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Old 07-08-2013, 08:42 PM   #31
nooneuknow
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morac View Post
While it won't hurt a good drive, doing a KS52 can make a "bad" drive fail faster. At best, it does nothing, at worse it can trigger a failure, so it's not the best thing to do frequently.

KS54 can't fix a bad drive, it can only tell you of the drive is going bad and it doesn't do a good job at that either. Like most SMART tests it's fairly useless. They are not a good predictor of when a drive is about to fail. Google's drive study found that:


Personally I've had an expander drive completely fail on the TiVo, yet TiVo's KS54 said it was working great. Of course the drive still works great on my PC.
Whatever. I've been doing it for YEARS, on four TiVo HDs, and four TiVo Premieres. It's NEVER nuked a drive for me.

Like I said, in the original post,
Quote:
That *should* cover all the bases. If it doesn't, the drive was doomed, anyway.

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Old 07-08-2013, 08:46 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morac View Post
they just make drives that are already going bad (spontaneous reboots, macro blocking, etc) more likely to simply fail to boot up.
Hence "expose a bad drive".
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Old 07-08-2013, 09:32 PM   #33
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Hence "expose a bad drive".
Exactly! If it is bad, the next update would bring that to light, anyway. Or, maybe the next one, or the one after that, and so on...

There's no acceleration of it *becoming* bad, doing what what I proposed, as well as practice, only exposing the fact.

Uneven wear, which is somewhat addressed by the PWL (Pre-emptive Wear Leveling) feature, which most, if not all, AV rated drives have, which may also be the ONLY AV drive feature that an AV drive puts to use in a TiVo, is there to EXTEND the drive life, by making sure the heads traverse the entire platter surface, from time-to-time.

So, my idea, is a poor man's PWL technique, if it is used regularly. Otherwise, the inactive partitions, don't get written/read/verified, until the next update, or the next KS 52 initiation.

I also can attest to the fact that I've had SEVERAL KS 54 SMART tests tell me that my drives were failing the "read element", portion of the tests. Yet, they seemed to be fine. They worked fine. However, WinDLG, from WD told me that they failed SMART as well, during the read test.

One may argue, that only the manufacturer's utilities can really tell you if a drive is bad. However, it has been my experience that this scenario usually happens ONLY during a full destructive "write zeros" test, or may pop up when you do a full read test, AFTER the writing of the zeros.

Your mileage may vary, of course...
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Old 07-08-2013, 10:05 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SullyND View Post

Hence "expose a bad drive".
There are other ways to tell a drive is bad, though many people incorrectly blame software bugs.
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Old 07-08-2013, 10:07 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by nooneuknow View Post

Whatever. I've been doing it for YEARS, on four TiVo HDs, and four TiVo Premieres. It's NEVER nuked a drive for me.

Like I said, in the original post,
And I've never done it and my drive is fine, so all you proved is your placebo doesn't hurt anything. Which is what I said, if your drive is good, it won't hurt, but it doesn't help either.
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Old 07-08-2013, 10:53 PM   #36
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And I've never done it and my drive is fine, so all you proved is your placebo doesn't hurt anything. Which is what I said, if your drive is good, it won't hurt, but it doesn't help either.
Take your cat and go claw somebody else's face off. Troll.
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Old 07-08-2013, 10:55 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by nooneuknow View Post

Take your cat and go claw somebody else's face off. Troll.
I'm not trolling, I'm just telling people to ignore your advice to run a kickstart 52 every few months as it's not needed.
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Old 07-09-2013, 03:04 PM   #38
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I'm not trolling, I'm just telling people to ignore your advice to run a kickstart 52 every few months as it's not needed.
So you are TELLING people what to do, or not to do. You even did the selective quoting, and not addressing or counterpointing all the rest. Typical troll behavior.

I was simply SHARING something I do. I made some observations about doing it and shared them. I didn't go telling people what, or what not, to do.

