TiVo Community
TiVo Community
TiVo Community
Go Back   TiVo Community > Main TiVo Forums > TiVo Mini
TiVo Community
Reply
Forum Jump
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old 04-16-2013, 02:41 PM   #61
Saxion
Substantive Member
 
Saxion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 485
Quote:
Originally Posted by atmuscarella View Post
Hopefully TiVo will release a new unit that supports OTA that will support the Mini for those who do not want multiple DVRs
I truly wish TiVo would offer that; I would buy such a product immediately, along with 2 Minis. I am on cable now but planning to go OTA-only in the near future, so I don't want to invest in a system (XL4) that prevents me from going that route. Buying 2 more Premiere's just for Mini-esq functionality means higher HW costs, higher TiVo service costs, higher Cable costs (2xCableCARDs), and higher power consumption costs. TiVo has not provided me any attractive roadmap. Thus the interest in this workaround solution, which I hope will get me by until TiVo releases such a DVR.
__________________
Have you ever imagined a world with no hypothetical situations?
Saxion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 10:49 PM   #62
Arcady
Stargate Fan
 
Arcady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 2,886
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saxion View Post
Snarky remarks aren't helpful. What, exactly, are OTA-only people supposed to buy?
A second Premiere. It's only like $100 more and you get a whole DVR with it. You can choose to ignore that it is a DVR if you want, and it does the same thing as a Mini, without killing a tuner on your main box.
__________________
Roamio Pro (3TB) on MoCA
Premiere Elite (2TB) on MoCA
Premiere (2TB upgrade) w/ MoCA adapter
Premiere (320GB) w/ MoCA adapter
Mini

Left DirecTV 4/15/07. Left TWC 8/8/11. Now on Comcast Xfinity.
Arcady is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2013, 11:05 PM   #63
Davisadm
TiVo is Back!!!!!!!!
 
Davisadm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcady View Post
A second Premiere. It's only like $100 more and you get a whole DVR with it. You can choose to ignore that it is a DVR if you want, and it does the same thing as a Mini, without killing a tuner on your main box.
And $13 monthly or $400-500 lifetime vs $$6 monthly or $149 lifetime
Plus cable company outlet and cablecard fees. So a second Premiere is considerably more.
Davisadm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 07:17 AM   #64
slowbiscuit
FUBAR
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: In the ATL
Posts: 2,336
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcady View Post
A second Premiere. It's only like $100 more and you get a whole DVR with it. You can choose to ignore that it is a DVR if you want, and it does the same thing as a Mini, without killing a tuner on your main box.
It's at least $200 more per box (gets expensive fast for whole home), draws more power, takes longer to boot. The Mini is the answer, not more DVRs if you don't need them.
slowbiscuit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 08:09 AM   #65
lessd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: CT
Posts: 5,417
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post
It's at least $200 more per box (gets expensive fast for whole home), draws more power, takes longer to boot. The Mini is the answer, not more DVRs if you don't need them.
To test your idea you will have to get a TP-4, activate it, order cable service, order a cable card, active the cable card, at that point your idea will work, than cancel the TiVo activation, cancel your cable service, return the cable card, return the TP-4, and now see if the Mini will work over a long period of time. My Mini would not pair with my active TP-4 until I got a cable card into the TP-4 and activated the card.
__________________
Les Daniels

_____________________________________________
3 Roamio Plus upgraded to 2Tb & 3Tb, and 1 Mini, Also 1 not used Humax Series 2 with a DVD burner
lessd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 08:50 AM   #66
mr_smits
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by lessd View Post
My Mini would not pair with my active TP-4 until I got a cable card into the TP-4 and activated the card.
The unanswered question is: after pairing with the TP-4 and then removing the TP-4 from the system, will the Mini still function properly or will it stop functioning after 2 weeks/30 days/60 days, etc?
mr_smits is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 12:49 PM   #67
Saxion
Substantive Member
 
