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Old 03-19-2013, 06:07 PM   #1
overFEDEXed
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Thinkng of deactivating my Mini's

I was thinking of taking the service off of my Mini's. I thought that it would be enough to have HuluPlus and I did want to try them out. It is not going to get it, in my household.

I called Tivo, to ask what my options were. I told the CSR that I really needed Netflix and that I just wanted to hold onto the boxes, and reactivate if/when it shows up with an update.

1: He said that I could pay $50 extra, for each box and that there would be no commitment.... No way, I could just buy them at BestBuy.

2: I could return them and pay for return shipping. He said that when I call back, they will work something out with me on the cost... Probably the route that I will take.

3: He could give me 60 days to try them out. That would give me 60 days instead of 30, to see if Netflix will appear.

The CSR said that was an update coming, in a couple of weeks.
It WILL NOT include Netflix, but will have MLB and NASA TV??? He said that they are still working on Netflix.

Now I know that this is just a CSR, so this may mean nothing. I asked him about the two-tuner/Mini no deal. I did not mention the "Buy the four tuner, activate Mini, return four-tuner" deal, He did. He said that his friend just did this and he can see that it was going to be a problem. (The returns to retail stores.) I asked him if Tivo could do a check, when the four-tuner doesn't call in, and he didn't really reply.

I did know, before I ordered, that Netflix was not included. I'm trying to figure out my next step. The Mini's are cool but I don't really need them without Netflix.

What do you guys think? option#2
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Old 03-19-2013, 06:28 PM   #2
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You knew they didn't have Netflix and, even though that is deal break feature for you, you bought them anyway?

I say pay the return shipping and write it off as a lesson learned.
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Old 03-19-2013, 06:42 PM   #3
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You knew they didn't have Netflix and, even though that is deal break feature for you, you bought them anyway?

I say pay the return shipping and write it off as a lesson learned.
Yes, you are right and I will do that. I was surprised that they offered a 60 day "TRIAL" though.

Yesterday, we reconfigured the house. TV's, who moving into what room, that kind of thing. Now, I don't really need them like I thought, before this last minute plan, by my wife.

They would have come in handy, with or without Netflix, on the old layout.
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Old 03-20-2013, 08:00 AM   #4
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If you just want streaming media, and not an extender for the DVR, go with Roku or WD TV Live - both excellent. Roku includes hundreds of channels, but I only use it for Netflix, Hulu, and Vudu. WD TV Live has DLNA, so you can stream content from your own server.
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Old 03-20-2013, 08:23 AM   #5
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If you just want streaming media, and not an extender for the DVR, go with Roku or WD TV Live - both excellent. Roku includes hundreds of channels, but I only use it for Netflix, Hulu, and Vudu. WD TV Live has DLNA, so you can stream content from your own server.
The only real DVR extender that TiVo has is the stream. However you need to jailbreak the device to allow it to airplay or HDMI out to a TV. This way you could get all the shows and live tivo from your main unit and just use the Netflix app from iPad, iPod, or iPhone.
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Old 03-20-2013, 08:49 AM   #6
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Pretty funny that they already know about the buy-and-return a 4-tuner loophole to get a Mini working with 2-tuner boxes. Also pretty stupid on Tivo's part but that's nothing new.

OP the simple answer is to get a Roku if you want OTT services like Netflix, Tivo will never be the one box to get you all the extra stuff on the net anyway. You get Minis to extend Tivos, anything else is a bonus.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:08 AM   #7
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Pretty funny that they already know about the buy-and-return a 4-tuner loophole to get a Mini working with 2-tuner boxes. Also pretty stupid on Tivo's part but that's nothing new.
Yeah, I predict one of two things happening:
  • TiVo will concede and make it possible to pair the Mini with a 2 tuner Premiere.
  • TiVo will take a stand and make it so the 4 tuner Premiere has to remain on the network for the Mini to work.

