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Old 06-10-2012, 03:01 PM   #61
HerronScott
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I did finally get the parts and repaired my original S3 OLED power supply which had bulging capacitors for the C401/C402 (2200uF 6.3V). Thought I would post the parts list here for anyone else looking to do this.

TiVo S3 OLED capacitor list:
3Y power supply: CP-1104 R2
TiVo PN: SPWR-00008-000 Rev A3

I went ahead and replaced 11 of the 15 capacitors to hopefully preemptively catch any of the other primary ones that might fail. The ones that I replaced fall into 3 main groups on the power supply board so that's how I've listed them starting with the ones that were bulging on mine.

C401 2200uF 6.3V Panasonic EEU-FR0J222 Digikey P14365-ND $0.81 (Alternate: P15308CT-ND?)
C402 2200uF 6.3V Panasonic EEU-FR0J222 Digikey P14365-ND $0.81 (Alternate: P15308CT-ND?)

C601 2200uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C222 Digikey P14402-ND $1.01
C701 2200uF 25V Panasonic EEU-FR1E222L Digikey P14428-ND $1.43
C501 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01
C502 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01
C503 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01

C50? 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01
C603 470uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C471 Digikey P14394-ND $0.49 (Alternate: P15342CT-ND?)
C702 470uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C471 Digikey P14394-ND $0.49 (Alternate: P15342CT-ND?)
C403 1000uF 6.3V Panasonic EEU-FM0J102 Digikey P12340-ND $0.51

All are rated at 10000hrs@105C except for the last 3 which are 6000hrs@105C and 4000hrs@105C. Cost was $9.59 in parts plus $0.48 tax and $4.91 S&H for a total of $14.98.

I actually ordered enough caps to repair my 2nd S3 OLED as well since it has a few bulging 3300uF caps so the S&H was for both sets although the way it was boxed and shipped, I'm not sure it would have been any cheaper for just 1 set of caps.

I hope this helps someone else who might have an S3 OLED with a bad caps!

Scott

Last edited by HerronScott : 02-14-2013 at 08:03 PM.
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Old 06-14-2012, 01:19 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HerronScott View Post
I did finally get the parts and repaired my original S3 OLED power supply which had bulging capacitors for the C401/C402 (2200uF 6.3V). Thought I would post the parts list here for anyone else looking to do this.

TiVo S3 OLED capacitor list:
3Y power supply: CP-1104 R2
TiVo PN: SPWR-00008-000 Rev A3

I went ahead and replaced 11 of the 15 capacitors to hopefully preemptively catch any of the other primary ones that might fail. The ones that I replaced fall into 3 main groups on the power supply board so that's how I've listed them starting with the ones that were bulging on mine.

C401 2200uF 6.3V Panasonic EEU-FR0J222 Digikey P14365-ND $0.81
C401 2200uF 6.3V Panasonic EEU-FR0J222 Digikey P14365-ND $0.81

C601 2200uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C222 Digikey P14402-ND $1.01
C701 2200uF 25V Panasonic EEU-FR1E222L Digikey P14428-ND $1.43
C501 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01
C502 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01
C503 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01

C50? 3300uF 10V Panasonic EEU-FR1A332 Digikey P14383-ND $1.01
C603 470uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C471 Digikey P14394-ND $0.49
C702 470uF 16V Panasonic EEU-FR1C471 Digikey P14394-ND $0.49
C403 1000uF 6.3V Panasonic EEU-FM0J102 Digikey P12340-ND $0.51

All are rated at 10000hrs@105C except for the last 3 which are 6000hrs@105C and 4000hrs@105C. Cost was $9.59 in parts plus $0.48 tax and $4.91 S&H for a total of $14.98.

I actually ordered enough caps to repair my 2nd S3 OLED as well since it has a few bulging 3300uF caps so the S&H was for both sets although the way it was boxed and shipped, I'm not sure it would have been any cheaper for just 1 set of caps.

I hope this helps someone else who might have an S3 OLED with a bad caps!

