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Old 06-13-2014, 03:16 PM   #1
jhjones75
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Probably a stupid MOCA question

So I've had MOCA up and running for about 3 years now. Plugged everything in and all was working just fine so never really questioned it. However, recently one of my adapters (MCA1001v1) began having problems and not seeing the MOCA network and it made me start trying to follow the logic of the whole thing. I fixed that issue (ended up that both the cat5 and the coax cable were bad - either that or rebooting the device a few dozen times fixed it and the whole device is slowly dying).

Either way, I still have some questions:

I have a Premiere XL4 with the builtin MOCA. I've got it sitting next to the cable modem and the ethernet is plugged in there. I also have the coax split to go in there and it is listed in settings as Ethernet+MOCA

I have 2 other MCA1001v1's. One is plugged in upstairs and has a 2 tuner premiere hanging off it (the one having issues). The other is in the basement plugged into an internet ready TV

The 2 MCA adapters can both get to the internet now and everything seems fine. When I plug directly into each and go into their settings they can each see all 3 MOCA adapters and show link and everything is hunky-dory.

However when I go into the settings on the XL4, it shows the MOCA link is down and can't see the other 2. Obviously, it's working as the other 2 can get to the internet.

If I unplug the ethernet on it it sees the MOCA network and says the link is up, but obviously no one can get to the internet. When I plug it back in it says link is down but everything works.

I have gone in and disabled moca and gone back to re-enable it and chosen the "join an existing network" option and it couldn't find one. If I go to re-enable it and choose to create a new one it works, and the other devices are fine. However, it still says link down.

Everything is technically working, so I know I don't really have a problem, but it feels like it should be able to see the link up and show me the other devices. Am I missing something?

Thanks!
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Old 06-13-2014, 07:49 PM   #2
nooneuknow
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Do you happen to have a Cisco tuning adapter?

If so, are you using the proper connection method, for when MoCA is involved?

This is using a splitter with one leg going into the TiVo, and the other leg with a PoE filter, going into the TA.

The incorrect way is using the TA "out" coax port to connect the TiVo.

Cable provider, and verification of TA (if you have one) connection method, please.

It may seem irrelevant, but I've seen this connection difference create a lot of issues of different types, especially recently.
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Old 06-13-2014, 08:28 PM   #3
jhjones75
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No tuning adapter. I have Comcast. I also don't have a PoE filter. Everything always seemed to work okay, so never saw the point. Altho I ordered one today from Amazon.
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Old 06-13-2014, 10:15 PM   #4
BigJimOutlaw
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I think the "network down" thing has come up before, it's a weird little Tivo bug of some kind. If everything's otherwise working I wouldn't sweat it much.
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Old 06-13-2014, 11:47 PM   #5
jhjones75
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So apparently all the troubleshooting I did today didn't really fix it. The premiere off the adapter is having its issues again. It's getting the C133 error and when I try to troubleshoot it it's not grabbing an IP. Static doesn't help either.

All the lights are on on the MOCA but it's acting like it can't see the rest of the network. Last time it did this I swapped the MOCA adapters to see if the problem traveled with it, which it didn't.

At this point I don't know if the premiere's Ethernet port is dying or if the moca on the elite is wonky. We only watch this TV right before bed so I'm usually not in the mood to troubleshoot at 11pm. Any ideas?
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Old 06-13-2014, 11:58 PM   #6
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Okay. So I broke down and grabbed my laptop and plugged it into the adapter and it couldn't grab an IP. All the lights are on the adapter indicating that it has a connection to the coax network.

The Elite is the only point in here I don't know how to test. It's the bridge and it doesn't sound like it's bridging. Thoughts?
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Old 06-14-2014, 02:23 AM   #7
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Yeah, ignore what the tivo reports about it being down... Is your tivo software 20.4.1? That version generally seemed to fix the Moca info display issue for a lot of folks (including me)

You said you swapped out coax.... Did you look at your splitter(s)? They need to be rated to a high enough frequency, and they can simply become flakey, get damaged by surges,etc over time

Adding the Moca filter does a few things for you.
-Security.
-Blocks interference in the Moca frequency range from outside.
-shortens the total amount of wire the Moca signal has to travel down.
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Last edited by lgnad : 06-14-2014 at 02:35 AM.
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Old 06-14-2014, 10:29 AM   #8
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I just checked. It's 20.3.8-01-2-758. Is there an update I'm missing?

I've already swapped the moca adapter's out and the problem did not follow the adapter. I also swapped out all the cables on this adapter that seems to be having problems and no change. This one just has coax straight out of the wall with no splitter and the Tivo is the only thing plugged into it.

It was still dead when I got up this morning so I played around a little bit. If I go into the Elite and turn off the bridge and turn it back on, it starts working again. I did that yesterday and it worked for a while. So that tells me it's a problem with the Elite.

Has anyone heard of the bridge in the Elite dying? That seems crazy. Everything on the elite (cable and internet-wise) seems fine.
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Old 06-14-2014, 10:31 AM   #9
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Oh and there are only 2 splitters in the house. One at the tap and one at the cable modem. I was having some bad channels not turning about 6 months ago and called Comcast out and they swapped out both of the splitters and all my other problems went away.
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Old 06-14-2014, 08:26 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhjones75 View Post
I just checked. It's 20.3.8-01-2-758. Is there an update I'm missing?

I've already swapped the moca adapter's out and the problem did not follow the adapter. I also swapped out all the cables on this adapter that seems to be having problems and no change. This one just has coax straight out of the wall with no splitter and the Tivo is the only thing plugged into it.

