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Old 11-14-2012, 12:34 PM   #91
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As has been said several times in this thread those numbers don't reflect the market for a Stream. First off Android is used on a LOT of dumb phones which wouldn't even be able to use the TiVo app. Second the Stream's main target is tablet users, not smart phone users, and the iPad still holds a majority share in that market. Lastly studies have shown that iOS users use their devices more frequently and spend more money on apps and accessories. With a niche product like the Stream you have to target the audience that's most likely to actually buy and use it.

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Old 11-14-2012, 02:29 PM   #92
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Android yes...windows phone waste of time

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No idea.

How many Android and Windows devices, including Computers, were sold last year ?
a lot of Android devices and windows computers...Tivo should support Android. However Windows phone is a waste of time for their 2% market share.
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:57 PM   #93
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Windows 8 will overtake iOS and Android in a few months, if you count all the desktop PCs running it. So if their only criteria is market share then I'd think a Windows 8 version should take precedence over Android.

Seriously who cares why they choose iOS first? I realize some people are upset that they can't use a Stream yet, but they obviously had some reason. Whether it was a business decision or simply that they like Apple devices more, who cares? They've stated publicly that they are working on Android support. Bitching about it isn't going to make them release it any faster.

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Old 11-14-2012, 03:01 PM   #94
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Tivo should have been developed and released the apps simultaneously not one before the other. Tivo is supposed to be easy for customers and potential customers. Releasing a product that supports only a fraction of the market is confusing and a bad business decision. I understand it was a decision based on limited resources, but it was a myopic one especially considering the latest market share with Android at 72.4% and iOS 13.9%. This is global market share, but the U.S. numbers are likely trending similarly.

http://readwrite.com/2012/10/25/appl...three-carriers

Or not. We get all sorts of these reports from analytics companies comparing this data and that data... putting up these big percentage marketshare numbers... but they never really say where any of the data comes from. None of these companies puts out real numbers on sales. So they area all based on estimates and who knows what.

I'm sure there are a ton of Android devices out there, but a whole lot of them aren't being used as smartphones.
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Old 11-15-2012, 02:36 PM   #95
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As a long-time Tivo customer, it's not simply disappointing that the Apple first, Android later development strategy is so outdated. For me, it throws into doubt their long-term strategic vision and ability to execute that vision, gain customers, thrive/grow, and continue to innovate. Do I want to continue to invest in products from a company with that strategy? I've invested thousands so far, but do I want to keep doing so? That is the big question.

The one piece that I'm clinging to is that maybe the development cycle for Stream was such a long process (2009-ish?) that the iPhone was the only game in town so they thought it was a waste to develop for another platform (Blackberry being impossible back then despite market share). I hope that is the reason there is still no Android support for Stream.
As an Apple/Mac user.... I love it. It used to be Windows first and screw everyone else. But I do believe that Tivo will update the app to work with android soon.
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Old 11-15-2012, 09:21 PM   #96
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What is your point?

Android is different. Because there is a wide variety of hardware and vendors producing devices, there are many older software phones still around. However, that is changing. It just takes time for the old to be replaced with the new.
You are talking about the *HARDWARE* being replaced. I am saying that Android has fragmentation because MANY phones do not get Android updates, and they still sell NEW phones running "obsolete" versions of Android that will never get updates. (Confession: My major source of news about Android phones is the various CNET podcasts like "First Look".)

Apple devices get updates for a few YEARS.
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Old 11-15-2012, 09:24 PM   #97
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Dumb question time -- I can watch (both streamed and converted) shows on an iPhone, right?

I think I proved that myself, I already had the TiVo app… TiVo sure makes the iPad most prevalent in the mentions on their web site too. (Back when I had streaming netflix, I watched streaming netflix on my iPhone a few times.. yeah, not routinely, but it was useful to have. It's a shame that the free Amazon Prime Instant Videos don't seem to be available on iOS at all.)

