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Old 09-15-2012, 09:51 PM   #31
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Also Bob Lee, I would say if you can't get the Tivo app to work, you probably won't be able to get the streaming to work. So, figure that out first. If you use your phone as a mobile hotspot and enable VPN on the iPad I would think that would work. Are you sure you turned on VPN when you connected to the hotspot from your iPad?

Wombat, DMZ is the easiest but it is probably worth the effort to see if you can get port forwarding to work. You might have to figure out how to specify GRE (protocol 47) should be forwarded, as was the case for my router. Using DMZ is like hooking your computer up directly to the internet. Anything can connect to it. There are lots of bots/worms scanning IPs on the internet and trying to infect them. Not being behind a firewall greatly increases your chance of getting infected. Some people have actually done tests on this and found an out of the box windows install (no patches, virus scanners, etc) gets infected in something like 7 minutes.
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Old 09-15-2012, 10:07 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sling_Blade View Post
Also Bob Lee, I would say if you can't get the Tivo app to work, you probably won't be able to get the streaming to work. So, figure that out first. If you use your phone as a mobile hotspot and enable VPN on the iPad I would think that would work. Are you sure you turned on VPN when you connected to the hotspot from your iPad?

Wombat, DMZ is the easiest but it is probably worth the effort to see if you can get port forwarding to work. You might have to figure out how to specify GRE (protocol 47) should be forwarded, as was the case for my router. Using DMZ is like hooking your computer up directly to the internet. Anything can connect to it. There are lots of bots/worms scanning IPs on the internet and trying to infect them. Not being behind a firewall greatly increases your chance of getting infected. Some people have actually done tests on this and found an out of the box windows install (no patches, virus scanners, etc) gets infected in something like 7 minutes.
I just got back from being out and about, and while out I had my iPad with me and was on somebody's wifi network. I was able to VPN in just fine, but in terms of the Tivo app I was a nogo...couldn't find a Tivo on the "local" network. My IP address was assigned to the same subnet as all of my local devices at home, and I even tried moving my VPN server machine to the DMZ...but same negative result.
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Old 09-15-2012, 10:09 PM   #33
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Sling_Blade, I totally agree. DMZ was only a quick-and-dirty test. I will configure the PPTP connection and specific port forwards on the router. (Actually, I will probably upgrade my router to a third-party firmware that supports running a PPTP server on the router).

Also... as you noted (you were posting at the same time as me earlier) if the Tivo app is already running on the iOS device, it can reconnect directly via the cellular/VPN, but if the app is not running already, it falls back to the "away mode" of operation.

So I then went back to the iPad... reconnected everything the way I had had it a few minutes ago, but killed the Tivo app first. So I was connected via PPTP via my iPhone hotspot with a VPN from the iPad back to my Macbook... I launched the Tivo app, and it could not find the Tivos... the error message was not that I didn't have Wifi on (since I did), but it searched for Tivos, timed out and then offered to go into "Away mode" or watch shows already downloaded.

I am suspecting that what is going on here is that PPTP is fine for the communication protocols including streaming and remote control, but that Bonjour is not really working over PPTP.

I'm off to see if there is any discussion of this specific issue that I can find.

It'll be interesting to experiment for a while though and see how long the cached bonjour discovery works. Maybe some combination of the PPTP along with the experimental DDNS remote Bonjour services that was mentioned above can get us to the total solution.

Ted
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Old 09-15-2012, 10:11 PM   #34
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It sounds like your VPN server isn't forwarding multicast packets. Until I am able to test mine on a different network I won't be positive mine is either.

Edit: heh just saw your post wombat. Yep, this may be a problem. I think it will just take finding a VPN that can forward those and the right settings.
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Old 09-15-2012, 10:22 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Bob Lee View Post

I just got back from being out and about, and while out I had my iPad with me and was on somebody's wifi network. I was able to VPN in just fine, but in terms of the Tivo app I was a nogo...couldn't find a Tivo on the "local" network. My IP address was assigned to the same subnet as all of my local devices at home, and I even tried moving my VPN server machine to the DMZ...but same negative result.
I've never gotten PPTP to work with the TiVo app. I tried a number of times with older app versions "just because" and even though I had a PPTP connection into my router and had a LAN ip address, bonjour discovery never worked. This with broadcast packet forwarding on (though it's possible the implementation on my router is flawed).

