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Old 07-03-2013, 03:28 PM   #61
waynomo
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I think someone mentioned this previously.

There is a new Harrison. I just checked the cast on IMDB. The old Harrison is credited to twin brothers, Luke & Evan Kruntchev. The 2013 Harrison is credited as Jadon Wells.

I swear the old Harrisons seemed mentally challenged. They couldn't deliver a line. I think they must have told them to not say anything and just act dumb. Of course it is very difficult to cast an infant and hope they can act in 3 or 5 years.
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Old 07-03-2013, 03:34 PM   #62
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About Vogel's appearance.

To me Vogel looked like a female version of John Lithgow (Trinity.) And that could just be a coincidence, however I get a very different vibe from her as opposed to Frank Lundy, the other "outside" consultant that was working with the department.

I would never suspect Lundy of anything evil. At least at first blush, there can be a lot going on with Vogel.
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Old 07-03-2013, 03:57 PM   #63
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From this I will assume that Vogel worked with Harry to create a code, so the Dexter could reasonably function in society.
I was with you until that point (well, with the exception of Vogel being a child psychiatrist, unless I missed some hint, I thought she was probably always specializing in sociopaths and psychopaths).

But I don't see that the Code was intended for Dexter to "reasonably function in society". I think there is really no way that the Code was intended to have Dexter function reasonably in society. It was either a last ditch effort to keep Dexter from killing innocents and/or going to prison, or it was an attempt to create a secret weapon to go after people that the police could not get. Either way, he is functioning outside society in a way that many people would consider quite unreasonable.
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Old 07-03-2013, 05:19 PM   #64
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I was with you until that point (well, with the exception of Vogel being a child psychiatrist, unless I missed some hint, I thought she was probably always specializing in sociopaths and psychopaths).
Well, the hint would be the drawings she handed Dexter. They are typically one of the tools child psychiatrists use. I think you are right that she worked/works with sociopaths and psychopaths, and perhaps is just familiar with treating children. I don't think there is too much of a need to pin down exactly what she is. We are certainly in the ball park.

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But I don't see that the Code was intended for Dexter to "reasonably function in society". I think there is really no way that the Code was intended to have Dexter function reasonably in society. It was either a last ditch effort to keep Dexter from killing innocents and/or going to prison, or it was an attempt to create a secret weapon to go after people that the police could not get. Either way, he is functioning outside society in a way that many people would consider quite unreasonable.
Well I think "reasonably function in society" = "keep Dexter from killing innocents and/or going to prison." Granted that might be stretching it, but certainly for the first few years I viewed Dexter as a hero. He was ridding society of people we didn't want harming anybody else.

However, I do like the secret weapon theory. Harry and Vogel created a modern day Frankenstein. That is a definite possibility.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:24 PM   #65
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No way. LaGuerta went to him last season with her suspicions about Dexter. If Captain Matthews knows about Dex and wanted him to be caught, he would have helped her rather than obstructing her.
Matthews might have changed his mind about Dexter after LaGuerta was killed, thinking Dexter did it. That might have been a step too far for him.

Personally I don't think that Matthews invited Vogel in to catch Dexter. I think she showed up herself for her own reasons, and Matthews may or may not know or suspect about Dexter, but that's beside the point.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:26 PM   #66
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Dexter's mom is dead.. In season 1 his brother Brian Moser bought their childhood home. IIRC Dexter had flashbacks when he went to visit Deb and her fiance (dexters brother) at the home. Brian Moser and Dexter also had memories of each other. Dex also had memories of his mother being chainsawed alive. Too much points to that Laura Moser is the mother, and she dead.

If the writers make Vogel the mother, it means that're completely throwing out all the back story season 1 and 2 built up.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:30 PM   #67
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Matthews might have changed his mind about Dexter after LaGuerta was killed, thinking Dexter did it. That might have been a step too far for him.

Personally I don't think that Matthews invited Vogel in to catch Dexter. I think she showed up herself for her own reasons, and Matthews may or may not know or suspect about Dexter, but that's beside the point.
Yeah, whether Matthews knows about Dexter or not, I think LaGuerta's death and her unwavering suspicions about Dexter could have pushed him to bring someone in. However Vogel knowing so much about Dexter (unless he's crazy, and that last scene was in his head) and having those paintings, knowing the code, just enforces the theory Matthews knows about Dexter too. I think Matthews asked Vogel to come and work with Dexter to see if they created a monster or not.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:36 PM   #68
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I think Vogel showed up on her own.

