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Old 08-31-2013, 08:33 PM   #1
Kev1419
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Roamio RWD/FFD/30sec Local Channel Issues

I am having an issue on 2 of my local TV channels thru Time Warner Cable on my Roamio Plus. Unfortunately it is channels I watch often(ABC & CBS HD). Hoping someone has some advice they can give and wanted to post my Roamio experience in case someone is frustrated by the same issue to help give Tivo some feedback to narrow down the issue.

Here are the symptoms:
1) Live TV - The green buffer bar does not show. Pressing Rewind does the "bong" sound. All other channels rewind properly except 2 channels.
2) Recoding works and plays back fine if I don't try to FFW/RWD/30sec. But I of course don't want to sit through the commercials.
3) The FFW and 30sec seems to jump like 8 minutes but not 100% sure where I will end up in video when I press those buttons.
4) Streaming to iPad has similar issues
5) Fully downloading the video to iPad "solves" the issue. Functionally to full control the video then works. But of course not feasible to download every video I want to watch.
6) Issue only happens on a couple channels (ABC 1003-WBAYDT and CBS 1006WFRVDT in Green Bay) confirmed. I tried probably 25 other channels and those work fine.
7) Issue only happens on HD versions of CBS and ABC. SD versions of these channels work fine.

Troubleshooting Notes:
- My XL4 works perfect on these channels connected in same location. I put it back in today to reconfirm it works perfect.
- Live TV looks perfect and Signal strength in 90s on these channels
- I fully rebooted/wiped/re-setup nothing fixed the issue
- I called Tivo and they thought it was firmware or maybe hardware issue just with my box so recommended I return the Roamio and pick up a new one. So I went to BB today and picked up a new box, same issue with new box.

Anyone run into anything similar to this on ABC/CBS HD? Any advice? Thanks!
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Old 09-01-2013, 06:18 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Kev1419 View Post
I am having an issue on 2 of my local TV channels thru Time Warner Cable on my Roamio Plus. Unfortunately it is channels I watch often(ABC & CBS HD). Hoping someone has some advice they can give and wanted to post my Roamio experience in case someone is frustrated by the same issue to help give Tivo some feedback to narrow down the issue.

Here are the symptoms:
1) Live TV - The green buffer bar does not show. Pressing Rewind does the "bong" sound. All other channels rewind properly except 2 channels.
2) Recoding works and plays back fine if I don't try to FFW/RWD/30sec. But I of course don't want to sit through the commercials.
3) The FFW and 30sec seems to jump like 8 minutes but not 100% sure where I will end up in video when I press those buttons.
4) Streaming to iPad has similar issues
5) Fully downloading the video to iPad "solves" the issue. Functionally to full control the video then works. But of course not feasible to download every video I want to watch.
6) Issue only happens on a couple channels (ABC 1003-WBAYDT and CBS 1006WFRVDT in Green Bay) confirmed. I tried probably 25 other channels and those work fine.
7) Issue only happens on HD versions of CBS and ABC. SD versions of these channels work fine.

Troubleshooting Notes:
- My XL4 works perfect on these channels connected in same location. I put it back in today to reconfirm it works perfect.
- Live TV looks perfect and Signal strength in 90s on these channels
- I fully rebooted/wiped/re-setup nothing fixed the issue
- I called Tivo and they thought it was firmware or maybe hardware issue just with my box so recommended I return the Roamio and pick up a new one. So I went to BB today and picked up a new box, same issue with new box.

Anyone run into anything similar to this on ABC/CBS HD? Any advice? Thanks!
You're not alone! I just posted this a few hours ago, sounds like we're in the same boat...

I'm with Bright House in SE Michigan which is SDV. That said, I have a brand new Roamio Pro and Mini over gigabit ethernet. After going through all of my channels, I noticed 7 that tune and play perfectly on my Roamio, however they will not stream to my Mini or record properly. If I attempt to play these recordings back on either the Roamio or Mini, it's just a black screen. I also noticed that the buffer doesn't behave correctly for these 7 channels as I cannot rewind. These are regular non premium channels:

224 - Fox News
270 - National Geographic Channel
286 - Fox Sports Detroit Plus
288 - Fox Sports 1
321 - Nat Geo Wild
322 - Fox Business
368 - Fox Soccer

TiVo has no idea nor do I as to why the Roamio can tune these channels fine but can't stream or record them correctly. By the way, signal levels are great at around 80-85 with 35 SNR and 0 RS Corrected/Uncorrected errors. I was using this same Cablecard/TA with my XL4 and these channels recorded/played back fine, so I'm confident my Cablecard/TA are ok.