Free will, and all... People are free to ignore what I share, or decide to try it. It's not like I told somebody to go drop their drive, or TiVo, four feet or more to fix it. I didn't tell anybody to put their hand on a power supply, while the unit is plugged in. These things are where it makes sense to speak up and tell people "Don't do that!". Since there's plenty of threads, where people are actually giving out advice, like these dangerous/destructive measures, why don't I see you stepping in? I'm sure your answer will be quite amusing...
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:08 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by nooneuknow View Post

So you are TELLING people what to do, or not to do. You even did the selective quoting, and not addressing or counterpointing all the rest. Typical troll behavior.

I was simply SHARING something I do. I made some observations about doing it and shared them. I didn't go telling people what, or what not, to do.

Free will, and all... People are free to ignore what I share, or decide to try it. It's not like I told somebody to go drop their drive, or TiVo, four feet or more to fix it. I didn't tell anybody to put their hand on a power supply, while the unit is plugged in. These things are where it makes sense to speak up and tell people "Don't do that!". Since there's plenty of threads, where people are actually giving out advice, like these dangerous/destructive measures, why don't I see you stepping in? I'm sure your answer will be quite amusing...
I'm not sure what you are talking about when you say I did "selective quoting" as I quoted your entire post. I can only assume you just like to argue, which based on your posts in other threads is likely the case (talking of "typical troll behavior").

In any case I don't care what you do to your own TiVo, but if you are telling other TiVo users that routine Kickstart 52s are recommended to keep your TiVo in peak condition, I'm going to say "no it's not". No offense, but I have a lot more experience using TiVo software and hardware than you (compare our join dates), so I know what I'm talking about. Plus there's the old adage, if it's not broke, don't fix it. In any case I'm done responding as I've already made my point that there's no reason to perform routine KS 52s.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:22 PM   #40
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11.0m

I have 1 S3 TIVO and 2 HD's. One of my HD's the !!.0m software. The S3 and the other HD don't, as of now.

Don H
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:36 PM   #41
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I'm not sure what you are talking about when you say I did "selective quoting" as I quoted your entire post. I can only assume you just like to argue, which based on your posts in other threads is likely the case (talking of "typical troll behavior").

In any case I don't care what you do to your own TiVo, but if you are telling other TiVo users that routine Kickstart 52s are recommended to keep your TiVo in peak condition, I'm going to say "no it's not". No offense, but I have a lot more experience using TiVo software and hardware than you (compare our join dates), so I know what I'm talking about. Plus there's the old adage, if it's not broke, don't fix it. In any case I'm done responding as I've already made my point that there's no reason to perform routine KS 52s.
I'm going to just ignore you, after I point out that "Join Dates" and "Post Counts" don't mean jack squat. I lurked here for years before creating an account. Zip your damn pants up. Oh, sorry, trolls don't wear pants. I don't like to pick fights. I especially don't like being manipulated into them. That's where the join dates, and post counts might actually have any relevance. You long-timer big-poster guys think you own the damn place. Well, sorry, you don't.
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Old 07-10-2013, 05:28 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by wtkflhn View Post
I have 1 S3 TIVO and 2 HD's. One of my HD's the !!.0m software. The S3 and the other HD don't, as of now.

Don H
That's good news that 0m is ready for the HD both of my HD's are still on 11.0k can you access and download from the updated HD using the web interface?
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Old 07-12-2013, 02:32 AM   #43
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Take your cat and go claw somebody else's face off. Troll.
You're talking to the "troll" that came up with the fix to the "expired cookie prevents TiVo Desktop from working" problem, so I'm willing to consider the possibility that the troll knows whereof he (or she) speaks.
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Old 07-12-2013, 04:27 AM   #44
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You're talking to the "troll" that came up with the fix to the "expired cookie prevents TiVo Desktop from working" problem, so I'm willing to consider the possibility that the troll knows whereof he (or she) speaks.
I've seen more than one person post about finding a fix on their own, in various ways, shapes, and forms, long before TiVo addressed it.