Of note, 1.9.1 added a new discovery method which I don't believe uses Bonjour, though I'm not sure what it would use.
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Old 09-15-2012, 10:35 PM   #36
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Ahh, just found a way of testing this. I do have the hotspot feature on my iPad, just not on my iPhone, so I tried streaming on my iPhone using my iPad as the hotspot. I had the same problem. Now that I think back to my earlier testing, I think this is a more serious problem. It works when I do a VPN connection over my local network, which I think must mean that the iPad itself is not sending the multicast packets over the VPN, but rather whatever network it is connected to. That means the only other options are to try the other VPN types that are built in to the iPhone to see if they work, or find a third party app that will forward multicast packets.

Of course this wouldn't be a problem if Tivo would just give you the option of statically defining the IP of your Tivo and not using bonjoir :/

EDIT: Actually I think I have it the wrong way around. The VPN Server isn't forwarding all the multicast it sees over the VPN, but if I am on that network it will still see it. Googling this it looks like most VPN services only do normal IP, and you'd have to use something like OpenVPN, and you would have to jailbreak your iphone/ipad to get that to work.

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Old 09-18-2012, 08:28 PM   #37
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I've sort of found a way to make it work outside the home. It's not how you'd want to do it long term but:

Connect the app to the TiVo on the local network. Press the home button and head out. Go to a bar and connect to your home network via VPN. Now open the TiVo app back up. It'll see the TiVo and it'll let you stream.

If at any time the TiVo app doesn't see a WiFi connection or you forget and don't connect to VPN then it will reset the app and put it in away mode until it sees the TiVo again.

Again, this isn't ideal BUT it at least let's you see it work while you're out and about.
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Old 09-18-2012, 11:12 PM   #38
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I seem to have declared victory too soon as well. Athough it works for me if you fire up the app locally and then switch to VPN, if I start the app remotely it does not find my tivos. I think I need to configure my VPN to support bonjour broadcasting.
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Old 09-18-2012, 11:29 PM   #39
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Well, let us know if you find an Apple supported VPN that works. From my googling I couldn't find anything. There are only two solutions I could find:

1. Jailbreak and use OpenVPN for server/client. It uses ssl, not L2TP,PPTP, or IPSEC. It can however forward multicast over the VPN connection.

2. Bring along a laptop that can run a bonjoir proxy, there are a number of programs that do this, that will advertise your Tivo service, with it's local IP, on whatever network you are connected to.

Neither of those are ideal. I haven't actually tried either of the above but there's been lots of people trying to get home sharing working over VPN, which has the same problem.
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Old 09-22-2012, 10:32 PM   #40
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I took a shot with OpenVPN this weekend and made some promising headway, but it's not working.

I'm using the OpenVPN sever in DD-WRT on my router, and the GuizmOVPN application from Cydia for iOS (which supposedly supports multicast forwarding for iTunes sharing). Using TAP, I can get my iPhone to connect to the VPN and then I can ping and SSH into my iPhone from the local network (with the iPhone on 3G). The Bonjour browser can "see" all of the TiVo services on my local network. But, even with that, I must have a setting wrong because I can't seem to hit ALL my local network resources from the phone. I can SSH into my Linux server, but can't connect to a TiVo's Now Playing List over https and can't connect to my Calibre library.

On top of all of that, the TiVo app knows I'm not on WiFi so it won't discover any boxes. I know there's 3G Unrestrictor but I don't really need that so I'll just test again when I'm on a WiFi network that's not my own (I wasn't able to get the OpenVPN connection to work when my iPhone was on my local WiFi, which I'm sure is just a config setting I'm missing).