Last edited by ahwman : 09-05-2013 at 06:56 AM.
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Old 09-01-2013, 06:24 PM   #3
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Is there anything common about these channels? Do they use MPEG-4 encoding? Do they use a different audio format? Can you check the diagnostics screen and see if they use a strange CCI byte? Perhaps they're set to Copy Never? (Although I think that should still give you 90 minutes)
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Old 09-01-2013, 06:28 PM   #4
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Is there anything common about these channels? Do they use MPEG-4 encoding? Do they use a different audio format? Can you check the diagnostics screen and see if they use a strange CCI byte? Perhaps they're set to Copy Never? (Although I think that should still give you 90 minutes)
Do you mean the "DVR Diagnostics" screen from the HDUI or a different diagnostics screen?
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Old 09-01-2013, 06:35 PM   #5
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Do you mean the "DVR Diagnostics" screen from the HDUI or a different diagnostics screen?
That's the one. Tune a couple of your tuners to these weird channels and then the others to channels that work. Is there anything unusual about the CCI Byte value or any of the PIDs?

The CCI byte should be either 0x00 or 0x02, any other value is strange.
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Old 09-01-2013, 09:53 PM   #6
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That's the one. Tune a couple of your tuners to these weird channels and then the others to channels that work. Is there anything unusual about the CCI Byte value or any of the PIDs?

The CCI byte should be either 0x00 or 0x02, any other value is strange.
The CCI values are fine, however the PID values are different from channel to channel so I'm not sure what I should be looking for.
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:37 AM   #7
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Thanks, glad to see I am not alone on this one!

My numbers seem "normal" when I compare to the other channels also but here they are if you spot anything off, thanks.

Signal Strength: 96
SNR: 40db
RS: both are 0
CCI: 0x00
PCR PID: 0x31
Video PID: 0x31 (MPEG2)
Audio PID: 0x34 (AC3)
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:47 AM   #8
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Thanks, glad to see I am not alone on this one!

My numbers seem "normal" when I compare to the other channels also but here they are if you spot anything off, thanks.

Signal Strength: 96
SNR: 40db
RS: both are 0
CCI: 0x00
PCR PID: 0x31
Video PID: 0x31 (MPEG2)
Audio PID: 0x34 (AC3)
Your numbers look very comparable to mine. I would suggest however that you consider attenuating your signal as a 40 SNR is very high and could potentially damage your TiVo's tuners. I used a 20db attenuator and it brought mine down from 100 signal and 41 SNR to 80-85 signal and 35 SNR.

In regards to the main issue, if you haven't already done so, I suggest calling TiVo and logging this issue so that we have both of these cases on file and can cross-reference them. I plan on calling TiVo back tomorrow and updating them with some of the similarities that you and I are experiencing to see if we can find a common thread. If you would like to contact me directly so we can stay in communication, please feel free to PM me your email address.

At this point I just don't know if it's an issue with the cable signal provided by my cable company or if it's TiVo software related. Based on your experience, I would lean towards the latter explanation. Sadly, if this isn't a widespread issue and it is software related, I think we may be in for a long wait, or worse.
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Old 09-02-2013, 04:26 PM   #9
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Your numbers look very comparable to mine. I would suggest however that you consider attenuating your signal as a 40 SNR is very high and could potentially damage your TiVo's tuners. I used a 20db attenuator and it brought mine down from 100 signal and 41 SNR to 80-85 signal and 35 SNR.

In regards to the main issue, if you haven't already done so, I suggest calling TiVo and logging this issue so that we have both of these cases on file and can cross-reference them. I plan on calling TiVo back tomorrow and updating them with some of the similarities that you and I are experiencing to see if we can find a common thread. If you would like to contact me directly so we can stay in communication, please feel free to PM me your email address.

At this point I just don't know if it's an issue with the cable signal provided by my cable company or if it's TiVo software related. Based on your experience, I would lean towards the latter explanation. Sadly, if this isn't a widespread issue and it is software related, I think we may be in for a long wait, or worse.
UPDATE: I spoke with a supervisor today at TiVo and he informed me that he has come across this same issue one time before. The ultimate fix was for the customer to replace their CableCard and he said this solved all their issues. Though I'm skeptical it's a CableCard issue, I have to give it a try to rule it out. You may want to do the same. I'll keep you posted...
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Old 09-02-2013, 04:29 PM   #10
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Seems like if it were a CC problem you wouldn't be able to tune the channel at all. The fact that you can tune it but there is some issue recording it and/or playing back the shows you do record seems like a software problem to me. Although like you said you have to try it just to rule out the possibility.
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Old 09-02-2013, 04:31 PM   #11
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Seems like if it were a CC problem you wouldn't be able to tune the channel at all. The fact that you can tune it but there is some issue recording it and/or playing back the shows you do record seems like a software problem to me. Although like you said you have to try it just to rule out the possibility.
I totaly agree, however I also wound think if it were a software issue that more people would be reporting it. Very confusing and frusterating at the same time...
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Old 09-04-2013, 08:52 PM   #12
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Seems like if it were a CC problem you wouldn't be able to tune the channel at all. The fact that you can tune it but there is some issue recording it and/or playing back the shows you do record seems like a software problem to me. Although like you said you have to try it just to rule out the possibility.
Well after pairing a brand new Motorola CableCard (still in it's original packaging), sadly the problem still exists . Now TiVo is sending me a new Roamio Pro, however at this point I don't have much faith that this will correct this issue as I'm starting to wonder if it is software related. Not to mention all of the headaches of re-pairing the CableCard and the transfer of the TiVo service and reconfiguration. It just shouldn't be this difficult...
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:17 PM   #13
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Here is an update on my situation...still no luck either. I tried a new cablecard with same results. I also tried it without a cablecard because I don't even need it to receive ABC & CBS. I also swapped it with a Tivo Roamio Basic just to give that a try if there could be any difference between the Plus hardware, same issue.

