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Old 11-22-2012, 03:10 PM   #1
VK-30
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HD Questions - xfer HD, what's next

Hi there. We've had 2 HD units since 2008. Initially, one of them rebooted frequently, and the other's been a rock. I ran all the various kickstart codes when the problem showed up, with no clear sign of success. Sometimes it'll work fine for months, and others, you can't play a program for more than a few minutes.

Earlier this year, it wouldn't boot. I sent the whole thing to Weaknees, who replaced its disc with a 1TB one. They also ran diagnostics and found nothing else wrong. While the unit acts a bit snappier, and has more space, the reboots are still there.

Questions:
========
Can I put the large HD into the more reliable of the 2 units? Would everything surrounding which unit is which, serial number and cable cards just work? One unit has lifetime, the other does not.

For the flaky unit - I'd considered buying a new unit - recommendations on type, and whether or not cablecards will be supported over the long term?

Weaknees did suggest replacing the power supply, sending me pictures of blown caps. Mine look fine. I'd considered swapping the power supplies between the 2 units to see if the problem moved. Any reason that's a bad idea, or whether it's worth the effort if the caps look fine?

TIA.

VK
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Old 11-22-2012, 06:24 PM   #2
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The PS can be a culprit of problems, as well as the HD. You can move the HD to another Tivo of the same model, but you would need to run Clear & Delete Everything. You would lose everything even settings as if you just installed a new Tivo, except the subscription is kept as it was before.
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Old 11-22-2012, 08:02 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VK-30 View Post
Hi there. We've had 2 HD units since 2008. Initially, one of them rebooted frequently, and the other's been a rock. I ran all the various kickstart codes when the problem showed up, with no clear sign of success. Sometimes it'll work fine for months, and others, you can't play a program for more than a few minutes.

Earlier this year, it wouldn't boot. I sent the whole thing to Weaknees, who replaced its disc with a 1TB one. They also ran diagnostics and found nothing else wrong. While the unit acts a bit snappier, and has more space, the reboots are still there.

Questions:
========
Can I put the large HD into the more reliable of the 2 units? Would everything surrounding which unit is which, serial number and cable cards just work? One unit has lifetime, the other does not.

For the flaky unit - I'd considered buying a new unit - recommendations on type, and whether or not cablecards will be supported over the long term?

Weaknees did suggest replacing the power supply, sending me pictures of blown caps. Mine look fine. I'd considered swapping the power supplies between the 2 units to see if the problem moved. Any reason that's a bad idea, or whether it's worth the effort if the caps look fine?

TIA.

VK
Do you have the TCD648250 or the TCD652160?
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Old 11-22-2012, 11:50 PM   #4
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They're both TCD652160s. I'll swap the power supplies back and forth tomorrow.
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:01 AM   #5
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They're both TCD652160s. I'll swap the power supplies back and forth tomorrow.
If I were going to do as you're considering, moving the 1TB drive from the "problem" machine to the lifetimed one (after making sure I knew where I stood power supply-wise), I'd copy the lifetimed machine's hard drive onto the 1TB drive (after making backup truncated images of it with an eye toward eventually getting the problem machine straightened out).

We can discuss how to go about all of that after we settle the power supply question.

In addition to the obvious screws holding the power supply board down on the standoffs on the chassis, there's a smaller screw that takes a smaller Torx bit that screws in from the outside on the back panel to help secure the AC jack.

Remember, always know where both ends of the TiVo power supply cord(s) are at all times.

Would you be interested in putting a 2TB drive in the lifetimed unit?
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:16 AM   #6
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Got it on the transfer. Thanks for the info. Will consider, as U say, once PS question is out of the way. I also read on a tivopedia page that fluctuating power can be an issue. I never paid attention to whether stuff like the washer, drier, dishwasher, etc, are on or not when it reboots. I could test that if swapping PSes does nothing, or put a UPS in and see whether that has an effect.
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:29 AM   #7
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Got it on the transfer. Thanks for the info. Will consider, as U say, once PS question is out of the way. I also read on a tivopedia page that fluctuating power can be an issue. I never paid attention to whether stuff like the washer, drier, dishwasher, etc, are on or not when it reboots. I could test that if swapping PSes does nothing, or put a UPS in and see whether that has an effect.
Don't introduce a UPS into the equation yet (we're trying to diagnose by changing only one variable at a time), although once everything is straightened out your TiVos should be on a UPS.