I'll keep messing around with it ...

edit: no better luck on remote WiFi. The TiVo actually scans for boxes, but doesn't find any, and the Bonjour browser doesn't find any services. Guess I need to poke around in the settings/config a bit more. Seems like I am so close.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:16 PM   #41
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You really shouldn't be using PPTP as a VPN protocol. It is horribly insecure. You should use either a SSL or IPsec vpn.

http://www.cso.com.au/article/432039...ion_under_day/

There is even a web service to auto crack PPTP so the attacker doesn't even need to be technically literate:
CloudCracker.com

Using PPTP is only marginally better than connecting your private network directly to the Internet.
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Old 09-27-2012, 09:26 PM   #42
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Lightbulb Got it working! (over 3G)

I wrote this up tonight in a lot (maybe too much, I tend to ramble) more detail here, but in a nutshell I was able to get the TiVo iOS app to work over an OpenVPN connection on my iPhone over 3G.

What I used:
  • Buffalo WZR-HP-G300N wireless router running DD-WRT v24-sp2
  • the TiVo app for iOS (tested v2.0.1 and v2.0.2)
  • iPhone 4S running iOS 5.1.1 (jailbroken)
  • GuizmOVPN v1.1.8-pre1 (trial)
  • My3G v5.3.2 (trial)
  • xCon v37~beta8

I configured OpenVPN on my router (I had been using PTPP until now for basic remote access) and configured the GuizmOVPN client on my iPhone likewise. I had to use My3G because the TiVo app checks if it's not on Wi-Fi and My3G works around that. As of v2.0.2 of the TiVo app xCon isn't necessary to just run the app, but I'm guessing you'd still need it if you own a Stream.

The end result?




Here's the kicker, though. I only got it work over WiFi once. I was testing at Starbucks last night and got it working over WiFi on my iPhone. Then I tried my iPad and it wouldn't detect any DVRs. Went back to my iPhone and it wouldn't detect any DVRs either. Tried over and over and could not replicate my initial result. 3G always seems to work though. I tried a few other WiFi hotspots and could not get the app to detect any DVRs so I can only assume it's something with their config messing with the multicast DNS relay through the tunnel.

I don't own a Stream so I couldn't test that, but hopefully this gives people some ideas and a place to start!
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Old 09-28-2012, 12:52 AM   #43
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I have the Stream sort of working over a VPN wi-fi connection! But only sort of -- possibly because the connection at the remote end is slower (getting about 14 Mb/s down on speedtest on iPhone, vs. a 35 Mb upstream Fios connection at the home end, where the Tivo and Stream are.)

This is only part of the way there. I don't have it yet set up to work without a computer alongside the iOS device on the remote side, nor is it working well. I haven't yet managed to successfully download anything to my iPhone and streaming is stuttery.

I can write up some actual details tomorrow, but I'm thrilled to have gotten this working to the point that I have.

If the standard Apple VPN tools passed Bonjour packets across the VPN, this would be a snap, but of course, that doesn't quite work. The problem with connecting to Tivo over a VPN has to do with how the VPN routes the Bonjour announcements.

Here's what I did:
1. I have a Mac at home running Mountain Lion (10.8) Server (on the same wired network as the Tivo and stream), where I set up a L2TP VPN and connected to that VPN on the iPhone.

2. Run Network Beacon on the remote end on a Mac laptop. This is repeating all of the Bonjour information that I found on the Tivo in Bonjour Browser. This computer is not connected to the VPN, but is on the same WiFi network with the iPhone.

3. Launch the Tivo app. The Tivo shows up and is ready to stream. With more bandwidth on this end, it might have even worked.

The next step that I need to figure out is using the DNS on Mountain Lion Server to send the Tivo Bonjour broadcasts to the VPN connected clients, which would obviate the need for a remote computer to be part of the mix.
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Old 09-28-2012, 01:17 AM   #44
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Is OpenVPN only possible on a jailbroken iOS device?

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Old 09-28-2012, 02:05 AM   #45
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I believe so.

