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Old 01-20-2014, 09:18 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
So is Comcast going to start encrypting the locals around the entire country? I wonder when the other major cable providers will start doing this?
Comcast has been doing this for some time now, the ATL was encrypted last month. They are going to do the whole footprint.

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r283...ncryption-here
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Old 01-20-2014, 01:12 PM   #62
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So is Comcast going to start encrypting the locals around the entire country? I wonder when the other major cable providers will start doing this?
and they are about to tack on a fee on the locals as well,
http://www.dslreports.com/news/127393
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Old 01-20-2014, 03:36 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by CrispyCritter View Post
I have seen reports here, but haven't seen them substantiated by looking at the hardware, that the Roamio has an extra internal amplifier because of the 6-way split. This seems consistent with various reports like this one and other reports that there are occasionally more problems when multiple tuners are on the same channel (eg after reboot). Has someone verify this on the hardware?
I can confirm at least in my situation that I had a base and a pro and the base showed signal levels in the high 80's while the pro showed levels of high 90's and 100 using the same cable tv coax. I took that to mean there's some internal amplification going on in the pro.
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Old 01-20-2014, 04:46 PM   #64
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If your signal strength is above 90 you need to get it lower. Tivo told me between 85 and 90 is the best. Any higher and it causes problems. If Comcast wont give you an antenuator then go pick up a 4 way splitter and put it in line. That will drop you 7 DB's
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Old 01-20-2014, 06:02 PM   #65
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If your signal strength is above 90 you need to get it lower. Tivo told me between 85 and 90 is the best. Any higher and it causes problems. If Comcast wont give you an antenuator then go pick up a 4 way splitter and put it in line. That will drop you 7 DB's
My signal strength sits at 100% and I have never had a single problem. The SNR is much more important. The Roamio's are much better at dealing with a high SNR than the Premiere was. Btw, the SNR has nothing to do with the original posters issues.
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Old 01-20-2014, 06:44 PM   #66
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Btw, the SNR has nothing to do with the original posters issues.
So it's the signal strength then?
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Old 01-20-2014, 07:38 PM   #67
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So it's the signal strength then?
No, I doubt signal has anything to do with the original poster. Either his Roamio is defective or Comcast doesn't know how to pair his card correctly.
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Old 01-20-2014, 08:04 PM   #68
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No, I doubt signal has anything to do with the original poster. Either his Roamio is defective or Comcast doesn't know how to pair his card correctly.
I had pretty much the same symptoms as the OP (on two different Roamios) and the only thing that fixed it was putting a 4-way splitter in-line.

And I don't think it's Cox, because before TiVo told me to drop the SNR down to the mid-30s, I could swap out the Roamio the old XL4 that it was replacing, and the card would pair the card perfectly on the XL4, every time. Did that probably 5-6x during the troubleshooting. Then swap the XL4 with the Roamio, and have them pair the same card the same way they just did with the XL4, and no-go. Showed perfectly fine on their end, but no encrypted channels on my end.
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Old 01-20-2014, 09:20 PM   #69
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I had pretty much the same symptoms as the OP (on two different Roamios) and the only thing that fixed it was putting a 4-way splitter in-line.

And I don't think it's Cox, because before TiVo told me to drop the SNR down to the mid-30s, I could swap out the Roamio the old XL4 that it was replacing, and the card would pair the card perfectly on the XL4, every time. Did that probably 5-6x during the troubleshooting. Then swap the XL4 with the Roamio, and have them pair the same card the same way they just did with the XL4, and no-go. Showed perfectly fine on their end, but no encrypted channels on my end.
It is possible but the original poster already noted they had other cablecard TiVos on the same line with no issues. In my experience, the Roamio is less susceptible to SNR issues than the Premiere (but maybe more so than the TiVo HD). But without the original poster giving us any details to the SNR or to their cablecard pairing screen info, it is impossible to tell.
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Old 01-20-2014, 10:42 PM   #70
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It is possible but the original poster already noted they had other cablecard TiVos on the same line with no issues.
Right, so did I.