Scott
Thanks Scott. I just happened to be doing this same thing right now and figured I'd search and see if anyone already did, though I was already in process so I did it more for sanity check. Here's some updates for you: You listed 401 twice - the one next to it is 402. and 50? is 503. And where you listed 503 is really 504. At least this is how it is on my Rev A2 board.

I also added what I observed by tracing the routes, but not actually checking voltages, so these comments could be off

C220 - 47uF 50V - Connected to: primary side of transformer
C227 - 10uF 25V - Connected to: primary side of transformer

C120 - 470uF 200V - Connected to: primary side of transformer

C601 - 2200uf 16V - Connected to: 7.5V (pre-inductor)
C701 - 2200uF 25V - Connected to: 12V (pre-inductor)
C502 - 3300uF 10V - Connected to: 5V (pre-inductor) [C502, C501 & C504 in parallel]
C501 - 3300uF 10V - Connected to: 5V (pre-inductor) [C502, C501 & C504 in parallel]
C504 - 3300uF 10V - Connected to: 5V (pre-inductor) [C502, C501 & C504 in parallel]

C401 - 2200uF 6.3V - Connected to: seems to be on 3.3V line
C402 - 2200uF 6.3V - Connected to: seems to be on 3.3V line

C306 - 2.2uF 50V - Connected to: secondary side amongst signals

C503 - 3300uF 10V - Connected to: Red 5V Output
C403 - 1000uF 6.3V - Connected to: Orange 3.3V Output
C603 - 470uF 16V - Connected to: Grey 7.5V Output
C702 - 470uF 16V - Connected to: Yellow 12V Output

Last edited by schoolbus : 06-14-2012 at 09:39 AM.
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Old 06-14-2012, 01:54 AM   #63
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Thanks Scott. I just happened to be doing this same thing right now and figured I'd search and see if anyone already did, though I was already in process so I did it more for sanity check. Here's some updates for you: You listed 401 twice - the one next to it is 402. and 50? is 503. And where you listed 503 is really 504. At least this is how it is on my Rev A2 board.

I also added what I observed by tracing the routes, but not actually checking voltages, so these comments could be off

C220 47uF 50V primary side of transformer
C227 10uF 25V primary side of transformer

C120 470uF 200V primary side of transformer

C601 2200uf 16V 7.5V (pre-inductor)
C701 2200uF 25V 12V (pre-inductor)
C502 3300uF 10V 5V (pre-inductor) [C502, C501 & C504 in parallel]
C501 3300uF 10V 5V (pre-inductor) [C502, C501 & C504 in parallel]
C504 3300uF 10V 5V (pre-inductor) [C502, C501 & C504 in parallel]

C401 2200uF 6.3V seems to be on 3.3V line
C402 2200uF 6.3V seems to be on 3.3V line

C306 2.2uF 50V secondary side amongst signals

C503 3300uF 10V Red 5V Output
C403 1000uF 6.3V Orange 3.3V Output
C603 470uF 16V Grey 7.5V Output
C702 470uF 16V Yellow 12V Output

From what I've seen so far, the ones that go bad are actually post-inductor, that is, assuming for the sake of illustration a current flow from positive to ground, current flows from the transformer secondary through the big coil to the other end of the coil which is soldered to a point which connects to the red or the yellow wire and to the + terminal of the bad cap(s) with the - terminal connected to the same place all the black wires are, which is to say, ground.


Assuming that current flows from positive to negative is known as conventional current theory, and still gets used a lot, especially in analyzing negative ground systems.

It is that view of current flow I'm using to say post-inductor.

Electron current theory says that the flow of current is actually the flow of electrons, and it goes from negative to positive.
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Old 06-14-2012, 09:22 AM   #64
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Quote:
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From what I've seen so far, the ones that go bad are actually post-inductor, that is, assuming for the sake of illustration a current flow from positive to ground, current flows from the transformer secondary through the big coil to the other end of the coil which is soldered to a point which connects to the red or the yellow wire and to the + terminal of the bad cap(s) with the - terminal connected to the same place all the black wires are, which is to say, ground.