I come up with plenty of fixes too. But I'm a member of NDA Club.

I don't want to get into it with you, unitron. We've gotten along so well in the past, in case you don't remember...
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Old 07-12-2013, 06:58 AM   #45
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I pulled my OLED S3 out of the closet to see if it would download 11.0m but I got the S03 error instead. So I need to let it run for a bit before I can try again. My THD is still on 11.0k. Looks like a slow roll-out?
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Old 07-12-2013, 08:20 AM   #46
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I pulled my OLED S3 out of the closet to see if it would download 11.0m but I got the S03 error instead. So I need to let it run for a bit before I can try again. My THD is still on 11.0k. Looks like a slow roll-out?
I would expect so. I would think TiVo would want to make very sure nothing goes wrong with the update, considering the S3's EOL status.
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Old 07-12-2013, 09:10 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by unitron View Post
You're talking to the "troll" that came up with the fix to the "expired cookie prevents TiVo Desktop from working" problem, so I'm willing to consider the possibility that the troll knows whereof he (or she) speaks.
+1 No reasonable justification for calling morac a troll.
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Old 07-12-2013, 12:26 PM   #48
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I don't care if they invented TiVo Desktop itself! Some people seem to think that just because they have an earlier join date, and thousands, or tens of thousands of posts, that they own the place, and have some right to look down upon others who didn't actually join ten years ago, and post thousands of who-knows-what posts.

Maybe I was just having a bad day or three, and didn't like the tone, or perceived tone of a response directed at me. So sue me.

I lurked here for years before joining. This place was different back then.

I have yet to be asked by any OFFICIAL moderator to change any behavior. If I'm doing something against the rules, moderator, please speak now.

The trolls have re-invaded, and those that were keeping low are back at it again. It sucks, it gets on my nerves, maybe sometimes I take it out on the wrong person.

This just rubbed me the wrong way:

Quote:
I have a lot more experience using TiVo software and hardware than you (compare our join dates), so I know what I'm talking about.
I'm sure it would rub others the wrong way, too, if directed at them. Pretexting it with "No offense, but..." doesn't make it non-offensive, when used in a context like that.

I'm willing to drop it, if everybody else will. I will not let fanboys, trolls, and/or people with sacred join dates/large post counts just trample on me, like I don't know what I'm talking about, just because of those two, insignificant markers! Now can we just get back on topic, please?

I'd delete those posts, as a good-will gesture. But, besides that being against the unwritten rules, it's been quoted already. I'm not going to apologize. I feel I was jumped first, and the matter I was jumped over, hasn't been disputed by another person, at all, yet...
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Old 07-12-2013, 02:17 PM   #49
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I was a lurker here for many years before I joined in '08 to publish TDCM. Your point is taken.

Morac has received more "thank you" posts than I will ever even dream of, and nooneyouknow always has something to say that's worth reading even if I sometimes disagree. There's no reason to start a cage match over a piddly 11.0m thread.
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Old 07-12-2013, 02:53 PM   #50
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Just when I thought I was out



I know I said I wasn't going to respond anymore, but ... well watch the video.

My original post was in my response to, IMHO, bad advice given regarding "necessary" routine maintenance of a TiVo box. My disagreement somehow offended the person in question, who apparently has a strong Type A personality and takes disagreement personally. Anyway I was immediately called a troll, despite the definition of that word not applying. I tend to respond to hostility and name calling with disdain, so I responded that I've been here a long time so I have knowledge of what I'm talking about. It's not like I showed up out of nowhere just to start an argument. The person was again offended by that, though this time I suppose rightfully so, since I was being a bit of a braggart.

In any case, I apologize if I came across as pretentiousness, but I will still stick by my initial comment.
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Old 07-12-2013, 03:33 PM   #51
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This must be a slow roll out of !!.0m. I still only have 1 of 3 TIVO's updated. I have forced connections, to no avail.

