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Old 08-29-2012, 05:12 PM   #241
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Originally Posted by bradleys View Post
Dave...


I am pretty sure I know the answer - but It is worth the question...

If I have a home movie or other video on my media library (something other then a .tivo file), can I move the video to my Premier and then sideload it to the tablet?

Any restrictions on non .tivo files I guess is the real question.
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Good question, and I don't know the answer. I know things like the podcast downloads and Amazon videos won't come over, but I would assume video we moved over would be seen as any other "normal" recording. I'll check in with a beta tester I know and reply if/when I learn anything further.

Might have to do with how you transfer to your TiVo. When I push non .tivo shows from my PC to my TiVo they're copy protected, but when I pull them they're not.
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Old 08-29-2012, 05:17 PM   #242
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Just ordered one. They made me read the email to verify I actually go it. I just read them what Dave posted on his site and they said that was OK.

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Old 08-29-2012, 05:50 PM   #243
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why are some folks sweating this? It will be available for everyone else just a day later. And if you can wait a few weeks, you may find it for less at amazon.

Using the TiVo slide remote as an example. I think that first went on the market for $90. Its been selling at amazon for a year now for $39.

I think I'll wait till the holidays and this thing will probably sell for well under $100 by then.
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Old 08-29-2012, 05:53 PM   #244
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why are some folks sweating this? It will be available for everyone else just a day later. And if you can wait a few weeks, you may find it for less at amazon.
Some people have been waiting a long time for it, are really excited about it, want to be amongst the first to be able to receive and use it... more than they care about saving $40.
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Old 08-29-2012, 06:05 PM   #245
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why are some folks sweating this? It will be available for everyone else just a day later. And if you can wait a few weeks, you may find it for less at amazon.
I considered that but I've been waiting for this for a while now, and my excitement overtook logic. I have a very specific use case for it and I just want to start using it ASAP.

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Old 08-29-2012, 06:08 PM   #246
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why are some folks sweating this? It will be available for everyone else just a day later. And if you can wait a few weeks, you may find it for less at amazon.

Using the TiVo slide remote as an example. I think that first went on the market for $90. Its been selling at amazon for a year now for $39.

I think I'll wait till the holidays and this thing will probably sell for well under $100 by then.
Some of us will get well more than $40 of utility out of the unit over the next 90 days while you wait for a price drop.

Will it be available within a week or two for $10-$20 less than the price to pre-order? Sure it will... but, the nice thing about getting it early is the entertainment factor. Considering that I pay over thirty bucks to be entertained by a 90 minute movie I think I am okay with paying MSRP on a really cool new bit of tech that will entertain me for far longer.
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Old 08-29-2012, 08:37 PM   #247
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That would kind of suck due to bandwidth issues. You'll be streaming wirelessly to your iPad, then streaming wireless out from your iPad to your Apple TV. It would be better if Tivo just had an Apple TV app.

Unless this thing downloads to your iPad/iPhone before being able to watch the show. I haven't read all the details on this device so it may work that way and thus you wouldn't be trying to push/pull data simultaneously over one wifi connection.
That's not typically how AirPlay works. The iPad sets up the connection with the Apple TV and the source directly and then just operates as a control device. (Unless you're doing AirPlay Mirroring, which is a continuous connection.)
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Old 08-29-2012, 08:51 PM   #248
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Thanks. Great I can stick it in my basement out of the way, but annoying that I'll finally have to move my router to get a decent wifi signal to my detached garage!
Get an Access Point and leave your router in place.
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:23 PM   #249
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But then can't you rip it off that DVD-RAM and do whatever you want with it?
I guess so, but what will read a DVD-RAM "filesystem" and get a raw mpeg2 file off of it, or convert it to standard DVD-R?
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:30 PM   #250
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So is the stream sending HD content to the mobile device or a lower resolution of the HD content.?
Since presumably they don't have a software-based MPEG-2 player on iOS (can you say 'suck all my battery' and not even be fast enough?), this device is reencoding the videos to be iOS specific. (I'm guessing MPEG 4?) Specific resolutions and formats that have direct iOS support.
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:31 PM   #251
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The Stream is LAN Connected - no wifi and it doesn't need to be. Hook it up directy to your router.
IT DOES NOT NEED TO BE NEAR EITHER A TIVO OR A TV!
Wait, how do you start up sideloads then? I thought it would be connected to a TV and then you effectively use a Tivo UI to convert recordings to the connected iPad..
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:32 PM   #252
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Wait, how do you start up sideloads then? I thought it would be connected to a TV and then you effectively use a Tivo UI to convert recordings to the connected iPad..
No. You control it all from the iPad.
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:50 PM   #253
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Since presumably they don't have a software-based MPEG-2 player on iOS (can you say 'suck all my battery' and not even be fast enough?), this device is reencoding the videos to be iOS specific. (I'm guessing MPEG 4?) Specific resolutions and formats that have direct iOS support.
No. It is not IOS specific. MPEG4 is MPEG4 (H.264 + AAC in an MPEG4 container). Although it will be encoding to typically supported resolutions and bitrates for most mobile devices (including, of course, the ipad and iphone). There are software MPEG-2 players on Android (and apps that will play just about anything). But like you said, because it is not hardware assisted/accelerated, they have to use the CPU a LOT and it will wipe the battery pretty quickly.
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:22 AM   #254
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So I'm getting confused about the setup of this thing.