Which one do you think TiVo will choose? I think the former, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's the latter.
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Old 03-20-2013, 10:35 AM   #8
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Pretty funny that they already know about the buy-and-return a 4-tuner loophole to get a Mini working with 2-tuner boxes.
What? Does this loophole last? I'm in a place where it would be nice to have a Mini now, but I don't want a 4 tuner current model (I'm holding out for the new model that may or may not appear in the fall).
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:08 AM   #9
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What? Does this loophole last? I'm in a place where it would be nice to have a Mini now, but I don't want a 4 tuner current model (I'm holding out for the new model that may or may not appear in the fall).
Nobody knows. I disconnected my four tuner, for about a day.
The mini still functioned. I even "called in" with my boxes and everything still worked.

Aaron also tried this. Maybe he will chime in.

On my situation, with the Mini's. I really wanted that "ALL IN ONE BOX" solution. Lol.
I have a Roku and that unit is now included in my reconfiguration.
Maybe I will just buy the Mini's outright, put them away and if/when Netflix appears, I will activate them.

Thanks for all the input, everyone.
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:12 AM   #10
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What? Does this loophole last? I'm in a place where it would be nice to have a Mini now, but I don't want a 4 tuner current model (I'm holding out for the new model that may or may not appear in the fall).
I would love to have someone post a review of the process and experience. I have seen some anecdotal information on the forum, but it seems like I remember reading something about warning messages? It gets at least some of it's information from the host DVR - doesn't it?

I just do not know.

Also, what happens when the mini reboots? Does it loose the connection? Software update - loose the connection?

It is an interesting idea, but yeah, I am skeptical.
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:32 AM   #11
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If people start a wave of buying Elites, then returning them, then repeating the process when a new FW update comes out, it will not take TiVo long to close the loophole off... the most likely way being they simply won't allow the Mini to work at all with 2-tuner models.

As to the OP, I'm not sure why you even bought these when you already have a multitude of DVRs. They are clearly aimed at users like me, who just want to extend the TiVo experience to other rooms of the house that have less usage.
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Old 03-20-2013, 11:42 AM   #12
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If people start a wave of buying Elites, then returning them, then repeating the process when a new FW update comes out, it will not take TiVo long to close the loophole off... the most likely way being they simply won't allow the Mini to work at all with 2-tuner models.
Frankly, who cares? This is a symptom of the current Tivo ecosystem and limiting the Mini to only 4 tuner boxes. Tivo states it is not supported, and anyone exploiting a loophole should be aware that it is a loophole. That being said, all the returns of Elites will create problems for Tivo in retail.

The bigger picture is that there is a demand for 2 tuner support with the Mini. Hopefully, Tivo keeps the loophole open until the next Tivo product is released.
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Old 03-20-2013, 12:26 PM   #13
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I would love to have someone post a review of the process and experience. I have seen some anecdotal information on the forum, but it seems like I remember reading something about warning messages? It gets at least some of it's information from the host DVR - doesn't it?

I just do not know.

Also, what happens when the mini reboots? Does it loose the connection? Software update - loose the connection?

It is an interesting idea, but yeah, I am skeptical.
I rebooted my Minis when the Elite was not on the network. And when they came back up I was still able to access my OTA only Premiere. But this was only short term. No one knows if there is a time limit on the Mini being on the network without the Host P4 TiVo.
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Old 03-20-2013, 12:38 PM   #14
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Cable card and outlet fees.

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If people start a wave of buying Elites, then returning them, then repeating the process when a new FW update comes out, it will not take TiVo long to close the loophole off... the most likely way being they simply won't allow the Mini to work at all with 2-tuner models.

As to the OP, I'm not sure why you even bought these when you already have a multitude of DVRs. They are clearly aimed at users like me, who just want to extend the TiVo experience to other rooms of the house that have less usage.
Cable cards, outlet fees, cable cards, outlet fees.
Cox cable was charging me $6 per unit for the CC and outlet fee.

I just recently changed my TV package. There are no longer any outlet fees.
Now, it's just $2 per box. I still don't trust them and think that they will add it back, later.

I would like to get my house down to two four tuners and two Mini's.
I've been selling off lifetimed HD's for $250 to $300 each.
TiVo keeps doing them for me at $99 and I keep buying them, adding LT and selling them. They even told me that I should do this, so that I can put it towards four tuners and lifetime!
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Old 03-20-2013, 01:05 PM   #15
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Frankly, who cares? This is a symptom of the current Tivo ecosystem and limiting the Mini to only 4 tuner boxes. Tivo states it is not supported, and anyone exploiting a loophole should be aware that it is a loophole. That being said, all the returns of Elites will create problems for Tivo in retail.

