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Old 08-27-2012, 12:54 PM   #91
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Quote:
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Worst "contest" ever. Really, just a way to harvest our email addresses so they can try to sell us these boxes when they come out. In 2014? LOL
They probably already have the email addressess from the people that will sign up to test the product. They are already TiVo owners.
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Old 08-27-2012, 12:55 PM   #92
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I've been told that TiVo will announce the contest winners tomorrow.
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Old 08-27-2012, 01:26 PM   #93
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Well, TiVo is going to want feedback on the Beta unit. I suspect they will gather that feedback using both usage logs as well as user feedback.

It is going to be very hard for someone to use the unit if they do not have an IOS device to pair it with.
I doubt there is much testing to be done on the device itself. In fact I doubt the device itself even has a UI to interact with. It's basically just a dumb box that sits on your network and preforms a transcode when the requesting device does not support the native MPEG-2 format.

The only thing that might be "beta" is the iOS app, and even then I doubt TiVo would release the product without going through a real private beta first, so I don't think they're expecting any feedback from the "winners" of this sweepstake.

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Old 08-27-2012, 01:42 PM   #94
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I doubt there is much testing to be done on the device itself. In fact I doubt the device itself even has a UI to interact with. It's basically just a dumb box that sits on your network and preforms a transcode when the requesting device does not support the native MPEG-2 format.

The only thing that might be "beta" is the iOS app, and even then I doubt TiVo would release the product without going through a real private beta first, so I don't think they're expecting any feedback from the "winners" of this sweepstake.

Dan
I agree completely. I think this offer is actually the opportunity for a user to receive the Stream box at their home the same day and date the Stream becomes available on tivo.com. Any beta testing that was done internally by TiVo will have been complete at that point.
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Old 08-27-2012, 01:58 PM   #95
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The buzz is that winners get their Streams when Tivo begins taking orders from everybody else. So I guess the benefit would only be a few days, unless they take pre-orders from the masses too.

Edit: yeah, what Sam said. So maybe that double-confirms it.

So I wouldn't take the "beta" term too literally... At least no moreso than other new products with day 1 issues.

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Old 08-27-2012, 02:12 PM   #96
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I'm just looking forward to hearing about pricing. Very curious about that.
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:17 PM   #97
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Wild guess... ~$100 for the Stream. If it's over $150 I'm going to reconsider buying even if I "win".

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Old 08-27-2012, 02:20 PM   #98
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Wild guess... ~$100 for the Stream. If it's over $150 I'm going to reconsider buying even if I "win".

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My wild guess is $99 for the Stream. Sounds like we might need a poll!
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:22 PM   #99
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The only thing that might be "beta" is the iOS app, and even then I doubt TiVo would release the product without going through a real private beta first, so I don't think they're expecting any feedback from the "winners" of this sweepstake.
It would be impossible for TiVo to release a beta iOS app to 600 "winners" as Apple restricts test releases of apps to a maximum of 100 devices (devices, not users).
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:23 PM   #100
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Well, any of you who win and don't want it, I'll gladly take your spot.
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:27 PM   #101
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My wild guess is $99 for the Stream. Sounds like we might need a poll!
I'd vote $99. Can't be more than that, just can't
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:29 PM   #102
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My wild guess is $99 for the Stream. Sounds like we might need a poll!
The most expensive Roku 2 is $99 and that can do considerable more than what this Stream will be able to do. Granted though transcoding on the fly isn't one of them, but I'm betting the TiVo Stream doesn't come with a free copy of Angry Birds.

A product which can stream from any device with video out to outside the home, the Slingbox Solo, is currently going for $129 on Amazon (though it requires another $30 for the iOS app).

If the Stream comes out and costs the same or more than a Slingbox, it's dead on arrival, so I'd say $99 max. I'm hoping it's closer to $79, similar to what the Slide originally cost.
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:42 PM   #103
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- Slingbox SOLO (no HD) has a "sale" price on Amazon for $129.00 ($49 discount)
- Slingbox HD Pro has a "sale" price of $254.97 on Amazon for ($43.03 discount).

- The SlingPlayer app is $29.99 in the appstore...

So you are @ a minimum cost of $160

I expect to see the TiVo stream sell for $149.99 and the IOS software will remain free.