Assuming that current flows from positive to negative is known as conventional current theory, and still gets used a lot, especially in analyzing negative ground systems.

It is that view of current flow I'm using to say post-inductor.

Electron current theory says that the flow of current is actually the flow of electrons, and it goes from negative to positive.
Yes, current flow is what I was referring to, as most would likely understand it as flowing from the wall socket through a bunch of stuff and out/ending at the colored wires leaving the power supply board. I roughly put the list above in that order as well, in groups from top to bottom.

Mine that is obviously failed is C701. There may be others, but not obvious. I will likely replace all on the power rails on the secondary side of transformer.

Looking back at my list, I see my copy/paste from excel loses the columns causing the voltages to be listed next to each other - I'll edit that so it's less confusing in that regard.
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Old 06-14-2012, 06:30 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by schoolbus View Post
Thanks Scott. I just happened to be doing this same thing right now and figured I'd search and see if anyone already did, though I was already in process so I did it more for sanity check. Here's some updates for you: You listed 401 twice - the one next to it is 402. and 50? is 503. And where you listed 503 is really 504. At least this is how it is on my Rev A2 board.
Thanks for the feedback. I've fixed the C402 as that was an obvious cut and paste mistake. I was going by the numbers that I had jotted on an index cards for the rest and I just checked my spreadsheet and found that I had C501, C503 and C504 listed as being together and had not updated C50? there either (I think it had the white "glue" over it on the board).

I'll fix those when I repair my other TiVo which has the same rev board.

Scott
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Old 06-22-2012, 11:14 PM   #66
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I hope this helps someone else who might have an S3 OLED with a bad caps!

Scott
Outstanding work, my good man!! I just got mine running. I ordered your entire list (parts are too cheap as compared to shipping, best to have everything!)

First I replaced only the bulging caps. Plugged in power supply. Still goes tick tick tick, and 12v line is at 6-7 volts. Replaced more caps. Test again...same results. Replaced all the rest of them. Test again. Tick tick tick...damn.

Scratch head, and wonder if PSU needs a load against it to run. I was leery of testing this way, I didn't want to fry the mobo if I'd wrecked the PSU unit, but I was out of options.

Hooked up the hard drive and motherboard, and it powered up to the sunrise screen!! Now to get a good image on that hard drive, and my "for parts/as-is" lifetime ebay bargain tivo will be ready to go!
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Old 06-22-2012, 11:26 PM   #67
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Outstanding work, my good man!! I just got mine running. I ordered your entire list (parts are too cheap as compared to shipping, best to have everything!)

First I replaced only the bulging caps. Plugged in power supply. Still goes tick tick tick, and 12v line is at 6-7 volts. Replaced more caps. Test again...same results. Replaced all the rest of them. Test again. Tick tick tick...damn.

Scratch head, and wonder if PSU needs a load against it to run. I was leery of testing this way, I didn't want to fry the mobo if I'd wrecked the PSU unit, but I was out of options.

Hooked up the hard drive and motherboard, and it powered up to the sunrise screen!! Now to get a good image on that hard drive, and my "for parts/as-is" lifetime ebay bargain tivo will be ready to go!

For future reference, either the PROPER motherboard OR a hard drive should be sufficient load to momentarily test a TiVo's switch-mode power supply.
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Old 06-23-2012, 12:22 AM   #68
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The hard drive alone was not sufficient.

My S3 image from bittorrent turned out to be corrupted. I just now finished installing the one you hosted on dropbox and posted on the image thread, thx. I'm looking at "Almost there...etc etc" right now

I'm actually glad I didn't figure the power supply thing out sooner. If I had, I might never have replaced the rest of the caps, and long term, this is probably best.
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Old 06-23-2012, 10:25 AM   #69
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CrashHD,

Glad it helped! I saw something similar trying to measure the voltage without load both in swapping in the good power supply from my 2nd S3 and after I had replaced the caps. I connected input power without connecting the output connections just to make sure I hadn't made any mistakes in soldering in the new caps and when nothing smoked, hooked everything up correctly.