Don H.
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Old 07-12-2013, 04:44 PM   #52
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I don't understand this "lurking for years before joining" thing.

I do think that treating kickstart as a regular maintenance procedure is bad advice.
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Old 07-12-2013, 05:10 PM   #53
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Thursday AM I noticed that the TiVo S3 HD had reboot around 2:30AM I just verified and it had received the 11m update. The 2 other S3's are still on 0k.

wmcbrine, I lurked for almost a year before joining I figured that I did not have much to contribute about TiVo and would "listen" to the experts. beside that it took most of my free time just to keep up with the new messages. Then I had problems trying to add Telnet in the 240 Series 2.
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Old 07-12-2013, 06:21 PM   #54
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My 2TB OLED S3 was locked up yesterday AM, I thought it was the heat, but I just checked, it's 11.0m now! yippee!
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Old 07-12-2013, 07:09 PM   #55
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<content removed to save space>
1. It wasn't an immediate reaction.
2. You just wouldn't let up, even when others contributed, in a mostly neutral manner.
3. You implied you know more and know better, just because you've been a forum member for X amount of years, and further belittled me by pointing out my lower years.
4. X amount of people have chimed in, since this mess broke out, mostly neutral, and you still don't let up.
5. I'm the one who said I was willing to let it go. I even consulted with a mediator, to ask if I was being in the wrong.
6. Here you are again, doing the dance of video clips, Wikipedia articles, showing off your vastly superior intellect.
7. If I didn't write this, in response, you'd have proven everything I feel about you, but I'm not going to break out a slide show presentation, and provide links to definitions.
8. I keep saying, I never TOLD anybody to do anything. I SHARED something I do, and how I do it, that was actually RELEVANT TO A RELEVANT POINT RELEVANT TO THE THREAD.
9. You kept/keep trying to tell people exactly what to do (not do). Telling people not to do something, is the same as telling them to do something.
10. I think I'd have made a better impression to just let your ongoing demonstration of your agenda and own personality type prove all this.
10. Part 2. What the h-e-double-hockey-sticks does what you just posted have ANYTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH, OR IS OF ANY RELEVANCE TO THE THREAD TOPIC?

Last edited by nooneuknow : 07-12-2013 at 08:27 PM. Reason: spelling/grammar
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Old 07-12-2013, 11:20 PM   #56
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Instead of snipping my post and posting a top ten list of "how the world has wronged you and is out to get you" complaints that has nothing to do with my post, try actually reading what I wrote.

You know what, I don't care welcome to my ignore list. Congratulations you're the second person in 10 years to make it there.
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:40 AM   #57
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Instead of snipping my post and posting a top ten list of "how the world has wronged you and is out to get you" complaints that has nothing to do with my post, try actually reading what I wrote.

You know what, I don't care welcome to my ignore list. Congratulations you're the second person in 10 years to make it there.
OK, even though you aren't going to see this, I did read it, more than once, thought it over, thoroughly, and came to the conclusion that it was the equivalent of saying "Oh, I'm sorry, I apologize.", while pushing up your glasses, with you're middle finger. I'm happy to be on morac's ignore list, and this can FINALLY be over.

I think I can actually speak for more than just myself on this one, with this FINAL thought:

....and there was much rejoicing.
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:58 AM   #58
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You really need to stop taking this stuff personally man. Just because someone disagrees with you does not mean he's a troll or that he thinks you suck. I've seen this in multiple threads and it's getting old, please consider letting more stuff go in future or just respond without accusing the other person of attacking you.
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:01 AM   #59
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My 2TB OLED S3 was locked up yesterday AM, I thought it was the heat, but I just checked, it's 11.0m now! yippee!
Now that the thread is back on topic, I can also confirm this update is rolling.

Can anybody find/report anything that might have earned this update a nickname of anything more than "cookiecutter"?

Last I checked, speculation, and hopes, aren't forbidden, as long as they aren't presented as facts (even though there are a few who may vehemently object to anything other than "absolutes").