It was still dead when I got up this morning so I played around a little bit. If I go into the Elite and turn off the bridge and turn it back on, it starts working again. I did that yesterday and it worked for a while. So that tells me it's a problem with the Elite.

Has anyone heard of the bridge in the Elite dying? That seems crazy. Everything on the elite (cable and internet-wise) seems fine.
You need to get the software update. Contact Tivo and let them know you're behind a version! The display bug will go away, and you'll actually be able to see if you're getting moca errors, etc. We're actually expecting the next update pretty soon, too!

I dont agree that what you're seeing is narrowed down to the bridge dying. You have two locations, one where an adapter works fine, one where it doesnt, whether connected to a tivo or a laptop....

I'd get the POE filter installed and the software update before doing anyting more extreme!
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Old 06-15-2014, 06:42 PM   #11
jhjones75
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Well I pulled the power on the Elite and did a connect to Tivo service when it came back on and it did finally do the update. The MOCA status now shows correctly, too.

Fingers crossed it magically fixed the issue. Thanks for all the help!
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Old 06-16-2014, 11:52 PM   #12
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So still having the same problem. I've swapped my 2 moca devices out with each other and the same issue.

I'm an IT guy, although not a network guy, so am having trouble with my next level of troubleshooting. I appear to be having some fault with the current setup of: Premiere -- cat5 -- moca (which also has coax out to tv) -- coax into wall. Then we have elite bridge with one cat5 to the router and one coax into splitter. Splitter has coax out to cable modem and the final input back into the wall. This has all been this way forever and all of a sudden something is failing.

When the problem occurs the moca on the elite can no longer pull and ip for it. Which means its a problem with its connectivity to the elite, or the elite bridge not bridging the connections. The cat5 works fine during this because the Stream still works fine.

Here's my next step:

1) remove extra moca from basement and put it in front of the elite. Disable bridging. Coax in from the splitter, coax out to Elite. Cat5 from elite to router. Cat5 from moca to router. The elite needs the coax for cable and Ethernet for network. Moca needs coax and cat5 to function. Moca serves the rest of network and tivo does it's own thing.

2) not sure this would work. Coax from splitter to moca. Coax from moca to elite. Cat5 from moca to router. Enable moca on elite. Can you daisy chain 2 mochas off each other?

Thanks for any thoughts. Just trying to figure this out with the limited equipment I have.
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Old 06-17-2014, 11:53 AM   #13
jhjones75
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I realize I'm mainly talking to myself here,but it's helping me to walk thru the process so you guys can feel free to ignore, or comment

I took the Elite out of the mix completely and plugged a MOCA adapter into the router directly. Then I enabled the moca on the Elite and it could see the 2 devices (itself and the device connected to the router). Still couldn't see the device upstairs.

So at this point it doesn't appear to be either of my MOCA devices as the problem stays with the location, not the device.

Also not anything to do with the Elite or the Premiere themselves.

I've swapped out all the cables connected to the non-working location.

Logically, there are only a few things left:

1) The missing PoE filter. I have one coming today and will put that on. Not holding out hope on that one, but you never know.

2) The cable drop in the bedroom upstairs. I don't think it's really this either.

3) The splitter in the box provided by Comcast. Looking in the box outside it looks like when the guy was here last year he took my coax coming in and put it into a 2 way splitter and has one of them going to one of the outlets in the house (not the one upstairs, I checked) and the other going into a 5 way splitter, which apparently serves the rest of the house. We have 5 active cable outlets in the house, 3 of which have MOCA devices on them.

I'm thinking it's probably something to do with #3. Either the splitter itself is going, it doesn't like the double-split, or the tap that is going to the bedroom is going and doesn't like the MOCA signal.

Thoughts?

Here's my plan of attack:

1) Put the PoE filter on
2) Figure out which of the taps don't go to a room that has/needs MOCA and move the bedroom connection to that tap.
3) If those don't work, see if I can find a splitter with more connections on it so I can eliminate one of the splitters.
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:34 PM   #14
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I had a similar issue after a prolonged power outage and my battery backups drained. Apparently there is some kind of a "MoCA host" on the network, that, in my case, should be my Verizon router. As my Mini booted up first, that was my "host" and I was getting C133s and other problems with devices streaming and communicating. Powering everything down and rebooting the router first, than the Premiere's, and then the Mini fixed it for me.
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Old 06-17-2014, 04:51 PM   #15
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If the devices are eliminated as the problem and it's isolated to the location, it's just a matter of going further up the chain... Any splitters, amps, physical coax damage, or barrel connectors going to the "dead" moca location are all suspect. (replace with 1000 MHz or higher pass-through.)

If that doesn't solve it, the main splitter is suspect.

You might have already troubleshooted some of the above stuff, I'm just stating in general terms.

POE filter wouldn't hurt, but might not fix it.

Last edited by BigJimOutlaw : 06-17-2014 at 05:04 PM.
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Old 06-19-2014, 10:27 AM   #16
jhjones75
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So what's interesting now is that 2 days ago I moved the connection of this moca device to another end on the splitter at the cable drop. It immediately started working. A few hours later I finally got the PoE filter and things still worked. Great!

Over the past couple days I periodically check on my network thru the app and it shows all the Tivo's as functional and accessible. So I've *maybe* fixed that problem. The problem I'm having now is that at night when I go on the upstairs Tivo and try to watch a show on the downstairs Tivo it will let me browse, but when I go to play I can an error about how I can't watch right now. If I do a manual test of the internet connection it will pass that, and then work just fine. It's done this on me both nights.

Any idea there??
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