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Old 12-28-2012, 07:02 PM   #1
DJQuad
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Do some Comcast markets only support 2 tuners with an M-Card?

Hey all, I got a Premiere 4 to replace my Premiere so I can record 4 shows at once instead of 2. I have an M-card which should support it based on all the research I've done including tickets with both Comcast and TiVo.

I won't bore you with the details of the long drawn-out dialogs with both, but in a nutshell, Comcast claims they re-paired to support 4 tuners, and TiVo said they didn't based on a support doc they sent.

I believe the latter. A Comcast rep came out today and said in my area, M-Tuners only support 2 tuners. TiVo support said they have never heard of such a thing - that "quad tuning being supported by Comcast in one area and not the other. That's just simply not true."

I'm in northern Indiana. Have any of you had issues in your area with Comcast only supporting 2 tuners with an M-Card?
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Old 12-28-2012, 11:21 PM   #2
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What happens when you try to access the other two tuners?
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Old 12-29-2012, 12:32 AM   #3
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I have the 4 tuner elite and have Comcast. I can record 4 different programs at once. Comcast in your area is telling you BS.
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Old 12-29-2012, 01:16 AM   #4
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I have the 4 tuner elite and have Comcast. I can record 4 different programs at once. Comcast in your area is telling you BS.
I have Comcast and a TP4,no problems using 4 tuners.
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Old 12-29-2012, 08:40 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by lpwcomp View Post
What happens when you try to access the other two tuners?
They aren't available when I try to manually record 4 different channels. According to TiVo it hasn't been re-paired after Comcast said they did. I guess I'll try Comcast again.
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:02 AM   #6
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M-Cards support up to 6 Tuners/Streams
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:10 AM   #7
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I know the M-Cards themselves can support over 2, but TiVo has never heard of a market that only support 2. Probably because it's BS.. heh
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:16 AM   #8
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I know the M-Cards themselves can support over 2, but TiVo has never heard of a market that only support 2. Probably because it's BS.. heh
Yes you got someone who has no clue what they are talking about... which is 95% of employees who work for cable companies
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Old 12-29-2012, 09:17 AM   #9
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It's absolutely BS, call the Comcast card activation line and get it properly paired to your Tivo.

http://www.tivo.com/setupandsupport/...port-form.html
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Old 12-29-2012, 11:56 AM   #10
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You might try removing CableCARD, rerunning guided setup and scanning for clear QAM channels and see if you can access all 4 tuners.

This just makes sense whatsoever. I don't see how they could limit an m-card to 2 streams although I do see the following line on my 2-tuner Premier's "DVR Diagnostics":

Code:
Decrypt RecordChannels         2 ( 1 0 )
What do you see on the DVR diagnostics and System Information pages?

From where did you acquire this Premiere 4?
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:01 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by lpwcomp View Post
You might try removing CableCARD, rerunning guided setup and scanning for clear QAM channels and see if you can access all 4 tuners.
That would prove that your TiVo can receive 4 channels at the same time, and Comcast would play no part in this. Also make sure that you have a 4 tuner Series 4 as some people can get confused about a TiVo premiere series 4 and a TiVo Premiere 4, give us the first 3 digits of the TiVo TSN, and get that TSN from the system info screen.
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:11 PM   #12
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I got it from Amazon - http://www.amazon.com/TiVo-TCD750500...RoE.0VDKXX1_tt

I'll be calling the Comcast card activation line shortly and if necessary try the suggestions here. I'll let you know how it goes
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Old 12-30-2012, 04:24 PM   #13
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A small update from my trials and tribulations with this issue (heh) -

Calling the activation number seemed to help a bit. By seemed I mean at least someone from Comcast didn't sound utterly clueless when I explained the situation. They said it would take about an hour to re-pair it, so I suppose I'll have another update soon..

I'm not sure if this is related, but since Comcast said they paired it a few days ago (and since the Cablecard was put into my new TiVo), I lost a lot of channels from around 150 and up. They said that would be fixed too. We'll see.
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Old 12-31-2012, 10:35 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by DJQuad View Post
A small update from my trials and tribulations with this issue (heh) -

Calling the activation number seemed to help a bit. By seemed I mean at least someone from Comcast didn't sound utterly clueless when I explained the situation. They said it would take about an hour to re-pair it, so I suppose I'll have another update soon..

