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Old 01-13-2014, 07:47 AM   #31
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There have probably been hundred or thousands of shows that were well thought out, classically outlined and meticulously planned that still sucked big time. I can't say that I loved the direction BSG went in its last season or two but I don't care if he had planned it all along or made it up as the season progressed. It certainly won't stop me from watching something else he creates that seems interesting.
The thing that bothered me about BG wasn't that it wasn't planned out. It is that is was designed from the ground up to be planned out...and then wasn't.

You don't have "They Have A Plan" as your tagline and not have a clue what their plan is. You don't build a show around the mystery of who the remaining Spylons are and then just assign them at random after years of character development. There are good shows that are planned out and bad ones; there are good shows that aren't planned out and bad ones. Good shows are (among other things) one that know what kind they should be.
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Old 01-13-2014, 08:25 AM   #32
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The thing that bothered me about BG wasn't that it wasn't planned out. It is that is was designed from the ground up to be planned out...and then wasn't.

You don't have "They Have A Plan" as your tagline and not have a clue what their plan is. You don't build a show around the mystery of who the remaining Spylons are and then just assign them at random after years of character development. There are good shows that are planned out and bad ones; there are good shows that aren't planned out and bad ones. Good shows are (among other things) one that know what kind they should be.
That is probably true but why should that result in a binary judgement against his new show? My guess is that he was bashed so much for winging the end of BSG that he's in "I better not do that again!" mode for Helix. I allow for stinker albums from musicians, stinker books from authors and stinker movies from directors. I don't have a problem granting Moore a clean slate for Helix.
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Old 01-13-2014, 08:37 AM   #33
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Moore rubbed me the wrong way not only by not understanding that a show about They Have A Plan should have a plan, but by his utter contempt for people who DID understand that. He lost additional points by his sheer contempt for people who think that science might matter in science fiction. And finally, if you're going to be a "winging it" kind of showrunner (and again, that can be done quite well), you still have to do it well. And Moore seems to suck at it.

All that said, I'm certainly willing to give Helix a try, and so far it has not let me down.
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Old 01-13-2014, 08:50 AM   #34
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I guess I should have read more of what it was about. All I knew was "CDC medical drama" but I guess the fact that it was on Syfy should have clued me in that it wasn't going to be "realistic" CDC medical drama like Medical Investigation.

I thought it was ok... I'll give it a few more eps. These doctors sure do some dumb stuff though.
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Old 01-13-2014, 09:54 AM   #35
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I thought it was ok... I'll give it a few more eps. These doctors sure do some dumb stuff though.
I'll spoilerize this but it doesn't reveal anything that isn't in the first two episodes.
Spoiler:
I was surprised and kept wondering why the CDC team had no method of communicating to each other. The vet woman discovered a secret locked lab, a violent, supposedly non-existent monkey and decided to perform an autopsy on it without telling the CDC guy in charge.

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Old 01-13-2014, 09:56 AM   #36
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I'll spoilerize this but it doesn't reveal anything that isn't in the first two episodes.
Spoiler:
I was surprised and kept wondering why the CDC team had no method of communicating to each other. The vet woman discovered a secret locked lab, a violent, supposedly non-existent monkey and decided to perform an autopsy on it without telling the CDC guy in charge.
It is all part of the disease that everyone on TV has:

Spoiler:
They cannot tell anything to anyone else, at any time. The more critical the information, the more likely that it will not be passed on to others, for no good reason. In the old days, they used the excuse of no easy communications (before cell phones were common). But nowadays, it is just moronic, and yet, quite common.

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Old 01-13-2014, 10:06 AM   #37
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It is all part of the disease that everyone on TV has:

Spoiler:
They cannot tell anything to anyone else, at any time. The more critical the information, the more likely that it will not be passed on to others, for no good reason. In the old days, they used the excuse of no easy communications (before cell phones were common). But nowadays, it is just moronic, and yet, quite common.
I know Lost wasn't the first show to do it but it was the first show to infuriate me by doing it.
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:19 AM   #38
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It is all part of the disease that everyone on TV has:
That disease becomes even more acute in the third episode that I watched last night.
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:19 AM   #39
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My wife and I watched the first episode. Stylistically, it is somewhere between a Dr. Who episode and a horrible syfy freak of the week movie. The visual effects were TERRIBLE. They should never show any outside shots ever again. Ever. Never. They were unbelievably terrible and fake. As bad or worse than the average SyFy movie. Considering BSG had fairly good visual effects, I can only assume that the budget or crew are much different here.