Here's my setup.

My main TiVo (a premiere) is upstairs connected via a TiVo wireless dongle. This is the TiVo I want to be able to stream from.

My wireless router and modem are downstairs hooked up to another TiVo (TiVo HD).

Am I screwed here?

I don't really want to move my router upstairs or switch the two TiVos.

I also don't really feel like dealing with the hassle of setting up a MoCa network or whatever it's called. I have enough damn boxes hooked up to these things. At some point enough is enough. As cool as it would be to stream to my phone or iPad, it's just not worth a lot of hassle.

And a second question, if I got a second wifi router and used it as a network extender, could I hardwire the Stream into the second wifi router?
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Old 08-30-2012, 01:07 AM   #255
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TiVo is insisting that your premiere be on either wired Ethernet or MOCA. They say that wireless on the TiVo won't be supported.

You can plug the Stream box in anywhere in the house that you want (any Ethernet connection on the same network) and theoretically it would work, but TiVo is pretty insistent that your premiere be on a wired connection.
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Old 08-30-2012, 02:34 AM   #256
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So I'm getting confused about the setup of this thing.

Here's my setup.

My main TiVo (a premiere) is upstairs connected via a TiVo wireless dongle. This is the TiVo I want to be able to stream from.

My wireless router and modem are downstairs hooked up to another TiVo (TiVo HD).

Am I screwed here?

I don't really want to move my router upstairs or switch the two TiVos.

I also don't really feel like dealing with the hassle of setting up a MoCa network or whatever it's called. I have enough damn boxes hooked up to these things. At some point enough is enough. As cool as it would be to stream to my phone or iPad, it's just not worth a lot of hassle.

And a second question, if I got a second wifi router and used it as a network extender, could I hardwire the Stream into the second wifi router?
OK wireless is not officially supported, but you can hook it up easily and see for yourself if it works. All you have to do is connect the Stream box downstairs directly to the wireless router via Ethernet. My guess is that it'll probably work fine provided you only stream one show at a time. (I think it supports streaming up to 4 shows at once on a wired network)

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Old 08-30-2012, 03:03 AM   #257
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Wait, how do you start up sideloads then? I thought it would be connected to a TV and then you effectively use a Tivo UI to convert recordings to the connected iPad..
The Stream is just a middle man. It has no interface of it's own, no remote and no video outputs. It's controlled exclusively by the iPad via the network. The only reason it's necessary at all is because the iPad can't play the native MPEG-2 format TiVos record in. So the Stream sits between the TiVo and the iPad on the network and acts as a translator, converting the MPEG-2 stream from the TiVo into an H.264 stream the iPad can actually play.

My understanding is that a future hardware revision (Series 5?) will have this ability baked in and the iPad will be able to stream directly from the TiVo without the middle man. But until then the Stream is a way to add that ability to current generation Premieres.

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Old 08-30-2012, 09:59 AM   #258
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Bright House has told me I will not be able to download copyright protected shows to my ipad, just like current situation with Tivo to go to my PC. Tivo sales rep said most should be good to download, but I am guessing the Tivo rep is wrong. Just pre-ordered, should I cancel, since that is the only reason I am getting one?
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:02 AM   #259
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Bright House has told me I will not be able to download copyright protected shows to my ipad, just like current situation with Tivo to go to my PC. Tivo sales rep said most should be good to download, but I am guessing the Tivo rep is wrong. Just pre-ordered, should I cancel, since that is the only reason I am getting one?
On Bright House and Time Warner Cable everything but the local channels is locked down. If downloading/sideloading is the only reason you are buying the Stream than it will be disappointing. I do believe there is a chance the BHN and TWC may change their position at some point in the future but that is just speculation. Its also possible that the other cable operators may reverse their decision and decide to further lock-down their content.
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:12 AM   #260
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On Bright House and Time Warner Cable everything but the local channels is locked down. If downloading/sideloading is the only reason you are buying the Stream than it will be disappointing. I do believe there is a chance the BHN and TWC may change their position at some point in the future but that is just speculation. Its also possible that the other cable operators may reverse their decision and decide to further lock-down their content.


ugh, just cancelled my order based on your response, thanks, that's what I was afraid of

such a waste
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:25 PM   #261
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Yes side loading via the Stream will have the exact same limitations as TiVoToGo. You'll be able to Stream anything though, even if it's protected.