Scott
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Old 06-23-2012, 11:14 AM   #70
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Is there any reason to replace the white adhesive that was on the caps?

I used small dabs of hot glue, because it gives a little support, but can be peeled back off later if I need it to. Since I replaced all the caps in that area with the good ones from digikey, I don't anticipate getting back into that area of the PSU again.
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Old 06-23-2012, 11:34 AM   #71
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Is there any reason to replace the white adhesive that was on the caps?

I used small dabs of hot glue, because it gives a little support, but can be peeled back off later if I need it to. Since I replaced all the caps in that area with the good ones from digikey, I don't anticipate getting back into that area of the PSU again.
More to hold them in place for soldering and shipping than anything else, so I wouldn't worry about it.
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Old 06-30-2012, 09:04 PM   #72
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I replaced the power supply on my Series 3 with a power supply from Weaknees in November 2011. Today while watching Spongebob with my 4 year old it all went black. No lights, no power.
Methinks the "new" power supply (or the capacitors, after reading this thread) went bad.
Back to Weaknees, they don't claim the power supplies they sell for the S3's are "new", just "replacement". The warranty is 90 days. I buy a "replacement" power supply for $150, send them back the dead PS at my own cost and get $50 back. If they die every 90 days or so, I am paying $100 plus cost of shipping and giving them stock to refurb to boot, only to pay them again.
And lose the use of my S3 for as long as it takes to do all this, and considering we're out of town for 2 weeks...
Unitron, I hope you are still replacing capacitors. I will PM you in hope that you can help me
Just thought I would post to let folks reading know that if they do buy the replacement from weaknees, this is the deal.
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Old 06-30-2012, 09:12 PM   #73
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Unitron:
Hmm, well I am not allowed to send you a PM until I make 4 more posts... so here's the PM I tried to send to you:
I might be able to sort out the information on the thread and buy a soldering iron and the parts, but I'm out of time and patience, and wouldn't like to screw it up.

I'd prefer to pay you to sort it out
No hard feelings with weaknees, but it doesn't feel right to just keep paying them more than $100.00 for refurbs that have a 90 day warranty and punk out after 6 months. I'm probably lucky it lasted 6 months!

I replaced the power supply in November, it worked well enough since then (plus new cable cards, twice).

What do you think? And if you're willing to fix it, do I send the whole Tivo or just the power supply?

Many thanks for all the helpful posts and information,

a very tired Mommy,
Rachel
P.S. So far when I try to find my old posts (must be about this) I can't.
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Old 06-30-2012, 10:40 PM   #74
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Unitron:
Hmm, well I am not allowed to send you a PM until I make 4 more posts... so here's the PM I tried to send to you:
I might be able to sort out the information on the thread and buy a soldering iron and the parts, but I'm out of time and patience, and wouldn't like to screw it up.

I'd prefer to pay you to sort it out
No hard feelings with weaknees, but it doesn't feel right to just keep paying them more than $100.00 for refurbs that have a 90 day warranty and punk out after 6 months. I'm probably lucky it lasted 6 months!

I replaced the power supply in November, it worked well enough since then (plus new cable cards, twice).

What do you think? And if you're willing to fix it, do I send the whole Tivo or just the power supply?

Many thanks for all the helpful posts and information,

a very tired Mommy,
Rachel
P.S. So far when I try to find my old posts (must be about this) I can't.
I fix my own, otherwise I give advice. I'm not in a position to do it and offer any kind of guarantee.

If that's the original S3 (TCD648250), I'm not even in a position to properly test it, 'cause I don't have an original S3 to hook it to.

I'll try to email or PM you tomorrow when I'm awake to find out where you are geographically, and see if we can find you a fix-it shop.

If you can't PM yet, maybe you can receive and anwer.

