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Old 09-23-2013, 11:32 AM   #61
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I've thought through this "TiVO can't handle green switches" issue and decided that buying a MoCA adapter that will serve no other purpose outside of providing faster than wireless Internet to the Roamio. I have Ethernet drops in my house with switches working for everything but the Roamio so replacing the green switch with the NETGEAR 8-Port Gigabit Ethernet Switch (GS608NA) model makes more sense in my situation.

It doesn't say it is "not green" but it doesn't have this listed like the Netgear GS108NA model does.

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NETGEAR Green features provide energy savings
TiVo needs to continue to look into this because I'm thinking many people use green switches.
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Old 09-23-2013, 01:29 PM   #62
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This one doesn't appear to be green (I checked the manufacturer's web site and the manual): http://www.amazon.com/Tenda-G1008D-D...dp/B006KAP54A/
I ended up buying this but it ended up being a green switch but it works without any issues. Nice and cheap so thanks for the link. I got the last one in stock at $22.52 and now they've gone up to $35.47.
Seems like a good switch and I like that it has different color lights between 10/100 and 1000 Mbps depending on what your speed is.
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Old 09-23-2013, 01:42 PM   #63
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I think people have focused too narrowly on the "green" aspect of modern routers/switches. I'd be very surprised if it's the power saving features that are causing the problems.

My personal guess is that it has more to do with multicasting/mDNS/avahi/Bonjour features, which have also been changing in the past few years. Perhaps more innocuous multicast error messages are now making it all the way to the Roamio due to the way that modern switches now handle multicast, and the Roamio is improperly dropping the entire network connection instead of just noting the multicast problem.
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Old 09-23-2013, 04:52 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by CrispyCritter View Post
I think people have focused too narrowly on the "green" aspect of modern routers/switches. I'd be very surprised if it's the power saving features that are causing the problems.

My personal guess is that it has more to do with multicasting/mDNS/avahi/Bonjour features, which have also been changing in the past few years. Perhaps more innocuous multicast error messages are now making it all the way to the Roamio due to the way that modern switches now handle multicast, and the Roamio is improperly dropping the entire network connection instead of just noting the multicast problem.
This could certainly be true--but the issue does seem to impact newer switches more than older ones. I am hardly a networking expert, but something is occurring with the Roamio ethernet connection when connected to a newer switch that is causing a problem. Only TIVO tech support or engineering knows (or hopefully will know soon) the real cause.
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Old 09-24-2013, 02:03 PM   #65
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I hooked up my Romeo basic to my "green" 24 port GB switch. It connected and worked fine during initial testing.

I then hooked up a Mini at the end of 100 feet of Cat5 connected to the same switch. It worked fine on start up but it was losing connectivity on a random basis every 30 to 90 minutes.

I next hooked up a Steam to the same 24 port switch. It went through startup fine, ethernet activity lights indicating com was happening, the status light turned to steady white, but neither of my two iPads would find the switch.

Executed all the recommended fixes and saw no improvement.

At the recommendation of Tivo tech support, I connected all three Tivo devices to a single Airport extreme, then uplined that AE directly to my Comcast cable modem. Rebooted several times, forced connection several times, and the Romeo to Mini performance appears to be acceptable. The Stream remains invisible to both iPads.

When I went out to check the news this morning, the Mini could not find the Romeo . . .

One would think that the Tivo devices coming from the same design team would have robust enough design implementation to assure that when connected to a single router they would all find each other, but apparently that is not the case.

Since I am still inside the 30 day window I am looking for advice on if this is a solvable bump in the road or if I should just box them all up and ship them back to Tivo and wait another 5 years to see if they can come up with a design that actually works.

Thoughts?
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Old 09-24-2013, 02:11 PM   #66
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I hooked up my Romeo basic to my "green" 24 port GB switch. It connected and worked fine during initial testing.

I then hooked up a Mini at the end of 100 feet of Cat5 connected to the same switch. It worked fine on start up but it was losing connectivity on a random basis every 30 to 90 minutes.

I next hooked up a Steam to the same 24 port switch. It went through startup fine, ethernet activity lights indicating com was happening, the status light turned to steady white, but neither of my two iPads would find the switch.

