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Old 05-06-2013, 05:59 PM   #9481
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Originally Posted by unitron View Post
WD20EURS $90 at newegg 'til 5/7/13


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136783

Use promo code

EMCYTZT3403

to get $10 off of $99.99

Ends 11:59 PM Pacific Time, Tuesday night, May 7th, 2013

Thanks Unitron! I got one of these just as a spare...or in case I buy another Premiere.
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Old 05-06-2013, 06:57 PM   #9482
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You may need to run wdilde3.exe /D. To do it, you would need to boot up to an environment other than windows, like DOS.
wdidle3 did the job, at least for a 500gb drive. This is for a spare one that won't be used much, so I don't need to test the 1tb drive. Thanks.
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Old 05-06-2013, 09:35 PM   #9483
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Originally Posted by unitron View Post
WD20EURS $90 at newegg 'til 5/7/13
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136783
Use promo code
EMCYTZT3403
to get $10 off of $99.99
Ends 11:59 PM Pacific Time, Tuesday night, May 7th, 2013
THANK YOU!!! I've been waiting for that price point with free shipping on the menu and no sales tax. I bought the max of 5.

As much as I don't believe a need for an AV drive (retail/online stores and even WD often simply advertise them as for use in "video surveillance equipment"), and know that TiVo uses neither the standard ATA Streaming feature, nor the WD "Silkstream" feature (backwards compatible with standard streaming), there's no sure way to know that it will stay that way, and I like a 3 year warranty.

I've seen tons of advice, to others around the forums, which I find misleading. I'm sure the intentions were good, but I'd like to point out, after much research, that an AV drive only uses different error handling methods if using the streaming features. Think about it. TiVos have databases, and partitions that could easily become corrupted if handled with the streaming error-handling that the AV portions use. Even in the primary target market, for security/surveillance, there are areas where an AV/streaming error-handling method would lead to corruption in very important areas of the drive data. This is why you actually CAN safely use an AV drive in a computer to store databases/spreadsheets/etc. Also, think about the very important data that must be kept on security equipment, other than video, such as an accurate time/date-stamp/etc. That would not be handled through the streaming set, but overlaid on top of the AV portion that is. So far, the only thing that I can come up with that may help in a TiVo, not found in non-AV drives is PWL (Pre-emptive wear leveling). These days, all drives are made to run 24/7, regardless of if they will. I'd like to see PWL added to non-AV drives.

Believe it or not, I have a stack of Maxtor PATA drives from the days when 120GB was the biggest you could get, which have ATA streaming built into them. They were not sold as AV drives, but as high performance multimedia drives, to get the best multimedia experience possible on your PC, along with the most storage. It wasn't long before those drives got dropped from the product lines. They had no PWL, no alleged 24/7 rating. I find it amusing and oxymoronic to call a 24/7 rated AV drive "green", unless it's expected to be used to non-24/7 scenarios. I do recognize the value of lower RPMs, variable RPMs, and head parking/spindle spin-down. I do like Seagate's 7200RPM Barracuda SATA 3 drives, that state "Green when they need to be". I haven't used one in a TiVo, though. It seems like a waste of a high performance, yet green capable drive, that I could put in my new tower.
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Old 05-07-2013, 03:12 AM   #9484
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I've seen tons of advice, to others around the forums, which I find misleading. I'm sure the intentions were good, but I'd like to point out, after much research, that an AV drive only uses different error handling methods if using the streaming features.
I have found it to be very difficult to convince people that most of these AV features are command level behaviors, not drive level.
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Old 05-07-2013, 07:17 AM   #9485
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I have found it to be very difficult to convince people that most of these AV features are command level behaviors, not drive level.
Is anybody aware of any references that aver that the TiVo boxes never use any of these commands when streaming?
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Old 05-07-2013, 03:58 PM   #9486
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Originally Posted by unitron View Post
WD20EURS $90 at newegg 'til 5/7/13


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136783

Use promo code

EMCYTZT3403

to get $10 off of $99.99

Ends 11:59 PM Pacific Time, Tuesday night, May 7th, 2013
Thanks Unitron, got one for the shelf....now perhaps they'll drop some-more.

Just a heads up for anyone ordering these...The 'code' only works once; so if you want more than one....order them at the same time.