I chatted with Tivo customer service last night and could not get any real help only to say contact your cable company, sorry... I've spent too much time on this so I need to decide soon if I just live with the Roamio issues for now and hope a future update fixes or just return it and go back to the XL4 which works great on those channels. It will be a hard decision because I really want to keep the Roamio with the new features, if just these 2 channels worked!
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:25 PM   #14
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Here is an update on my situation...still no luck either. I tried a new cablecard with same results. I also tried it without a cablecard because I don't even need it to receive ABC & CBS. I also swapped it with a Tivo Roamio Basic just to give that a try if there could be any difference between the Plus hardware, same issue.

I chatted with Tivo customer service last night and could not get any real help only to say contact your cable company, sorry... I've spent too much time on this so I need to decide soon if I just live with the Roamio issues for now and hope a future update fixes or just return it and go back to the XL4 which works great on those channels. It will be a hard decision because I really want to keep the Roamio with the new features, if just these 2 channels worked!
I'm in the exact same boat as you and EXTREMELY frusterated and tired. Sadly, to appease TiVo, I have to go through the RMA process, have my cable company pair my CableCard to the new TiVo and more than likely have the same result, then re-pair the CableCard back to my current Roamio all to prove it's a problem with the software or hardware design. Perhaps it might help if you and I can cross reference our case numbers with TiVo as it lends more credence to this being a TiVo issue - not a customer issue.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:28 PM   #15
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If the list was the channels ahwman listed then I'd live with it and hope a future update fixed it. But with ABC and CBS affected I'm not sure I'd take the chance.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:43 PM   #16
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If the list was the channels ahwman listed then I'd live with it and hope a future update fixed it. But with ABC and CBS affected I'm not sure I'd take the chance.
There must be a common thread with these problem channels and the Roamio hardware/software. Sadly, I don't have the expertise to find it. My concern is that this since this doesn't appear to be a widespread issue, chances are TiVo won't expend a great deal of time and effort to fix it. Look how long it took to fix the suggestions not recording with a tuning adapter attached bug and that affected quite a few people. I want to love this new Roamio as it's so fast and does so many great things, however I feel like I'm driving a brand new Ferari that only makes right turns...
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:47 PM   #17
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Can you record from these channels at all? If so can you record a short segment on one of the channels, copy it to your computer using TiVoToGo and then upload it to me here...

http://www.videoredo.net/UploadFiles.htm

Use "attn Dan203" as the ticket number. Also send me a PM with your TiVo MAK so I can open the file. I have some tools that I can use to see if there is anything specific about the audio or video causing the problem.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:50 PM   #18
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Can you record from these channels at all? If so can you record a short segment on one of the channels, copy it to your computer using TiVoToGo and then upload it to me here...

http://www.videoredo.net/UploadFiles.htm

Use "attn Dan203" as the ticket number. Also send me a PM with your TiVo MAK so I can open the file. I have some tools that I can use to see if there is anything specific about the audio or video causing the problem.

Unfortunately for me these channels are copy protected.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:55 PM   #19
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What about you Kev1419?
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Old 09-05-2013, 10:35 AM   #20
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I have the same issue.

We've watched "So You Think You Can Dance" on FOX (Comcast) for many years across multiple TiVos with no issues. Recently, we upgraded to the Roamio Plus, and now we have the fast-forward/rewind glitch that's described here.

So far, we've only seen the problem with this show. All of the other shows we watch have worked perfectly. We now have two "bad" recordings of this show on the DVR, and both of them exhibit similar problems.

This morning, I setup my video camera and recorded the behavior. Note that you can also see a small video "hiccup" at the beginning of the show. Not sure if that means anything, but it isn't something I usually see. Otherwise, you'll see me use the slowest fast-forward mode, and when I press play, the video jumps about 20 minutes into the show.

