Sure, in theory, you could have two MoCA adapters, but that'd be a waste since you have the ability to run Ethernet. The only reason you'd want two MoCA adapters is if the TiVo and U-Verse RG were in different rooms and there was no way to run Ethernet between them.

3. You only need one MoCA adapter, after that, when you add Minis, they already have MoCA built in. If you wanted an S3 or 2-tuner Premiere, they would need a MoCA adapter, but Minis don't. So you'll likely only need one MoCA adapter.
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Old Today, 09:22 AM   #596
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Thank you for your informative and very clear answer.

Sorry, I'm not yet up with the "language". I am somewhat familiar with the term, but clearly misused it.
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Old Today, 10:14 AM   #597
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Just in case it isn't clear, Templar69's question was regarding a base Roamio, which itself has no MoCA, unlike the Plus/Pro, that have it built-in (and Minis can't actually be used as bridges, or to create a MoCA network, but are only able to be used on one).

I'm not sure enough of the original question, to know if that part may have been left out of Bigg's answer (by possibly missing the base model part).

It seems like it could be irellevant. But, I just wanted to make sure, since some use ethernet to the TiVo, then use the TiVo to create a MoCA bridge, when they have one with MoCA, or some still just prefer to still not do that, due to it slowing things down, when compared to throughput of standalone adapters.
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