Of course a clever person who's not a spambot could also probably figure out how to send me one of those electronic messages named after physical ones at coastalnet.com

It occurs to me, unfortunately, that if Weaknees actually refurbed the power supply they sold you, the first thing they would have done is replaced "the likely suspects" with quality capacitors, which means if it's the power supply, it's more likely to be some other component or components gone bad.

The kind that don't advertise themselves visually like the "industrial espionage" caps tend to.
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Old 07-01-2012, 11:44 PM   #75
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Unitron:
Hmm, well I am not allowed to send you a PM until I make 4 more posts... so here's the PM I tried to send to you:
I might be able to sort out the information on the thread and buy a soldering iron and the parts, but I'm out of time and patience, and wouldn't like to screw it up.

I'd prefer to pay you to sort it out
No hard feelings with weaknees, but it doesn't feel right to just keep paying them more than $100.00 for refurbs that have a 90 day warranty and punk out after 6 months. I'm probably lucky it lasted 6 months!

I replaced the power supply in November, it worked well enough since then (plus new cable cards, twice).

What do you think? And if you're willing to fix it, do I send the whole Tivo or just the power supply?

Many thanks for all the helpful posts and information,

a very tired Mommy,
Rachel
P.S. So far when I try to find my old posts (must be about this) I can't.
With a join date of 2004 your other posts are probably in Archive 1 or Archive 2, and that's why neither of us can find them.

A little Google-Fu later and sure enough

http://archive.tivocommunity.com/tiv...hreadid=168698
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Old 07-16-2012, 05:30 PM   #76
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Rebooting problems.....bad caps?

[b][b][b]I have an S3 TiVo HD. I've tried to reboot about 6 times now and all I'm getting is "Welcome...Powering Up" for 30-40 seconds before it flickers onscreen and does it again. It's a vicious loop. I have a 500GB Western Digital external hard drive attached.

I took the top off to check the capacitors. None are bulging. None are domed.
The unit runs quietly. No clicking. Nothing. Even the fan is quiet. I cleared out the dust and tried rebooting one more time. Same thing as before.

I even tried kick starting it but it won't let me. I can hold the pause button down until the cows come home but I never see the yellow or red lights.

I read 3 pages on the "bad cap thread" and the stories are similar if not dead on. Looking at the capacitors, they all seem fine. How would I know if they're bad? And yes, the larger cap is a CapXon.

I have Lifetime service on this TiVo so I need to fix this. Any suggestions?
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Old 07-16-2012, 06:14 PM   #77
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[b][b][b]I have an S3 TiVo HD. I've tried to reboot about 6 times now and all I'm getting is "Welcome...Powering Up" for 30-40 seconds before it flickers onscreen and does it again. It's a vicious loop. I have a 500GB Western Digital external hard drive attached.

I took the top off to check the capacitors. None are bulging. None are domed.
The unit runs quietly. No clicking. Nothing. Even the fan is quiet. I cleared out the dust and tried rebooting one more time. Same thing as before.

I even tried kick starting it but it won't let me. I can hold the pause button down until the cows come home but I never see the yellow or red lights.

I read 3 pages on the "bad cap thread" and the stories are similar if not dead on. Looking at the capacitors, they all seem fine. How would I know if they're bad? And yes, the larger cap is a CapXon.

I have Lifetime service on this TiVo so I need to fix this. Any suggestions?
There is also a good chance it is the external drive. Have you run done any of the tests on it?
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Old 07-16-2012, 07:01 PM   #78
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Not as of yet. It's fairly new and it's the Western Digital recommended and sold by TiVo (I purchased it from their website). That's not to say it couldn't be the problem......I had a 750GB from Seagate before this and it lasted for years.

It wasn't designed to be on all the time (the Seagate drive) and it ran hot unless I put a fan right on it.I've always had pretty good luck with my hard drives that's why I'm a bit reluctant to go there. I'm also a realist and know that might be it.
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Old 07-16-2012, 07:01 PM   #79
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This does not sound like a power supply /capacitors issue. It smells more like a bad hard drive.
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Old 07-16-2012, 07:04 PM   #80
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Is it possible to plug in the external to my laptop to run some tests?
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Old 07-16-2012, 07:13 PM   #81
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If your laptop has an esata port, it should be possible.