When I upgrade my Living Room TiVo, the only thing that changes is the TiVo model.

The wall jack stays the same.
The cable card and tuning adapter stay the same.
The wiring (coax, HDMI, power, USB-to-tuning adapter, ethernet) stays the same.

All I do is unplug/remove the old TiVo, swap the cable card to the new TiVo, put the new TiVo on the shelf + plug the wires back in, and then call Cox to pair the cable card with the new TiVo.

Zero problems pairing a Premiere.
Zero problems pairing an XL4.
Absolutely could not get a Roamio paired (using the exact same everything that the Premiere and XL4 used) until a 4-way splitter was added in-line.

Quote:
But without the original poster giving us any details to the SNR or to their cablecard pairing screen info, it is impossible to tell.
Agreed, which is why I was confused when you said "Btw, the SNR has nothing to do with the original posters issues."

I just wanted to share my experience with the OP, as I had pretty much the same symptoms, down to the cable company system reporting the Roamio paired properly, but the Roamio didn't (and couldn't tune all channels). Maybe he's got the same issue, maybe not.
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Old 01-20-2014, 10:51 PM   #71
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Agreed, which is why I was confused when you said "Btw, the SNR has nothing to do with the original posters issues."
Because the original poster has no issues viewing the locals. That points to the more likely cablecard pairing or defective Roamio.
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Old 01-20-2014, 11:22 PM   #72
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Because the original poster has no issues viewing the locals. That points to the more likely cablecard pairing or defective Roamio.
That's my point. I had two Roamios with cablecard pairing issues. The solution to fix the cablecard pairing was to lower the SNR/signal levels by installing a 4-way splitter. Only then would the cablecard pair with the Roamio, which allowed the Roamio to view everything.
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Old 01-22-2014, 12:05 AM   #73
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UPDATES

Wrote my nasty letter to comcast.

2 days later I got a call saying they were "out of cable cards in memphis" but working to find one in another state and send to me.

A few hours later I get another call. I was outside working in the yard, so they left a message. They talked to a senior tech and sent an "upgrade" to my cable card, please go check my TV.

I did and low and behold 97.5% of my channels were back. On whatever simple button push they did.

I asked what it was, but they just used nothing words like "upgrade signal"

Anyway -- points to a pairing issue to me.

Guy I talked to on the phone (i called back) seemed shocked that i had talked to cable card hotline 8 times and they couldn't help me.

Anyway…. it didn't fix everything.

I would still have some channels i'm supposed to get say "this channel not authorized" simple basic ones, like USA and TNT.

They would say this one minute and then work the next.

Also sometimes as you change channels the grey screen saying
"This screen is provided for your cable provider" would pop up.

Sometimes on it's own in the middle of a show.

They tried a few more "signal refreshes" they worked on some channels not on others.

Then some channels I got before were now saying "not authorized"

So…. they didn't know what was wrong and are sending a tech tomorrow.


New things popped up

Tivo would tell me its recording a show. but if you play it, it says it's a partial recording and there's nothing there, it's all black. no video.

but if you watch that same channel live, it works fine.

weird huh?

that never happened before.


This one too….

You're watching a show, you see the show just fine but the box

"this channel is not authorized" popped up over the channel which is showing just fine.

Again this never happened before yesterday.


Unsure what they did, but they fixed 97% of it with a button push from their office.


But it's still wonky.


To answer your other questions….


Signal strength is at 97% - 100 % ( it's different on different channels)

SNR is at 39db - 41db again varying by channel
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Old 01-22-2014, 01:21 AM   #74
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Signal strength is at 97% - 100 % ( it's different on different channels)

SNR is at 39db - 41db again varying by channel
That's about what I had before installing an attenuator, even though I did not have problem without the attenuator. I brought signal strength down to 93-98% and SNR down to 37-39dB.