Saxion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 485
Quote:
Originally Posted by lessd View Post
My Mini would not pair with my active TP-4 until I got a cable card into the TP-4 and activated the card.
Thanks lessd, that is very useful information. For those folks (myself included) already on cable, it should be easy to have the cable company reprovision our existing CableCARD over the phone in order to get the new TP4 box working. But folks with OTA-only setups would have significantly more hoops to jump through because of this, to the point it's probably infeasible for them.
__________________
Have you ever imagined a world with no hypothetical situations?
Saxion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 12:54 PM   #68
mr_smits
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 406
I really wish someone from Tivo would answer this question once and for all.
mr_smits is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 08:05 PM   #69
Arcady
Stargate Fan
 
Arcady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 2,886
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post
It's at least $200 more per box (gets expensive fast for whole home), draws more power, takes longer to boot. The Mini is the answer, not more DVRs if you don't need them.
The price difference I can understand. Power use? Okay.

Boot time? That's a really silly argument. Are you booting your TiVo a lot?


Someone asked what to use for OTA. I gave the only answer. If you are using it for OTA, then there are no cable outlet fees or CableCard fees, so those excuses are moot. Even if you have cable, you don't need to use the second TiVo as a DVR on cable.
__________________
Roamio Pro (3TB) on MoCA
Premiere Elite (2TB) on MoCA
Premiere (2TB upgrade) w/ MoCA adapter
Premiere (320GB) w/ MoCA adapter
Mini

Left DirecTV 4/15/07. Left TWC 8/8/11. Now on Comcast Xfinity.
Arcady is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 08:15 PM   #70
lessd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: CT
Posts: 5,417
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_smits View Post
The unanswered question is: after pairing with the TP-4 and then removing the TP-4 from the system, will the Mini still function properly or will it stop functioning after 2 weeks/30 days/60 days, etc?
I does keep functioning for about 10 min.
__________________
Les Daniels

_____________________________________________
3 Roamio Plus upgraded to 2Tb & 3Tb, and 1 Mini, Also 1 not used Humax Series 2 with a DVD burner
lessd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2013, 10:00 PM   #71
Saxion
Substantive Member
 
Saxion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 485
Quote:
Originally Posted by lessd View Post
I does keep functioning for about 10 min.
Can you elaborate? What exactly happens after 10 min?
__________________
Have you ever imagined a world with no hypothetical situations?
Saxion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2013, 10:05 AM   #72
lessd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: CT
Posts: 5,417
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saxion View Post
Can you elaborate? What exactly happens after 10 min?
I put the TP-4 back on line, at the time I just wanted to know if I took the TP-4 off line would the Mini not work with the other TPs I had at that time, the Mini keep working at least for 10 minutes, a few weeks later I changed all my TPs for one less TiVo as I had 4 TPs with cable cards, now I have 3 TP-4s and a Mini, the TiVo home system now using only 3 Cable cards and I have more tuners to record (11 tuners vs 8 before). I also sold all my TPs and wifi adapters, as I now can use the built in Moca.
This most likely does not help much in your OTC/Mini work-around.
__________________
Les Daniels

_____________________________________________
3 Roamio Plus upgraded to 2Tb & 3Tb, and 1 Mini, Also 1 not used Humax Series 2 with a DVD burner
lessd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2013, 11:51 PM   #73
Arcady
Stargate Fan
 
Arcady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 2,886
Quote:
Originally Posted by lessd View Post
This most likely does not help much in your OTC/Mini work-around.
It has nothing to do with anything.
__________________
Roamio Pro (3TB) on MoCA
Premiere Elite (2TB) on MoCA
Premiere (2TB upgrade) w/ MoCA adapter
Premiere (320GB) w/ MoCA adapter
Mini

Left DirecTV 4/15/07. Left TWC 8/8/11. Now on Comcast Xfinity.
Arcady is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2013, 11:11 AM   #74
moedaman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saxion View Post
Snarky remarks aren't helpful. What, exactly, are OTA-only people supposed to buy?
Microcenter sells refurbished Dell Core2Duo pc's (with Win 7) for under $175. Buy an external hdd for $60, install your favorite transfer software and use that on your second tv. At least you'll be able to stream Netflix, Hulu and Amazon without any problems using the pc.