If a power supply is marginal, then a momentary dip in the voltage on the input could cause enough of a dip in the output to reset the CPU, but for now, just swap supplies and see how each TiVo reacts.
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Old 11-25-2012, 08:48 PM   #8
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OK, I switched the power supplies.

Finally, after about 24 hours, the TiVo with the rebooting problem rebooted, with the power supply from the other unit. The bedroom unit with the problem unit's power supply hasn't rebooted yet. I conclude power supplies have nothing to do with it. HDs normally are a culprit, but since I got a new disc (500 GB, not 1 TB - I looked at it while the case was open), I conclude HD isn't the problem.

So, for the record, a check on tivo.com shows both units have lifetime. I have a vague memory of the year elapsing and then making a deal for lifetime.

So, I think I need to replace the problem unit.

I could put programs using kmttg (just a few I care about) from the problem unit, then put in a new one. I'll have to call TiVo to bitch and work out a deal on transferring the lifetime to the new unit - since I did call within the first month, I figure I have a shot.

Can U all verify that tivo to tivo transfer works between Premiers and HDs? kmttg can take from both? Galleon serves both? Streambaby? If so, it makes no difference what unit's there, so I'll swap HDs and get in a new unit. Old unit I'll pop out the HD and the power supply and chuck it.

All good? Any particular Premiers people like?

For the new unit, just put in the cablecard, or is it more complicated?

Steve
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Old 11-25-2012, 09:19 PM   #9
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How can you tell if the hard drive is bad just by "looking" at it. It may very well be the hard drive that's causing the problem.

streambaby? That just streams video, it does not get recorded to the hard drive. KMTTG downloads recordings, but it can use PyTivo to push to Tivo. And, yes you can transfer from a Series 3 /HD to Premiere, just as long as both are subscribed to Tivo Service.
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Old 11-25-2012, 09:39 PM   #10
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I'm just saying that rebooting problems didn't go away when a new HD was put in. What are the chances of 2 HDs being bad, one out of the box? I could operate them with swapped HDs for a short time to verify we still reboot on the problem box and not on the non-problem box, eliminating the possibility of the new HD in the problem box being the cause.

Thanks on the inter-TiVo info. Its struck me that TiVo is putting all the fancy stuff into the Premieres and it crossed my mind that there might be a deliberately-inflicted compatibility issue.

Disc swapping - so copy off that I care about from the smaller, reliable unit, and the bigger one, put in the buggy unit's 500GB HD in the reliable one replacing its 160GB one, so that the reliable one's bigger, and put in a new TiVo Premiere. I'll go work on them about lifetime transfer. Verify that when I swap the discs, I lose the programming, so copying the files off is required? I was just going to TTG the files to my own HD.

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Old 12-05-2012, 10:12 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VK-30 View Post
I'm just saying that rebooting problems didn't go away when a new HD was put in. What are the chances of 2 HDs being bad, one out of the box? I could operate them with swapped HDs for a short time to verify we still reboot on the problem box and not on the non-problem box, eliminating the possibility of the new HD in the problem box being the cause.

VK
With dual Hard drives in a Tivo, if even 1 speck of a problem arise with either drives and your Tivo can reboot. Removing a drive, deletes shows since recordings are spanned sporadically across the drives. That's the reason most prefer to have a single drive, all the shows and settings would be retained when we need to copy/swap them out.
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:33 PM   #12
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Mind's made up!

OK, it's been a month. The unit that's been stable the whole time has had the power supply from the rebooting one for a month and hasn't rebooted. The one that rebooted a lot still reboots with the other power supply.

Speaking of HDs, I think I didn't post clearly enough. The rebooting unit got a new HD (so still just one disc) and the problem persisted - never had 2 HDs in it.

So, my mind's made up. I'm going to replace the rebooting unit. I'll call TiVo to see what I can do about transferring lifetime or getting a discount on it for a new Premiere.

I'm presently kmttg-ing the few programs I care about off the rebooting unit with its big HD.

I want to transfer its big HD to the good unit. Did someone say I do a "clear and delete everything" on the rebooting unit with big HD, then put its HD into the good unit? Anything else I need to know?