I'm not sure if this is related, but since Comcast said they paired it a few days ago (and since the Cablecard was put into my new TiVo), I lost a lot of channels from around 150 and up. They said that would be fixed too. We'll see.
If Comcast does not fix this problem, do what post 10 said, and please give us the first 3 digits of your TSN.
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Old 01-01-2013, 09:58 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lpwcomp View Post
You might try removing CableCARD, rerunning guided setup and scanning for clear QAM channels and see if you can access all 4 tuners.

This just makes sense whatsoever. I don't see how they could limit an m-card to 2 streams although I do see the following line on my 2-tuner Premier's "DVR Diagnostics":

Code:
Decrypt RecordChannels         2 ( 1 0 )
What do you see on the DVR diagnostics and System Information pages?

From where did you acquire this Premiere 4?
Last night I called TiVo support who did a call to Comcast. Comcast said they re-paired it (again) and TiVo said to powercyle it after an hour.

Didn't help.

I removed the card, reran guided setup, but when trying a channel scan it wasn't available for my current setup.

Decrypt RecordChannels is 4 ( 2 3 0 1 )

The first 3 numbers of my TSN is 750.
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Old 01-01-2013, 10:26 AM   #16
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I removed the card, reran guided setup, but when trying a channel scan it wasn't available for my current setup.
When you reran guided setup, did you say that you would install the CableCARD later? If you did, that might prevent you from doing the channel scan. If you didn't, I am at a loss.
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Old 01-01-2013, 11:53 AM   #17
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When you reran guided setup, did you say that you would install the CableCARD later? If you did, that might prevent you from doing the channel scan. If you didn't, I am at a loss.
Nope I put it back in when the setup said to do so.

TiVo thinks the card is defective so I'll be getting a new one and see how that goes. :|
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Old 01-01-2013, 12:03 PM   #18
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Before you put the card back in, did it give you the opportunity to run a channel scan? You cannot run a cable channel scan with a CableCARD installed.
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Old 01-01-2013, 12:30 PM   #19
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Nope not that I saw.
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:29 PM   #20
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Well, if you're looking for something to try, remove the CableCARD, don't redo guided setup, and see if it will let you do a channel scan.
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Old 01-01-2013, 02:42 PM   #21
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I'll try that after I get the new card, hopefully tomorrow. Comcast seems utterly clueless about CableCARDs.
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Old 01-01-2013, 04:13 PM   #22
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I tell you, the more and more I read this thread and try to put together the insanity of the initial Comcast comment of "we only support 2 tuners" the more it makes me think they played they classic telephone game and they're misrembering that S-cards only support a single stream thus meaning you need 2 cards for 2 tuners in an original S3 or THD.

That's the only even remotely logical place I can get "2 tuners" in the discussion.
The fact that the OPs Comcast reps seem completely incompetent in the CableCARD arena pretty much is an assumption I have to go with from my Comcast experiences over the years.
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Old 01-02-2013, 01:09 PM   #23
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More likely it's because their DVRs only have two tuners, and they can't imagine anything else that would have more.

What's sadder is that their 'Anyroom', so-called 'whole-home' DVR only has two tuners. What a joke.

The trick with cards nowadays is to only call the card activation line and let them handle it, never call the main CSRs unless you have some other problem.
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Old 01-02-2013, 04:46 PM   #24
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A small update.. heh

Another local rep visited today about an unrelated Internet issue (slow speeds, dropped packets. my modem was bad.. yay). He also claimed that in this area only 2 tuners are supported, even with an M-Card. He says that he also asked his supervisor.

I frankly don't believe either of them based on Emails to Comcast, TiVo support, searches, and these forums.

I did contact TiVo again and they said once I get the new card to do another 3-way call to try to get this resolved. I'll be getting the replacement M-Card in a couple hours so again, I'll see how this all goes.
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Old 01-02-2013, 07:48 PM   #25
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So friggin sick of this.....

The new M-Card was inserted and it wasn't recognized.