The video also shows me navigating to last week's show and seeing the same problem.

TiVo Roamio Plus Fast Forward and Rewind Glitch

I'll try to transfer the show to my computer and get it to Dan203. The problem is, it's a long show!

Last edited by Anyware : 09-05-2013 at 10:59 AM.
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Old 09-05-2013, 11:59 AM   #21
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Hi everyone,

We believe we understand (and have a fix for) this issue. Please don't go to the effort to replace your CableCARDs -- it won't help.

First, we want to verify that you are experiencing the exact same issue, so please:

1. The next time it happens, please enter 9 1 1 CLEAR and then 7 7 7 CLEAR when looking at the problem video.

2. Connect to the TiVo Service *TWICE*.

3. (OPTIONAL) Sign up for the TiVo Beta program, which would be the quickest way to test the fix:
https://fieldtrials.tivo.com/signup/default.html

4. Email me with the date/time you did step #1 (margret@tivo.com) with the subject: "Roamio Trickplay Channel issue" and include your TiVo Service Number (TSN). Let me know in the email if you signed up for the Beta program.

Thanks,
--Margret
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:41 PM   #22
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Quote:
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I have the same issue.

We've watched "So You Think You Can Dance" on FOX (Comcast) for many years across multiple TiVos with no issues. Recently, we upgraded to the Roamio Plus, and now we have the fast-forward/rewind glitch that's described here.

So far, we've only seen the problem with this show. All of the other shows we watch have worked perfectly. We now have two "bad" recordings of this show on the DVR, and both of them exhibit similar problems.

This morning, I setup my video camera and recorded the behavior. Note that you can also see a small video "hiccup" at the beginning of the show. Not sure if that means anything, but it isn't something I usually see. Otherwise, you'll see me use the slowest fast-forward mode, and when I press play, the video jumps about 20 minutes into the show.

The video also shows me navigating to last week's show and seeing the same problem.

TiVo Roamio Plus Fast Forward and Rewind Glitch

I'll try to transfer the show to my computer and get it to Dan203. The problem is, it's a long show!
I get that video hiccup at the very beginning of "So You Think You Can Dance" on my 2 tuner premier but don't have any of the other problems with it so its probably not related. I think I've seen it on the last 3 or 4 episodes.
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Old 09-06-2013, 01:54 PM   #23
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I have the exact same problem as Anyware described, the only difference being that I was recording Masterchef. Oh, and I have a Roamio Basic.

For what it's worth, I'm also in the Seattle area, so it's the exact same local affiliate.

Is there still value in sending bug data through the process described above, like by viewing the stored recording and running through that sequence? Or has that ship sailed. Either way, looking forward to the presumed firmware update that restores our confidence that TiVo won't miss things.
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Old 09-08-2013, 05:22 PM   #24
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I have this same issue on my Fox affiliate KCPQ on Tacoma/Pierce County Comcast. Watching the NFL games I can't fwd/rwd (trick-play) the games but I can during the commercials. If I rewind during the football game it rewinds the preceding commercials but none of the game.
Edit: I can trick-play local commercials (feeds), not national commercials.

Last edited by fdisker2000 : 09-08-2013 at 05:49 PM.
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Old 09-09-2013, 10:55 AM   #25
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I have the same issues during the NFL games in Green Bay in my Roamio. It was only on the HD channels. It also happens to me during "Under The Dome" every week without fail. I contacted Tivo and they wanted me to replace my remote and contact Time Warner.
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Old 09-16-2013, 10:56 PM   #26
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I just experienced this issue watching the new episode of Bones on Fox. I'm on cox cable using a Roamio basic.

Fast forward and rewind would jump around and get stuck but I could watch the show without using fast forward and rewind. The timeline bar was not completely full even though the show was finished recording.
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:10 PM   #27
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If someone has a recording saved on their box that shows this issue 100% of the time, please send me an email (margret@tivo.com). We may want to "extract" the recording from your box so we can take a look at it.

Thanks,
--Margret
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Old 09-16-2013, 11:14 PM   #28
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I think I just encountered this issue tonight with Sleepy Hollow. I had not watched a show on Fox until now. Does this issue only affect Fox affiliates?
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Old 09-17-2013, 12:44 AM   #29
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Happened to me on Sleepy Hollow as well. I have mine set to record 3 minutes after the show, and I can ff and rw during that portion.

I'll look in to it again tomorrow and email Margret the deets
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Old 09-17-2013, 11:09 AM   #30
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If someone has a recording saved on their box that shows this issue 100% of the time, please send me an email (margret@tivo.com). We may want to "extract" the recording from your box so we can take a look at it.
I still have the original two recordings on my TiVo (kept them for exactly this reason) that I illustrated in the YouTube video.

I've sent you an e-mail, and I'm happy to get them to you.
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