Executed all the recommended fixes and saw no improvement.

At the recommendation of Tivo tech support, I connected all three Tivo devices to a single Airport extreme, then uplined that AE directly to my Comcast cable modem. Rebooted several times, forced connection several times, and the Romeo to Mini performance appears to be acceptable. The Stream remains invisible to both iPads.

When I went out to check the news this morning, the Mini could not find the Romeo . . .

One would think that the Tivo devices coming from the same design team would have robust enough design implementation to assure that when connected to a single router they would all find each other, but apparently that is not the case.

Since I am still inside the 30 day window I am looking for advice on if this is a solvable bump in the road or if I should just box them all up and ship them back to Tivo and wait another 5 years to see if they can come up with a design that actually works.

Thoughts?
Well, TiVo's design VP has commented in this thread (or a similar one) that they are looking into these issues.... so, I guess it's your call on if you want to see if they can fix it in software or if you should sit this round out.
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Old 09-24-2013, 02:32 PM   #67
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Since I am still inside the 30 day window I am looking for advice on if this is a solvable bump in the road or if I should just box them all up and ship them back to Tivo and wait another 5 years to see if they can come up with a design that actually works.

Thoughts?
I think it is solvable but you'll need to decide if it is worth the time and expense to replace more equipment.

Thanks for posting though. The more people post these issues, the faster TiVo will work to resolve them, IMO. They have a good product in the Roamio but they should not rest on their laurels.
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Old 09-24-2013, 02:49 PM   #68
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I know you shoudn't have to change the type of switch you use, but I just bought a cheap non-green switch from monoprice and problem solved.
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Old 09-25-2013, 08:27 PM   #69
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I have D-Link DGS-2208 (green gigabit) switches in a few places to share network drops. I have noticed a few problems here and there with my Roamio Pro, but it seems able to at least make its daily connection without trouble.

The main problem I had was while watching Netflix. I had a short video dropout, I hit the back key to rewind and play through it, but the TiVo rebooted (twice). It came back up and I was able to rewatch the program. This occurred after having watched an hour or two of other Netflix programs and having transferred several hours of programming from my old Premiere (at the same time as I started watching Netflix). Once or twice other than that I did have a network problem as I was setting it up and doing manual "connect to the TiVo service" connections to get the accounts to synch, but since then the daily connections have seemed to be fine. I'll keep an eye on it.

My DGS-2208's are at least a couple of years old now, not sure if that matters but someone else was hypothesizing above about whether the problems were gigabit-vs-fast or newer models vs older so I thought I would mention it.

If this continues at this rate, I'll be happy to keep the box and wait out a software fix, as it is still very usable. But, if this is going to be a permanent issue, or if TiVo drags their heels, then I would have second thoughts about the box. I'm hoping there is an update soon to improve stability for us...
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Old 09-26-2013, 12:33 PM   #70
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I had the same dlink models as jmpage but he didnt have issues and I did. I do know there are different hardware revisions. All mone were the same and everyone I tried had issues. Jmpage wasn't able to check his hardware revision. I went to one of my old Dlink DGS models that was not labeled green although my other old Dlinks had green on them.
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Old 09-26-2013, 02:03 PM   #71
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I happen to work in a fairly high end technical video environment, and any time any new gear is added, we expect that something will go unexpectedly wrong. If manufacturers like TiVo waited till they caught every single possible problem, they'd never be able to release anything. The true story with this issue will be told when TiVo does one of two things, either issues a software update that deals with the issue, or issues a statement that claims the hardware they chose isn't compatible with green switches and post that users need to avoid the green switches. I'd hope for former, but if the latter is the answer, then at least they're being honest with their consumers, and you really can't ask for more than that. If they whitewash the issue, then your rant becomes valid. Till then, show TiVo a bit of slack.
Do you think I am wrong now MScottC? No I will not show Tivo a bit of slack since I paid over $800 for both boxes. This is not their first ever box they produced. They know what users except so get it right or provide tech support instead of dodging the question.