I don't think Matthews all of a sudden has it in for Dexter.

Also, don't forget that Matthews did not think that highly of LaGuerta. She basically screwed him over so she could get his job.
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Old 07-03-2013, 07:06 PM   #69
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Also, don't forget that Matthews did not think that highly of LaGuerta. She basically screwed him over so she could get his job.
Yeah, and IIRC after his retirement he was annoyed that she kept pestering him about Dexter, then a little intrigued, then Dexter finessed the situation so it looked like she was nuts and he went back to being annoyed.
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:43 PM   #70
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Dexter's mom is dead.. In season 1 his brother Brian Moser bought their childhood home. IIRC Dexter had flashbacks when he went to visit Deb and her fiance (dexters brother) at the home. Brian Moser and Dexter also had memories of each other. Dex also had memories of his mother being chainsawed alive. Too much points to that Laura Moser is the mother, and she dead.

If the writers make Vogel the mother, it means that're completely throwing out all the back story season 1 and 2 built up.
Correction on the childhood home ... Dex inherited the home from a dead relative of whom he had no awareness. Brian showed up at the home so that Dex could kill Deb.

Matthews has always been a shady character, and I like the theory about Vogel having been in on developing "Harry's Code". I don't think Matthews knows about any of that, however, but that he had the hots for Vogel back in the day and they may have had a relationship at one time long ago.
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Old 07-03-2013, 10:20 PM   #71
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Do we know who Dexter's real dad is/was?
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Old 07-03-2013, 11:18 PM   #72
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Do we know who Dexter's real dad is/was?
Joseph Driscoll
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Old 07-04-2013, 12:28 AM   #73
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Yeah, and IIRC after his retirement he was annoyed that she kept pestering him about Dexter, then a little intrigued, then Dexter finessed the situation so it looked like she was nuts and he went back to being annoyed.
And so while you are agreeing with me, I have to point out though that it seems like the evidence has been pounded over Matthews head of who Dexter really is. So in a sense this makes him out to be a real idiot.
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Old 07-04-2013, 12:32 AM   #74
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I don't recall anybody talking about where Debra is going this season.

I have to believe that her story line and Dexter's will converge in a significant way sometime this season. The mafia hit man knows that Deb has the key to where the jewels are hidden.

Also, if Debra lives, I don't think she can end the season as a drunk who is regretting everything. So somehow they will get her sober and back to her reasonable old self.

Just food for thought.
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Old 07-04-2013, 06:26 AM   #75
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Joseph Driscoll
What happened to him? Was it in the show at all?
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Old 07-04-2013, 06:43 AM   #76
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And so while you are agreeing with me, I have to point out though that it seems like the evidence has been pounded over Matthews head of who Dexter really is. So in a sense this makes him out to be a real idiot.
Or it just makes Dexter smarter than La Guerta.

Which would be really, really hard to dispute.
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Old 07-04-2013, 10:01 AM   #77
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What happened to him? Was it in the show at all?
Brian killed him.
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Old 07-08-2013, 07:24 AM   #78
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I think Vogel showed up on her own.

I don't think Matthews all of a sudden has it in for Dexter.

Also, don't forget that Matthews did not think that highly of LaGuerta. She basically screwed him over so she could get his job.
Agree with all of these points. IF Matthews was involved in bringing in Vogel, to target Dexter, I'd be surprised. I think Vogel 'caught wind' of where Dexter was, after all these years and decided to 'offer to help' to Matthews/Miami PD.

I guess we'll see where it all heads.

If she ends up being Dex's mom, I'd be surprised and very disappointed, given the background that we've been given to date. That would really be writing in a character that makes no sense simply for a "plot twist' or surprise. (which I know has been done, but come one!_). I know Dexter isn't the great show with terrific writing as it was in the beginning, but I don't think it has 'jumped the shark'. I think making Vogel his mother would be a "jump the shark" moment for me.
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Old 07-09-2013, 04:40 PM   #79
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An interesting spin would be if she's a serial killer who kills by convincing others to kill.
+1! I'm strongly heading towards this because of glaringly obvious times they don't show things relating to her...

Spoiler:
...oh this package arrived...oh my door was open when I got here


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I hate the "Next on Dexter" clips -- they really throw in A LOT of spoilers -- more than most other shows, so I try to avoid them at all costs.
But also remember historically, this show's great at editing and misdirecting on the NEXT ONs. There was already a misdirection in the "this season on" preview that when showed that it'll be on the next episode is totally different in context.
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