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Old 08-30-2012, 12:33 PM   #262
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It would be nice if the would revamp TiVo Desktop or supply a Mac and PC app that used the Stream for streaming and transcoding. Probably not going to happen though since that could solve the problem of getting content to other TV's without having to purchase another box from TiVo.
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:45 PM   #263
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I guess so, but what will read a DVD-RAM "filesystem" and get a raw mpeg2 file off of it, or convert it to standard DVD-R?
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:48 PM   #264
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OK wireless is not officially supported, but you can hook it up easily and see for yourself if it works. All you have to do is connect the Stream box downstairs directly to the wireless router via Ethernet. My guess is that it'll probably work fine provided you only stream one show at a time. (I think it supports streaming up to 4 shows at once on a wired network)

Dan
So it doesn't need to be hooked into the TiVo it's streaming from? The show has to get streamed down to the Stream Box, converted and then streamed out to my iPad? That seems... strange to me.

I think I'll wait and see how this plays out once a lot of people try to do these things.

I don't want to spend the $130 only to have it not work exactly as expected.

Thanks for the info!
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Old 08-30-2012, 01:09 PM   #265
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So it doesn't need to be hooked into the TiVo it's streaming from? The show has to get streamed down to the Stream Box, converted and then streamed out to my iPad? That seems... strange to me.

I think I'll wait and see how this plays out once a lot of people try to do these things.

I don't want to spend the $130 only to have it not work exactly as expected.

Thanks for the info!
Look at it this way... The TiVo and the Stream ARE connected - simply through your Local Area Network...

The TiVo app on your IOS device is also connected (wirelessly) into your LAN.

Currently Premier to Premier streaming works by sending a TiVo stream from TiVo 1 through your network to TiVo 2. Simple…

The TiVo Stream Box works the same way. As far as TiVo 1 is concerned the Stream Box is just another Premier on your network. TiVo 1 sends a stream through your network to the Stream box, this device has dedicated hardware that transcodes the stream into the proper format and then sends it on its way to the TiVo app on a mobile device.

Dave Zatz has done a great review of the box if you have any other questions.

http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2012-08/tivo-stream-review/
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Old 08-30-2012, 01:50 PM   #266
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So it doesn't need to be hooked into the TiVo it's streaming from? The show has to get streamed down to the Stream Box, converted and then streamed out to my iPad? That seems... strange to me.
The way it works is actually better then requiring it to be connected directly to the TiVo because one Stream can actually be used with multiple TiVos. Provided you had enough iPads and Premiere units you could actually stream 3 different shows from 3 different TiVos to 3 different iPads all at the same time. If the device were dedicated to a single TiVo then you'd have to buy one Stream for each TiVo on your network.

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Old 08-30-2012, 01:53 PM   #267
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The way it works is actually better then requiring it to be connected directly to the TiVo because one Stream can actually be used with multiple TiVos. Provided you had enough iPads and Premiere units you could actually stream 3 different shows from 3 different TiVos to 3 different iPads all at the same time. If the device were dedicated to a single TiVo then you'd have to buy one Stream for each TiVo on your network.

Dan
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Old 08-30-2012, 03:14 PM   #268
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Yes side loading via the Stream will have the exact same limitations as TiVoToGo. You'll be able to Stream anything though, even if it's protected.

Dan


I really , really want to be able to download copyrighted shows to my ipad to take on long flights for my personal use, then delete them. I don't understand why Bright House and TWC block this, they could DRM it somehow I would think to prevent illegal retransmission.

all this old way of thinking does is force people to use torrents that really don't want to do that kind of stuff
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Old 08-30-2012, 03:22 PM   #269
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I don't understand why Bright House and TWC block this, they could DRM it somehow I would think to prevent illegal retransmission.
Because hitting things with a very big hammer requires little effort or skill, and it really doesn't matter if you occasionally smash someone else's thumb in the process.
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Old 08-30-2012, 04:14 PM   #270
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I really , really want to be able to download copyrighted shows to my ipad to take on long flights for my personal use, then delete them. I don't understand why Bright House and TWC block this, they could DRM it somehow I would think to prevent illegal retransmission.

all this old way of thinking does is force people to use torrents that really don't want to do that kind of stuff
It's not entirely Bright House or TWCs fault. The CableCARD rules were designed by a consortium of companies in the cable industry, all of whom agreed to include the CCI bit and force developers of CableCARD equipment to adhere to it. Bright House and TWC use it excessively, but even the cable companies that don't use it across the board still use it whenever the channel provider requests it. For example in most areas the premium channels and PPV are protected even when the rest of the channels are not. Even FIOS, who had avoided using the CCI bit completely, had to start using it a few weeks ago for HBO.

Now it's possible TiVo might be able to get around the CCI bit by moving, rather then copying, shows between devices. However they'd probably have to use better protection for their TTG format then what they're using now or or the cable companies would take issue.

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