The bigger picture is that there is a demand for 2 tuner support with the Mini. Hopefully, Tivo keeps the loophole open until the next Tivo product is released.
Everyone in the market for TiVo gear should care, at least a little, because a high level of returns will trickle down eventually into higher retail pricing.

I agree, that there is a market for the ability to watch TiVo recordings from a 2 tuner Premiere. I am far more skeptical that there is a market for people who want to dedicate one of their two tuners from a 2 tuner Premiere to service a Mini.

TiVo might do an about face when dynamic tuner allocation becomes available (well, if it does). Time will tell.
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Old 03-20-2013, 02:27 PM   #16
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Everyone in the market for TiVo gear should care, at least a little, because a high level of returns will trickle down eventually into higher retail pricing.

I agree, that there is a market for the ability to watch TiVo recordings from a 2 tuner Premiere. I am far more skeptical that there is a market for people who want to dedicate one of their two tuners from a 2 tuner Premiere to service a Mini.
It's not the consumer's responsibility to care about Tivo management decisions like this nor care about the retail impact. This situation reminds of a perverse incentive.

Tivo wants to sell more 4 tuner boxes (for valid reasons, including MoCa built in and no dynamic tuner allocation yet) along with the new Mini.

Tivo restricts the Mini extender to 2 tuner Premiere boxes only.

Customers buy 4 tuner boxes, set up the Mini, then return the 4 tuner boxes, costing Tivo money.


Yes, Tivo makes money on the Mini and stickiness of customers, but they ideally want to also sell more 4 tuner boxes and make even more money.
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Old 03-20-2013, 02:34 PM   #17
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Everyone in the market for TiVo gear should care, at least a little, because a high level of returns will trickle down eventually into higher retail pricing.
I'm wondering how much extra I have to pay for all my electronic gear to cope with people who treat places like Best Buy as their special free rental place for stuff they don't even want but feel compelled to take home for a few days.

In my opinion TiVo should charge people like the OP a restocking fee so that they might be encouraged to thinks things through more thoroughly before buying more stuff they don't want in the future. Looking at the history of the OP's purchase he bought two Minis for no other reason than he couldn't be bothered to wait for the first one to show up in the mail.
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Old 03-20-2013, 02:48 PM   #18
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I'm wondering how much extra I have to pay for all my electronic gear to cope with people who treat places like Best Buy as their special free rental place for stuff they don't even want but feel compelled to take home for a few days.

In my opinion TiVo should charge people like the OP a restocking fee so that they might be encouraged to thinks things through more thoroughly before buying more stuff they don't want in the future. Looking at the history of the OP's purchase he bought two Minis for no other reason than he couldn't be bothered to wait for the first one to show up in the mail.
There are reasons for return policies. You buy something and if you don't like it return it! No questions asked and I freaken hate restocking fees. It is part of doing business and factored into most company's budget and should never be passed onto consumers.
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Old 03-20-2013, 02:57 PM   #19
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There are reasons for return policies. You buy something and if you don't like it return it! No questions asked and I freaken hate restocking fees. It is part of doing business and factored into most company's budget and should never be passed onto consumers.
Why would you buy something you don't like? In the case of this thread, why would anyone buy two of something they don't like? Why not ten - it's free to return them right?

You don't like restocking fees, I don't like subsidizing other people's consumer regret over impulse buys.
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Old 03-20-2013, 03:10 PM   #20
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Why would you buy something you don't like? In the case of this thread, why would anyone buy two of something they don't like? Why not ten - it's free to return them right?

You don't like restocking fees, I don't like subsidizing other people's consumer regret over impulse buys.

I can't agree with you more. Reading this thread makes my head spin!
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Old 03-20-2013, 03:38 PM   #21
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Why would you buy something you don't like? In the case of this thread, why would anyone buy two of something they don't like? Why not ten - it's free to return them right?