I happily welcome ANY (forward-moving) update to old end-of-life platforms, so long as they don't introduce any new bugs/issues/problems, or make the old units any less operable/inter-operable, than the release they superseded. Then, if they do, I expect another update to address those matters. If new problems come with the update, I *HOPE* TiVo will do the right thing. That's if it applies. Otherwise, I'm content, and happy, that they haven't entirely abandoned the EOL platforms. TiVo isn't obliged to update EOL platforms, so I see this as a very good indiciation that TiVo has not forgotten/abandoned those with the EOL platforms. Good for TiVo, and their image & end-user/owner perception of TiVo within the community (myself included). I didn't se this coming, and an pleasantly surprised. Good for us, & good for TiVo. I had accepted 11.0k as being the last/final revision for us, long ago. So here's to TiVo, for doing the right thing:

Last edited by nooneuknow : 07-13-2013 at 09:23 AM. Reason: additions.
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:42 AM   #60
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You really need to stop taking this stuff personally man. Just because someone disagrees with you does not mean he's a troll or that he thinks you suck. I've seen this in multiple threads and it's getting old, please consider letting more stuff go in future or just respond without accusing the other person of attacking you.
Point taken. I will *TRY* to do exactly that. I can only thicken my skin, to a point, and raise my "can't let that slide" scale/threshold to a point, at this juncture. But, I do agree, in general, it has gotten out-of-hand/out of control. I assure everybody, it was not my intention to set-out to make it that way.

I will pray for the strength to not allow some people to get under my skin and will *TRY* to do better. It's counter-productive/counter-intuitive to not try. I DO pay attention to what others have to say.

Some threads are meant for speculation, and hopes, while others are not. I allowed that line to blur. I offer my sincere apologies, to all who deserve it.

While I have either wrapped-up the existing conflicts, or stepped-away from them, there may still be a small number of fires, which I either need to address, or chose to step-back from (and hope they extinguish without further interaction, from me).

I may take a vacation, from these forums, in order to try and reset my reaction mechanism. I will not leave, but may choose to just lurk for a while.

Edit/Add: My goal is to find the best way, or a better way, to deal with situations like the "morac" incident, and prevent any more of those from happening (to the best of my abilities).

It's my opinion, that for me to just add such participants to my ignore list, merely gives them an opportunity to belittle/degrade me, for all to see, except myself. That just doesn't seem to be the right, or best, way to "handle" such matters...

I do have a lot of good/constructive experience/knowledge to offer/contribute, which choosing not to contribute, just makes me a parasite, feeding on the knowledge of others, while not "paying it forward". That just seems/feels like a way to further degrade the usefulness of these forums/threads, to those looking to it for help/knowledge (especially the novices and/or newcomers).

All I ask (even though there's much I'd like to), is that people don't auto-condemn me for being a late-joiner, with a low post count. Those who understand the "lurking, while not joining/contributing" part, know that just because I only joined, officially, a couple years ago, doesn't mean anything.

My case/point: There's an unquantifiable number of lurkers, who have not joined, and any one of them could know more than all the joined members, combined. There's no way to prove, or dis-prove this. An example, would be actual TiVo engineers, supervisors, code-writers, support staff, and other VERY knowledgeable people, who may chose not to join, or can't/don't, perhaps due to a directive, from up-on-high, within TiVo, not to join and/or participate, here.

There is no question that there are people, who could be great assets to the forum, that either chose not to join/contribute, or they have no choice in the matter. TiVo is well-aware of these forums, and their ranks wouldn't be so harsh, and quick to dismiss what is here, if they didn't know what was actually here.

I'm not saying "case-closed", or that this is gospel. However, further discussion about what I have brought up, in this thread, and most other threads, is Off-Topic, thus is a violation of the forum rules. I don't want to get myself into trouble for continuing on, in the wrong places...

Last edited by nooneuknow : 07-13-2013 at 12:25 PM. Reason: grammar
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