Edit: Just my luck....The drive seems to work (spin-up) in a dock on a Win 7 Machine.. But none of WD tests will pass. SMART initially had one parameter (re-allocate Sector Count) that was higher than threshold. After multiple tests, and last ditch one of letting Windows format it, hopefully to make it fail, it now shows another issue in SMART of a RAW Read Error Rate failure, but the drive keep chugging like it has no issues..... I wrote zeros to it successfully (????). .....Got it boxed-up and ready to return to the egg... unfortunately; Got a bad feeling about my outcome.

Last edited by ccrider2 : 05-13-2013 at 10:52 AM. Reason: Bad experience with new drive
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Old 05-09-2013, 06:09 PM   #9487
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I have found it to be very difficult to convince people that most of these AV features are command level behaviors, not drive level.
You are not alone. The ONLY reason I suspect that TiVo keeps treating AV as regular data is how many people would end up with "bricked" TiVo units if the drives don't support streaming extensions. Even though TiVo is NOT obligated to provide support for end-user upgraded TiVos, using non-AV drives, it still would flood the support lines with calls, anyway. I can no longer recommend non-AV drives for Premieres, as I have this feeling that TiVo could, at any time, send out an update that requires the streaming extensions, thus "bricking" such units. I think DVR_DUDE knows something the rest of us don't. It's just a suspicion, though. Until I know that the hardware doesn't support the ATA streaming, or WD silkstream (backwards compatible), it's always a possible scenario.

Just dig into "ATA streaming" and "WD silkstream", beyond the advertising, and the "specifications" disguised as advertising, and it will all make sense.
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Old 05-09-2013, 06:51 PM   #9488
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Is anybody aware of any references that aver that the TiVo boxes never use any of these commands when streaming?
richsadams was notorious for saying this. As of the past couple years, he's taken a lot of sabbaticals from the forums, as he doesn't seem to like getting in battles with others. I respect him for that. However, he dismissed my honest attempts to get the "kickstart FAQ" sticky changed to reflect my units having a different behavior. He admitted that he had a Premiere XL that he based his sticky on. I have four non-XL Premieres, which all behaved differently. The lights on the front of the units apparently behaved differently, based on the revision of the board, firmware, and software. I've seen some people say the last update changed how their units behaved. I do recognize richsadams as a very valuable resource to these forums, who may have had TiVo models going way back to possibly the first generation. He's always tried to help anybody he could. But, he's not somebody who likes to experiment on his family TiVos. He's more of the "let the others try it and see how it works over time" type. But, he has tried to help many newbies on here, as best he could. I just don't see him as the type to buy a TiVo, strip off the internal shields, research the chipsets, and report on the facts of that. There are other forums that are more underground/hacking related, which have posts that say it may even be possible for a Premiere to have it's BIOS (PROM) flashed by TiVo, remotely, but never proven. It was found that each PROM had the TSN programmed into it. AFAIK, nobody went any further past that discovery.

Since this thread is in the "Series 3" area, I SOMEWHAT feel it's safe to say that no S3/HD will ever require the streaming extensions to be supported by the hard drive. That's unless TiVo deliberately sends out an update, which would also require the hardware to support it.

Last edited by nooneuknow : 05-09-2013 at 07:03 PM. Reason: spelling, grammar
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Old 05-14-2013, 10:49 PM   #9489
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Originally Posted by ccrider2 View Post
Thanks Unitron, got one for the shelf....now perhaps they'll drop some-more.

Just a heads up for anyone ordering these...The 'code' only works once; so if you want more than one....order them at the same time.

Edit: Just my luck....The drive seems to work (spin-up) in a dock on a Win 7 Machine.. But none of WD tests will pass. SMART initially had one parameter (re-allocate Sector Count) that was higher than threshold. After multiple tests, and last ditch one of letting Windows format it, hopefully to make it fail, it now shows another issue in SMART of a RAW Read Error Rate failure, but the drive keep chugging like it has no issues..... I wrote zeros to it successfully (????). .....Got it boxed-up and ready to return to the egg... unfortunately; Got a bad feeling about my outcome.
Looks like I got one from the same batch as ccrider2. Thanks to advice I received on this thread, I always run the WD Diagnostic Extended Test on a new drive. Up to this point I haven't had an issue. Until this last purchase from Newegg! It failed the extended test with "too many sector errors detected" so I have to get it replaced.
Question: Should I RMA it with Newegg or RMA it with WD?