Is it the perfect solution? For some it is, for most no. But it is an option.
moedaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2013, 11:13 AM   #75
jmpage2
Registered User
 
jmpage2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,862
Quote:
Originally Posted by moedaman View Post
Microcenter sells refurbished Dell Core2Duo pc's (with Win 7) for under $175. Buy an external hdd for $60, install your favorite transfer software and use that on your second tv. At least you'll be able to stream Netflix, Hulu and Amazon without any problems using the pc.

Is it the perfect solution? For some it is, for most no. But it is an option.
I doubt even 1% of users would contemplate using something like a PC running windows to replace a DVR like TiVo.
jmpage2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2013, 11:26 AM   #76
moedaman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post
I doubt even 1% of users would contemplate using something like a PC running windows to replace a DVR like TiVo.
This is why I mentioned it. Most people are so concerned about using a mini, they've forgotten that there is more than one way to skin a cat. Besides I didn't say replace a Tivo. I said to use it a substitute for a mini. Plenty of people on this site use Tivo Desktop or the third party apps on their pc. Why not connect that pc to a tv?

Of course, I've had a pc connected to my basement hdtv since 2006. Whenever I see a question about home entertainment, my answer usually has the letters h t p & c in it.
moedaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2013, 11:29 AM   #77
jmpage2
Registered User
 
jmpage2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,862
Quote:
Originally Posted by moedaman View Post
This is why I mentioned it. Most people are so concerned about using a mini, they've forgotten that there is more than one way to skin a cat. Besides I didn't say replace a Tivo. I said to use it a substitute for a mini. Plenty of people on this site use Tivo Desktop or the third party apps on their pc. Why not connect that pc to a tv?

Of course, I've had a pc connected to my basement hdtv since 2006. Whenever I see a question about home entertainment, my answer usually has the letters h t p & c in it.
I do have an HTPC that runs XBMC and serves up my BD and DVD rips. It is also good at playing music, etc. It also doesn't run Windows.

A Mini extends the functions of a central TiVo, is relatively inexpensive ($250 including lifetime service) and is an "appliance" that requires no real setup or maintenance. It also uses a fraction of the electricity of even a low end PC.

I wouldn't even contemplate replacing it with a PC, and I am more knowledgeable about PCs then most people.
jmpage2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2013, 11:36 AM   #78
moedaman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post
It also doesn't run Windows.
I mentioned Windows because most people are familiar with it. I take it you don't like Windows, otherwise there is no real need to even mention it in this context.
Quote:
A Mini extends the functions of a central TiVo, is relatively inexpensive ($250 including lifetime service) and is an "appliance" that requires no real setup or maintenance. It also uses a fraction of the electricity of even a low end PC.

I wouldn't even contemplate replacing it with a PC, and I am more knowledgeable about PCs then most people.
Like I said I was giving options. Most people are myopic when discussing a subject. Look, the mini isn't for an ota user. Instead of bitching about it, people should look at their options.
moedaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 12:05 AM   #79
Saxion
Substantive Member
 
Saxion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 485
Quote:
Originally Posted by moedaman View Post
Like I said I was giving options.
Moedaman, thanks for pointing out this option. It is good to consider all possibilities. An HTPC isn't an attractive option for me, but it might work for other folks.

