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Old 09-21-2013, 01:28 PM   #1
saibari
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Is Plus really worth double the price of basic?

I'm debating between the basic and the plus. Hard to justify double the price. I currently have a 6-year old TiVo HD (2 tuners). So moving to the basic will be a big upgrade for me. I can't imagine needing 6 tuners and figure I'll do fine with the storage capacity since it's a lot more than what I'm used to. I also don't really care about the streaming. However... I don't want to have buyer's remorse and wish I had upgraded. Is there something I'm missing regarding a compelling reason to go with the Plus vs the basic?

ALSO... unrelated question--Roamio does support Cox VOD, correct? Thanks!
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Old 09-21-2013, 01:34 PM   #2
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Nope, you pretty much covered it all. Plus benefits are larger drive, 2 more tuners, stream. Basic has support for OTA.
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Old 09-21-2013, 01:35 PM   #3
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If you don't need 6 tuners or built in streaming, seems like the basic model would be perfect for you.
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Old 09-21-2013, 01:35 PM   #4
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If you only need 4 tuners and don't care about Stream and built in MoCA/bridging which Basic also doesn't have, then Basic should be fine. IMO you can never have enough tuners especially when events such as Olympics roll around. I need 5 tuners for myself during busy TV season.

Cox VOD was never rolled out for TiVos (Comcast VOD was).
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Old 09-21-2013, 02:02 PM   #5
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I got a Premiere last year, but am now thinking of upgrading just so I can work with the Mini. I want to put a mini in my bedroom (where i have a network cable but no coax cable). I got the mini without reading first , that i need a 4 tuner DVR.

The streaming etc is nice, but I can do without. I can also do without the extra space. However, I did notice the base is only 10/100 for network, which really should be fine since mini only supports 10/100 anyway.


Side note: I wish plex had a tivo app so i could get rid of my roku player As i run a plex media server for my movies.

In reality I am being picky because I don't want buyers remorse and I am already upset spending almost $300 last year for my Premiere XL and 3 year warranty, which is almost worthless on ebay and craigslist.

If the dear members of this forum convince me I think i will go get the base this evening from best buy and swap out my Premiere (I hope i can keep the $12.99 monthly i negotiated (one device), just earlier today on my premiere)
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Old 09-21-2013, 04:18 PM   #6
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Nope, you pretty much covered it all. Plus benefits are larger drive, 2 more tuners, stream. Basic has support for OTA.
Plus also has integrated MoCA bridge which is worth another $50-$70 if you ever want to extend the network over coax for supporting TiVo Minis. Also has a remote finder which is kinda of neat and maybe worth $10.
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Old 09-21-2013, 05:16 PM   #7
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Also has component jacks if you want to go that route.
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Old 09-21-2013, 06:19 PM   #8
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Differences in the Plus from the basic:

2 additional tuners
MoCa support (w/ Ethernet bridge mode)
1 Gbps (1000Mbps) port speed
75 HD hrs more storage capacity (both can be upgraded to 450 HD hrs)
Standby button
Remote Finder
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Component/Composite jacks
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Old 09-21-2013, 09:21 PM   #9
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Yes, it is. Streaming and downloading to my iPad. Starting YouTube playback from my iPad. Extra tuners and larger capacity. All great.

Of course, I say that having decided that the extra capacity for the Pro wasn't worth another $200. So find your price point and enjoy
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Old 09-21-2013, 09:37 PM   #10
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Thanks all for the replies. I guess part of the problem in my decision making is that I'm fairly ignorant of the finer points of the technology. That is, I don't know what MoCa is and why I would need "Ethernet bridge mode." I don't know what it means to "extend the network over coax"--can't I use a TiVo mini with the basic model? Or will I need to buy something additional to make it work? And I don't know what practical difference the "port speed" makes or what I'd need the "component/composite" jacks for.

Really bummed about the Cox VOD. I ran across an item online from a couple of years ago that said the Premiere supports Cox VOD so I thought the Roamio would too. But maybe that fell through and the Premiere doesn't support Cox VOD either? I really think the fact that the consumer is caught between the turf wars of the cable companies and TiVo is ridiculous!
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Old 09-21-2013, 11:51 PM   #11
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If you have cat5 to all locations you can deploy mini's. If u only have coax to some of those locations you would need moca adapters with the Roamio basic.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:09 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post
If you have cat5 to all locations you can deploy mini's. If u only have coax to some of those locations you would need moca adapters with the Roamio basic.
Question: I'm using older FiOS Motorola NIM 100's right now at all my TV drops for ethernet over coax...so the built-in MOCA wouldn't be a big deal in my case, correct?