Thanks for your input.
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Last edited by John Wilson : 05-14-2013 at 11:05 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 05-15-2013, 08:00 PM   #9490
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Originally Posted by John Wilson View Post
Looks like I got one from the same batch as ccrider2. Thanks to advice I received on this thread, I always run the WD Diagnostic Extended Test on a new drive. Up to this point I haven't had an issue. Until this last purchase from Newegg! It failed the extended test with "too many sector errors detected" so I have to get it replaced.
Question: Should I RMA it with Newegg or RMA it with WD?

Thanks for your input.
OK, this has me worried then. Does anyone have a link to an ISO of a bootable CD with the right WD diagnostic program for this drive?
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Old 05-15-2013, 08:46 PM   #9491
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Originally Posted by John Wilson View Post
Looks like I got one from the same batch as ccrider2. Thanks to advice I received on this thread, I always run the WD Diagnostic Extended Test on a new drive. Up to this point I haven't had an issue. Until this last purchase from Newegg! It failed the extended test with "too many sector errors detected" so I have to get it replaced.
Question: Should I RMA it with Newegg or RMA it with WD?

Thanks for your input.
Newegg RMA it. Will get a new replacement. WD RMA will probably get remanufactured drive.
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Old 05-15-2013, 08:49 PM   #9492
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OK, this has me worried then. Does anyone have a link to an ISO of a bootable CD with the right WD diagnostic program for this drive?
WD website has both Windows and DOS version of their diagnostic. It will be the latest version that will support your drive.
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Old 05-15-2013, 09:26 PM   #9493
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WD website has both Windows and DOS version of their diagnostic. It will be the latest version that will support your drive.
That does not help me.

I have no Windows or DOS PC.

What I want is a bootable CD that works in an old Dell PC (Pentium III maybe) that has no OS on it at all.
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Old 05-15-2013, 09:33 PM   #9494
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That does not help me.

I have no Windows or DOS PC.

What I want is a bootable CD that works in an old Dell PC (Pentium III maybe) that has no OS on it at all.
Ultimate Boot CD
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Old 05-15-2013, 09:33 PM   #9495
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And btw, when will these companies start producing a Linux diagnostic program?
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Old 05-15-2013, 09:37 PM   #9496
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Ultimate Boot CD
But the WD Diag .exe file is not on this CD.

The crappy PC has only the new SATA drive attached and a floppy and a single CD drive from which I can boot.

But I have no OS that can write to the floppy.

Can the UBCD be removed once the DOS on it is running? So I can load a burn CD with the .exe I want on it and run it?
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Old 05-15-2013, 11:06 PM   #9497
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That does not help me.

I have no Windows or DOS PC.

What I want is a bootable CD that works in an old Dell PC (Pentium III maybe) that has no OS on it at all.
Sorry, didn't know your specifics. Since you mentioned Linux. Can I assume you are running that on a PC or are you using a MAC with some flavor of OSX. You could create a DOS USB key or a DOS floppy and easily add the program on it. It would be a little more difficult to create a DOS iso and add the program to it. Would any other options mentioned other than and iso work for you.

As mentioned earlier the ultimate boot CD is an option. You could edit the iso before you burn it and update the WD diagnostic program on it.

Here is the info on customizing the Ultimate Boot CD http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/customize.html
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:59 PM   #9498
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Sorry, didn't know your specifics. Since you mentioned Linux. Can I assume you are running that on a PC or are you using a MAC with some flavor of OSX. You could create a DOS USB key or a DOS floppy and easily add the program on it. It would be a little more difficult to create a DOS iso and add the program to it. Would any other options mentioned other than and iso work for you.

As mentioned earlier the ultimate boot CD is an option. You could edit the iso before you burn it and update the WD diagnostic program on it.

Here is the info on customizing the Ultimate Boot CD http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/customize.html

The customize .iso may well do it for me. I'd always figured that was possible but never figured out how.

It's a weird setup I have, I know. I do have MacBooks and a Mac Mini, but I'd always used my old crappy Dell Pentium III system for TiVo upgrades.

It has CD and floppy drive, but no OS--so by now I have no OS anymore that can write floppies. It doesn't have Linux unless I boot a Linux CD. And I don't even think it has USB, not really sure.