That aside, we enjoyed the first episode a fair amount. Campbell is super charismatic and it is very hard not to enjoy any scene he's in because of that.
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:21 AM   #40
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Hollywood has a tendency to ignore the facts in lieu of dramatic presentation. Most movies and TV shows would probably bore most of us to tears if they stuck with reality.

For instance, is there ever a time when a cop doesn't enter a dark room using only a flashlight instead of simply turning on the lights? They rarely check to see if the lights work and automatically pull out their flashlight along with their gun.
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:16 AM   #41
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Hated it. Dialogue was horrible. Special Effects unbelievable. Interesting premise, but I'm not sticking around.

Why did they not disable the RFID in the brother immediately, why wait till after he escapes? When he ripped the guys hand off why did they not disable or even think of the RFID? The question and answer to if they had a T1 was retarded. T1 lines are provided by the telephone company. there is no Antarctic Bell to provide such a service. the 10GB fiber optic is for internal connection. do how fast was the satellite connection they only get 1 hour a day. Why were they not confronted about the moneys? Why was no one securing the quarantine?
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:22 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by cheesesteak View Post
I'll spoilerize this but it doesn't reveal anything that isn't in the first two episodes.
Spoiler:
I was surprised and kept wondering why the CDC team had no method of communicating to each other. The vet woman discovered a secret locked lab, a violent, supposedly non-existent monkey and decided to perform an autopsy on it without telling the CDC guy in charge.
Spoiler:
If there was a deranged zombie guy wandering around the facility, I would NOT be autopsying some dead monkey in a secret lab all by myself WITH MY IPOD HEADPHONES ON!

Also, I would not stick my face in the deranged monkey's cage... wtf lady? I said as soon as they started going towards the cage, "STOP STOP THAT MONKEY IS GOING TO JUMP OUT AND EAT YOUR FACE OFF!"

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Old 01-13-2014, 11:44 AM   #43
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Hated it. Dialogue was horrible. Special Effects unbelievable. Interesting premise, but I'm not sticking around.

Why did they not disable the RFID in the brother immediately, why wait till after he escapes? When he ripped the guys hand off why did they not disable or even think of the RFID? The question and answer to if they had a T1 was retarded. T1 lines are provided by the telephone company. there is no Antarctic Bell to provide such a service. the 10GB fiber optic is for internal connection. do how fast was the satellite connection they only get 1 hour a day. Why were they not confronted about the moneys? Why was no one securing the quarantine?
Sadly, this. Especially the T1/Satellite bit. Oh, and quarantine bit and the RFID bit......

Meh.... I hate it when a show with a compelling premise completely destroys my ability to suspend disbelief so quickly.

The only thing this show was missing was some Tech Sgt. questioning the orders of a 4 star general.
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Old 01-13-2014, 12:03 PM   #44
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I know Lost wasn't the first show to do it but it was the first show to infuriate me by doing it.
At least on Lost they had an excuse -- no access to modern telecommunication devices like cell phones.
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Old 01-13-2014, 12:14 PM   #45
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Moore rubbed me the wrong way not only by not understanding that a show about They Have A Plan should have a plan, but by his utter contempt for people who DID understand that. He lost additional points by his sheer contempt for people who think that science might matter in science fiction. And finally, if you're going to be a "winging it" kind of showrunner (and again, that can be done quite well), you still have to do it well. And Moore seems to suck at it.

All that said, I'm certainly willing to give Helix a try, and so far it has not let me down.
This was exactly my take.

I hope he has a plan this time around and I hope that every couple of weeks there isn't this character that we thought was the way they seemed, but lo and behold they were working for this sinister purpose. We already got that with the soldier, but I really hope there is no more of that on Campbell's team...
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Old 01-13-2014, 12:18 PM   #46
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At least on Lost they had an excuse -- no access to modern telecommunication devices like cell phones.
But that only works until the next time you see someone. So they failed miserably there too.