I will eventually get an iPad, but might get a Stream this weekend, so I can watch my Tivo's content on a treadmill in a different room. (For some content, again, the small screen won't be a big deal… especially for stuff I'm more listening to than watching.)
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Old 11-16-2012, 08:48 AM   #98
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Windows 8 will overtake iOS and Android in a few months, if you count all the desktop PCs running it. So if their only criteria is market share then I'd think a Windows 8 version should take precedence over Android.
You make a good point, Dan. I'm bowing out of this thread now. It has been fun.
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Old 11-16-2012, 12:47 PM   #99
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Dumb question time -- I can watch (both streamed and converted) shows on an iPhone, right?

I think I proved that myself, I already had the TiVo app… TiVo sure makes the iPad most prevalent in the mentions on their web site too. (Back when I had streaming netflix, I watched streaming netflix on my iPhone a few times.. yeah, not routinely, but it was useful to have. It's a shame that the free Amazon Prime Instant Videos don't seem to be available on iOS at all.)

I will eventually get an iPad, but might get a Stream this weekend, so I can watch my Tivo's content on a treadmill in a different room. (For some content, again, the small screen won't be a big deal… especially for stuff I'm more listening to than watching.)
Yes. The Stream works with both the iPad and iPhone.

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Old 11-17-2012, 10:34 AM   #100
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It's a shame that the free Amazon Prime Instant Videos don't seem to be available on iOS at all.)
I know this is a TiVo forum, but just to be clear there is an app for that on the iPad.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/amaz...545519333?mt=8

However, I do agree about it being a shame it's not available for the iPhone.
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Old 11-17-2012, 06:13 PM   #101
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a lot of Android devices and windows computers...Tivo should support Android. However Windows phone is a waste of time for their 2% market share.
If you spent any time working with Microsoft you would find that when there is something that they want, development dollars are available. If they "buy" the development, that would push it to the front faster than the android that they have to pay to create.

NRE goes a long way in getting your things done.
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Old 11-18-2012, 12:57 AM   #102
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Goats, OTOH, had almost no desire at all to either lead or follow (and often not even an ability to do so). They are not comfortable with arbitrary rules or popular trends, and they question authority out of hand. They are independent thinkers and often care very little what others think of them. If they choose to partake of a popular item, the popularity is purely incidental to the nature of the item. Goats are in a decided minority, compared to sheep, although not exceedingly rare.
Interesting.
  • Not comfortable with arbitrary rules or popular trends - check.
  • Questions authority out of hand - check.
  • Independent thinker - check.
  • Cares very little what others think of them - check.
  • If they choose to partake of a popular item (for me, it's TiVo), the popularity is purely incidental to the nature of the item - check.
Seems that I am 100% goat. I don't know if that's good or bad.
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Old 11-26-2012, 04:05 PM   #103
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I should probably just let this go, but whatever... reading this story today made me think of this thread...

http://allthingsd.com/20121125/were-...ads-for-ipads/

Just to sum up, total Black Friday shopping traffic...

iPhones = 8.7% of total traffic
iPads = 9.8% of total traffic
All of Android = 5.5% of total traffic

Breaking down just the tablets:
iPad = 88% of traffic
Kindle = 2.4%
Galaxy = 1.8%
Nook = 3.1%
Other = 4.4%
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Old 11-26-2012, 04:11 PM   #104
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I didn't even turn on any of my tablets on Black Friday. Any online shopping I did, I used my desktop PCs. And I definitely had no desire to shop with my cell phones ultra tiny 4.3" screen. I couldn't imagine doing it on the iPhones even smaller screens.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:53 AM   #105
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I used my iPad to do some shopping while watching TV. In fact I find that I do 95% of my couch surfing on my iPad now even though I have a full blown Windows laptop sitting under the coffee table.

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Old 11-27-2012, 12:19 PM   #106
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I used my iPad to do some shopping while watching TV. In fact I find that I do 95% of my couch surfing on my iPad now even though I have a full blown Windows laptop sitting under the coffee table.

Dan
Why don't you swap that windows laptop for a mac and port VideoReDo over to mac?
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:02 PM   #107
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Why don't you swap that windows laptop for a mac and port VideoReDo over to mac?
If it were that simple I would have done it a long time ago. Unfortunately VRD is heavily rooted in Windows APIs and would need almost a complete rewrite to port to mac.