I now have QuizmoVPN installed. And how do I import a configuration file for it? Is this generated on the VPN server itself, like perhaps a Buffalo WZR-HP-G300N wireless router running DD-WRT?
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Old 09-28-2012, 08:01 AM   #46
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I now have QuizmoVPN installed. And how do I import a configuration file for it? Is this generated on the VPN server itself, like perhaps a Buffalo WZR-HP-G300N wireless router running DD-WRT?
The configuration file for GuizmOVPN is just a plain text file with a .ovpn extension that contains the various OpenVPN directives. But if you're using certificates for OpenVPN, you can put the three certificates (your CA certificate and your client's certificate and key) plus the config into a ZIP file and then import it into GuizmOVPN. You don't have to use certificates for OpenVPN, but that was the way I did it.

For DD-WRT, you configure the OpenVPN settings under Services > VPN (this creates the server config file) and then paste in the contents of the certificates it needs into the proper fields.
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Old 09-28-2012, 11:49 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wombat94 View Post
PPTP works perfectly for me.

I have a mac based network, and PPTP is not easily configured on OSX unless you have Lion or Mountain Lion server, so I downloaded EasyVPN... a GUI that enabled PPTP and allows simple administration of VPN accounts.
Me too!

I'd previously had this same setup in order to trick the TWCable (live TV) app to think I was at home, and it works great.




I use the iPad's built-in VPN dialer to connect to EasyVPN on an iMac, and now that app works for me over external WiFi or 3G (with 3G Unrestrictor installed.) I also needed some other tweak called "FakeTimeWarner" allow TWCableTV to run on a jailbroken device, with VPN enabled.


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Originally Posted by wombat94 View Post
I ran EasyVPN on my MacBook, used the DMZ feature of my router to forward enable PPTP packets to pass through to my MacBook and then set up a PPTP VPN connection on my iPhone.
So I tried this, in order to get TiVo working when I am away from home, as this is far more interesting to me than live TV. My router is a Time Capsule, and on this unit DMZ is called "Default Host."



I set it to point to the IP address of the iMac running Easy VPN. And yet, when I am on a remote network, and I connect to home via VPN, and then launch the TiVo app, it scans for and does NOT find my TiVo. It only lets me operate in "Away" (or "Guest") mode. I'm never able to connect to my Premiere in order to stream anything.

I don't want to have to change my router... I'm just wondering if there's anything I might be missing here, or anything else I should try?
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Old 09-28-2012, 11:51 AM   #48
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The configuration file for GuizmOVPN is just a plain text file with a .ovpn extension that contains the various OpenVPN directives. But if you're using certificates for OpenVPN, you can put the three certificates (your CA certificate and your client's certificate and key) plus the config into a ZIP file and then import it into GuizmOVPN. You don't have to use certificates for OpenVPN, but that was the way I did it.

For DD-WRT, you configure the OpenVPN settings under Services > VPN (this creates the server config file) and then paste in the contents of the certificates it needs into the proper fields.
Thanks so much for this. If I can't get EasyVPN working with the built-in iOS dialer to get TiVo to work as I've wished for years (as I have for TWCable's app) then I will dive in deeper with GuizmoVPN and some other kind of VPN server.
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Old 09-28-2012, 12:04 PM   #49
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I'm not clear on how wombat94's setup is working over PTPP. From what I've read (and in my experience), multicast DNS (Bonjour) traffic will just not go over a PTPP connection. Also, he mentions he launched the TiVo app via a VPN connection over 4G. The TiVo app will not work over a 3G connection, it's WiFi only. So I'm guessing he's jailbroken and was using something like 3G Unrestrictor or My3G like I did in my test.
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Old 09-28-2012, 12:14 PM   #50
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Yes, I hear ya. I am jailbroken and I have 3G Unrestrictor installed. I also tried via external WiFi though. I guess I'll keep tinkering and monitoring this thread for more breakthroughs and tips.

I'd love to learn of the most consistent way to get this working, if possible. And if I can use the existing equipment and software I already have, that'd be great.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:13 PM   #51
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I've sort of found a way to make it work outside the home. It's not how you'd want to do it long term but:

Connect the app to the TiVo on the local network. Press the home button and head out. Go to a bar and connect to your home network via VPN. Now open the TiVo app back up. It'll see the TiVo and it'll let you stream.

If at any time the TiVo app doesn't see a WiFi connection or you forget and don't connect to VPN then it will reset the app and put it in away mode until it sees the TiVo again.