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Originally Posted by Marget Schmidt
TODAY'S update has fixes that include:
- fixed an issue where customers might see error V301 when trying to launch Xfinity On Demand
- fixed an issue where all six tuners would display video, but one was missing audio

The NEXT update (maybe in two weeks?) should include:
- a fix for the "green switch" problem
- support for older versions of CableCARDS from FiOS

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Old 09-27-2013, 03:40 PM   #72
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I think people have focused too narrowly on the "green" aspect of modern routers/switches. I'd be very surprised if it's the power saving features that are causing the problems.

My personal guess is that it has more to do with multicasting/mDNS/avahi/Bonjour features, which have also been changing in the past few years. Perhaps more innocuous multicast error messages are now making it all the way to the Roamio due to the way that modern switches now handle multicast, and the Roamio is improperly dropping the entire network connection instead of just noting the multicast problem.
I would agree that it's probably more to do with multicasting, etc. However, I do NOT agree that it's just more errors making it to the Roamio. I'm having tons of "network related issues" with my Premiers and Minis. V301, etc. And I have never, ever, ever, ever, had any issues with with any other network related device in my home. My network is EXTREMELY strong.
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Old 09-27-2013, 06:43 PM   #73
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I would agree that it's probably more to do with multicasting, etc. However, I do NOT agree that it's just more errors making it to the Roamio. I'm having tons of "network related issues" with my Premiers and Minis. V301, etc. And I have never, ever, ever, ever, had any issues with with any other network related device in my home. My network is EXTREMELY strong.
But I don't know anybody else on these forums who have had as many network issues as you have had. There may be a couple of folks with similar issues, but the vast majority of folks with TiVos do not have the problems you have. Therefore there is something in your network that is causing your TiVos problems. It could very well be TiVo's fault, but it is still being set off by something in your network (or you've been very unlucky in getting TiVos with bad network devices).

You've never had issues with other devices? How strange. I've been running a home network for over 25 years, and I doubt I've had a single year in which I didn't have a networking issue with some new device. My network is more complicated than most (5 routers, probably double digit different OS versions), but still, no problems? I would even say that the majority of new motherboards I've bought need several iterations of firmware before the networking settles down completely.
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Old 10-05-2013, 06:37 PM   #74
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Thought I would try this thread before calling TiVo support.

I had 2 TiVo HDs and an S2 in the home using FiOS. Each device is networked via MoCa. At the two locations where the THDs are/were, it went wall coax --> Nim 100 (moca adapter) --> to ethernet switch (DLink DES 1105 in one location, Dynex DX-ESW5 in the 2nd) --> Tivo ethernet in and to coax in on the TiVo. The S2 is connected directly to a Nim 100, no switch. With this setup, all boxes saw one another and connected to my PC via the FiOS Actiontec router.

I just set up a Roamio Plus, which replaced a TiVoHD (the one using the DLink DES 1105). So now I have the Roamio, 1 TiVo HD and a S2 in my network. Set up using Ethernet and same chain as described above. While the Roamio can see video files on the PC, and displays the name of both TiVo boxes, I get an error (network problem) message when I try to view any of the shows on the THD or S2 boxes. Both of the older TiVos still see each other, and can see the Roamio as well (but can't see recordings on The Roamio)

I don't believe any of the switches I am using are green switches. Any thoughts I what I might be doing wrong?

Disconnecting Ethernet from the setup fails to connect to internet when turning on MOCA. Taking coax directly from wall to Roamio without Ethernet (bypassing the adapter) connects to internet via MOCA, but PC and other TiVos don't show up on the Roamio.
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Old 10-06-2013, 09:11 AM   #75
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Thought I would try this thread before calling TiVo support.

I had 2 TiVo HDs and an S2 in the home using FiOS. Each device is networked via MoCa. At the two locations where the THDs are/were, it went wall coax --> Nim 100 (moca adapter) --> to ethernet switch (DLink DES 1105 in one location, Dynex DX-ESW5 in the 2nd) --> Tivo ethernet in and to coax in on the TiVo. The S2 is connected directly to a Nim 100, no switch. With this setup, all boxes saw one another and connected to my PC via the FiOS Actiontec router.