Devin: I see, go ahead and unplug the TiVo box, remove your CableCARD, blow out the CableCARD slot, then re-insert the CableCARD before reconnecting the TiVo box to power.
Phil Iovino: ok one moment
Devin: Not a problem.
Phil Iovino: luckily i have some canned air.. heh. it's starting up now
Devin: Alright good, has this occurred with any previous CableCARDs you have used?
Phil Iovino: i previously had a premiere, which worked fine. i upgraded to a premiere 4 which worked fine other than it only supported 2 tuners. i've already contacted comcast to activate it for 4, and tivo has conferenced called them twice
Phil Iovino: it still says non mcard inserted
Devin: OK, did you every get this error with other CableCARDs where the TiVo Premiere 4 box would not recognize them?
Phil Iovino: no. tivo suggested i get a new mcard because they thought it may be defective since it only supports 2 tuners. i got a new one from the local office which says non mcard inserted
Devin: I see, the reason I ask is because there may be a malfunction with the CableCARD if this has never occurred before, the only thing you can do to troubleshoot this particular error to make sure the issue is not your TiVo Premiere 4 box would be to get another Multi-Stream CableCARD. I do apologize.
Phil Iovino: ugh. this mcard is brand new
Devin: I definitely understand your position, if the TiVo Premiere 4 box is not recognizing the CableCARD there is not additional troubleshooting we can perform due to the card not being recognized as inserted.
Phil Iovino: so go to my local office AGAIN and tell them AGAIN the card is defective?
Devin: I do apologize, however since the CableCARD is not being recognized as inserted you would need another CableCARD to try to identify if the CableCARD was defective or if the TiVo Premiere 4's CableCARD slot is malfunctioning since this is the first time this has started occurring in your troubleshooting.
Phil Iovino: if i get another new card and it still isn't recognized, what then? it's beginning to seem like my new premiere is the problem
Devin: Once more I understand your frustration with this continued issue, if you get a new CableCARD and the problem is persisting where it is not recognized we can confirm that the CableCARD slot is malfunctioning, which according to notation, it was not prior. We would be able to replace the TiVo Premiere 4 box if necessary for you if the problem is persisting.
Phil Iovino: ok i'll try that. thanks for your help
Devin: You're welcome!

Oy

So at this point I'm stuck with *0* tuners, instead of the 2 I had and the 4 I was wanting. Yay.
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:46 PM   #26
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DJ, you might consider posting on the DSLreports.com website. There's a section there called "Comcast direct" that's a private, secure posting section where official Comcast support folks can troubleshoot for you directly.

The team there did some great detective work for us on our Comcast internet service when we'd just about given up hope after many telephone and a couple of service calls. While we're generally happy with our local Comcast support sometimes it takes a bit more forest/tree view that the forum techies can do in spades.

https://secure.dslreports.com/forum/comcastdirect
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Old 01-03-2013, 08:09 AM   #27
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It's certainly worth a try. Thanks!
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:45 PM   #28
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There is no way Comcast could limit the number of tuners on a cable card... the card is paired at the NOC with the host ID and card ID, that is all they can do, the card is just a decryption device that can run up to 6 decryption streams at a time... this is not controllable by the cableco, all the cableco can do is enable or disable the card in its entirety.

Once the card has its decryption key it can decrypt up to 6 streams at once using that single key... but once again, Comcast has zero control over this...

NOW there is one hitch to this.... are you a Motorola system? Is the M-Card a Moto M-Card? because Motorola did make older M-Cards that only supported two streams, which where only suppose to be used in their Motorola set top boxes... if they are using those cards in a TiVo box, you will only have two streams, because they made those cards only to support two streams... this is not a Comcast limitation but a limitation of the Motorola M-Card that was designed for Motorola STB's


Quote:
M-Card MediaCipher Multi-Stream CableCARD

Based on OpenCable standards, the M-Card enables a wide variety of consumer electronics products to include Motorola's MediaCipher® and DigiCipher® conditional access technologies. M-Card’s higher throughput rates support simultaneous viewing and recording of multiple digital video channels, and dual-tuner, picture-in-picture, viewing of two channels simultaneously, with Motorola cable programming security.

The M-Card expands upon single-stream conditional access features and provides compatibility with S-Card devices while maximizing cable operators’ investment in single-stream technologies.

M-Card is included with Motorola Digital Cable Host (DCH) set-tops.

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Old 01-03-2013, 06:12 PM   #29
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NOW there is one hitch to this.... are you a Motorola system? Is the M-Card a Moto M-Card? because Motorola did make older M-Cards that only supported two streams, which where only suppose to be used in their Motorola set top boxes... if they are using those cards in a TiVo box, you will only have two streams, because they made those cards only to support two streams... this is not a Comcast limitation but a limitation of the Motorola M-Card that was designed for Motorola STB's
My old one was indeed a Motorola. I'll be getting the replacement tomorrow but I don't know if that's the only card my local office carries or not.
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Old 01-03-2013, 06:53 PM   #30
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My old one was indeed a Motorola. I'll be getting the replacement tomorrow but I don't know if that's the only card my local office carries or not.
Motorola is Ok.. it is the older Motorola ones you want to watch out for
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