Again, this isn't ideal BUT it at least let's you see it work while you're out and about.
Ahhhh, I had it working too a few nights ago (details below) -- tested over my super-slow 3G tethering. But then I stupidly upgraded the TiVo app last night and trying it from work today it fails. I wonder if they are now forcing a Bonjour scan when you switch networks.

Anyways, here's how it was working with the TiVo version *PRIOR* to 2.0.2 (09/26/2012):
  • Set up VPN on an old G3 Tower running 10.5.
  • Followed these instructions: http://stormrook.com/2010/05/31/sett...server-on-osx/
  • Configured my Belkin firewall to forward UDP ports 500, 1701 and 4500 to the tower.
  • Connected iPad to TiVo over my local area network.
  • Switched to a different app.
  • Connected iPad to my 3G tethering Android.
  • Switch back to TiVo app.
  • Watch the Jeopardy stutter and buffer and play in 10 seconds bursts. Yeah, it's not really optimized for slow cell networks.

Ok, now I'm going to try to set up Network Beacon. Fun fun fun.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:22 PM   #52
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In order to get this to work you need to setup Wide Area Bonjour. Regular LAN based Bonjour is delivered over ip multicast which isn't typically transported over VPN connections.

With Wide Area Bonjour you setup a DNS server to advertise the Bonjour services. I see the following Tivo services being advertised via Bonjour on my network:

_tivo-device._tcp.
_tivo-mindrpc._tcp.
_tivo-remote._tcp.
_tivo-videos.tcp.
_tivo-videostream._tcp.
_tivo-xcode._tcp.

You would need to add mDNS entries for the above records. Then have the VPN client use this DNS server for name resolution. The client should then be able to connect to the services remotely.

Looks like dyn-dns is offering an experimental bonjour-dns service:
http://dyn.com/support/bonjour-and-dns-discovery/
Heya Cipher and others -- does anybody happen to know the Ports I should map these services to? Thanks!
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:24 PM   #53
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2. Run Network Beacon on the remote end on a Mac laptop. This is repeating all of the Bonjour information that I found on the Tivo in Bonjour Browser. This computer is not connected to the VPN, but is on the same WiFi network with the iPhone.

3. Launch the Tivo app. The Tivo shows up and is ready to stream. With more bandwidth on this end, it might have even worked.

The next step that I need to figure out is using the DNS on Mountain Lion Server to send the Tivo Bonjour broadcasts to the VPN connected clients, which would obviate the need for a remote computer to be part of the mix.
Hey Drew -- this sounds very promising. Could you please post your Network Beacon settings? I got the Services from Cipherwar's post, but I don't have the ports.

Thanks!
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Old 10-02-2012, 02:45 PM   #54
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Download Bonjour Browser from http://www.tildesoft.com/ to get the specific IP addresses, Tivo software and serial number info.

_tivo-device._tcp. uses port 80
_tivo-remote._tcp. uses port 31339
_tivo-videos._tcp. uses port 443
_tivo-videostream._tcp. uses port 443
_http._tcp. uses port 80
_tivo-xcode._tcp. uses port 49152

The service name is the Premiere name (and proxied in Network Beacon using the Premiere's IP address) except for tivo-xcode which uses the Stream's name. There are two instances of the _http._tcp., one for the Premiere, the other for the Stream.

I've successfully streamed remotely over VPN, but the video wasn't entirely smooth. Going back to try a second streaming session or download later, I couldn't reconnect to the Stream. I think there may be other discussion between the Stream and the iOS app when they pair that I'm not getting routed across the VPN.
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Old 10-19-2012, 10:26 AM   #55
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I have had my TiVos now for a few months and I am quite happy with them. In fact, I am flying to my mom's next week to convert all of her STBs to TiVo's because she is frustrated with Cox's STBs. One feature I have been looking forward to is the Stream because I was under the impression that it would stream when not at home (like Sling). Obviously I was disappointed that is not the case.