When you get a problematic channel, check the signal levels and error counts.
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Old 01-22-2014, 07:41 AM   #75
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Tivo did some troubleshooting and said this is a known issue with some comcast cisco/sci atlanta cable cards and the roamio. they said for the least issues ask for motorola. If they can't give me that I must have firmware version 1.5.3 for cisco. the 1.5.2 I currently have doesn't work, and won't work. I must have 1.5.3.

and comcast says they have no motorola and no 1.5.3 in my market, and while they're offering service on the cable cards in circulation they're not offering anymore. They're are none available of 1.5.3 or motorola anything in my area.
Just for giggles can you post what the full firmware version number running on your CableCard, so far I have only seen the first three digits mentioned, ie; "152" as being the firmware you have and "153" being the firmware Tivo mentioned would work but Comcast doesn't support.

I am running firmware "PKEY1.5.2_F.p.2401" on a Cisco CableCard and have had to limit my Roamio Pro to 5 active tuners to have a fully stable service. Any firmware that is older than this firmware release on a Cisco/SA CableCard will not work on a 6 tuner Roamio. The Tivo website states the minimum firmware for Cisco/SA CableCard is "PKEY1.5.2_F.p.2801", hence the problem of only 5 tuners working for me at this time. Charter just shrugs their shoulders at upgrading firmware to a more current release...

It is my understanding that the ultimate solution is to upgrade the firmware to PKEY1.5.3_F.p.1101 for full functionality on the Roamio Pro, but I believe that firmware release PKEY1.5.2_F.p.3001 also works with all 6 Roamio Pro tuners active according to reports by other users.

BTW, to activate/deactivate the number of tuners on your Roamio 6 tuner box:

Go to Settings > Channels > Channel List
Enter one of the following number sequences using the number buttons on the remote.
(you will here a sound similar to when you press the "Thumbs Up" button once the code is entered properly).

These codes will tell Roamio the how many tuners it can use.
- 88633 = use 3 tuners
- 88634 = use 4 tuners
- 88635 = use 5 tuners
- 88636 = use 6 tuners
Then force a reboot of the Tivo, very important! Do not skip this last step!
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Old 01-22-2014, 07:54 AM   #76
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It is my understanding that the ultimate solution is to upgrade the firmware to PKEY1.5.3_F.p.1101 for full functionality on the Roamio Pro, but I believe that firmware release PKEY1.5.2_F.p.3001 also works with all 6 Roamio Pro tuners active according to reports by other users.


PKEY1.5.2_F.p.3001 does not work with six tuners. It may work sometimes but eventually you will get errors.
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Old 01-22-2014, 08:30 AM   #77
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PKEY1.5.2_F.p.3001 does not work with six tuners. It may work sometimes but eventually you will get errors.
This might depend on the area you are in, right? I'm going on 2 months without a single issue.
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Old 01-23-2014, 12:49 AM   #78
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My firmware is PKEY1.5.2_F.p.2401

I have tuners 0 - 5 running according to DVR Diagnostics… for a total of 6.

I just know it's a heck of a lot and enough for us. lol

We have the roamio and 3 mini's in our house, but they're never all running at once.

only me, my wife, and my 4 year old here. :-)

We usually only use 4% of our hard drive of shows.

as for my other issues

I have tech supervisor and tivo senior tech on conference call in my home.
two smart guys.

Tivo basically said I need the new firmware, to help fix it. Saying Cisco put it out and it helps. Comcast says they're beta testing the new firmware from cisco on their system and it's not available yet until they work out the kinks. They say the 1.5.3 firmware is causing a black screen issue on their network that they're trying to fix. Only a small amount of tivo users have the 1.5.3 in some markets while they work out the kinks So…. 1.5.2 is the best they can do until they finish beta testing.


Tivo swears the SNR needs to be lower. They say somewhere between 29 and 35 is ideal.

Comcast says their SNR rate must be 37-38. They say FCC fines them if it's lower than 35.