I would recommend downloading and burning a diagnostic disk from western digital, and using that to test it out. Letting windows boot up with that disk connected is risky. Some versions of windows can mess up a tivo disk.

If that disk checks out, don't forget to check the internal disk as well. It is just as, if not more, likely to be the cause of this.
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Old 07-16-2012, 07:19 PM   #82
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Thanks Crash. I'll try that out.
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Old 07-17-2012, 06:24 AM   #83
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Paul,
If the consensus is external hard drive may be the problem...
Have you tried booting the TiVo w/o the external drive attached to see how far it gets?
(If you don't care too much about the recordings, you could just let the S3 divorce the drive if it gets that far.)

My personal experiences with external hard drive problems were:
- The occasional loose esata connector
- Forgetting to plug in the external drive's power (I'm quite certain you'd have figured this one out)
- The external drive needing to be re-seated inside the enclosure
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Old 08-02-2012, 02:13 PM   #84
btgulledge
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Thanks so much HerronScott for the digikey orderlist. That should be a sticky for anyone wanting to do this themselves. Twelve dollars and a hour or so, sure beats the 100 from weaknees. But the psu took the hard drive with it, so I'm messing with that now. Once again thanks to HerronScott for the push in the right direction.
Also is there any chance the system board could have been affected?

-Bryan
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Old 08-03-2012, 07:41 AM   #85
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It's possible, but rare. mainboards commonly live through multiple hard drives and psu's.
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Old 08-04-2012, 09:24 AM   #86
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Bryan,

Glad it helped. I had been looking for this information earlier this year myself when I suspected my power supply was failing (faint wavy lines through video) so thought it might be useful for others.

We need someone to post the same list for the HD power supply.

Scott
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:19 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul7285 View Post
[b][b][b]I have an S3 TiVo HD. I've tried to reboot about 6 times now and all I'm getting is "Welcome...Powering Up" for 30-40 seconds before it flickers onscreen and does it again. It's a vicious loop. I have a 500GB Western Digital external hard drive attached.
Paul, My S3 went through this same bahavior and I assumed it was a bad drive too. I just this evening finished copying my 1st replacement 750GB drive (~3 yr old) to a new 1TB drive. On startup, same reboot loop. I then dug out the original 250GB drive that came with the machine and same reboot loop.

On original inspection I thought all my caps looked okay, but after the 250GB drive didn't work and reading through this thread I took a closer look and the tops of C401 and C402 are slightly domed but not leaking. Guess I'll be replacing some caps
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:34 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by ATB View Post
Paul, My S3 went through this same bahavior and I assumed it was a bad drive too. I just this evening finished copying my 1st replacement 750GB drive (~3 yr old) to a new 1TB drive. On startup, same reboot loop. I then dug out the original 250GB drive that came with the machine and same reboot loop.

On original inspection I thought all my caps looked okay, but after the 250GB drive didn't work and reading through this thread I took a closer look and the tops of C401 and C402 are slightly domed but not leaking. Guess I'll be replacing some caps
Do you have a TCD648250? As in not a TCD652160?
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Old 11-19-2012, 06:26 AM   #89
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On original inspection I thought all my caps looked okay, but after the 250GB drive didn't work and reading through this thread I took a closer look and the tops of C401 and C402 are slightly domed but not leaking. Guess I'll be replacing some caps
Those were the 2 that were bulging slightly on 1 of my S3 OLED's and you are correct that they do not have to be leaking to be bad and cause power supply issues.

Scott
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Old 11-19-2012, 08:01 AM   #90
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Pretty certain it was a 250..thats the size drive I found to put back in. But frankly I only ever venture back here every few years when I need to replace a drive or fix something else. Meaning I'm really not sure which model I have..I'll have to check when I'm home.

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Do you have a TCD648250? As in not a TCD652160?

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