Mr_smits, do you still think you might give the Mini loophole a try in the next month?
__________________
Have you ever imagined a world with no hypothetical situations?
Saxion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 09:41 AM   #80
mr_smits
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saxion View Post
Mr_smits, do you still think you might give the Mini loophole a try in the next month?
I just switched to OTA, but if OTA doesn't cut it then I will bring back the cablecards and test out the Mini loophole.
mr_smits is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 02:42 PM   #81
SeaFractor
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_smits View Post
You don't know that unless you've tried it or a Tivo official has stated that this is the case. That's the entire point of this thread.


I may give this a try in the next month or two.
Tivo need not answer this question, ever. Why? They've already stated what is "supported". Why would they need to clarify what end-user attempted solutions, like temporarily matching to someone elses 4 tuner Tivo might do?

That's like a hospital that says "we don't do this surgery period" and someone asking what the complications would be.
SeaFractor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 02:55 PM   #82
mr_smits
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaFractor View Post
Tivo need not answer this question, ever. Why? They've already stated what is "supported". Why would they need to clarify what end-user attempted solutions, like temporarily matching to someone elses 4 tuner Tivo might do?

That's like a hospital that says "we don't do this surgery period" and someone asking what the complications would be.

This isn't for what is "supported"; it is for what is possible. If I tried this and it works I know Tivo won't support any issues that come up from it. Just like they won't support wifi on Mini connections, they wouldn't support this loophole. However, if it works then I can start reaping the benefits of the Mini immediately instead of waiting for the next, possible but not guaranteed Tivo box that supports OTA.

If it's not possible, an official Tivo person could end the speculation.
mr_smits is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 06:26 PM   #83
Austin Bike
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 511
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_smits View Post
This isn't for what is "supported"; it is for what is possible. If I tried this and it works I know Tivo won't support any issues that come up from it. Just like they won't support wifi on Mini connections, they wouldn't support this loophole. However, if it works then I can start reaping the benefits of the Mini immediately instead of waiting for the next, possible but not guaranteed Tivo box that supports OTA.

If it's not possible, an official Tivo person could end the speculation.
Having been on the other side I can tell you why this is a bad thing. They have made their position known. Any discussion outside of what is officially supported can lead to support issues down the road. The official line is "this is what is supported" and they can't deviate.

We always had people trying to use our products for applications they were not tested or qualified for. I knew they worked that way, that is how I used them at home, but I could not ever discuss that in public. Because of cost/support issues you need to stick to the company line.
Austin Bike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 07:37 PM   #84
SeaFractor
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_smits View Post
If it's not possible, an official Tivo person could end the speculation.
Not likely to happen. As stated in the posting above, it opens up new support headaches and potential liabilities. Also might impact any license negotiations for "streaming" that is included into the premium purchase of a 4 tuner appliance.

So who's willing to shell out the price and have it fail within some range of time, if a "re-key/refresh" occurs between the Mini and the Premiere?

Will the 4 tuner owner who was willing to help out get stuck with a monthly Mini fee on their billing as well? Will some kind of billing error occur for the 2 tuner owner, as the Mini shouldn't be able to be activated on their account?

Fun stuff.
SeaFractor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 08:20 PM   #85
lessd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: CT
Posts: 5,417
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaFractor View Post
Not likely to happen. As stated in the posting above, it opens up new support headaches and potential liabilities. Also might impact any license negotiations for "streaming" that is included into the premium purchase of a 4 tuner appliance.

So who's willing to shell out the price and have it fail within some range of time, if a "re-key/refresh" occurs between the Mini and the Premiere?

Will the 4 tuner owner who was willing to help out get stuck with a monthly Mini fee on their billing as well? Will some kind of billing error occur for the 2 tuner owner, as the Mini shouldn't be able to be activated on their account?