Tivo says no FCC requires no lower than 29.

Pissing match here over the SNR.

Comcast saying it will affect my internet signal too.

my outlet where the roamio is , is the same outlet where my modem is. there's a splitter feeding both.

They finally agreed that as long my -6 attenuator is on the split between the tivo and the splitter it would lower the SNR for the tivo roamio only and that's ok.


So…. everyone shook hands so to speak.

Im supposed to go buy a - 6db attenuator, if that doesn't help. Tivo will switch out my roamio, if that doesn't help, I wait for comcast to finish beta testing new firmware.

Although about 2 hours later my comcast guru's boss called back and said they had brainstormed with some engineers and wanted to come back and try one more thing….

so…. they'll be here in the morning. We'll see.
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Old 01-23-2014, 01:22 AM   #79
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An attenuator reduces both the signal and noise levels, not the signal to noise ratio directly. If something is too high, it's the overall signal level that's high, not the SNR.
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Old 01-23-2014, 08:31 AM   #80
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so…. they'll be here in the morning. We'll see.
Thanks for keeping us in the loop. The information you are capturing will certainly help others in the future.
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Old 01-23-2014, 09:36 AM   #81
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My firmware is PKEY1.5.2_F.p.2401

I have tuners 0 - 5 running according to DVR Diagnostics… for a total of 6.


so…. they'll be here in the morning. We'll see.
You are currently running the same firmware release as I am. I have had to set my Roamio to 5 active tuners to have a completely error free viewing experience. This is a temporary fix while I wait for Charter Cable to make the PKEY1.5.3_F.p.1101 firmware available to it's customers.

Have you tried changing the number of active tuners on your Roamio to see if the problem goes away?

Go to Settings > Channels > Channel List
Enter one of the following number sequences using the number buttons on the remote.
(you will here a sound similar to when you press the "Thumbs Up" button once the code is entered properly).

These codes will tell Roamio the how many tuners it can use.
- 88633 = use 3 tuners
- 88634 = use 4 tuners
- 88635 = use 5 tuners
- 88636 = use 6 tuners
Then force a reboot of the Tivo, very important! Do not skip this last step!

I changed mine to 4 tuners for about a week and found that my Roamio worked without error. I then read on this forum that 5 tuners might also work. I switched to 5 active tuners and have been running with that setting for about two months now with ZERO problems on my Roamio.

I have a Roamio Pro, three Tivo Mini's and a Basic Roamio 4-tuner all connected via MoCA networking... (The Basic Roamio (4 tuners) has worked perfectly from day one with an even older firmware release, PKEY1.5.2_F.p.1601), pointing further to this being a greater than 4 tuners problem. The fact that I have two active CableCards from Charter at different firmware release levels leads me to think Charter has a problem updating firmware over the cable....

Reducing the active tuners is not he ultimate solution, but it works for now. There have been very few times where I could use the 6th active tuner, so it has not been a big inconvenience so far, but I would like to have the full functionality that I paid for in my Tivo.

I forgot to mention that the main problem I was having with my Roamio Pro was seemingly random V58 Unauthorized channel errors
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Old 01-23-2014, 02:38 PM   #82
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You are currently running the same firmware release as I am. I have had to set my Roamio to 5 active tuners to have a completely error free viewing experience. This is a temporary fix while I wait for Charter Cable to make the PKEY1.5.3_F.p.1101 firmware available to it's customers.
I second this. Anyone having any problems getting channels while using a Cisco (aka Scientific Atlanta) cablecard with an older firmware should try switching to 5 tuners (and then rebooting!) to see if it solves the problem. If that doesn't help, try 4 tuners. (Although 5 seems to work for most people, there seem to be some circumstances where dropping down to 4 might be needed.)