Quote:
I'm hoping it's closer to $79, similar to what the Slide originally cost.
I am betting that is pretty close to the hardware / manufacturing costs for this device. At that cost TiVo makes no profit at all. TiVo does not have Foxcon and 100 million units a year to spread profits accross. They need to spread R&D, part costs and manufacturing accross maybe 10 thousand units - tops.

Your pricing is laughable in the real world. And frankly if only a company the size of Apple can deliver products in this new tech world - this is going to get pretty boring pretty quickly.
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Last edited by bradleys : 08-27-2012 at 02:57 PM.
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:48 PM   #104
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I expect to see the TiVo stream sell for $149.99 and the IOS solftware will remain free.
My guess would be the ~ $150 price point as well. I think there's going to be some people in the < $100 crowd that will be disappointed.

People need to keep in mind this thing isn't a roku. I'm not sure why it's being compared to a roku.
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Old 08-27-2012, 02:50 PM   #105
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It would be impossible for TiVo to release a beta iOS app to 600 "winners" as Apple restricts test releases of apps to a maximum of 100 devices (devices, not users).
I'm guessing/hoping it's going to be using the same app we already have from TiVo on our iPads, for consistent and elegant UI. Please, don't give us a whole separate app! The current one is fine!

Maybe they'll roll the functionality into the release version, considering it'll only work with the TiVo Stream hardware installed, what's the harm?
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Old 08-27-2012, 03:05 PM   #106
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I'm guessing/hoping it's going to be using the same app we already have from TiVo on our iPads, for consistent and elegant UI. Please, don't give us a whole separate app! The current one is fine!

Maybe they'll roll the functionality into the release version, considering it'll only work with the TiVo Stream hardware installed, what's the harm?
Based on what was shown at that cable show a few months ago that's exactly what they plan to do. The playback and side loading functionality will be rolled right into the main iOS app.

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Old 08-27-2012, 04:03 PM   #107
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I am betting that is pretty close to the hardware / manufacturing costs for this device. At that cost TiVo makes no profit at all. TiVo does not have Foxcon and 100 million units a year to spread profits accross. They need to spread R&D, part costs and manufacturing accross maybe 10 thousand units - tops.

Your pricing is laughable in the real world. And frankly if only a company the size of Apple can deliver products in this new tech world - this is going to get pretty boring pretty quickly.
I'm not comparing Apple to TiVo, which isn't a fair comparison because of how huge Apple is. I'm comparing TiVo to relatively small companies which are comparable in size to TiVo (or smaller) .


The Slingbox has hardware in it that a Stream would not require, namely an analog to digital converter and input jacks. Any time you have A2D or D2A hardware, you greatly increase the price of the hardware.

The PogoPlug video, which did real-time transcoding from attached hard drives, retailed for $200. That could stream from any connected hard drive or video camera that supported USB. It could also print to printers. That also had hardware that the Stream wouldn't require, namely USB and hard drive support. Note, it was recalled and shelved because of fire risk.

There's a full blown linux computer on a board for $35. It doesn't have the power for real time transcoding, but it is pretty powerful for it's cost and is capable of outputting HD video.


Realistically the Stream could be nothing more than board with an embedded CPU, hardware transcoder and network interface. Something like that would be cheap even if you thrown in research, design and manufacturing.

I think $99 is a fair price, though the early adopter tax that TiVo tends to add to newly released products could push it up to $150. At that price though, one might as well just get a Slingbox, which can stream out over the Internet from any device.
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Old 08-27-2012, 04:31 PM   #108
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Realistically the Stream could be nothing more than board with an embedded CPU, hardware transcoder and network interface. Something like that would be cheap even if you thrown in research, design and manufacturing.
In fact you can combine the embedded CPU and hardware transcoder as both are part of the Zenverge ZN200 SoC. The ZN200 would connect to the E-NET or MoCA interfaces via a PCIe bus. Add some DDR memory, flash memory for Stream program storage, and power supply circuitry and a circuit board and that's probably about it for the hardware.