I just set up a Roamio Plus, which replaced a TiVoHD (the one using the DLink DES 1105). So now I have the Roamio, 1 TiVo HD and a S2 in my network. Set up using Ethernet and same chain as described above. While the Roamio can see video files on the PC, and displays the name of both TiVo boxes, I get an error (network problem) message when I try to view any of the shows on the THD or S2 boxes. Both of the older TiVos still see each other, and can see the Roamio as well (but can't see recordings on The Roamio)

I don't believe any of the switches I am using are green switches. Any thoughts I what I might be doing wrong?

Disconnecting Ethernet from the setup fails to connect to internet when turning on MOCA. Taking coax directly from wall to Roamio without Ethernet (bypassing the adapter) connects to internet via MOCA, but PC and other TiVos don't show up on the Roamio.
If the boxes see each other then the most likely explanation is that the Roamio is not yet seen on your account by the other devices. Does not sound like a network problem to me.
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Old 10-06-2013, 06:54 PM   #76
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I originally plugged my Roamio into my Netgear GS724T, the same switch I had plugged my premier into and my series 3, and my stream without an issue. I found with the roamio that I had trouble with my Control 4 IP driver controlling the tivo and when I tried to stream from the Roamio the streaming would freeze and suddenly say finished.

I followed the advice here and plugged my Roamio directly into my Airport router that is plugged into the cable modem.

So far the issues have gone away. I'm hoping a service update comes soon and I'm out of ports on the on the Apple airport, so I can go back to the switch.
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Old 10-07-2013, 09:44 AM   #77
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Just wanted to chime in and also say that I've been having issues with the Roamio and my Netgear "Green" switch. I had it hooked upstairs through a green switch and checking the network diagnostics it would bounce back and forth to be connected and "failed" (I would also get the internet connection lost message). At first I thought this was due to my set up as I am running off of a powerline adapter. However, I moved my Roamio box downstairs and connected it to another green switch which is directly connected to my router and the same problem occurred. When I connected it directly to my router.. the problem goes away.

I made the same observations as everyone else. The port light will go out for a short period on the green switch which obviously severs the connection. Sure, I was able to switch devices around so that the Roamio is directly connected to the router but I agree that this is an issue that should be fixed asap.
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Old 10-07-2013, 10:44 PM   #78
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If the boxes see each other then the most likely explanation is that the Roamio is not yet seen on your account by the other devices. Does not sound like a network problem to me.
I have the same problem as dslunceford. Thanks to you I have an answer. I went to my Tivo account where it says " We're still processing your activation. Try again in 24 hours." about my new Roamio.

Also someone mentioned that we should be expecting 150+ Mbs when transferring to a PC from a Roamio. I'm getting 90 Mbs on my Roamio Plus on a Giga connection. The download speed is twice what I was getting from my Premiere, but I'd love to get an ever faster connection. Can someone point me in a direction where I might read up on how to speed up the transfers with Tivo?
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Old 10-07-2013, 10:50 PM   #79
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We plan to release an update for Roamio on Wednesday (10/9) that should address these issues with green switches.

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Old 10-08-2013, 12:04 AM   #80
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We plan to release an update for Roamio on Wednesday (10/9) that should address these issues with green switches. --Margret
Yay!
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Old 10-08-2013, 08:40 AM   #81
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i'm a new roamio plus user who purchased last Saturday. I also had wifi issues and inconsistent c133 errors associated with not a stable connection. I ended up switching to Ethernet cable to avoid using wifi. I do not have a green router or have I had connection problems with my dlink 655 router at any time in the past.

however, during my investigation of the problem using wifi I did find a curious fact which TiVo margaret may find interesting:

in my router log and on a status page of connected wireless users I had not 1, but 3 mac addresses associated with my TiVo connected to my router.

one of course was the designed mac address as noted on the TiVo screen, but in addition there were 2 other mac addresses all different.

the 3 mac addresses all had the first 7 digits the same, but the remainder were different. also, one of the ip addresses associated with one of the connections was assigned 0.0.0.0 which I've never seen before in all my years.