My main HD box with Lifetime just died, and I'm trying to decide whether just to upgrade that drive or go with a Roamio. I could get basic and use a MyDVR expander, or even upgrade the drive (since it appears to be plug 'n play) and save some money.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:25 AM   #13
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I don't know what MoCa is and why I would need "Ethernet bridge mode." I don't know what it means to "extend the network over coax"--can't I use a TiVo mini with the basic model? Or will I need to buy something additional to make it work?
You can use a TiVo Mini with the base model Roamio, but the Mini requires a network connection to the Roamio and the Internet in order to work.

TiVo has deemed WiFi connections not reliable enough for the Mini, so you'll need a wired network connection that connects the Mini to both the Roamio and the Internet.

If you're lucky, your house was pre-wired with Ethernet (CAT-5/CAT-6), and you'll have an Ethernet jack in each room. Assuming you already have that setup, you'd just plug the Mini and the Roamio into their respective Ethernet jacks, and you should be good to go.

If you're like most people, you don't live in a house that was pre-wired with Ethernet, but you probably have a "Cable TV" jack in most rooms. MoCa is a technology that lets devices like the Roamio/Mini use the "Cable TV" wiring for networking. The Mini has MoCa built-in, and the Roamio Plus and Pro come with MoCa bridges, but the basic Roamio does not have anything MoCa. So if you want to use MoCa to connect the Mini to the basic Roamio, you'll have to buy a separate MoCa adapter for the basic Roamio. At that point, you've created a network between the Mini and the Roamio, but you still need a way for the Mini to get on the Internet. This is where the "bridge" comes in. A MoCa bridge connects the MoCa network to your house's regular network that has Internet access. You just need one bridge somewhere in your house, and that bridge will allow all of the MoCa devices to have Internet access.

IIRC, TiVo sells separate MoCa bridges for $50 (plus shipping). So even if you need one or two, it still sounds like a basic Mini will be less expensive than the Plus (if you truly would have no use for streaming, the extra tuners, etc).

Quote:
I ran across an item online from a couple of years ago that said the Premiere supports Cox VOD so I thought the Roamio would too. But maybe that fell through and the Premiere doesn't support Cox VOD either?
Correct, the Premiere doesn't support Cox VOD either.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:32 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by dslunceford View Post
Question: I'm using older FiOS Motorola NIM 100's right now at all my TV drops for ethernet over coax...so the built-in MOCA wouldn't be a big deal in my case, correct?

My main HD box with Lifetime just died, and I'm trying to decide whether just to upgrade that drive or go with a Roamio. I could get basic and use a MyDVR expander, or even upgrade the drive (since it appears to be plug 'n play) and save some money.
It sounds like you are already using MoCA, so I have no idea how the TiVo Mini would work in such a scenario, you might have to split the coaxial at the wall plate if you need the Mini plus another "TV drop over ethernet" at that location.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:34 AM   #15
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It sounds like you are already using MoCA, so I have no idea how the TiVo Mini would work in such a scenario, you might have to split the coaxial at the wall plate if you need the Mini plus another "TV drop over ethernet" at that location.
If the FiOS Motorola NIM 100's are giving him ethernet at all of his TV drops currently, couldn't he just plug the Mini into one of them via Ethernet?
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:57 AM   #16
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Side note: I wish plex had a tivo app so i could get rid of my roku player As i run a plex media server for my movies.
Take a wander over to TiVo Home Media Features & TiVoToGo section of the forum, and learn about StreamBaby.
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Old 09-22-2013, 11:00 AM   #17
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If the FiOS Motorola NIM 100's are giving him ethernet at all of his TV drops currently, couldn't he just plug the Mini into one of them via Ethernet?
Assuming he has an ethernet port available then sure, otherwise he would have to install an ethernet switch.

It is becoming more apparent with the advent of the Roamio and Mini that TCF needs a dedicated network sub-forum to handle the numerous questions people have about basic home networking.
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Old 09-22-2013, 12:43 PM   #18
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Assuming he has an ethernet port available then sure, otherwise he would have to install an ethernet switch.

It is becoming more apparent with the advent of the Roamio and Mini that TCF needs a dedicated network sub-forum to handle the numerous questions people have about basic home networking.
I have 5 port switches at each TV drop as well. In my family room it's the Nim to switch which then connects to my THD and PlayStation3. In the home theater it's the same, + an AV receiver connected to the switch.