And as laria demonstrates, supposedly smart people acting like total morons is also off-putting.
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Old 01-13-2014, 12:37 PM   #47
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Looking at this more/moore closely, I don't see why we are placing so much emphasis on Moore. It seems like he's just an exec producer and not necessarily the creative lead. Am I misinterpreting?
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Old 01-13-2014, 01:05 PM   #48
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Come on, guys, this is TV, not reality. Stop analyzing it so much. Just sit back and enjoy the ride. If I had to dissect every show I watch to decide if I thought it was realistic enough to enjoy I'd probably be reading a book instead.
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Old 01-13-2014, 01:30 PM   #49
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Looking at this more/moore closely, I don't see why we are placing so much emphasis on Moore. It seems like he's just an exec producer and not necessarily the creative lead. Am I misinterpreting?
I thought he was the showrunner, but it looks like he was brought in to help revamp it during development and then sell it to Syfy.
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Old 01-13-2014, 04:40 PM   #50
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Come on, guys, this is TV, not reality. Stop analyzing it so much. Just sit back and enjoy the ride. If I had to dissect every show I watch to decide if I thought it was realistic enough to enjoy I'd probably be reading a book instead.
I don't think I dissected the show, I just found it stupid as I watched. It was instantly obvious why the infected guy took the hand, yet the characters on the show were oblivious to it.
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Old 01-13-2014, 04:51 PM   #51
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I thought he was the showrunner, but it looks like he was brought in to help revamp it during development and then sell it to Syfy.
The main show runner is Steve Maeda. He was a writer on Lost for a couple seasons and also wrote a few x-file episodes and a bunch of CSI episodes. Moore is just one of the executive producers and they're also using him as a marketing tool.
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Old 01-13-2014, 05:14 PM   #52
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Come on, guys, this is TV, not reality. Stop analyzing it so much. Just sit back and enjoy the ride. If I had to dissect every show I watch to decide if I thought it was realistic enough to enjoy I'd probably be reading a book instead.
If they're going to give us a show about Top. Men. from the CDC and USAMRID they can't send in Bill & Ted.... even if they've read 'Infectious Diseases for Dummies'.
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Old 01-13-2014, 06:28 PM   #53
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I'm sticking with it so far, but could do without the soap opera aspect.
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Old 01-13-2014, 07:18 PM   #54
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I'm sticking with it so far, but could do without the soap opera aspect.

This. When I see the lead dealing with ex-wife/girlfriend issues, I can't help but to want J-Lo to emerge and kick his azz -- again.
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Old 01-13-2014, 07:40 PM   #55
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I'm sticking with it so far, but could do without the soap opera aspect.
I didn't think the GF / Ex stuff was all that bad. I feared the worst when the GF was being told that the women was the ex wife. But they seem to be keeping it to such a minimum, that I'm not understanding why it was even made a plot point.
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Old 01-15-2014, 03:07 PM   #56
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Watched the first two eps last night. Outside of a lot of commercial breaks, I did stay interested and was disappointed when the 2nd ep ended. Now if the writing can be consistent from week to week, good to go.
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Old 01-19-2014, 05:04 AM   #57
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It's a sign of bad/lazy writing when, in order to advance the plot, you have to make all of these supposedly super intelligent characters galactically stupid!

In addition to the other things already mentioned, there were a couple of other things that irked me.

I was in the Air Force and the closest I got to a combat zone was Thailand in '72 and I had to re-qualify on the M-16 every year. This guy was in the Army and stationed in Afghanistan and supposedly hadn't fired a weapon since basic? Yeah, I know he was lying to maintain his cover but geez-louise. Make the lie at least plausible.

Also, how they heck do they have a permanent facility that extensive that far north? There's no land and even if the icecap isn't melting, the ice moves a lot.

To answer Mr. Unnatural, in order for me to truly enjoy something like this, I have to immerse myself in the story. Glaring, unnecessary errors act like the penny in "Somewhere in Time". Willing suspension of disbelief is one thing. Having to totally turn your brain off is quite another.
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Old 01-19-2014, 07:43 AM   #58
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Also, how they heck do they have a permanent facility that extensive that far north? There's no land and even if the icecap isn't melting, the ice moves a lot.
The map they showed in the first episode made it look like it was in Greenland.
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Old 01-19-2014, 02:02 PM   #59
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It's a sign of bad/lazy writing when, in order to advance the plot, you have to make all of these supposedly super intelligent characters galactically stupid!
That's my big problem with this show but I see this on a lot of shows. It's the old "I just discovered something really important but I won't tell anybody" syndrome.

Spoiler involving episode 3:
Spoiler:

Dr. Ex-Wife was exposed to the pathogen and, of course, doesn't tell anybody.

There appears to be something wrong with Dr. Foxy Lady but, of course, she won't tell anyone.

At least Dr. Perfect killed the homicidal, infected woman. He should be off his high horse now. Lethal response is sometimes necessary in situations like that.

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Old 01-19-2014, 03:01 PM   #60
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The map they showed in the first episode made it look like it was in Greenland.
They said it was north of 83°. There is no land north of 83°. The northern most point of land in the world is Kaffeklubben Island at 83°40'N.
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