Many many times I've almost bought a newer used Dell with SATA and USB on board just to have for TiVo upgrades. I figured I should get rid of my old crappy Dells....their husks, really. Not much to them.

But now I have this new WD drive that I'd like to test. I've mostly gotten lucky not bothering with the long test all these years. Of the dozens of TiVos I've done over the years (for us and friends/family), only a couple had drive issues. At first I used Samsung drives, switched to WD with the Premieres.

I'll ask around at work if anyone has an old PC they want to get rid of that's less old than my crap.
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:02 PM   #9499
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The customize .iso may well do it for me. I'd always figured that was possible but never figured out how.
Quoting my own post here....but OK, how do I customize an .iso image on a Mac OSX? That link seems to be all C:\ crap (windows).
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Old 05-16-2013, 11:19 PM   #9500
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Quoting my own post here....but OK, how do I customize an .iso image on a Mac OSX? That link seems to be all C:\ crap (windows).
At the bottom it shows you where the equivalent Linux commands reside. They may or may not work with OSX. You essentially follow the Windows instructions using the OSX equivalent commands. The files on the iso is just data to OSX. It might not recognize the data but it will manipulate it. All that C:\ crap is essentially the equivalent to a folder in OSX or Linux.
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Old 05-17-2013, 08:30 PM   #9501
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what external case are people using these days?

i've got a Antec mx-1 that's having a fan issue. Not sure if I can hold on long enough to get the fan replacement.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:33 AM   #9502
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what external case are people using these days?

i've got a Antec mx-1 that's having a fan issue. Not sure if I can hold on long enough to get the fan replacement.
It can live with a sick fan for longer than you can live with it making noise and driving you insane

With the original S3 now being able to take a 2TB drive the solution a lot of us have moved to is a single 2TB internal drive.
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Old 05-18-2013, 04:26 PM   #9503
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yeah, the noise is driving us crazy. I was even thinking of putting the drive in my hot swap thingy.

good to know my annoyance with the noise is the biggest worry. I've instructed everyone in the house. "if the tivo asks to unmarry the external hdd, turn the tv off & come find me".
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:30 PM   #9504
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six WD20EADS-00S2B0 HARCHV2AA 2TB Western Digital hard drives - PM me an offer:

I just received a shipment of six WD20EADS-00S2B0 HARCHV2AA 2TB Western Digital hard drives, as replacements for some degraded/defective ones I sent back. They're factory recertified replacements, still sealed.

PM me if you'd like to make me an offer. If you'd like, I could pre-image them for either TiVo HD, or 2-tuner Premiere. I don't need them, because I already bought EURS AV-GP replacements, when Newegg had them on special.

I know some don't like/trust 4K drives, so I figured these 512-byte sector ones may be of interest to some of you.
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Old 06-11-2013, 11:52 AM   #9505
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I have had my Series 3 for ages now and have had an eSATA drive connected to it for the vast majority of that time. Recently, my internal drive started failing, so I started to look into replacing it. I decided to get a new drive that was at least as big as both drives together and consolidate everything.

So I'm trying to copy everything from the 250GB internal drive and 1TB eSATA drive to a single 2TB drive to be installed as a replacement internal drive.

None of the tools I've found to use seem to work. The MFSlive CD gets about 80% done with a "backup | restore" chain and then tells me "Memory exhausted". I just tried WinMFS and it's telling me "Combine 2 drive to 1 is not supported yet!", despite the "Full Guide" at mfslive.org saying, at option 3.20, "This option is built into WinMFS so give it a try."

I've been using WinMFS Beta Build 9.3f and MFSlive 1.4, both downloaded from mfslive.org. Should I be using different tools? What am I doing wrong?
I am in the same boat, have had the identical experiences, and unfortunately, it appears there are no tools currently available to do what we need. It is doable (weaknees offers it as a service if you buy a drive from them), but I suspect it's all done manually.

What I have done for the moment is use the program DVRbars:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...d.php?t=503261

to image and refresh both internal and external S3 drives. It is a straight byte-for-byte copy and restore program that works in Windows and does what it says.

With the help of a clever and experienced guy from that thread, we are investigating doing it manually, but it's slow going.

If Spike is still around, it would be nice if he changed his pages to reflect that combining two into one on the S3 is not possible with his software.
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Old 06-12-2013, 11:16 PM   #9506
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But the WD Diag .exe file is not on this CD.