The big unknown is how much TiVo is paying for the ZN200. It appears that TiVo will be the first large customer for Zenverge so perhaps they received some pretty good discounts. The ZN200 actually appears to leverage a Synopsys DDR IP solution.

http://www.zenverge.com/pro-media-processors_zn200.html

https://www.synopsys.com/dw/doc.php/ss/zenverge_ss.pdf
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Old 08-27-2012, 04:33 PM   #109
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I'm not comparing Apple to TiVo, which isn't a fair comparison because of how huge Apple is. I'm comparing TiVo to relatively small companies which are comparable in size to TiVo (or smaller) .


The Slingbox has hardware in it that a Stream would not require, namely an analog to digital converter and input jacks. Any time you have A2D or D2A hardware, you greatly increase the price of the hardware.

The PogoPlug video, which did real-time transcoding from attached hard drives, retailed for $200. That could stream from any connected hard drive or video camera that supported USB. It could also print to printers. That also had hardware that the Stream wouldn't require, namely USB and hard drive support. Note, it was recalled and shelved because of fire risk.

There's a full blown linux computer on a board for $35. It doesn't have the power for real time transcoding, but it is pretty powerful for it's cost and is capable of outputting HD video.


Realistically the Stream could be nothing more than board with an embedded CPU, hardware transcoder and network interface. Something like that would be cheap even if you thrown in research, design and manufacturing.

I think $99 is a fair price, though the early adopter tax that TiVo tends to add to newly released products could push it up to $150. At that price though, one might as well just get a Slingbox, which can stream out over the Internet from any device.
I am not going to debate specific hardware elements in the device, but I suspect you are underestimating both the fixed costs and R&D costs.

As for Slingbox, even the non HD version is more expensive then you are allowing TiVo and it does not allow sideloading onto device - a function that I will be using a lot more then streaming...
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Old 08-27-2012, 05:59 PM   #110
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It would be impossible for TiVo to release a beta iOS app to 600 "winners" as Apple restricts test releases of apps to a maximum of 100 devices (devices, not users).
TiVo could release an app that works only with the stream. Then they could release a new version of the tivo app if they wanted to. Not an elegant option, but it is a lot easier than adding devices onto their apple account.
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Old 08-27-2012, 06:21 PM   #111
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I hope the cost isn't too much. My guess is it will be built-in to the next-gen boxes anyways.
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Old 08-27-2012, 06:30 PM   #112
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TiVo could release an app that works only with the stream. Then they could release a new version of the tivo app if they wanted to. Not an elegant option, but it is a lot easier than adding devices onto their apple account.
Yes, but then it wouldn't be a beta app, would it.
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Old 08-27-2012, 07:17 PM   #113
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Well, I'm going with $59-$79. I can't imagine that it would be more.
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Old 08-27-2012, 07:19 PM   #114
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Optimistically, I am hoping it'll be $99 (or less.) I will pay up to $129.

Realistically, knowing what I know about this company, it'll be a ridiculous $249 (or more.)
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Old 08-27-2012, 07:46 PM   #115
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Realistically, knowing what I know about this company, it'll be a ridiculous $249 (or more.)
... or require a $15/mo service fee.

I'd pay up to about $175, maybe $200. I'm expecting it to come in around $150. I'd be astonished if the price (including app) was less than $100.

We really need a poll about this!!
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Old 08-27-2012, 08:30 PM   #116
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I don't care what the price is. No Android = no interest.

But if I had to speculate, I would say $150.
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Old 08-27-2012, 08:56 PM   #117
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I don't care what the price is. No Android = no interest.

But if I had to speculate, I would say $150.
+1 on the "no interest" part...
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Old 08-27-2012, 10:13 PM   #118
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if it cant stream outside of the house 150 is way to much. I would be better off getting a Slingbox if it is 150. The solo's are on WOOT all the time for pretty cheap
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Old 08-28-2012, 12:34 AM   #119
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+2 on no interest. For me nothing I record is copy protected so I can download stuff I need and edit out commercials, etc. and put shows on any device I want. Plus since I already have a Slingbox I can watch via internet if desired as well. i.e. Much more capability than this box will offer. I can understand the interest from some but it's a pass for me. I too doubt very much it will be under $100 at least for initial release. TiVo has always surprised me on the up side as far as initial pricing goes. I'm more interested in the Mini.
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Old 08-28-2012, 05:47 AM   #120
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I love the people that make an effort to come into these threads just to say they are not interested. Lol
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