My first reaction was to VPN into my home network, which after some frustration with iOS's VPN, did get connected to a Windows 7 VPN. I have DD-WRT on my router but was unable to get iOS to connect to it. I am having the same TiVo Stream connection issues as the rest of you. I will be taking several multi-week trips over the next year and having this work remotely would be a real benefit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Bishop View Post
I've sort of found a way to make it work outside the home. It's not how you'd want to do it long term but:

Connect the app to the TiVo on the local network. Press the home button and head out. Go to a bar and connect to your home network via VPN. Now open the TiVo app back up. It'll see the TiVo and it'll let you stream.

If at any time the TiVo app doesn't see a WiFi connection or you forget and don't connect to VPN then it will reset the app and put it in away mode until it sees the TiVo again.

Again, this isn't ideal BUT it at least let's you see it work while you're out and about.
I did manage to get this to work once, but have been unable to repeat since.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drewfidelic View Post
Download Bonjour Browser from http://www.tildesoft.com/ to get the specific IP addresses, Tivo software and serial number info.

_tivo-device._tcp. uses port 80
_tivo-remote._tcp. uses port 31339
_tivo-videos._tcp. uses port 443
_tivo-videostream._tcp. uses port 443
_http._tcp. uses port 80
_tivo-xcode._tcp. uses port 49152

The service name is the Premiere name (and proxied in Network Beacon using the Premiere's IP address) except for tivo-xcode which uses the Stream's name. There are two instances of the _http._tcp., one for the Premiere, the other for the Stream.

I've successfully streamed remotely over VPN, but the video wasn't entirely smooth. Going back to try a second streaming session or download later, I couldn't reconnect to the Stream. I think there may be other discussion between the Stream and the iOS app when they pair that I'm not getting routed across the VPN.
What did you do to get it working? What about forwarding 80, 31339, 443, 49152 from the router to the VPN server?
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Old 10-20-2012, 08:27 PM   #56
mitchk03
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TiVo Stream via VPN / TiVo App over VPN

I too have been playing around with this. I'm using a Sonicwall TZ100 and the VPN client on the iPad.

I connected via a neighbor's WiFi, fired up VPN and have the same experiance as others. If I had the TiVo app open and running on my network before I flipped over to my neighbor w/ VPN, The TiVo app works. But, if you close the app and reopen, no joy.

I think this may have less to do with ports than it does with the iPad's VPN. While still on VPN, I went to Safari and entered TiVo IP addresses in my Home. I get to them. I think entered the IP address of my neighbors router. I can get to it. This I think is the problem.

I know that my VPN server assigned me an IP on my home network. If I can still Browse to my Neighbors IP's (his router) then all IP traffic is not being properly forwarded to MY network.

This causes the TiVo app to know something's fishy. It's looking on the local network addresses, not being properly sent through the VPN Tunnel.

That's my theory.

Thoughts?

-mk
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Old 10-21-2012, 12:21 PM   #57
GTXgp
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I agree. If it was a simple Bonjour or Multicast issue then we shouldn't be able to fool the app by not completely closing it before logging in to VPN.
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Old 10-21-2012, 02:13 PM   #58
SandDune
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Check and make sure "Send All Traffic" in the VPN Configuration is set to On. If its On, and you're still seeing stuff inside you're friends network, something is fishy in the VPN client (assuming your friends network isn't routable from the outside world).
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Old 10-24-2012, 10:40 PM   #59
GTXgp
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SandDune View Post
Check and make sure "Send All Traffic" in the VPN Configuration is set to On. If its On, and you're still seeing stuff inside you're friends network, something is fishy in the VPN client (assuming your friends network isn't routable from the outside world).
Unfortunately, the iOS VPN client is not very robust and does not allow for much troubleshooting. However, there is a "send all traffic" tab that is set on by default.
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Old 10-25-2012, 08:04 AM   #60
wkearney99
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Also be sure your network devices properly handle multicast traffic. Many interfaces based on Realtek chips do a terrible job of handling multicast packets. The only ones I've found that do it reliably are Intel-based network chipsets.

I wouldn't hold out a lot of hope for getting it to work over a VPN. Too many variables and too much dependency on the software not screwing it up. Multicast is very poorly understood and often very badly implemented in software.
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