The crappy PC has only the new SATA drive attached and a floppy and a single CD drive from which I can boot.

But I have no OS that can write to the floppy.

Can the UBCD be removed once the DOS on it is running? So I can load a burn CD with the .exe I want on it and run it?
Sorry I didn't see your post earlier.

I no longer get notification emails from this site.

Boot from the UBCD

Go to hard drive menu, go to the diagnostics menu, there are two version of the WD software from which to choose--go with the newer one, I think it's 9.4

I promise you it's on there, I just used it a few days ago to pre-test a 20EURS before putting it into service.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:39 AM   #9507
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Question about creating a 2 TB upgrade HDD for a Tivo HD (model 652) using a WinMFS truncated backup (i.e., not transferring recordings) taken from a 1 TB HDD running 11.0k :

I would like to do this in one step using WinMFS -- the TiVo is in a very difficult to reach location so hooking it up for intermediate testing (i.e., after restoring but prior to expanding) is very difficult.

In an earlier post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by unitron View Post
..........
In your case as long as you don't mind losing the recordings you can make a backup with WinMFS, then restore it to the 2TB, don't accept when it offers to expand, test it in the TiVo, then hook it back to the PC, launch WinMFS and click on mfsadd to use the entire drive, and then use WinMFS to supersize.
.
I then questioned the need for the intermediate hookup test and was told it was just a "one step at a time" preference.

My question is:
If I choose not to do the intermediate hookup test, can I go ahead and accept when WinMFS offers to expand (during the restore process) or do I still need to do it as a separate mfsadd step?

Another question is about the swap size. Is it advisable to increase it to say 1GB and if so can I do that during the WinMFS restore/expand/supersize ?
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Old 06-13-2013, 10:21 AM   #9508
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My question is:
If I choose not to do the intermediate hookup test, can I go ahead and accept when WinMFS offers to expand (during the restore process) or do I still need to do it as a separate mfsadd step?

Another question is about the swap size. Is it advisable to increase it to say 1GB and if so can I do that during the WinMFS restore/expand/supersize ?
Intermediate testing is not required just a recommendation.
Whenever I tried to expand right after restore, WinMFS hangs but if I say no to expand right after restore followed by running MFSAdd it works just fine. Remember to say no to limit the expansion to 1TB.

You can specify the swap size during the restore process. FWIW, the 2TB premiere XL4 with its 2TB drive only has a 128mb swap size. That being said I did increase mine to 1024mb.
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Old 06-14-2013, 12:26 AM   #9509
ThreeSoFar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unitron View Post
Sorry I didn't see your post earlier.

I no longer get notification emails from this site.

Boot from the UBCD

Go to hard drive menu, go to the diagnostics menu, there are two version of the WD software from which to choose--go with the newer one, I think it's 9.4

I promise you it's on there, I just used it a few days ago to pre-test a 20EURS before putting it into service.
Thanks for the reply.

I want to try this...but where can I download the thing?

http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/download.html

I go to this site and all I see are explanations and ads, no actual link to download anything.

Way to many damn ads...has to be the wrong place.

So of course I go here:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/ubcd/

ANd I see this I can download:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/ubcd...atest/download

What good will that be? It says downloads "Downloads/firefox-0.8.tar".

WUWT?

ETA: Aha! Is this it? ubcd524.iso from:

http://ultimate-boot-cd.soft32.com

Here's the sha1sum of the first chunk (it's not done downloading yet):

-rw-r--r-- 1 rackoblack rackoblack 20000000 Jun 14 01:37 xaa


b810f6ce03d0f8ade266300673c358abb4644a91 xaa

Last edited by ThreeSoFar : 06-14-2013 at 12:38 AM. Reason: found it
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Old 06-14-2013, 12:36 AM   #9510
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeSoFar View Post
I want to try this...but where can I download the thing?

http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/download.html

I go to this site and all I see are explanations and ads, no actual link to download anything.
On the download page,



Don't click on the link with the names, look to the left and click on the little icon (a disk drive with an arrow) and that will start the download. The link on the right is just a link to the host.

Download the .ISO file and save it, unless you are ready to burn a CD while it downloads.
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File Type: jpg ubcd.jpg (23.5 KB, 227 views)
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Last edited by ThAbtO : 06-14-2013 at 12:45 AM.
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