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Old 11-27-2012, 06:18 PM   #108
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If it were that simple I would have done it a long time ago. Unfortunately VRD is heavily rooted in Windows APIs and would need almost a complete rewrite to port to mac.

Dan
I would expect nothing less than that. Cocoa and Objective C take a while to become fluent in.
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Old 11-27-2012, 06:31 PM   #109
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If we ever do it we'll likely move all the low level routines into simple C++ classes that can be cross compiled and use something cross platform, like QT, for the UI. That way we can have one product for both platforms. Although some stuff, like the codecs, might still be a problem as not all of the ones we use are available in Mac builds.

We're getting way off topic here though.

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Old 11-29-2012, 10:02 AM   #110
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It's a shame that the free Amazon Prime Instant Videos don't seem to be available on iOS at all.)
amazon prime instant streaming is totally on iOS (iPad only): https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/amaz...545519333?mt=8
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Old 11-29-2012, 09:42 PM   #111
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amazon prime instant streaming is totally on iOS (iPad only): https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/amaz...545519333?mt=8
Oh thanks, I must have missed that.. That's another reason for me to get an iPad sooner. (Using it for downloaded Tivo Stream material is another.)

Bummer, I wish it were on the iPhone too.
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Old 11-30-2012, 08:31 AM   #112
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If we ever do it we'll likely move all the low level routines into simple C++ classes that can be cross compiled and use something cross platform, like QT, for the UI. That way we can have one product for both platforms. Although some stuff, like the codecs, might still be a problem as not all of the ones we use are available in Mac builds.

We're getting way off topic here though.

Dan
how about you get off the sofa and start on a Mac version

how about some kind of imovie plugin? i can imagine you are missing a nice market segment. especially that tivo went all in with iOS so far.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:02 PM   #113
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I actually considered doing an iOS version after the Stream was released, but then I discovered that the shows downloaded by the Stream are encrypted so there is no way an iOS version would ever be able to touch them. (I was hoping they would be standard MP4 files stored in the common video directory)

I'm sure we are missing a bit of market share by not having a Mac version, but Macs still make a relatively small percentage of the total market and with Parallels and Boot Camp Mac users can easily boot into Windows and use VideoReDo if they want.

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Old 12-01-2012, 06:24 AM   #114
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Has there been any info how the stream is protected. Just trying to understand if it's possible to do own hacks if someone is willing to use time to investigate/hack these streams.
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Old 12-01-2012, 01:03 PM   #115
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Based on my brief investigation it appears that they use encrypted HLS, which uses https encryption which would be very difficult to hack.

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Old 12-03-2012, 06:56 AM   #116
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who makes these asinine decisions to only support Iphones and Ipads? Is tivo trying to put themselves out of business? First the do not build the ability to stream into the boxes themselves making you buy a silly add on streaming box and then they restrict streaming to a tiny share of the market?
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:58 AM   #117
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I used my iPad to do some shopping while watching TV. In fact I find that I do 95% of my couch surfing on my iPad now even though I have a full blown Windows laptop sitting under the coffee table.

Dan
same here.
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Old 12-03-2012, 09:55 AM   #118
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who makes these asinine decisions to only support Iphones and Ipads? Is tivo trying to put themselves out of business? First the do not build the ability to stream into the boxes themselves making you buy a silly add on streaming box and then they restrict streaming to a tiny share of the market?
What is asinine about only supporting iPhones and iPads, for now? They, especially the iPad, hold the largest market share!
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Old 12-03-2012, 11:55 AM   #119
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Apple currently holds 71% of the tablet market. How is that a tiny share?
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:37 PM   #120
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There's actually two reasons to support iOS first:

1. The iPhone 5 is outselling all other android phones combined in the U.S.

2. Usage of iOS greatly exceeds usage on Android. For example on Black Friday 88.3 percent of all tablet shopping was done on an iPad. Interestingly for mobile phones, 8.7% was done on an iPhone as opposed to 5.5% on Android. Yes other devices are eating into the iPad's market share, but it's still king at the moment.
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