My Roamio works great as long as I have it set to use only 5 tuners. Sure, I look forward to the day they roll out 1.5.3_F.p.1101, but I'm not exactly holding my breath while I wait. (The last time Charter sent out a cablecard firmware update in my area was 4 or 5 years ago, after all.)
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Old 01-23-2014, 08:18 PM   #83
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Try removing the splitter and using the most direct connection you can. I had similar issues with a 2way split feeding a 4way that feed the Roamio. I removed the 4way and the issues went away.


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Old 01-23-2014, 08:37 PM   #84
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From a technical aspect, the higher the S/N ratio is the better. Noise is bad.
From a signal strength point of view, if the cable company is over amping the cable (resulting is a high signal strength), their amps could be clipping, and introducing all sorts of issues. On analog, over amping the signal would result in images of certain channels appearing on other channels (harmonics). Introducing a splitter or attenuator at your house drops the hot signal, and the resultant harmonics. Its the harmonics that are causing the problems. If Tivo picks that up as "noise" in their S/N ratio reading, then that would explain why they say the S/N should be lower. Its really not noise that its reading though, apparently.

The comcast tech that comes out should be able to drop the hot signal down to where it is supposed to be, on the pole/amp. Make sure you tell them that you think the signal is overloading your tuner.

Hope you get it all worked out.
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Old 01-23-2014, 09:38 PM   #85
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I'm not kidding.

To answer your questions…

Dan, I have a cisco…. it doesn't work. The Error message

"this channel is not authorized please contact your cable provider" is literally on every single cable channel. I can only watch local channels nothing else.
So not literally every single channel.

This means that your cable card is not PAIRED correctly.
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Old 01-24-2014, 12:37 AM   #86
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So not literally every single channel.

This means that your cable card is not PAIRED correctly.
More likely that it is not authorized for the correct package.
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Old 01-24-2014, 12:44 AM   #87
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Comcast showed up today with their… "one more thing"

they made me a part of their beta test group for the 1.5.3. fp1101

They updated my cable card to work on this firmware and boom problems solved.

No attenuator nothing.

I have all 6 tuners and so far… knocking on wood all working channels.

they will be checking with me regularly for progress reports on any problems with the box.

Seems problem was totally cable card related.

we'll see if everything stays working from here on out with the new firmware.
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Old 01-24-2014, 06:42 AM   #88
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Comcast showed up today with their… "one more thing"

they made me a part of their beta test group for the 1.5.3. fp1101

They updated my cable card to work on this firmware and boom problems solved.

No attenuator nothing.

I have all 6 tuners and so far… knocking on wood all working channels.

they will be checking with me regularly for progress reports on any problems with the box.

Seems problem was totally cable card related.

we'll see if everything stays working from here on out with the new firmware.
It is unlikely your problem was firmware. As part of the firmware update, they had to re-pair yet again and probably also checked all the settings on your account again and you had the attention of non-clueless people this time around.

Based on all I have read, I believe your problems all along were simply they were not pairing and setting it up correctly due to repeated gross incompetence.
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Old 01-24-2014, 07:10 AM   #89
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It was the firmware. No doubt in my mind. Especially, in my case, after having 6-8 different cable cards, 10-12 tech visits, and at least 20 re-pairings -- first with a Premiere and then the Roamio. 1.5.2. 2401 (from 1401?) fixed the daily to monthly rep-pairing, and 1.5.3. 1101 fixed everything else.
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Old 01-24-2014, 08:40 AM   #90
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Comcast showed up today with their… "one more thing"

they made me a part of their beta test group for the 1.5.3. fp1101

They updated my cable card to work on this firmware and boom problems solved.

No attenuator nothing.

I have all 6 tuners and so far… knocking on wood all working channels.

they will be checking with me regularly for progress reports on any problems with the box.

Seems problem was totally cable card related.

we'll see if everything stays working from here on out with the new firmware.
Thanks for providing this information, both the problems and the solution. I live in Huntsville, AL and plan on using Comcast & TiVo. We are not too far from Memphis so if this problem affects both our areas I will be knowledgeable and armed with the solution!

Curtis
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