Basically, I was trying to determine if the built in MOCA on the Roamio serves the same purpose as my Nim 100, and it appears the answer is yes. As I have multiple devices using MOCA, having that feature built-in doesn't really add anything in my situation, and makes the Basic an option to consider.

However, ordering a Pro and a mini might work as well, especially as I could sell the HDs with Lifetime on eBay to help defray costs....
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Last edited by dslunceford : 09-22-2013 at 04:07 PM.
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Old 09-22-2013, 02:09 PM   #19
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Thank you aristoBrat for taking the time to explain things in plain English! Since I tend to keep my TiVos a long time, I'll likely bite the bullet and go with the Plus.
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Old 09-23-2013, 02:16 PM   #20
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I went with the plus for the streaming.
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Old 09-23-2013, 04:03 PM   #21
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However, ordering a Pro and a mini might work as well, especially as I could sell the HDs with Lifetime on eBay to help defray costs....
Some folks have reported issues with the older NIM 100's mixed with the Tivo's integrated moca. They don't seem to always play nice. Just something to keep in mind. The "work-around" would be not to use the integrated moca, which it sounds like you don't need.
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Old 09-23-2013, 04:06 PM   #22
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Some folks have reported issues with the older NIM 100's mixed with the Tivo's integrated moca. They don't seem to always play nice. Just something to keep in mind. The "work-around" would be not to use the integrated moca, which it sounds like you don't need.
Yes, I couldn't use my NIM100 as MoCA master and have the Elite or the Mini connect to it using their internal MoCA devices. Of course if you continue to use NIM100 adapters without using the internal MoCA devices that should be fine. Eventually I just bought a new MoCA 1.1 adapter (NIM100 was 1.0 I believe) and that worked fine with Mini and Elite. With that setup I was able to get rid of 2 external MoCA adaptors.
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Old 09-23-2013, 07:04 PM   #23
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I ended up with the base model and the best buy triple points offer. I think for many multi tv homes the upgrade makes sense to the pro. For me I am in a one bedroom co op in NYC. So my upgrade was really to use a mini in bedroom because I actually had run a cat5 cable to the bedroom a year ago for a roku so I was set already. I actually don't have a coax cable in the bedroom . For two TVs the 4 tuners is plenty for my use. Since the mini only has 10/100 the upgraded speed of the pro Ethernet port would be eared on one mini. So for me and my use I couldn't justify the extra $200 since the experience would have ended up the same . The mini I did lifetime , the regular TiVo box I didn't because I have changed my box for the newer ones before the three year break even period based in my plan. Mini was a two year break even period so I went for that
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Old 09-23-2013, 08:21 PM   #24
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But if you lifetime your main Roamio it'll be worth a heck of a lot more in a couple years, regardless of any break even points.
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Old 09-24-2013, 07:09 AM   #25
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Yes, I couldn't use my NIM100 as MoCA master and have the Elite or the Mini connect to it using their internal MoCA devices. Of course if you continue to use NIM100 adapters without using the internal MoCA devices that should be fine. Eventually I just bought a new MoCA 1.1 adapter (NIM100 was 1.0 I believe) and that worked fine with Mini and Elite. With that setup I was able to get rid of 2 external MoCA adaptors.
Is there a software setting to turn on/off internal MoCA?
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Old 09-24-2013, 07:55 AM   #26
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Is there a software setting to turn on/off internal MoCA?
Yes, you can set up for WiFi, direct Ethernet, or MoCA.
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Old 09-24-2013, 08:00 AM   #27
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Yes, you can set up for WiFi, direct Ethernet, or MoCA.
Thanks. So sounds like direct Ethernet should be the way to go using my current adapters....
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Old 09-24-2013, 01:22 PM   #28
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Thanks. So sounds like direct Ethernet should be the way to go using my current adapters....
Direct Ethernet would always be the best way, but most people (like myself ) don't have the jacks at each TiVo location so MoCA is the 2nd best for me and many others.
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Old 09-24-2013, 01:24 PM   #29
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Side note: I wish plex had a tivo app so i could get rid of my roku player As i run a plex media server for my movies.
I use pytivo to access movies/media files stored on my computer. I played with Streambaby too but pytivo has just worked so that's what I use.
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Old 09-24-2013, 02:04 PM   #30
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Direct Ethernet would always be the best way, but most people (like myself ) don't have the jacks at each TiVo location so MoCA is the 2nd best for me and many others.
Well, he doesn't really have direct ethernet, he just has an existing MoCA setup which should still be able I guess to do what he's after, depending on how much traffic is running on that thing.
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