You don't like restocking fees, I don't like subsidizing other people's consumer regret over impulse buys.
Then BestBuy needs to end their sixty day return policy. I can purchase an item and decide to return it up to sixty days later. It doens't happen very often but it does happen sometimes. I ordered two Minis and then got one when they had it in stock before the ones I ordered arrived.
So I will be returning one of the minis I ordered. Now I would have preferred to return it at pickup but you have to wait at least two hours before it can be returned. So their policy is screwed up to begin with, But this Mini also has not been opened so it is still brand new.And should be able to be put back on the shelf.
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Old 03-20-2013, 04:08 PM   #22
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Then BestBuy needs to end their sixty day return policy. I can purchase an item and decide to return it up to sixty days later. It doens't happen very often but it does happen sometimes. I ordered two Minis and then got one when they had it in stock before the ones I ordered arrived.
So I will be returning one of the minis I ordered. Now I would have preferred to return it at pickup but you have to wait at least two hours before it can be returned. So their policy is screwed up to begin with, But this Mini also has not been opened so it is still brand new.And should be able to be put back on the shelf.

I also think the no questions asked 60 day return policy should be changed. Returning items unopened is a separate issue to the OP who not only opened his but spent hours setting set them up (apparently) and a few days of confirming they don't have Netflix like he was told before wanting a do over and his money back.
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Old 03-20-2013, 04:40 PM   #23
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I rebooted my Minis when the Elite was not on the network. And when they came back up I was still able to access my OTA only Premiere. But this was only short term. No one knows if there is a time limit on the Mini being on the network without the Host P4 TiVo.
But what you will not know is what happens if your TP-4 is taken off your account at TiVo, to test that out you will need to move your TP-4 to another TiVo account and then see if the Mini still works. That would be a pain.
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Old 03-20-2013, 05:39 PM   #24
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Why would you buy something you don't like? In the case of this thread, why would anyone buy two of something they don't like? Why not ten - it's free to return them right?

You don't like restocking fees, I don't like subsidizing other people's consumer regret over impulse buys.
Or for that matter, purchases they intend to use and return. We've all purchased products that don't live up to what they claim, but in this case the OP bought something that he/she KNEW didn't do it. That is a new level of abusing a lenient return policy.
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Old 03-20-2013, 05:54 PM   #25
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What a waste of time and money that was!
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Old 03-20-2013, 05:54 PM   #26
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I'm wondering how much extra I have to pay for all my electronic gear to cope with people who treat places like Best Buy as their special free rental place for stuff they don't even want but feel compelled to take home for a few days.

In my opinion TiVo should charge people like the OP a restocking fee so that they might be encouraged to thinks things through more thoroughly before buying more stuff they don't want in the future. Looking at the history of the OP's purchase he bought two Minis for no other reason than he couldn't be bothered to wait for the first one to show up in the mail.
button1066,
Is this me that you are posting about?

I didn't purchase these at Bestbuy. I had an order with them, that was cancelled. I got these from Tivo.
I wanted to deactivate and keep them. Tivo said that I would have to pay $50 a piece more for them, if I deactivated them.

Why is everyone talking about sixty day return policy at Bestbuy?

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Old 03-20-2013, 06:09 PM   #27
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Sixty days is my return period with Reward zone silver.

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Old 03-20-2013, 06:13 PM   #28
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There are reasons for return policies. You buy something and if you don't like it return it! No questions asked and I freaken hate restocking fees. It is part of doing business and factored into most company's budget and should never be passed onto consumers.
These are always factored into the cost of their products and is passed on to you whether you like it or not. Abuse of these policies will only cause them to increase costs and ultimately raise prices. This isn't just Best Buy, but all retailers including Amazon.

As for the 60 day Best Buy policy, that is only for Silver Members. All others only get 15 days.
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Old 03-20-2013, 06:28 PM   #29
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Sixty days is my return period with Reward zone silver.

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aaron,

I meant, are his or these other posts directed at me?
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Old 03-20-2013, 06:34 PM   #30
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I also think the no questions asked 60 day return policy should be changed. Returning items unopened is a separate issue to the OP who not only opened his but spent hours setting set them up (apparently) and a few days of confirming they don't have Netflix like he was told before wanting a do over and his money back.
button1066,

Are your posts directed at me? I did start the thread so...I was wondering.
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