in conclusion, TiVo is using 3 distinct mac addresses attempting to connect to my wifi. this could be cause of problems no doubt.

if TiVo Margaret is interested I have a printed copy of the wireless status page.
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Old 10-08-2013, 09:13 AM   #82
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More than likely the 3 MAC addresses are the Wi-Fi, the physical ethernet port and the MoCA bridge. Since the Roamio can bridge connections all of these MAC addresses could possibly show up when you look at the connectivity.
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Old 10-08-2013, 09:47 AM   #83
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There should be a MAC and separate IP for the internal Stream as well.
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Old 10-08-2013, 10:15 AM   #84
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There should be a MAC and separate IP for the internal Stream as well.
Yep, I forgot that one.

Bottom line is I'm pretty sure that seeing multiple MAC addresses from the TiVo is "normal" and not a cause for alarm.
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Old 10-08-2013, 10:17 AM   #85
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I would think that these additional mac addresses should not be accessing the wifi network unless requested thru the TiVo settings.

in addition, when I attempted to reactivate my mac filtering thru the router I could not connect using TiVo's wifi by limiting the ip to specifically TiVo's wifi mac address. it is as if these other connections are necessary when not desired or needed.

i'm just wondering if this is something causing a problem with people's wifi like I experienced.
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Old 10-08-2013, 11:04 AM   #86
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Biggest issue with Roamio WiFi I see is there is no "off" button. Once you've enabled it, even when you plug in ethernet cable or use MoCA the WiFi link remains alive. After testing it out of curiosity (I am wired now) I had to choose a neighbor's WiFi network and enter a bogus password to effectively turn it off - prior to that my router kept showing my Roamio as a wireless client. It would seem like this could create network collisions and may explain some of the networking problems some are having with Roamios.
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Old 10-08-2013, 12:15 PM   #87
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If the boxes see each other then the most likely explanation is that the Roamio is not yet seen on your account by the other devices. Does not sound like a network problem to me.
Circling back. I believe that must have been the issue. Thought it had already had all the service data needed, as I had forced a number of connections and the device name came down/updated, as did the lifetime service status.
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Old 10-08-2013, 07:09 PM   #88
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...Also someone mentioned that we should be expecting 150+ Mbs when transferring to a PC from a Roamio. I'm getting 90 Mbs on my Roamio Plus on a Giga connection. The download speed is twice what I was getting from my Premiere, but I'd love to get an ever faster connection. Can someone point me in a direction where I might read up on how to speed up the transfers with Tivo?
I can confirm the transfer speeds. My server can download from the Roamio Pro at 150+ Mbps. The transfer rate typically varies between 140-200Mbps.

On improving the transfer rate, are you using Tivo Desktop? The only thing I can think of is to make sure the File Transfer speed box is checked in File, preferences. It may be checked by default but I've had it installed so long I don't remember. I didn't really do anything special to get the high transfer rate. The Roamio Pro has all tuners on HD channels, server is mostly idle, using Tivo Desktop 2.8.3, both on gigabit connections of course.
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Old 10-09-2013, 09:43 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by Hyrax View Post
I have the same problem as dslunceford. Thanks to you I have an answer. I went to my Tivo account where it says " We're still processing your activation. Try again in 24 hours." about my new Roamio.

Also someone mentioned that we should be expecting 150+ Mbs when transferring to a PC from a Roamio. I'm getting 90 Mbs on my Roamio Plus on a Giga connection. The download speed is twice what I was getting from my Premiere, but I'd love to get an ever faster connection. Can someone point me in a direction where I might read up on how to speed up the transfers with Tivo?
Even the download speeds from the Premiere should be over 70Mb/s to TiVo Desktop.

I would certainly make sure that box is checked that Devx mentioned. The speeds you quote are nowhere near what i get from my Roamio Pro and Premiere.
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Old 10-09-2013, 09:28 PM   #90
kbmb
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: NH
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I see software update 20.3.6.3 was released tonight. Can anyone confirm this fixes the green switch issue?

Also, anyone here have issues with a Netgear GS605? I'm looking to upgrade my 10/100 switch to a gigabit switch.

-Kevin
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