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Old 12-30-2012, 12:34 PM   #13
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Thanks for the input. No dual HDs - the unit got a new 500GB disc, replacing the original disc. Problem remained.
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Old 12-30-2012, 01:45 PM   #14
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Don't tell me if this is sub-par, but I got them to take $200 off lifetime fee, and a Premiere is on its way. Once it's set up and stable I can do the HD swap. Reading has shown that MFSLive could be a good tool?
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Old 12-30-2012, 02:54 PM   #15
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Quote:
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Don't tell me if this is sub-par, but I got them to take $200 off lifetime fee, and a Premiere is on its way. Once it's set up and stable I can do the HD swap. Reading has shown that MFSLive could be a good tool?
The only known way right now to upgrade a Premiere is with comer's jmfs--there's a whole thread about it.

With S3s and below you can still use MFS Live or WinMFS, but you can't use them on S4s.

You might want to see if newegg and/or Amazon are still offering the 2TB WD20EURS for $100 and grab one to put in that Premiere, because jmfs will only let you upgrade once.

Then you can put your next biggest drive into the "good" S3.

Did your deal involve giving up Lifetime on either of your S3 HDs, or was it just a discount on Lifetime on the S4?


BTW, you can also use WinMFS to upgrade an S3 HD to a 1TB drive and then use jmfs to upgrade that to a 2TB drive, so you might want to grab 2 of those WDs before the price goes back up or they get discontinued.
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Old 12-30-2012, 05:41 PM   #16
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Right. The deal was a transfer of lifetime from the rebooting TiVo HD with the 500 GB drive to a new Premiere. So I'll take its 500 GB and stuff it in the working TiVo HD, which has the stock 160 GB drive. Rebooting TiVo HD will cease to exist.

I'm not afraid of Linux, really. I have one machine running Ubuntu in the house. Despite that, seems WinMFS is simplest for transferring 1 HD from a TiVo HD to another TiVo HD.

Looking here:
http://www.mfslive.org/winmfs/quickstart.htm

Seems that I would back up the 160 GB disc in case something goes wrong, then simply do the disc to disc copy from the 500 GB to the 160 GB, right?

VK
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Old 12-30-2012, 07:08 PM   #17
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On running Clear & Delete Everything, You run it AFTER the HD is in a different Tivo box, not before. It marries it to the Tivo and its Service number.

The rebooting issue may be caused by the HD, if its less than perfect of problems.
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Old 12-30-2012, 07:29 PM   #18
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Right. The deal was a transfer of lifetime from the rebooting TiVo HD with the 500 GB drive to a new Premiere. So I'll take its 500 GB and stuff it in the working TiVo HD, which has the stock 160 GB drive. Rebooting TiVo HD will cease to exist.

I'm not afraid of Linux, really. I have one machine running Ubuntu in the house. Despite that, seems WinMFS is simplest for transferring 1 HD from a TiVo HD to another TiVo HD.

Looking here:
http://www.mfslive.org/winmfs/quickstart.htm

Seems that I would back up the 160 GB disc in case something goes wrong, then simply do the disc to disc copy from the 500 GB to the 160 GB, right?

VK
If rebooting S3 is going to be well and truly retired, then save it for parts.

Are there any shows on the 500GB that was in it that you want to save?

TiVo should have given you a grace period of maybe a month before it gets de-activated, account status-wise, to move shows, so use TiVo Desktop to copy over everything you want to an NTFS partition on the PC, or if you don't care about meta data like when the show was recorded you can go straight to one of the other two TiVos.

I recommend copying to computer via Desktop to reduce confusion and maximize options.

Anyway, once you've salvaged what you want to from the 500, you can use WinMFS to copy the 160 to it and expand.

This will allow you one further upgrade, via jmfs, in the future.

Make sure the 160 is set up like you want it, season passes, wishlists, cable card parings, whatever, and then copy it and tuck it away somewhere safe, so if you ever need it again for troubleshooting or because of catastrophic failure of the 500, you'll have it.

Using WinMFS to make a truncated backup of it before copying it to the 500 is also something you should do.

It wouldn't be the end of the world if you also used the MFS Live cd v1.4 to make a backup of it that it can work with as a further precaution.

Though from the same guy, MFS Live and WinMFS make backups the other can't understand.

If you have trouble downloading either from mfslive.org, PM me.

And remember, never use either of them on a Premiere or other Series 4 drive.

For those you boot straight into the jmfs cd.

And don't do any of this work, or even connect the drives to it on a GigaByte brand motherboard unless we talk further about precautions that must be taken.
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