Fun stuff.
That part of the problem, if it did work the next software update may kill the system, after some period of time (days months etc) the system may stop working, no way to know in advance on a non supported TiVo system.
__________________
Les Daniels

_____________________________________________
3 Roamio Plus upgraded to 2Tb & 3Tb, and 1 Mini, Also 1 not used Humax Series 2 with a DVD burner
lessd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2013, 08:54 PM   #86
Arcady
Stargate Fan
 
Arcady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 2,886
Quote:
Originally Posted by lessd View Post
That part of the problem, if it did work the next software update may kill the system, after some period of time (days months etc) the system may stop working, no way to know in advance on a non supported TiVo system.
I remember people talking like this about hard drive upgrades 10 years ago.
__________________
Roamio Pro (3TB) on MoCA
Premiere Elite (2TB) on MoCA
Premiere (2TB upgrade) w/ MoCA adapter
Premiere (320GB) w/ MoCA adapter
Mini

Left DirecTV 4/15/07. Left TWC 8/8/11. Now on Comcast Xfinity.
Arcady is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2013, 12:45 AM   #87
lessd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: CT
Posts: 5,417
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcady View Post
I remember people talking like this about hard drive upgrades 10 years ago.
Yes but the investment in an upgraded hard drive was not that much money and you could keep your original drive, if TiVo had ever disabled upgraded drives, the drive could be use in your computer. TiVo does not care about drive upgrades as they can and do stop support for some people with upgraded drives, but TiVo could disable all TiVos with upgraded drives, that would not be to their advantage. At some point, way in the past, TiVo even asked if you had an upgraded drive and wanted to know the size.
__________________
Les Daniels

_____________________________________________
3 Roamio Plus upgraded to 2Tb & 3Tb, and 1 Mini, Also 1 not used Humax Series 2 with a DVD burner
lessd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2013, 09:56 AM   #88
mr_smits
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaFractor View Post
Not likely to happen. As stated in the posting above, it opens up new support headaches and potential liabilities. Also might impact any license negotiations for "streaming" that is included into the premium purchase of a 4 tuner appliance.
How is Tivo saying "this isn't possible" going to open them up to support headaches? It would do the exact opposite.

I suppose we could read into Tivo's silence to mean that they cannot acknowledge that it DOES work or is possible since that would result in the support headaches. However, if it simply does not work they could state that and end the speculation.

Round and round we go.
mr_smits is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2013, 01:09 PM   #89
lessd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: CT
Posts: 5,417
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_smits View Post
How is Tivo saying "this isn't possible" going to open them up to support headaches? It would do the exact opposite.

I suppose we could read into Tivo's silence to mean that they cannot acknowledge that it DOES work or is possible since that would result in the support headaches. However, if it simply does not work they could state that and end the speculation.

Round and round we go.
Most co.s do not tell what their product does not do ! TiVo never said that I can't make my morning toast using just a TiVo, they also never said that I can upgrade the hard drive, like most co.s TiVo tells you what the produce can do, one goes to user forums to find out other things one can do with some products.
__________________
Les Daniels

_____________________________________________
3 Roamio Plus upgraded to 2Tb & 3Tb, and 1 Mini, Also 1 not used Humax Series 2 with a DVD burner
lessd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2013, 11:08 PM   #90
Arcady
Stargate Fan
 
Arcady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 2,886
What the hell is a co.s?
__________________
Roamio Pro (3TB) on MoCA
Premiere Elite (2TB) on MoCA
Premiere (2TB upgrade) w/ MoCA adapter
Premiere (320GB) w/ MoCA adapter
Mini

Left DirecTV 4/15/07. Left TWC 8/8/11. Now on Comcast Xfinity.
Arcady is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Forum Jump




Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Advertisements

TiVo Community
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Skins by: Relivo Media

(C) 2013 Magenium Solutions - All Rights Reserved. No information may be posted elsewhere without written permission.
TiVoŽ is a registered trademark of TiVo Inc. This site is not owned or operated by TiVo Inc.
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:28 PM.
OUR NETWORK: MyOpenRouter | TechLore | SansaCommunity | RoboCommunity | MediaSmart Home | Explore3DTV | Dijit Community | DVR Playground |